So, if this image shows the flat earth and it's sun rotation correctly :

How comes that this sunset from Canada, in the north of the equator, shows the sun going slightly to the north before going under the horrizon :

While this sunset from Sydney in Australia, in the south of the equator, we see the sun going slightly to the south before going under the horrizon :

This would not be possible in the model I showed you before, because no mather where you are on the flat earth, you should see the sun always going slightly to the north because of it's rotation around the north pole.

The only way it would be possible is if the sun was actually turning like this (and it would only work for Australia because it would fuck up every other time zones, daytime, etc for other countries)



(This sun trajectory has been added with love using that beautifull software called paint)

Is there something I am missing about the flat earth model?

(I am sorry for my bad english, I do not speak in english as a first language, but I tried my best, please tell me if anything is unclear and I will try to fix it)

Max_Almond

I don't think you're missing anything: I think you're just pointing out one of the multiple impossibilities of the flat earth sun.

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Offline Tom Bishop

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You are missing the fact that the sun travels North-South over the course of the year.
"The biggest problem in astronomy is that when we look at something in the sky, we don’t know how far away it is" — Pauline Barmby, Ph.D., Professor of Astronomy

You are missing the fact that the sun travels North-South over the course of the year.

Actually I am not missing that, both videos I have showed you are fast-forward of more or less 30 minutes of a sunset. The trajectory of season change should in no mean be visible at such a small time span. If it was really going that far to the south in like 30 min, it would be the equivalent of changing from summer to winter in 30 minutes... I do not think it was the case here. Also if it really happenned to go that far to the south, the sun would show much later than usual in the other countries. I'll try to make some pictures as soon as I get on my PC.

Thank you for your answer sir.

It definately true that sunrise/set happens lot quicker closer to equator. I've been in few different places areound the globe (flat or not) and the quickness of the sunrise/set close at places close to the equator always obvious. Doesn't matter season or time of year.

I'm actually not up to speed with FE theory as to what explanation is?
As the saying goes "The internet belongs to the lunatics in their walled gardens" - Xiang Yu

I see a Flat Earth. And I can't imagine anything else.

I got work to do. 0.00018% of Christians believe in a Flat Earth. Pls help

Really? No one can come up to my question with a functionnal flat earth model?

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Offline Tom Bishop

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First off, before we entertain this further, why should we assume that this Flat Earth Monopole model that our society rejected over 100 years ago in favor of a Bi-Polar model, is true?

Where is your evidence for this Flat Earth model you are proposing?
« Last Edit: June 07, 2018, 05:47:48 AM by Tom Bishop »
"The biggest problem in astronomy is that when we look at something in the sky, we don’t know how far away it is" — Pauline Barmby, Ph.D., Professor of Astronomy

Max_Almond

Really? No one can come up to my question with a functional flat earth model?

Well, first thing is I don't know anyone who's claiming that your original image is correct.

Offline Tontogary

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First off, before we entertain this further, why should we assume that this Flat Earth Monopole model that our society rejected over 100 years ago in favor of a Bi-Polar model, is true?

Where is your evidence for this Flat Earth model you are proposing?

Has your society rejected the monopole model?

I gues that makes EnaG wrong then, in many things.

The Wiki regarding the suns rotation, the seasons etc all rely upon a monopole model, and show (i am sure for illustration purposes only) a monopole model, which is fine, (to a point, but lets not go into that here) but a bi polar model does not work with the suns rotation, seasons etc etc.

Is the Wiki wrong or need updating?

Also, if you haven't heard of bronies before, that reflects poorly on your understanding of the world that surrounds you. It's practically impossible not to know about them.

First off, before we entertain this further, why should we assume that this Flat Earth Monopole model that our society rejected over 100 years ago in favor of a Bi-Polar model, is true?

Where is your evidence for this Flat Earth model you are proposing?
Where is your evidence (outside of ENaG) for any Flat Earth model?!

If the monopole model has been rejected then your Wiki needs updating, in the FAQ a map of the monopole model is shown.
https://wiki.tfes.org/Frequently_Asked_Questions

While it does say the map is not definitive the page does then go on to explain how seasons work by the sun making tighter circles in the northern "hemisphere" summer and larger ones in the southern "hemisphere" summer.

What is the sun's suggested path in the bipolar model? Given that 24 hour sun at both Poles has been observed in their respective summers.
"On a very clear and chilly day it is possible to see Lighthouse Beach from Lovers Point and vice versa...Upon looking into the telescope I can see children running in and out of the water, splashing and playing. I can see people sun bathing at the shore
- An excerpt from the account of the Bishop Experiment. My emphasis

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Offline Pete Svarrior

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Tom is correct, on a technicality, that the Flat Earth Society moved away from monopole models in the past. I'm unconvinced that this has much of a bearing on the present, however.
Read the FAQ before asking your question - chances are we've already addressed it.
Follow the Flat Earth Society on Twitter and Facebook!

<Parsifal> I like looking at Chinese Wikipedia with Noto installed
<Parsifal> I don't understand any of it but the symbols look nice

See, this is where debating with you guys becomes quite tricky.
Tom hints quite strongly that the FES recected the monopole model over 100 years ago - he gives no indication that this has since been reversed.
You're hinting quite strongly that this has been reversed and the current position is the monopole model
Neither of you are quite saying it outright. It's like trying to guess a number someone is thinking of but they never tell you what it is and they keep changing the number they're thinking of!
 ???

So...which is it? Are the two poles or is there one?

If there's two then...how does the sun move such that you get 24 hour sun circling the poles in their respective summers and it tallies with other observations of the sun?

If there's one then...what? You can literally go to the South Pole! People work there. There's no international treaty or armed guards which stop you.
https://www.discover-the-world.co.uk/destinations/antarctica-holidays/south-pole-adventure
(It'll cost you, mind - quite amused that the price excludes flights, you'd think for that price they'd throw them in, but I digress).
"On a very clear and chilly day it is possible to see Lighthouse Beach from Lovers Point and vice versa...Upon looking into the telescope I can see children running in and out of the water, splashing and playing. I can see people sun bathing at the shore
- An excerpt from the account of the Bishop Experiment. My emphasis

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Offline Pete Svarrior

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Neither of you are quite saying it outright.
That's because neither of us are a definitive authority on the Flat Earth. I'm not sure why Tom is getting involved in a debate against a model he doesn't support, but I'm even more confused as to why you'd engage him back when he does.
Read the FAQ before asking your question - chances are we've already addressed it.
Follow the Flat Earth Society on Twitter and Facebook!

<Parsifal> I like looking at Chinese Wikipedia with Noto installed
<Parsifal> I don't understand any of it but the symbols look nice

Well, because his response left me with a bunch of other questions.
I'm not sure there's a definitive authority on anything. If there was then there would be nothing to debate, we'd just talk to that dude and he'd tell us the answer.
I was going to continue but the question about poles is a different thread so maybe I'll create one.
"On a very clear and chilly day it is possible to see Lighthouse Beach from Lovers Point and vice versa...Upon looking into the telescope I can see children running in and out of the water, splashing and playing. I can see people sun bathing at the shore
- An excerpt from the account of the Bishop Experiment. My emphasis

First off, before we entertain this further, why should we assume that this Flat Earth Monopole model that our society rejected over 100 years ago in favor of a Bi-Polar model, is true?

Where is your evidence for this Flat Earth model you are proposing?

This is exactly my point... Don't you guys have a working model? Since every model I saw are wrong on a certain point how can you be so sure the earth is flat??? I looked for a flat earth model and this one is the one you guys usually use to show the earth is flat... Is it really an improper model? And of so which one is really working?

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Offline MCToon

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First off, before we entertain this further, why should we assume that this Flat Earth Monopole model that our society rejected over 100 years ago in favor of a Bi-Polar model, is true?

Where is your evidence for this Flat Earth model you are proposing?

This is exactly my point... Don't you guys have a working model? Since every model I saw are wrong on a certain point how can you be so sure the earth is flat??? I looked for a flat earth model and this one is the one you guys usually use to show the earth is flat... Is it really an improper model? And of so which one is really working?

The AE or Gleason flat earth map does the best job of allowing for an explanation of the sun movement.  However, it leaves a lot to be desired when it comes to a few points:
  • Stars when looking south from the southern hemisphere
  • Apparent warping of land masses
  • Distances between continents in the southern hemisphere
  • Sun position during equinoxes
  • Large number of people that claim to have been to the south pole

So, there have been other proposed map possibilities.  A two-pole map, for example, explains Stars when looking south from the southern hemisphere and does a little better on some Distances between continents in the southern hemisphere, and satisfies Large number of people that claim to have been to the south pole.  However, the two-pole map still skews land masses, and utterly fails to explain travel between some continents at all.  I have not seen how the sun and moon would work on a two-pole map.

Some of the two pole models require a pac-man teleport to explain the sun and moon movement.  These are quite ludicrous and only good for laughs.

I have not seen any other proposed maps other than the AE/Gleason style or different versions of the two pole model.  Though, there could be some I have missed.

I love this site, it's a fantastic collection of evidence of a spherical earth:
Flight times
Full moon
Horizon eye level drops
Sinking ship effect

I think we can forget about the 2 poles map, since you can test that from playing any multiplayer games having a japanese server (exemple given is server in japan and console in usa), the latency between your console/pc and the server isnt high enough to be travelling from usa to japan from the east only, it has to go through the pacific or the latency (the time it takes for your info to get from point a to point b) would be significantly higher, also the 6 months of day followed by 6 month of night in pole north (and south btw but lets scrap it for the sake of the AE/Gleason model) wouldn't be respected.

But back to my question, is the AE/Gleason model really the official one? Is there an official model? Because if there are NO official model, I will work on the AE/Gleason model to find a proof that the earth is not flat (yeah this is my position) that you can test by yourself, which doesn't need a lot of instrument and that will not be able to be treated as "fake".

The thing is, it is difficult for me to work on model that isn't even accepted by it's community...

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Offline MCToon

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I think we can forget about the 2 poles map, since you can test that from playing any multiplayer games having a japanese server (exemple given is server in japan and console in usa), the latency between your console/pc and the server isnt high enough to be travelling from usa to japan from the east only, it has to go through the pacific or the latency (the time it takes for your info to get from point a to point b) would be significantly higher, also the 6 months of day followed by 6 month of night in pole north (and south btw but lets scrap it for the sake of the AE/Gleason model) wouldn't be respected.

But back to my question, is the AE/Gleason model really the official one? Is there an official model? Because if there are NO official model, I will work on the AE/Gleason model to find a proof that the earth is not flat (yeah this is my position) that you can test by yourself, which doesn't need a lot of instrument and that will not be able to be treated as "fake".

The thing is, it is difficult for me to work on model that isn't even accepted by it's community...

There absolutely is no official map.  Many YouTubers like the AE/Gleason map, but it is so easily proven incorrect that it's pointless to defend it except with either ignoring trivial facts or resorting to unexplained, unexperienced phenomenon.

Tom Bishop, who seems to be the head FE guy on this site, says the AE/Gleason map was discarded over 100 years ago in favor of a two-pole map.  Unfortunately, I haven't found any reasonable explanations of how this works at all.  There's some writings by "Lady Blount", I've read them, not useful.

Basically, there is no map.
I love this site, it's a fantastic collection of evidence of a spherical earth:
Flight times
Full moon
Horizon eye level drops
Sinking ship effect

How is there supposed to be a debate if there is nothing to prove wrong?

Max_Almond

Maybe there isn't supposed to be a debate?