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Messages - Tumeni

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There's a video doing the rounds on social media at the moment, showing the New Jersey police citing a citizen for carrying an open beer in public. There's around half a dozen of them pushing him over a park bench, pinning him to the ground, cuffing him, and leading him away.

In another instance, in Portland, a group of around 15 officers swarm someone for chalking on the pavement. later charging them with "destruction of government property". This video is notable for the concerted efforts of around a dozen of these fiften to merely get in the way of the camera, and prevent filming of the three or four who are dogpiling the victim.

Looks like some defunding would help here.

Is there anyone on this forum who thinks that this is a worthwhile use of police time or resources? Is there anyone here who would consider this the result of having too many police standing around, looking for something to do?

In other news, nineteen LAPD officers stand accused of falsification of incident reports, and conspiracy to do so. The criminal complaint against the first three of those officers includes 59 counts of wrongdoing.

Tom, it's clear that many police forces up and down your country have spent an absolute sh*tload of money on equipment which has NO PURPOSE other than to brutalise the citizens who actually fund the police.

The American taxpayer has given some city police forces a budget of greater than HALF the entire city budget; more than 50%; the majority of the budget.

We can see what they spent it on; seemingly endless supplies of -  plexiglass shields; batons and other hand weapons; helmets; body armour; gas masks; plastic zip-tie cuffs; baton rounds, and launchers; rubber bullets & launchers; pepper balls & launchers; tear gas & launchers; flash-bang grenades & launchers, etc, etc. This stuff has NO PURPOSE other than to cause pain and suffering.

Tell us truthfully - wouldn't you prefer that your money went on something other than this in your community?

When teachers are dipping into their own pockets to provide educational supplies for their students, wouldn't you agree with at least some money being taken away from the police budget to better educate the children? These are the children of the taxpayers whose money is being spent by the police...

When citizens in your country are queuing up for food banks, wouldn't you prefer that some of that police budget goes on food to feed the taxpayer? 

A world without police looks like "a suburb" according to liberal dem leadership.

Why is he "imagining" this?

Defunding the police is not the same as total removal of police. Defunding means reallocating budgets so that (for instance) the police spend what they do get on things which work for the community, as opposed to acquisition of military-grade hardware to be used against citizens exercising their first amendment right to free speech and assembly.

The suggestion is that, for instance, schools police should not be investing in grenade launchers.

Defunding is suggested in order to balance up the budget in some cities, where it can be seen that the police budget is greater than the amount spent on EVERYTHING else by the city. The police force is getting over half the budget. The city budget is effectively the police budget, with all others fighting for the scraps.

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Trump
« on: July 13, 2020, 08:44:08 PM »

GOP voter registrations outpace Dems in swing states: report

In Maine, for example, 59 percent of new voters registered as Dems pre-coronavirus — but only 40 percent have done so in the months since.

Dem declines were also seen in Colorado, Florida, North Carolina and Pennsylvania, TargetSmart found.

Additionally, in the swing state of Iowa, the new voters helped the GOP retake the statewide lead in voter registrations last month, Politico reported.

Why does that get a LOL?

Mr. West ...

The author uses a close-range perspective effect to match the Moon. There is little doubt that holding something very near to one's face or camera can create lots of angles. Yet, in the first far distance scene the illuminated portion of the ball points at the Sun. It is not until the observer gets up close to the ball, to a special carefully selected position beneath it, that the ball is able to point away from the sun, in a similar direction as the Moon.

So we see, the phase of the ball does not behave in the same at all positions. One must carefully select the position of the camera to match the Moon.

The observer, without the ball, can look at the Moon, or the Sun, or points elsewhere. If he looks at the Moon, he is looking along side CA, toward A; if at the Sun, along side CB, toward B.

The only place to hold the ball in order to see if its phase matches that of the Moon is ON side CA. If you hold it elsewhere, at any of the "other angles" or "other positions" that you refer to, you've instantly defeated the whole point of the exercise.

Since it is impossible to see through most ping-pong or golf balls, the observer must hold the ball slightly off from the line of side CA in order to see both the ball and the Moon. If it is held perfectly ON the line, it will obscure the Moon.

OF COURSE the phase of the ball will vary if you look at it from different places. If you look at it from between it and the sun, from a point along side CB, toward C, it will have no phase, and all you will see is the lit surface. If you look at it from outwith the triangle, from a point extended along BC but "behind" the ball with respect to the Sun, all you will see is shade. The phase will vary according to the angle at which you view it, and will only match the Moon's if you hold it such that you are viewing it AND the Moon from the same angle.

The whole idea of the exercise is to observe the ball from the same angle at which you are viewing the Moon. 

Your lamp posts from a page or so back (currently #74) only line up if you stand in line with them. Clearly, if you stand elsewhere, they will not line up. Clearly, if you do not align your line of sight with the ball AND the Moon, they will not appear to have the same phase.

Let's take a triangle, A being the center of the Moon, B the center of the Sun, C your eye.

If you hold a string between any point on AC and any point on BC, this line will appear to your eye as a straight line between A and B. There are infinite possibilities but the end result is the same. You will see a projection of AB.

To put it another way;

When viewed from the side, the three points form the plane of the triangle, and it appears as a straight line from this viewpoint, because you cannot perceive its shape from looking at its edge. However, the observer can only view the plane of it from point C itself, not from the point of view of the side view shown.

A string held up at point C, the earth observer, aligned with side AB would in side view, simply merge into the plane of the triangle. It looks to be parallel to side AB from the observer viewpoint. It could be parallel, and it might vary, but from this viewpoint, it could not be seen whether it was or not.

If viewed from above the triangle, Tom appears to be arguing in the last page or two that whilst the string appears to be parallel to AB, it could be non-parallel, and still appear to the Earth observer to be so (still in the plane of the triangle, but non-parallel to AB - aligned across the triangle, as it were). This appears to be the argument starting with the green cone. Yes, it is possible to align the string with AB along the plane, but have it non-parallel to the side itself; but this does. not. matter.

It only matters if the observer has the ability to view the situation from above. Nobody can do this.   

IMG snipped

The phase of the ball will change with small movements around the scene. If the camera is somewhere behind his hand looking up at the moon the ping pong ball is going to be a darker phase. If the camera is angled from lower, looking up, the phase of the ping pong ball is going to be pointing more upwards.

Of course it will. So what? Do you really STILL not get the point of the exercise? 

The whole idea is to look at the ball AT THE SAME ANGLE at which you are looking at the Moon. Call the datum line between your eye and the ball, or your eye and the Moon, the zero degree 'datum' line.

For the ball, in order to move your eye or camera to the side, such that you have moved the datum line 5 degrees, you move your eye or camera a small distance.

In order to do the same for the Moon, you must move it a large distance.

So if you move the eye or camera a small distance to yield a different phase on the ball, you will not have changed your view of the phase of the Moon. Because the Moon is much further away than the ball.

In order to match the angle, you hold the ball as close as you can to the Moon in your field of vision, hold the ball in line with the Moon, such that the angles match as closely as they can. If you don't, there's no point. 

1. You claim that if we hold a laser pointer up to the ascending line of street lights that the beams will shine out upwards into space, and not at the horizon behind you, because the upwards ascent is an illusion.

Draw a line across the (presumed to be all at the same level) lights, and that line continued to the right and behind the observer appears to ascend, and the continuation to the left, away from the photographer appears to descend.

It's an illusion. You know the light columns are not getting shorter. You know that the lights in the distance are not resting on the ground. You know that the ones behind the observer are not taller than those in view. It's an illusion.

EDIT to add image and comment below

If there's more lights behind the observer, and he turns around, they will then appear to descend toward the ground, not ascend. The illusion depends on where the observer observes from, and in which direction he/she looks. Agree?

I also agree that any police officer should respond to all calls and find out what the issue and then act on it appropriately.

Firstly, the calls should be getting filtered so that officers are not being sent on spurious calls.

Second, surely one of the core takeaways from the database of recent police brutality is that they are NOT acting appropriately...

Flat Earth Media / Re: International Shipping Agent
« on: July 11, 2020, 12:37:21 PM »
I don't believe that he said that there aren't any paths going the pro-RE geographical route. He said that the majority make an anti-RE geographical route.

I have the YouTube transcript. What are the pertinent phrases from what you heard or read? What did he say?

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Latitude and longitude - please enlighten me
« on: July 11, 2020, 12:19:01 PM »
For FE to be true, either (1) lines of longitude are not straight or (2) lines of longitude do not converge at the Poles.

Lines of lat or long are bisected by angles, the difference between such lines being expressed in degrees of angle.

By definition, this has no meaning on FE. Where would you draw the angle? Where do the lines or vectors forming the angle meet?

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Latitude and longitude - please enlighten me
« on: July 10, 2020, 10:58:04 PM »
Convergence of longitude lines does imply a shape of the Earth, if longitude lines are the shortest distance between two points, i.e. straight. Then two straight lines enclose a space, right?

The shortest distance over the surface of any globe is the arc (S). The shortest distance between the points is the chord (C), but that cannot be travelled without mining into the globe.

Arc S will appear straight only if you view it from directly above. Else it will appear curved. But it's never physically straight

Say you hold out a laser pointer up against the moon like your short piece of string and get the laser pointer to point upwards. Assuming no atmosphere absorbency, if you could turn it on would its photons broadcast out into to space away from the earth or would they curve around on the celestial sphere and hit the sun on the horizon behind you?

That would depend.

You, the Moon and the Sun form three points of a triangle. A triangle is a planar figure.

If you look at the Moon, or the Sun, you are looking along this plane of the triangle. You're not looking above or below it.

If, while looking at the Moon, you hold string, rod, or laser point up such that it is perpendicular to the Moon terminator, then any of those will be in alignment with the side (EDIT sides and plane) of the triangle, as viewed from your position behind the string, rod or laser line.

In order for your laser to point at the Sun, you need to hold it broadly parallel to the line (EDIT /side) of the triangle connecting Moon and Sun in order for it to point at the Sun. You could align it to miss the Sun, and it would still look as though it were perpendicular to the terminator from your viewpoint.

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Black Lives Matter
« on: July 09, 2020, 10:59:42 PM »
The overwhelming reason why kids do not do well in the US is due to the loss of the nuclear family.

... is that based on opinion, or science?

They haven't been defunded?  What about New York? 

What about them? Has the NYPD had monies taken away from it since the protests began?

LA's Mayor is proposing that over half the city budget for next year goes on the police. At the expense of Fire, Library, Parks and Rec, and a host of others, who get the scraps from the table...

There is no fluff or ala kazaam when it comes black people being murdered in the street in the very areas where the protests crying out for DEFUND THE POLICE are loudest.

They've not been defunded yet.

So the adequately or over-funded police are ineffective in stopping crime? Why bother with them, then?

In areas like Chicago, Seattle, New York, and DC, where the protests and calls for defunding the police are loudest, they are experiencing the largest rates of gun violence and murders, predominately committed by otherwise peaceful black citizens upon other peaceful black citizens.

Since no defunding has taken place, does that not suggest to you that overfunded police forces aren't actually successful?

...and after umpteen pages, I refer you back to Tom's assertion, similar to yours and TL's, which he made at Reply #6, and to my response to his at #8.

One thing clearly demonstrated by this thread is that you would have no clue about policing anywhere, let alone the US.

Even if you're right about this, so what?


Don't need experience to quote facts.

Don't need experience of US policing to quote videos which show them brutalising the citizens they are supposed to protect and serve.

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