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Offline Rushy

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Are IP addresses personally identifiable?
« on: May 09, 2018, 07:31:55 PM »
IP addresses aren't personally identifiable information, and their connection status would be logged by your ISP anyway (which no doubt has Google analytics interacting with them regardless). I don't see how any of this is effective at stopping the "Google Overlords" from reaping data that's anonymized already.

Re: Re: Protecting IP addresses from google
« Reply #1 on: May 09, 2018, 07:36:45 PM »
IP addresses aren't personally identifiable information ...

Yeah, you keep saying that
https://www.enterprisetimes.co.uk/2016/10/20/ecj-rules-ip-address-is-pii/

From an IP address you can infer a location. It is none of Google's business where I am from.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2018, 07:40:05 PM by Baby Thork »
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Offline Rushy

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Re: Re: Protecting IP addresses from google
« Reply #2 on: May 09, 2018, 07:49:53 PM »
That same article says IP addresses only count as PII if you also gave the website your real name, email address, and physical address. This website doesn't record one of those three things. It only counts as PII if the website also possesses information that could link you directly to the IP address, which we don't, so it still isn't PII.

Re: Re: Protecting IP addresses from google
« Reply #3 on: May 09, 2018, 07:51:41 PM »
This forum also records all of our posts ... and there is enough data on here to know exactly who I am. So it is PII.
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Re: Re: Protecting IP addresses from google
« Reply #4 on: May 09, 2018, 08:51:03 PM »
You might not have a fixed IP. On boards I've moderated I found bans by IP (to stop Trolls) notoriously unreliable as some ISPs route multiple people through the same IP.
Also, I really don't think Google care that much what you're up to.
"This is literally just a few people talking about it for a brief time every day on their spare time. That’s the flat earth movement" - Tom Bishop

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Re: Are IP addresses personally identifiable?
« Reply #5 on: May 10, 2018, 05:19:28 AM »
I can demonstrate an easy ban-evasion tactic for many game servers that ban by IP and any websites using plain HTTP, as well as IP ban evasion for websites secured by TLS (this requires a bit more work with TLS certificates, particularly dealing with trust and all of that).

I'm aware that fake account information is most likely against the Terms of Service of any of the services, and have not created any accounts with fake information.

Simply:
1. Sign up for any PaaS provider that supports Node (Heroku, Google App Engine, AWS)... Usually PaaS has a more flexible free tier than IaaS, which is important because you want fake account information.
2. Install https://github.com/mhzed/wstunnel as your app.
3. Invoke wstunnel from your local command-line.
4. Profit.

Of course, if the IP address comes back to a residential network that's at your house... That's pretty good circumstantial evidence, as most people do not run proxy servers.

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Offline Pete Svarrior

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Re: Are IP addresses personally identifiable?
« Reply #6 on: May 10, 2018, 07:59:07 AM »
I can demonstrate an easy ban-evasion tactic
Congratulations, you have demonstrated a high-schooler's level of understanding of networking, though you managed to overcomplicate your process to oblivion. Why did you think anyone would care?

More importantly, what does your arcane knowledge of proxies have to do with the claim that IP addresses can be personally identifiable?
« Last Edit: May 10, 2018, 08:00:46 AM by Pete Svarrior »
Read the FAQ before asking your question - chances are we've already addressed it.
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Re: Re: Protecting IP addresses from google
« Reply #7 on: May 10, 2018, 11:40:31 AM »
You might not have a fixed IP. On boards I've moderated I found bans by IP (to stop Trolls) notoriously unreliable as some ISPs route multiple people through the same IP.
Also, I really don't think Google care that much what you're up to.
Google likes to keep its friends close and its enemies closer. I'm exactly the sort of person they want data on ... because I actively try to keep it from them. I'm the guy that is hard to advertise to. I'm the shadow on the interweb, the vigilante with a grudge, the fly in the ointment, the citizen that won't conform, the rebel with a cause. I'm dangerous.
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Offline ElTrancy

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Re: Re: Protecting IP addresses from google
« Reply #8 on: May 10, 2018, 12:56:14 PM »
IP addresses aren't personally identifiable information ...

Yeah, you keep saying that
https://www.enterprisetimes.co.uk/2016/10/20/ecj-rules-ip-address-is-pii/

From an IP address you can infer a location. It is none of Google's business where I am from.

Actually it really is Google's business. Google has a Privacy Policy page, and a Terms of Service page. Both state that google can collect information on you, I.P. Addresses included. If you have a problem with this, don't use the internet.
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Offline Parsifal

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Re: Are IP addresses personally identifiable?
« Reply #9 on: May 10, 2018, 01:13:19 PM »
Actually it really is Google's business. Google has a Privacy Policy page, and a Terms of Service page. Both state that google can collect information on you, I.P. Addresses included. If you have a problem with this, don't use the internet.

Or you can just, you know, configure your browser not to send your information to Google.

I use five privacy-related browser extensions:
  • Privacy Badger to dynamically detect and block trackers.
  • uBlock Origin, primarily an adblocker but also blocks some known trackers.
  • Decentraleyes, which caches static content from content providers locally to avoid passive tracking through the hosting of static files like jquery.
  • Cookie AutoDelete to delete cookies from (non-whitelisted) websites after I close their tab.
  • DuckDuckGo Privacy Essentials, which, aside from replacing the default search engine with DuckDuckGo, provides its own tracker-blocking functionality.
There are also others such as uMatrix which you can use if you're really paranoid, but they require more work to maintain. The five I listed above are set and forget.

Edit: I should add that Google Analytics is automatically blocked by three of these extensions (Privacy Badger, uBlock Origin and DuckDuckGo), so I don't get tracked by Google here regardless.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2018, 01:17:24 PM by Parsifal »
How the hell am I supposed to be a moron if I keep educating myself?  >:(

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Offline ElTrancy

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Re: Are IP addresses personally identifiable?
« Reply #10 on: May 10, 2018, 01:14:49 PM »
Actually it really is Google's business. Google has a Privacy Policy page, and a Terms of Service page. Both state that google can collect information on you, I.P. Addresses included. If you have a problem with this, don't use the internet.

Or you can just, you know, configure your browser not to send your information to Google.

I use five privacy-related browser extensions:
  • Privacy Badger to dynamically detect and block trackers.
  • uBlock Origin, primarily an adblocker but also blocks some known trackers.
  • Decentraleyes, which caches static content from content providers locally to avoid passive tracking through the hosting of static files like jquery.
  • Cookie AutoDelete to delete cookies from (non-whitelisted) websites after I close their tab.
  • DuckDuckGo Privacy Essentials, which aside from replacing the default search engine with DuckDuckGo, provides its own tracker-blocking functionality.
There are also others such as uMatrix which you can use if you're really paranoid, but they require more work to maintain. The five I listed above are set and forget.

You really don't need to hide your I.P Address if you're a normal citizen though...
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Offline Parsifal

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Re: Are IP addresses personally identifiable?
« Reply #11 on: May 10, 2018, 01:21:10 PM »
You really don't need to hide your I.P Address if you're a normal citizen though...

This is too vague a statement to respond to. What do you mean by "hide your IP address"? You can't hide it in connections you make since it is what identifies you on the Internet, but there is quite a big difference between obfuscating your IP address with a proxy and having a megacorporation forever storing your every online move associated with your IP address.
How the hell am I supposed to be a moron if I keep educating myself?  >:(

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Offline ElTrancy

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Re: Are IP addresses personally identifiable?
« Reply #12 on: May 10, 2018, 01:25:19 PM »
You really don't need to hide your I.P Address if you're a normal citizen though...

This is too vague a statement to respond to. What do you mean by "hide your IP address"? You can't hide it in connections you make since it is what identifies you on the Internet, but there is quite a big difference between obfuscating your IP address with a proxy and having a megacorporation forever storing your every online move associated with your IP address.

As in unless you're doing something illegal, why do you need to hide your IP address? And having a problem with them storing your online data, is like saying that a phone does the same thing, even though it says that they have the right to use browser and data information in a court. You sign away a lot of freedom while using electronics, and IP address can be shared throughout a large amount of people, IE a school or company. It makes zero sense to hide it. Is this a better statement?
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Offline Parsifal

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Re: Are IP addresses personally identifiable?
« Reply #13 on: May 10, 2018, 01:31:08 PM »
As in unless you're doing something illegal, why do you need to hide your IP address? And having a problem with them storing your online data, is like saying that a phone does the same thing, even though it says that they have the right to use browser and data information in a court. You sign away a lot of freedom while using electronics, and IP address can be shared throughout a large amount of people, IE a school or company. It makes zero sense to hide it. Is this a better statement?

No, it's a worse one. Nobody "signs away" anything by using a computer. You're confusing terms of use of specific online services with the use of a machine.

You don't need to be doing something illegal to worry about your IP address being stored, but hyperfocusing on the IP address part is probably why you're getting confused. Google collects too much information from too many different sources about people already. If we can do something small to anonymise that data a little bit better, such as obfuscating part of an IP address, that is an improvement.

I would be equally in favour of, say, anonymising user agents. The fact that we're talking about IP addresses is incidental.
How the hell am I supposed to be a moron if I keep educating myself?  >:(

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Offline ElTrancy

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Re: Are IP addresses personally identifiable?
« Reply #14 on: May 10, 2018, 01:45:28 PM »
As in unless you're doing something illegal, why do you need to hide your IP address? And having a problem with them storing your online data, is like saying that a phone does the same thing, even though it says that they have the right to use browser and data information in a court. You sign away a lot of freedom while using electronics, and IP address can be shared throughout a large amount of people, IE a school or company. It makes zero sense to hide it. Is this a better statement?

No, it's a worse one. Nobody "signs away" anything by using a computer. You're confusing terms of use of specific online services with the use of a machine.

You don't need to be doing something illegal to worry about your IP address being stored, but hyperfocusing on the IP address part is probably why you're getting confused. Google collects too much information from too many different sources about people already. If we can do something small to anonymise that data a little bit better, such as obfuscating part of an IP address, that is an improvement.

I would be equally in favour of, say, anonymising user agents. The fact that we're talking about IP addresses is incidental.

Oh...Well, I admit that I am wrong. I'm not exactly the keenest in subjects, so I might have messed up a few things. I apologize.
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Offline Rushy

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Re: Are IP addresses personally identifiable?
« Reply #15 on: May 10, 2018, 03:24:33 PM »
If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear,  comrade!

Re: Are IP addresses personally identifiable?
« Reply #16 on: May 10, 2018, 04:35:20 PM »
If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear,  comrade!
That's why they put in the 5th Amendment in America: So we know who the mobsters and criminals are.

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Offline ElTrancy

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Re: Are IP addresses personally identifiable?
« Reply #17 on: May 10, 2018, 04:36:41 PM »
If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear,  comrade!
That's why they put in the 5th Amendment in America: So we know who the mobsters and criminals are.

Did you mean the 4th?
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Re: Are IP addresses personally identifiable?
« Reply #18 on: May 10, 2018, 07:48:27 PM »
Actually it really is Google's business. Google has a Privacy Policy page, and a Terms of Service page. Both state that google can collect information on you, I.P. Addresses included. If you have a problem with this, don't use the internet.

Or you can just, you know, configure your browser not to send your information to Google.

I use five privacy-related browser extensions:
  • Privacy Badger to dynamically detect and block trackers.
  • uBlock Origin, primarily an adblocker but also blocks some known trackers.
  • Decentraleyes, which caches static content from content providers locally to avoid passive tracking through the hosting of static files like jquery.
  • Cookie AutoDelete to delete cookies from (non-whitelisted) websites after I close their tab.
  • DuckDuckGo Privacy Essentials, which, aside from replacing the default search engine with DuckDuckGo, provides its own tracker-blocking functionality.
There are also others such as uMatrix which you can use if you're really paranoid, but they require more work to maintain. The five I listed above are set and forget.

Edit: I should add that Google Analytics is automatically blocked by three of these extensions (Privacy Badger, uBlock Origin and DuckDuckGo), so I don't get tracked by Google here regardless.
I also use Cloudflare for my DNS instead of google or my ISP.
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Offline Parsifal

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Re: Are IP addresses personally identifiable?
« Reply #19 on: May 10, 2018, 07:51:25 PM »
I also use Cloudflare for my DNS instead of google or my ISP.

CloudFlare's DNS provides no advantages over your ISP's DNS if your ISP really wants to spy on you.
How the hell am I supposed to be a moron if I keep educating myself?  >:(