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Offline timterroo

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Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #240 on: June 25, 2020, 08:04:07 PM »
Just like minorities get trained to pull the race card every time they want to do what they want to do without logical consequence.

Now that's an interesting claim.

Let's say this is true.... who's training them to pull the race card?
"noche te ipsum"

"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough."  - Albert Einstein

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Offline Roundy

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Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #241 on: June 25, 2020, 08:05:37 PM »
Just like minorities get trained to pull the race card every time they want to do what they want to do without logical consequence.

Now that's an interesting claim.

Let's say this is true.... who's training them to pull the race card?

The liberal media, of course.   ::)
Electro-Theologist, Poet, Philosopher, Musician, Etymologist, Egyptologist, Astro-Theologist, Geocentrist, Flat Earther, and Collector of Rare Books.

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Offline Tumeni

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Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #242 on: June 26, 2020, 09:59:33 AM »
Again, pre-protests, but footage has emerged of a Miami Gardens officer tasing a pregnant woman in the stomach while he has her pinned on the ground with his knee on her neck. According to some reporting, she later lost the baby. Over a minor argument in a night club.

He was fired, and has now been charged with battery. Apparently, the officer was working "off-duty security" at the time... 
=============================
Not Flat. Happy to prove this, if you ask me.
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Nearly all flat earthers agree the earth is not a globe.

Nearly?

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Offline Tumeni

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Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #243 on: June 26, 2020, 10:06:08 AM »
Police, not protesters, are overwhelmingly responsible for attacks on journalists

See pressfredomtracker.us

440+ reported aggressions against the press during BLM protests
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Not Flat. Happy to prove this, if you ask me.
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Nearly all flat earthers agree the earth is not a globe.

Nearly?

Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #244 on: June 26, 2020, 10:12:10 AM »
Just like minorities get trained to pull the race card every time they want to do what they want to do without logical consequence.

Now that's an interesting claim.

Let's say this is true.... who's training them to pull the race card?
Life.
I didn't say (conversion of) thermal energy wasn't involved at all.
A rocket does not create thrust by converting thermal energy.

Offline ChrisTP

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Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #245 on: June 26, 2020, 10:36:15 AM »
Just like minorities get trained to pull the race card every time they want to do what they want to do without logical consequence.

Now that's an interesting claim.

Let's say this is true.... who's training them to pull the race card?
Life.
Yes I imagine a life full of racism would train them to point out racism toward them.
Tom is wrong most of the time. Hardly big news, don't you think?

Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #246 on: June 26, 2020, 10:47:56 AM »
Just like minorities get trained to pull the race card every time they want to do what they want to do without logical consequence.

Now that's an interesting claim.

Let's say this is true.... who's training them to pull the race card?
Life.
Yes I imagine a life full of racism would train them to point out racism toward them.
Why do you have such an easy time ignoring the injustice of others directed at you?

I know why I do.
I didn't say (conversion of) thermal energy wasn't involved at all.
A rocket does not create thrust by converting thermal energy.

Offline ChrisTP

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Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #247 on: June 26, 2020, 12:31:07 PM »
Just like minorities get trained to pull the race card every time they want to do what they want to do without logical consequence.

Now that's an interesting claim.

Let's say this is true.... who's training them to pull the race card?
Life.
Yes I imagine a life full of racism would train them to point out racism toward them.
Why do you have such an easy time ignoring the injustice of others directed at you?

I know why I do.
I'm not sure I fully understand your question, can you explain? I don't think I'm ignoring any injustice and I'm not entirely sure what you mean by 'injustice of others directed at me'. Which injustice, at who others and how is any of that directed at me?

You say people are trained by life to pull the race card, I agree with you, a lifetime full of racism toward a person would make them quicker to point out racism toward them. I'm fully acknowledging the injustice of racial discrimination.

If you know why you have an easy time ignoring racial discrimination and injustice by all means tell us.
Tom is wrong most of the time. Hardly big news, don't you think?

Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #248 on: June 29, 2020, 11:58:10 AM »
Just like minorities get trained to pull the race card every time they want to do what they want to do without logical consequence.

Now that's an interesting claim.

Let's say this is true.... who's training them to pull the race card?
Life.
Yes I imagine a life full of racism would train them to point out racism toward them.
Why do you have such an easy time ignoring the injustice of others directed at you?

I know why I do.
I'm not sure I fully understand your question, can you explain? I don't think I'm ignoring any injustice and I'm not entirely sure what you mean by 'injustice of others directed at me'. Which injustice, at who others and how is any of that directed at me?
Injustice occurs toward you each day, does it not?
You say people are trained by life to pull the race card, I agree with you, a lifetime full of racism toward a person would make them quicker to point out racism toward them. I'm fully acknowledging the injustice of racial discrimination.
I find it hard to believe you are so quick to accept the word of another regarding racial injustice, having experienced none yourself.

How do you know it is real?
If you know why you have an easy time ignoring racial discrimination and injustice by all means tell us.
I do not try and guess the motivation of others when they commit acts of injustice.

I simply realize it is an unjust act, call it such, and realize life is not fair and never was and never will be.
I didn't say (conversion of) thermal energy wasn't involved at all.
A rocket does not create thrust by converting thermal energy.

Offline ChrisTP

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Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #249 on: June 29, 2020, 04:23:32 PM »
Quote
I find it hard to believe you are so quick to accept the word of another regarding racial injustice, having experienced none yourself.
What makes you say that? What a strange stance since you've seen literally 0% of my life experiences and you've no idea what I look like or what my background is. I've certainly had people discriminate me based on race and gender (in fact it's the trendy thing to do at universities by 'woke' students at the moment). I've experienced injustice, even if it's not to the degree of getting shot at by police. Regardless, it's pretty obvious based on the vast amounts of evidence that racism exists and it goes both ways, but one way has been more extreme. Hell I've had people pull the race card on me even though I'd consider myself rather of accepting (or rather I don't give a shit) of peoples race so it's not to say people don't randomly pull the race card at every chance because some do. If racism didn't exist people wouldn't think to pull a race card though.
Tom is wrong most of the time. Hardly big news, don't you think?

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Offline TomInAustin

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Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #250 on: June 29, 2020, 04:24:23 PM »
https://imgur.com/gallery/qnpKl0j

Defence lawyer's Twitter thread of instances of unprovoked, almost casual brutality from the police has reached over 300 entries now.

In the instance above, elderly man pushed over by police, cracks head on concrete, and they casually walk past him like he's a piece of trash

Wheelchair-bound homeless guy in LA shot and blinded in one eye

Journalist ordered to lie face down, while waving his press credentials and pleading to be let up, a group of cops walk past, and one of them casually pepper sprays him, apparently out of spite.

Numerous cases of people blinded or injured from close-quarters hits from rubber bullets and such

Utah police rush up to clearly fragile older man WITH A WALKING STICK and jostle him along the road until he falls.

Woman is sitting on ground, face covered, apparently from effects of pepper spray, and cop walks up and casually kicks her over.

etc

etc

@greg_doucette



This is a 2 sided problem when it comes to inner cities and poor people.   

1.  The Police are undertrained, underpaid, and under-educated.    They developed an "us against them" mentality and it shows.
2.  You have vast areas of people that have lived with poverty for generations.  Except for a few outliers, no one succeeds and those few have left.   The young people have no one to look up to besides the criminals that have money, nice cars, clothes, guns, etc.


Now put these 2 groups together and it's no surprise that shit hits the fan.



Nothing Guest has ever said should be taken as representative of anything other than Guest's own delusions opinions.

Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #251 on: June 30, 2020, 10:06:02 AM »
Quote
I find it hard to believe you are so quick to accept the word of another regarding racial injustice, having experienced none yourself.
What makes you say that? What a strange stance since you've seen literally 0% of my life experiences and you've no idea what I look like or what my background is. I've certainly had people discriminate me based on race and gender (in fact it's the trendy thing to do at universities by 'woke' students at the moment). I've experienced injustice, even if it's not to the degree of getting shot at by police. Regardless, it's pretty obvious based on the vast amounts of evidence that racism exists and it goes both ways, but one way has been more extreme. Hell I've had people pull the race card on me even though I'd consider myself rather of accepting (or rather I don't give a shit) of peoples race so it's not to say people don't randomly pull the race card at every chance because some do. If racism didn't exist people wouldn't think to pull a race card though.
This is laughable.

In the very first question I asked you about injustices and you provided no background whatsoever, demonstrating you are not even interested in a serious discussion, further evidenced by ignoring the actual question.
« Last Edit: June 30, 2020, 10:43:08 AM by totallackey »
I didn't say (conversion of) thermal energy wasn't involved at all.
A rocket does not create thrust by converting thermal energy.

Offline ChrisTP

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Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #252 on: June 30, 2020, 11:33:37 AM »
Quote
I find it hard to believe you are so quick to accept the word of another regarding racial injustice, having experienced none yourself.
What makes you say that? What a strange stance since you've seen literally 0% of my life experiences and you've no idea what I look like or what my background is. I've certainly had people discriminate me based on race and gender (in fact it's the trendy thing to do at universities by 'woke' students at the moment). I've experienced injustice, even if it's not to the degree of getting shot at by police. Regardless, it's pretty obvious based on the vast amounts of evidence that racism exists and it goes both ways, but one way has been more extreme. Hell I've had people pull the race card on me even though I'd consider myself rather of accepting (or rather I don't give a shit) of peoples race so it's not to say people don't randomly pull the race card at every chance because some do. If racism didn't exist people wouldn't think to pull a race card though.
This is laughable.

In the very first question I asked you about injustices and you provided no background whatsoever, demonstrating you are not even interested in a serious discussion, further evidenced by ignoring the actual question.
Because we aren't here to discuss my personal injustices, we're here to talk about whether or not the US police force are competent. This has nothing to do with my life here in the UK. I'm not going to tell you my life story when it has no relevance to the topic (and is really my business whether I share information about my life).
Tom is wrong most of the time. Hardly big news, don't you think?

Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #253 on: June 30, 2020, 11:40:30 AM »
Quote
I find it hard to believe you are so quick to accept the word of another regarding racial injustice, having experienced none yourself.
What makes you say that? What a strange stance since you've seen literally 0% of my life experiences and you've no idea what I look like or what my background is. I've certainly had people discriminate me based on race and gender (in fact it's the trendy thing to do at universities by 'woke' students at the moment). I've experienced injustice, even if it's not to the degree of getting shot at by police. Regardless, it's pretty obvious based on the vast amounts of evidence that racism exists and it goes both ways, but one way has been more extreme. Hell I've had people pull the race card on me even though I'd consider myself rather of accepting (or rather I don't give a shit) of peoples race so it's not to say people don't randomly pull the race card at every chance because some do. If racism didn't exist people wouldn't think to pull a race card though.
This is laughable.

In the very first question I asked you about injustices and you provided no background whatsoever, demonstrating you are not even interested in a serious discussion, further evidenced by ignoring the actual question.
Because we aren't here to discuss my personal injustices, we're here to talk about whether or not the US police force are competent. This has nothing to do with my life here in the UK. I'm not going to tell you my life story when it has no relevance to the topic (and is really my business whether I share information about my life).
If you have no experience with the American police or forms of injustice then you really have no worthwhile insight in the topic at all.

Neither does Tumeni.

You are incapable of even drawing correlation between any of your experiences and that of persons involved with the American system.

Even offering you the benefit of doubt when it comes to such a function, you do not want to discuss it within this most worthwhile framework due to its exposition demonstrating the bankruptcy of your overall message.
I didn't say (conversion of) thermal energy wasn't involved at all.
A rocket does not create thrust by converting thermal energy.

Offline ChrisTP

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Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #254 on: June 30, 2020, 12:11:10 PM »
Quote
I find it hard to believe you are so quick to accept the word of another regarding racial injustice, having experienced none yourself.
What makes you say that? What a strange stance since you've seen literally 0% of my life experiences and you've no idea what I look like or what my background is. I've certainly had people discriminate me based on race and gender (in fact it's the trendy thing to do at universities by 'woke' students at the moment). I've experienced injustice, even if it's not to the degree of getting shot at by police. Regardless, it's pretty obvious based on the vast amounts of evidence that racism exists and it goes both ways, but one way has been more extreme. Hell I've had people pull the race card on me even though I'd consider myself rather of accepting (or rather I don't give a shit) of peoples race so it's not to say people don't randomly pull the race card at every chance because some do. If racism didn't exist people wouldn't think to pull a race card though.
This is laughable.

In the very first question I asked you about injustices and you provided no background whatsoever, demonstrating you are not even interested in a serious discussion, further evidenced by ignoring the actual question.
Because we aren't here to discuss my personal injustices, we're here to talk about whether or not the US police force are competent. This has nothing to do with my life here in the UK. I'm not going to tell you my life story when it has no relevance to the topic (and is really my business whether I share information about my life).
If you have no experience with the American police or forms of injustice then you really have no worthwhile insight in the topic at all.

Neither does Tumeni.

You are incapable of even drawing correlation between any of your experiences and that of persons involved with the American system.

Even offering you the benefit of doubt when it comes to such a function, you do not want to discuss it within this most worthwhile framework due to its exposition demonstrating the bankruptcy of your overall message.
Lol... Just because I don't live in america doesn't mean I've never been to america or seen anything to do with american law enforcement. This a really strange opinion for you to have, given that it would mean you can't have an opinion on literally anything unless it's something related directly to yourself.

Just the other day you used LiverpoolFC as an example for how English people and the English police force act. I guess that point of yours is void? Since you don't live in the UK and aren't a footballer or a UK police officer or football hooligan in Liverpool? Of course not, you can still have an outside view of something. You can still see stuff happening via media or first hand experience when going on holidays. I don't have to be living in the US to see that some US officers are breaking the law or discriminating against race. I don't need to have been there at the time of an incident to see that there was an incident when there's video footage of an incident. There's documented evidence of that stuff for me to see. Just like everyone else in this thread that isn't from the US, I can have a viewpoint of the US. In fact people all around the globe has an opinion about the US.
Tom is wrong most of the time. Hardly big news, don't you think?

Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #255 on: June 30, 2020, 12:19:35 PM »
Lol... Just because I don't live in america doesn't mean I've never been to america or seen anything to do with american law enforcement. This a really strange opinion for you to have, given that it would mean you can't have an opinion on literally anything unless it's something related directly to yourself.
I didn't write you couldn't have an opinion.

I wrote your opinion is worth no consideration by others unless presented within a framework.
Just the other day you used LiverpoolFC as an example for how English people and the English police force act. I guess that point of yours is void? Since you don't live in the UK and aren't a footballer or a UK police officer or football hooligan in Liverpool? Of course not, you can still have an outside view of something.
All correct.
You can still see stuff happening via media or first hand experience when going on holidays. I don't have to be living in the US to see that some US officers are breaking the law or discriminating against race. I don't need to have been there at the time of an incident to see that there was an incident when there's video footage of an incident. There's documented evidence of that stuff for me to see. Just like everyone else in this thread that isn't from the US, I can have a viewpoint of the US. In fact people all around the globe has an opinion about the US.
All worthless, unless discussed within the framework of experience and correlation.

And like I wrote earlier, that type of discussion would bankrupt your position.
I didn't say (conversion of) thermal energy wasn't involved at all.
A rocket does not create thrust by converting thermal energy.

Offline ChrisTP

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Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #256 on: June 30, 2020, 12:50:44 PM »
Lol... Just because I don't live in america doesn't mean I've never been to america or seen anything to do with american law enforcement. This a really strange opinion for you to have, given that it would mean you can't have an opinion on literally anything unless it's something related directly to yourself.
I didn't write you couldn't have an opinion.

I wrote your opinion is worth no consideration by others unless presented within a framework.
Just the other day you used LiverpoolFC as an example for how English people and the English police force act. I guess that point of yours is void? Since you don't live in the UK and aren't a footballer or a UK police officer or football hooligan in Liverpool? Of course not, you can still have an outside view of something.
All correct.
You can still see stuff happening via media or first hand experience when going on holidays. I don't have to be living in the US to see that some US officers are breaking the law or discriminating against race. I don't need to have been there at the time of an incident to see that there was an incident when there's video footage of an incident. There's documented evidence of that stuff for me to see. Just like everyone else in this thread that isn't from the US, I can have a viewpoint of the US. In fact people all around the globe has an opinion about the US.
All worthless, unless discussed within the framework of experience and correlation.

And like I wrote earlier, that type of discussion would bankrupt your position.
Yea sorry this isn't how it works. You don't know what experiences I've had, you've no idea what I've learned through life. not being in the US doesn't "bankrupt" my position. Which btw, is that most officers are sound and only a few bad apples that get a lot of media coverage ruin it for the rest. but IMO Those bad apples shouldn't have made it to their position. So I guess I'd question the education system of the US and the training that police officers receive. when I've seen evidence of those bad apples existing, my point still stands I believe. I don't have an extreme position which I get the feeling you think I do. I just think potential officers should go through more of a trial and better training. I think anyone showing red flags of having a massive ego shouldn't be an officer. I think any officer shown to be abusing their position or breaking the law themselves should be stripped of their position.

Not everyone is cut out to be a law enforcement officer, I know I wouldn't be, so I have nothing against people that do that stuff for a living but I can visibly see some of them aren't capable and shouldn't be an officer. There are cultural differences that make the US and UK police really quite different for sure, but that doesn't mean I don't have any insight into the US police force, especially since the US is under a microscope most of the time.
Tom is wrong most of the time. Hardly big news, don't you think?

Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #257 on: June 30, 2020, 02:35:40 PM »
Lol... Just because I don't live in america doesn't mean I've never been to america or seen anything to do with american law enforcement. This a really strange opinion for you to have, given that it would mean you can't have an opinion on literally anything unless it's something related directly to yourself.
I didn't write you couldn't have an opinion.

I wrote your opinion is worth no consideration by others unless presented within a framework.
Just the other day you used LiverpoolFC as an example for how English people and the English police force act. I guess that point of yours is void? Since you don't live in the UK and aren't a footballer or a UK police officer or football hooligan in Liverpool? Of course not, you can still have an outside view of something.
All correct.
You can still see stuff happening via media or first hand experience when going on holidays. I don't have to be living in the US to see that some US officers are breaking the law or discriminating against race. I don't need to have been there at the time of an incident to see that there was an incident when there's video footage of an incident. There's documented evidence of that stuff for me to see. Just like everyone else in this thread that isn't from the US, I can have a viewpoint of the US. In fact people all around the globe has an opinion about the US.
All worthless, unless discussed within the framework of experience and correlation.

And like I wrote earlier, that type of discussion would bankrupt your position.
Yea sorry this isn't how it works.
That is exactly how it works.
You don't know what experiences I've had, you've no idea what I've learned through life. not being in the US doesn't "bankrupt" my position.
You are correct.

I do not know your experience.

I didn't write what you have stated I wrote.

It is not the idea of you having never been or even being in the US which bankrupts your position.

It is your lack of framework provided for interpretation of whatever experience you have had, applied to the subject matter at hand, which bankrupts your position.

That, and of course which you so clearly demonstrate here, a decided lack of understanding.
Which btw, is that most officers are sound and only a few bad apples that get a lot of media coverage ruin it for the rest.
There is some semblance of a framework offered here, but it certainly isn't your entire position.

And I agree with what you wrote, except it doesn't ruin it for the rest.

Too broad a brush.

The people chosen for the police come from society, just like every other occupation.

As far as the rest of it, discipline has and is being taken.

You act like it hasn't.
« Last Edit: July 06, 2020, 02:27:37 PM by totallackey »
I didn't say (conversion of) thermal energy wasn't involved at all.
A rocket does not create thrust by converting thermal energy.

Offline ChrisTP

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Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #258 on: June 30, 2020, 07:47:45 PM »
Lol... Just because I don't live in america doesn't mean I've never been to america or seen anything to do with american law enforcement. This a really strange opinion for you to have, given that it would mean you can't have an opinion on literally anything unless it's something related directly to yourself.
I didn't write you couldn't have an opinion.

I wrote your opinion is worth no consideration by others unless presented within a framework.
Just the other day you used LiverpoolFC as an example for how English people and the English police force act. I guess that point of yours is void? Since you don't live in the UK and aren't a footballer or a UK police officer or football hooligan in Liverpool? Of course not, you can still have an outside view of something.
All correct.
You can still see stuff happening via media or first hand experience when going on holidays. I don't have to be living in the US to see that some US officers are breaking the law or discriminating against race. I don't need to have been there at the time of an incident to see that there was an incident when there's video footage of an incident. There's documented evidence of that stuff for me to see. Just like everyone else in this thread that isn't from the US, I can have a viewpoint of the US. In fact people all around the globe has an opinion about the US.
All worthless, unless discussed within the framework of experience and correlation.

And like I wrote earlier, that type of discussion would bankrupt your position.
Yea sorry this isn't how it works.
That is exactly how it works.
You don't know what experiences I've had, you've no idea what I've learned through life. not being in the US doesn't "bankrupt" my position.
You are correct.

I do not know your experience.

I didn't write what you have stated I wrote.

It is not the idea of you having never been or even having been to the US which bankrupts your position.

It is your lack of framework provided for interpretation of whatever experience you have had. applied to the subject matter at hand, which bankrupts your position.

That, and of course which you so clearly demonstrate here, a decided lack of understanding.
Which btw, is that most officers are sound and only a few bad apples that get a lot of media coverage ruin it for the rest.
There is some semblance of a framework offered here, but it certainly isn't your entire position.

And I agree with what you wrote, except it doesn't ruin it for the rest.

Too broad a brush.

The people chosen for the police come from society, just like every other occupation.

As far as the rest of it, discipline has and is being taken.

You act like it hasn't.
Ok well I'll remember this the next time you chime in to a topic about rockets with your absolute lack of experience in rocket science or engineering. Worthless indeed.

Yes what I wrote is a broad description. I guess you can round it down to the fact that there are any bad apples at all should not be possible. Police enforcing the law should be lawful. Some aren't and that is not acceptable. Some get found out and disciplined sure, but

A) Why were they able to become an officer in the first place and
B) What about all the ones that haven't been found out yet?

Don't get me wrong, I don't expect every officer to have gone through law school and be the perfect specimen of human, no one is perfect, but you can find footage of some absolute moronic police officers and that shouldn't be possible. You don't need to have experienced it for yourself to see that. How can someone uphold the law while not being lawful? Why were they given such a position? How were they able to keep that position for years? How can I expect the police to protect and serve citizens if there's potentially morons with big egos in the force? These are questions I think desperately need to be answered and corrected in future. It should be progress at least ie; something needs to change.
Tom is wrong most of the time. Hardly big news, don't you think?

Offline ChrisTP

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Re: Are the American police out of control?
« Reply #259 on: July 03, 2020, 06:57:41 AM »
black man was arrested for dancing in the street... Wut. Why would it escalate to that point? Police are supposed to be trained to deescalate. I understand they have to investigate when someone calls them but... Cops arrive, ask the guy if everything is all good, guy says year just doing my morning routine. Cops at that point should have just stopped bothering him but instead went into restraining him, which is ridiculous. And having to have neighbours come out and vouch for you to the police is also ridiculous because he was doing nothing wrong... It's a completely bizarre exchange between the police and the guy.
 

Tom is wrong most of the time. Hardly big news, don't you think?