1

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Trump

« on: March 19, 2025, 06:35:15 PM »

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cy7x382je03o

It’s good that Trump and Musk know what they’re doing. Oh

2

Flat Earth Investigations / Re: Does light naturally travel in curved paths?

« on: March 18, 2025, 08:47:03 PM »

AATW is well aware that the Flat Earth effect has been observed many times.

It has been claimed many times. I dealt with that above. In every claim I've seen the claimant made a mistake - I've listed some of the mistakes I've seen made above.

There are probably over 500 videos of this observation on Youtube and throughout the Flat Earth streams.

Cool. So post some examples and I'll have a look.
There are significantly more than 500 videos and photos of the globe earth from space.

My observation does not need to be videotaped

I'm somewhat surprised that in all the times you made this observation you didn't once think to take a photo or document it in enough detail that the claim can be examined.

3

Flat Earth Investigations / Re: Does light naturally travel in curved paths?

« on: March 18, 2025, 11:13:02 AM »

I mean, it's a fairly easy one to do if you live near a body of water. I've had decent success looking at the coast of Normandy from Alderney. Now, it was more like 18.5 kilometres rather than 23 miles, so it's an expected drop of "only" 27 metres - but that's still 27 metres of height that my sight line somehow overtook.

27m given a viewer height of 0. With a viewer height of 1m it's 17.5m, 2m it's 14m. And that's without refraction.
Obviously I don't know the details of what you did, what you were looking at, what the atmospheric conditions were.
What I do know is I've seen a load of images said to be "gotchas" and "proof of FE" and they are all people making basic mistakes like:
Failing to take viewer height into account.
Failing to take refraction in to account.
Misidentifying what they're looking at and therefore how far away it is
Not accounting for the fact that the distant object is not at sea level.
Not acknowledging that the bottom part of the object is missing.

For someone who really likes accusing others of being lazy, you're really unwilling to do anything.

Similar answer to the one in the thread about space travel. I'm not the one who feels like I need to test anything.
The shape of the earth has been known for millennia. If there was any lingering doubt about it, which there wasn't really, the pictures and footage from the space race, and the emergent technologies like GPS and Satellite TV put and end to that. I've seen enough timelapses of boats going over the horizon, the claim that some make that if you zoom in you can see them again is clearly untrue. A friend who is in to sailing has told me how distant landmarks emerge from over the horizon top first.
I've never seen any timelapse of a boat going out to sea and just getting smaller and smaller until the optical zoom fails to resolve it.

All that said, on occasional trips to see family near the coast or on holiday I've done a few slightly half hearted tests but never well enough to find anything that conclusive.

I don't have an issue with refraction as a concept, but that doesn't make your flippant use of it any less an ad-hoc explanation. You take a variable phenomenon, declare without evidence that the variables must have just magically aligned for different conditions every time someone has replicated an experiment, and you consider the matter closed. I'm just not happy with such lazy shallow-mindedness.

I'm not really sure what you mean by this. Tom has posted timelapse videos of it varying over the course of a day - while claiming he can replicate the Bishop in varying conditions: "Provided that there is no fog and the day is clear and calm, the same result comes up over and over throughout the year".
He's not shown any evidence that he's done this at all, let alone that he can consistently repeat the results. His (correct) claim that refraction is variable demonstrates that his other claim about consistently being about to reproduce the results is impossible.

Obviously if someone presents a photo like the black swan you can't really know what the atmospheric conditions were like when the photo was taken. Maybe if you look in to where and when it was taken you can approximate it, but it's impossible to be that accurate. But the you can infer the conditions from the photo. The photo IS the evidence.
Now, if someone showed me a photo which is completely impossible on a globe, something no amount of refraction or accounting for viewer height and so on could explain, then I'd take that seriously. I just haven't seen it yet.

4

Science & Alternative Science / Re: Blue Ghost

« on: March 17, 2025, 06:01:17 PM »

For me, it's genuinely hard to comprehend that you keep coming here and telling others what they should be interested in, or what they should be doing based on your understanding of their interests.

On this site I see a set of people who claim to be trying to make sense of the world. Which is commendable, I guess that's what we should all be doing.
But the conclusion they have come to is so different from the mainstream understanding that I would imagine they would be checking their workings pretty carefully.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, as they say.

If I didn't believe kangaroos existed and maintained that all images and footage of them has been faked then I think we could agree that would be a bit of an "out there" view. It would be reasonable of people on the kangaroosarefake.org forum to raise an eyebrow if I'd never bothered to go to a zoo. If someone is going to go around saying that the ISS is fake and they've never bothered to look to see if they can see it then yeah, I think that's lazy. And where have these people been for the last 9 months?

https://news.sky.com/story/crew-arrives-at-international-space-station-to-replace-astronauts-stranded-for-9-months-13329910

Does anyone know them? Surely someone can verify that they've not been around and that, all being well, they soon will be again.

The problem is that "evaluating the evidence" is extremely vague. You're openly dismissive of people who seem to form their opinions based on YouTube videos, for example, but that absolutely falls under "evaluating evidence". To a more cynical eye, your "evaluation of evidence" is just reading unverifiable claims made by people in positions of power and vibe-checking whether you feel like trusting them.

YouTube videos are definitely evaluating the evidence, but if that's all someone does - and if the YouTube channels they watch are spouting obvious bollocks, then yes I'm going to be scathing. Obvious is in the eye of the beholder of course, but if someone is getting their views from the YouTube FE mob saying that gravity doesn't exist and objects fall because of "density", and they haven't bothered to learn enough basic physics to understand why that's bollocks, then they need to give their head a wobble.

Your characterisation of the way I evaluate evidence isn't that unfair. But isn't that what everyone does? I believe you about your cooking prowess on the basis that being good at cooking is a fairly common skill and it would be a silly thing to lie about. I can't directly verify your claim unless you're inviting me round for dinner, I don't think we're quite at that stage of our relationship yet.
I'd suggest a lot of claims are unverifiable. With space travel yeah - most of it is me reading and watching stuff and deciding what I find credible. There's no way of me directly verifying claims about events which occurred before I was born. You could say that about any historical event. Don't most people check claims against their overall model of reality? Famously, people can't fly. So when I see David Copperfield flying around, I might not be able to see the wires, but at some level I know they must be there. I know I'm being tricked, I don't think "oh ok, so I guess some people can fly then".
With the moon landings - I've said this before, they're not claiming to have teleported there. If they did claim that then I'd probably want to see some pretty good evidence. As it is, they claimed to use technology which I know exists, it's all well documented by the protagonists, may of whom are still alive. It's all on film. There's plenty of documentation of it all. There's lots of 3rd party evidence - what interest do all those people have in lying? Did the Japanese fake their pictures of the Apollo landing sites? Why would they be bothering to do that? And literally all the hoax theories are based on complete ignorance - the "BuT wHy CaN't YoU sEe ThE sTaRs?" sort of thing. Or it's just incredulity - see my sig for further details.

But: why would you go online and try to force others to follow your unevidenced belief? It's the fervour and zealotry I don't understand.

Fervour is overstating it, I just find it odd. People on here have come to such a radically different view of reality from most that I would have thought they'd want to check their workings, so to speak. If I saw a dog out the window I'd think nothing of it. If I saw a dragon I'd probably want to look in to that a bit.
Investigating space travel is one of the ways to check your workings because it's a claim which, if true, would show the FE model that many people hold to be false. And there's space missions going on all the time. I agree that it's hard to verify some of these things directly but if A69 hasn't even bothered to see if he can see the ISS and use some fairly inexpensive optics to see its shape then I think that's a bit weird/lazy.
Say what you like about TFE and Jeran, but at least he got off his arse and went there. He saw something which contradicted his worldview and as a consequence changed that view. The fact he had to see it for himself before believing it is still a bit weird, I don't know why he thinks anyone would have faked all the other timelapses of the 24 hour sun in Antarctica, but at least he did it.

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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Trump

« on: March 17, 2025, 12:17:27 PM »

As barbaric as the US system is in still having the death penalty - something which most advanced civilizations have now moved on from - I didn't think you actually hanged people these days.

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Flat Earth Theory / Re: A paradox in SR

« on: March 15, 2025, 10:20:57 PM »

This is ironic, since many modern researchers have criticisms against Special Relativity.

And by "many" you mean a few people who you cherry picked quotes from, as is your common dishonest tactic.
Your source is your own Wiki which is a box set of that cherry picking. Meanwhile, back in the real world

Special relativity and quantum mechanics are two of the most widely accepted models of how our universe works.

https://www.space.com/36273-theory-special-relativity.html

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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Trump

« on: March 14, 2025, 09:49:07 AM »

However, I am not too sure why you are concerned and appear to care about the success of America, considering that your own country is failing significantly

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/happiest-countries-in-the-world

D’oh!

8

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Trump

« on: March 14, 2025, 08:20:27 AM »

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-tariffs-economic-approval-rating-polls-b2714162.html#

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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Trump

« on: March 14, 2025, 07:51:27 AM »

Your narrative of small surcharges on Canadian and Mexican goods causing this is a terrible take.

Now try responding to what I actually said, not what you're imagining I did.

Here is NY Post to set you straight

Literally the first line of the article:

Wall Street is puking big-time, and the Sell buttons are working overtime whenever the word “tariff” passes from Donald Trump’s lips

This situation will likely correct itself

Well, maybe. But the recent drop IS caused by Trump shouting TARIFF every 5 minutes and the fact that no-one knows what he's going to do next, least of all him.
The markets do not like uncertainty.

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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Trump

« on: March 14, 2025, 07:51:11 AM »

Your narrative of small surcharges on Canadian and Mexican goods causing this is a terrible take.

Now try responding to what I actually said, not what you're imagining I did.

Here is NY Post to set you straight

Literally the first line of the article:

Wall Street is puking big-time, and the Sell buttons are working overtime whenever the word “tariff” passes from Donald Trump’s lips

This situation will likely correct itself

Well, maybe. But the recent drop IS caused by Trump shouting TARIF every 5 minutes and the fact that no-one knows what he's going to do next, least of all him.
The markets do not like uncertainty.

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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Trump

« on: March 13, 2025, 08:16:36 PM »

And did you see how much it gained in the previous two years prior to that?

And who was president when that was going on?

It's called a correction.

And what a coincidence that it happened just as Trump started flailing around shouting “TARIF” at everyone.
The markets actually went up when he first became president. Then everyone realised he has no idea what he’s doing. No strategy. No one knows what he’s going to do next, least of all Trump. The markets hate uncertainty, that’s why everything is tanking.

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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Trump

« on: March 13, 2025, 07:25:32 PM »

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4gdwgjkk1no

It’s almost like the economy is being run by someone who has had multiple failed businesses

Only a retart would doom about the stock market dropping a few percent.

8.5% in the last month.
When was the last monthly drop that big?

13

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Is Earth rotating faster?

« on: March 13, 2025, 01:47:15 PM »

Remember what I was telling everyone here some three years ago: for a real pandemic you need a huge volcanic eruption

No I don't

which is exactly what happened on October 12, 1918 (the largest eruption of the century, Katla). It was the dust from comet Halley (1910) which caused the influenza pandemic.

Citation needed. And you seem to have skilled the "correlation does not imply causation" lesson in science class.

For a pandemic you need something airborne, high population density and a global travel network so people can get around quickly and spread it efficiently.
The second and third of those are in place. The reason Ebola has never become a global pandemic is it's missing the first of those things so while it's very serious it's relatively easy to contain. Flu-like things such as Covid, not so much.

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Flat Earth Theory / Re: Is Earth rotating faster?

« on: March 13, 2025, 08:55:28 AM »

This was filmed in Kiev, just last night:

And what's going on in Ukraine right now which could offer a different explanation for what that is? Did you even look at the text? I did, and used Google to translate. It says:

"Ahahaha, a meteorite? Yeah, let's have an alien landing.
PS: if anything, our air defense forces will handle them too."

There's no claim made that it's the moon. The implication of the bit I've bolded is that it's a missile or drone. Which makes a whole lot more sense than the moon going at that speed which would surely have been seen by a lot of people and been a major news story.

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Flat Earth Theory / Re: Is Earth rotating faster?

« on: March 13, 2025, 08:47:55 AM »

Take a look at the comments, there were other eyewitnesses who were watching the Moon moving faster than usual.

Comments by random people on the internet? Well, there's no way that can be inaccurate then.
I've offered a few possibilities. Do your own tests. Isn't that the Zetetic way.

16

Science & Alternative Science / Re: Nuclear Bombs Do Not Exist

« on: March 12, 2025, 11:16:56 AM »

Do you think that the reluctance to use such weapons around the world since then is only related to the repercussions, or do you think that other variables, such as mutual deterrence, also play a part?

I'd suggest those are more-or-less the same thing. Anyone who dropped a nuke would immediately be the "bad guy" and if it was on a country which either had nuclear capabilities or is ally with one it would almost certainly lead to a retaliation and then it could all escalate into MAD. I don't think anyone is quite mad enough to press the button. And in real life of course there isn't a button - there are checks and balances. Maybe not in North Korea but I don't think even Putin literally has a button on his desk marked "Nuke the West" which he could press on a whim.

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Flat Earth Theory / Re: Is Earth rotating faster?

« on: March 12, 2025, 11:13:19 AM »

No one can explain the movement of the Moon in that clip.

I'm not sure I particularly believe it. Obviously if it was moving that fast then you'd see that everywhere so why don't you test for yourself?
Possible the foreground object is moving, I can't quite tell what that is. And obviously he's zoomed in - the more you zoom in the more the apparent moving will be. I've been dabbling in astrophotography recently but have borrowed a very basic entry level telescope with a mount which has no motor in it. So I'm constantly having the adjust it to keep the moon in frame, not because it's moving "quickly" but because it's zoomed in.
It's cloudy today, next time it's clear I can have a go at taking a video but as I said you can too wherever you are.

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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Trump

« on: March 11, 2025, 06:39:48 AM »

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4gdwgjkk1no

It’s almost like the economy is being run by someone who has had multiple failed businesses

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Science & Alternative Science / Re: Nuclear Bombs Do Not Exist

« on: March 10, 2025, 02:53:34 PM »

Suspiciously, no one anywhere ever uses them! Wow! It must be because humanity is so strong willed and moral

No, it's because of the consequences of using them.
The only time they've been used in the context of a war is when no-one else had them.
And lol @ the idea that Japan surrendered because of "propaganda" and not because two of their cities had been absolutely flattened in a way not possible with conventional weapons.

20

Science & Alternative Science / Re: Blue Ghost

« on: March 07, 2025, 04:21:40 PM »

There are a multitude of alternative explanations for the existence of GPS.

OK. And which of those do you believe and what is your evidence for it?
Or is your belief just a different faith claim?

RE-adherents have a terrible habit of blatantly ignoring the willful, open disinformation campaigns waged by world-wide governments and corporations since the dawn of time

I don't think anyone believes that governments or corporations are shining beacons of truth or integrity.
But that doesn't mean they lie about literally everything and I see no reason that multiple countries would claim to be able to launch things in to space. If they are pretending to be able to that then they're making it hard for themselves by publishing so many photos and so much video from the missions which can be analysed. It would probably be easier if they hadn't done all the ISS stuff too, especially as you can see it from the ground. And are the companies providing satellite TV just sending out millions of dishes which don't really point at anything? I know from personal experience that mine is pointing at something - when a neighbour did some work on his house which needed some scaffolding it blocked the signal. I've also observed on work trips to countries near the equator that the dishes there point up at a noticeably steeper angle.
Why are the Japanese publishing pictures of Apollo landing sites? What do they gain from backing up the US narrative? Why are people at Jodrell Bank in the UK and people in Australia saying they were tracking the Apollo craft and relaying signals? Are they in on it? Why? While we're here, why are NASA handing out contracts to 3rd parties anyway? That's another lot of people who need to be in on it and kept quiet.

and simply state the space race is real, cause "daddy told me so," or the "New York Times reports..."

Well, no. I've seen a shuttle launch. I've listed above the other pieces of evidence I've seen and evaluated.
Your turn. What evidence do you have that GPS is ground based or that the space race didn't happen and satellites aren't really orbiting?
What is that thing in the sky if it isn't a space station? Those people who are currently stranded on it - where are they really?