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Messages - Tom Bishop

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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: President Joe Biden
« on: Today at 01:17:53 AM »
Why should the favorability of foreign countries factor into it? If someone were to suggest that America or China should decide on how British laws are made or how British public monies are spent they would be called a dunce.


I don't see any reason for why anything should be assumed without evidence.

As one who most enjoys simply being a bug on the wall, I must admit I find your requiring evidence of something that's been known for centuries to be a most amusing.

Why do you find it amusing that our side requires evidence and your side does not?

Flat Earth Investigations / Re: The bi-polar FE maps in the wiki/faq
« on: March 07, 2021, 10:29:47 PM »
If you want to start a "How do you explain x" thread, please provide the evidence that x does occur exactly as alleged. Otherwise you may as well explain for us why the earth is flat with an underside made of rocks if it is round.

The OP asked lots of things Tom, probably too many for one post to be fair. But is there anything in there that you'd actually challenge? Surely there must be some baseline level of fact that you accept without requiring evidence, due to it being so well studied and documented? Nothing they said is particularly controversial. Sailors have successfully used the north star, for example, to determine their latitude for hundreds of years - are you seriously demanding evidence for that basic fact? If so, where do your evidence demands end?

And if you do agree with some of it, such as the north star / latitude bit, why not address that point so we can enjoy some discussion about flat earth?

I don't see any reason for why anything should be assumed without evidence.

Maybe you should consider that you are posting here pleading with people to assume things without evidence so that you can proceed to make assertions without evidence and assume those assertions to be fact.

Flat Earth Investigations / Re: The bi-polar FE maps in the wiki/faq
« on: March 07, 2021, 06:13:29 PM »
If you want to start a "How do you explain x" thread, please provide the evidence that x does occur exactly as alleged. Otherwise you may as well explain for us why the earth is flat with an underside made of rocks if it is round.

Suggestions & Concerns / Increase Upload Size on Wiki
« on: March 07, 2021, 05:42:48 AM »
At one point we had set a 30MB upload limit. After some of the MediaWiki updates the upload limit was reduced to 2MB, which I assume is the default. I have a few images for articles that I would like to upload that surpasses this limit.

If space is not a concern, would it be possible to increase the limit to some higher amount, of at least 5MB?

Also, another potential issue is that the users on the Wiki are unable to delete their pages or media to cleanup things which are not needed and not used. So we have a collection of unused pages and images on the Wiki that are floating around.

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Trump
« on: March 04, 2021, 04:24:34 PM »
It was reported days ago that the gold statue of Trump that was paraded at CPAC was made in Mexico. Today, it is reported that it was made in China.

Sounds like good evidence that you are getting your information from bad sources.

Flat Earth Projects / Re: Additions to the Library
« on: March 04, 2021, 03:31:22 AM »
Modern Geocentric work by Walter Van Der Kamp

Airy's Failure Reconsidered

Flat Earth Community / Re: A working map of the Flat Earth
« on: March 04, 2021, 12:31:50 AM »
JSS: "I drove all across the US multiple times, so I can verify the distances in miles for all surveying projects are correct"

No wonder people question your integrity.

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Looking for curvature is a fool's errand.
« on: March 03, 2021, 09:01:49 PM »
Your picture overlay suggests that the earth should obscure all the buildings to the left of the tower.

What you have provided is evidence that it's not actually the curvature of the earth that is doing this.

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: An Idea for the flat earth cover-up
« on: February 24, 2021, 09:09:04 PM »
I don't believe that they're covering up FE. I believe that they have a bunch of fudges and fakery designed to pretend that they have international nuclear deterrence when they don't.

In regards to distances and a true map of the earth, that one is difficult to determine since planes adjust their path to find the quickest winds between any two points, which may be faster in one region than another. There are clearly multiple variables at play in that one -

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Simple Experiments
« on: February 24, 2021, 07:59:41 PM »
The below is a photo of the same experiment on a much grander scale, this shows how when viewed at the same angle, the Moon and the Earth are illuminated the same.

It would be pretty weird if we were looking at that scene and the Sun was behind us.

And if we were looking at that scene with the Sun behind us, you guys would then say that should just take a string and align it horizontally to the Sun behind us to prove that the illuminated portions of the Moon and Earth are pointed at the Sun.

He's an elected official in the State of Arizona and the majority whip. His responsibility is to act as a voice for his constituents and to mobilize votes in the State Senate on major issues. The people voted for him to be there. He represents their views. The position of an elected official representative doesn't require any particular background or expertise, and such expertise might be detrimental and unrepresentative of his constituents, as the people he represents may not have that expertise and he would be acting on his own independent accord. His role is merely to express the general views of the constituents in their place who voted for him and take actions in favor of those views.

He was elected to be the decision maker for a legislative body. As a representative of his constituents he is the arbiter of determining appropriate experts. If Republicans are unhappy about voter fraud it is because their constituents are unhappy about voter fraud. Obviously an audit orchestrated by the people who would have conducted the fraud and would go to jail for it if caught isn't going to fly.

Innocent people don't refuse to obey subpoenas by the Senate and risk arrest. If Democrats think that a Senate audit would involve shenanigans there are legal remedies for exposing that. Planting evidence of a crime is highly illegal. The right thing to do is to let the Senate run its audit and confirm that the people running the election and the machines performed an accurate count.

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Joe Biden is winning by a landslide
« on: February 24, 2021, 02:29:06 AM »
Grand Jury In Maricopa County Expected After Supervisor's Fake Audit - "When your cable guy comes in & hooks up your cable tv and 'certifies' that your remote control works. That's all they've done." "We're going to be demanding that the AG opens up a grand jury investigation."--Sen. Sonny Borrelli

Earth Not a Globe Workshop / Re: Religious Views of the Enlightenment
« on: February 24, 2021, 01:13:55 AM »
Galileo says that Catholics should not question the Copernican system:

    “ The falsity of the Copernican system should not in any way be called into question, above all, not by Catholics, since we have the unshakeable authority of the Sacred Scripture, interpreted by the most erudite theologians, whose consensus gives us certainty regarding the stability of the Earth, situated in the center, and the motion of the sun around the Earth. The conjectures employed by Copernicus and his followers in maintaining the contrary thesis are all sufficiently rebutted by that most solid argument deriving from the omnipotence of God. He is able to bring about in different ways, indeed, in an infinite number of ways, things that, according to our opinion and observation, appear to happen in one particular way. We should not seek to shorten the hand of God and boldly insist on something beyond the limits of our competence. ”
                      —Le Opere Di Galileo Galilei, p. 316, footnote #2.

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Joe Biden is winning by a landslide
« on: February 23, 2021, 09:22:12 PM »
Yeah, we should just believe the people who would have conducted the fraud that there is no fraud.  ::)

From that link - "The supervisors hired the two outside firms, Pro V&V and SLI Compliance, to offer an independent look at the county's voting machines and election results."

The people conducting the fraud picked the companies.

BREAKING EXCLUSIVE: The Same Clandestine Companies Involved in the Certification of Dominion Voting Systems and the 2020 Results in Georgia Were Chosen for the Upcoming Arizona ‘Audit’ -

"The Board of Supervisors, whom many believe are covering up election corruption due to their actions since the 2020 election, decided to pass on expert Jovan Pulitzer, who has a thorough and independent method to review the ballots and results.  Instead the Maricopa Board, after suing the Arizona Senate for ordering an audit be performed, eventually agreed to an audit but only if they could choose the auditors.  The county officials then limited their choices to Pro V&V and SLI Compliance."

The Maricopa Board of Supervisors were disobeying a subpoena to turn over elections material to the Arizona Senate for an audit

They were almost arrested, but the vote failed by a single vote.

How shady is that?

These Maricopa elections officials are refusing to comply with a subpoena from the Senate of their state, and now you want us to trust them.

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Simple Experiments
« on: February 23, 2021, 06:52:07 PM »
On the "Ball Experiment" -

So the argument is admitting that the ball experiment is a perspective effect, but the argument is now pointing out that when you align the ball to the Moon, the phase points in a similar direction. This is an argument that the Moon is undergoing a perspective effect.

If the Moon was aligning itself along on a surface of a sphere, it would also match the perspective effect. The perspective effect is unable to distinguish whether something is curving/aligning on a sphere around you, or if it is pointing upwards to perspective, because when you look around an object with this perspective effect the shifts in the perspective are making spherical shifts.

I created a semi-transparent wire-frame sphere with a purple cone inside of it:

Front View - Take note of the two rings that looks like an X:

Top View - Again, take note of the two rings that looks like an X:

Now when I aligned two of the rings which were angled like X's from the front and top views above the cone pointed upwards, matching the angle of the ring in the foreground and background.

View is from below the work plane. The purple cone basically matched the sphere around it.

There is no way to distinguish whether something is angled on the celestial sphere or not with this effect alone. Since this effect is orienting bodies in a spherical manner it will not distinguish whether something is truly angled as if on a sphere or not. Perspective causes similar shifts in a spherical manner simply because when you perform this effect you are looking at the object from a spherical direction around it. When viewing from spherical directions around an object it follows that it will shift in a spherical manner.

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Simple Experiments
« on: February 22, 2021, 09:58:09 PM »
On the "String Experiment" -

If I were to take a water bottle (red) and hold it out to match the Moon's orientation and where the light is coming from, it would appear that both Moon and water bottle are pointing out into space and not at the Sun.

If I were to take a string (blue) and align it with the ecliptic, the path near where the Sun and Moon travel across the sky, the string might be able to hit the Sun, but this 'string experiment' is unable to distinguish whether the string is aligning with the body you are putting it against.

Diagram is more or less similar to what I saw yesterday.

If the Moon and illuminated part of the Moon follows the ecliptic as it moves, aligning the string with the ecliptic would cause the Moon to connect to the Sun. However, this does not show that the illuminated area is pointing at the Sun, any more than being able to connect a string between objects in this scene show that the illuminated area is pointing at the sun:

Wow! We can connect a string between them. The illuminated portion of the Moon must be pointed at the Sun.

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Simple Experiments
« on: February 22, 2021, 09:51:26 PM »
So yes, it is a perspective effect. You seem to see this as a fatal flaw in the experiment when actually it’s the exact point. The phase we see on the moon depends on our perspective.

As you admit, the experiment is using a perspective effect to get the illuminated portion of the ball to point upwards. This doesn't demonstrate that the Moon is pointing upwards because of a perspective effect. We are using a perspective effect to get the ball to point upwards, when it could alternatively be that the Moon is pointing upwards and we are just matching it.

The experiment is unable to distinguish whether the Moon is actually pointing upwards or not. Previously I had a Moon pointing upwards in the background of a 3D scene and I was moving the camera around a ball in the foreground to match it. Why can't the same thing be going on here?

More on the fallacious ball experiment.

Foreground and background balls misaligned:

Wow, by moving the camera around the ball in the foreground I can make the foreground ball match a similar orientation to the ball in the background. Moon Illusion ProoooF!!

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Simple Experiments
« on: February 22, 2021, 06:28:42 PM »
On the "Ball Experiment" -

Bay Area California, Feb 21st, 2021, pictures taken around 5:27 PM PST with a Google Pixel 3 XL Phone.

Image 1:

I placed the ball on a post along the side of a road. The sun was shining from a horizontal direction. The ball is half lit.

Full Size:

Image 2:

Viewpoint from behind the ball, looking at Sun:

Full Size:

Image 3:

From a position front of the ball, with our back to sun, we can see that the illuminated portion of the Moon pointing upwards in the background. See Full Size for detail.

Full Size:

Image 4:

Closeup of the Moon in the background, while zooming in the device created a digital leveling tool on the screen to help ensure the device was level. Compare the orientation to the Moon in the Full Size Image 3 above.

Full Size:

Image 5:

Next I moved my position to below the ball and the top of the post, to get the ball to point upwards via a close range perspective effect. I could have done a better job at getting the phase to match, by moving the camera around. But it was easy to move the camera downwards to get the illuminated portion to point upwards:

Full Size:

Another version of the Tilt -

Image 6:

Finally, I turned the device and placed the ball across the screen from the sun on a wide frame. The illuminated portion pointed at the Sun.

Full Size:

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Simple Experiments
« on: February 21, 2021, 09:41:16 PM »
Quote from: Longtitube
And this is precisely the problem. If someone discovers the Moon's shadow alignment is replicated at ground level with a common ping pong ball held between eye and Moon, then what need is there to explain this with Electromagnetic Acceleration?

EA wasn't made up to explain the Moon Tilt Illusion. The Moon Tilt Illusion is simply a geometric consequence of EA.

RE'ers of all stripes are blasting the internet and literature, searching for explanations and ways to explain the Moon Tilt Illusion in RE under straight line geometry - invoking odd distortion to our vision, perspective effects, celestial spheres, and spamming all manner of specious reasonings, whereas it is simply a geometrical consequence of the FE model.

We didn't search for an answer, it was already there, due to the geometry of the pre-existing model. You know that it's not part of your model, hence the multiple explanations and nonsense.

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