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Offline Rama Set

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Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #20 on: November 14, 2018, 02:13:18 PM »
I wonder how much of our perception of policing in the states has to do with selection bias.  There is something like 750,000 cops in the States.  Probably 375,000 active at any given moment?  We hear about one shitty thing that happens every week or so, but there must be a plethora of other stories.  It's not like you are seeing stories of corruption and brutality from Thailand that most definitely exist as well.
You don't get races of anything ... accept people.

Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #21 on: November 14, 2018, 02:17:40 PM »
I wonder how much of our perception of policing in the states has to do with selection bias.  There is something like 750,000 cops in the States.  Probably 375,000 active at any given moment?  We hear about one shitty thing that happens every week or so, but there must be a plethora of other stories.  It's not like you are seeing stories of corruption and brutality from Thailand that most definitely exist as well.
I, for one, am of the opinion that most persons believe authority is corrupt, with or without specific evidence.

News around the world is primarily local.

You will seldom see or hear anything regarding economic or social conditions in other countries on/in the news/newsprint.

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Offline Luke 22:35-38

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Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #22 on: November 15, 2018, 07:11:18 AM »
https://www.npr.org/2018/11/13/667252788/police-fatally-shoot-black-security-guard-who-detained-suspected-shooter

American police: Literally shooting anyone with a gun, even a 2nd amendment loving citizen in uniform.

We don't know the details to make any conclusions of it.


Yeah we do.
Crazy gunman opened fire in a bar.  Security guard with a gun pins him and holds a gun to his head.  Cops show up and kill the security guard, who was wearing his uniform.


Its literaly in the article linked.  What else are you suggesting, the cops were told the gunman wore a security officer uniform?

We don't what did the guard did with his firearm or if the officer gave warnings or if he saw the uniform.
Isaiah 40:22 "It is he that sitteth upon the CIRCLE of the earth"

Scripture, science, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue

Evolutionism is a religion. Can dumb luck create a smart brain?

Please PM me to explain sunsets.

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Offline Luke 22:35-38

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Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #23 on: November 15, 2018, 07:14:02 AM »
https://www.npr.org/2018/11/13/667252788/police-fatally-shoot-black-security-guard-who-detained-suspected-shooter

American police: Literally shooting anyone with a gun, even a 2nd amendment loving citizen in uniform.

We don't know the details to make any conclusions of it.


Yeah we do.
Crazy gunman opened fire in a bar.  Security guard with a gun pins him and holds a gun to his head.  Cops show up and kill the security guard, who was wearing his uniform.


Its literaly in the article linked.  What else are you suggesting, the cops were told the gunman wore a security officer uniform?

Luke is a policeman. Part of his job requires him to make excuses for his murderous colleagues.

Correction, I never was a police officer. I was auxiliary law enforcement for a short bit but now I'm seeking employment as a law enforcement officer. Also, I don't make excuses. If the cop had no basis to shoot the guard then he doesn't have basis to shoot the guard.
Isaiah 40:22 "It is he that sitteth upon the CIRCLE of the earth"

Scripture, science, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue

Evolutionism is a religion. Can dumb luck create a smart brain?

Please PM me to explain sunsets.

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Offline Luke 22:35-38

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Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #24 on: November 15, 2018, 07:15:48 AM »
Here is Thai police. Imagine the outcome if in America!

http://www.directexpose.com/police-officer-hug/

Luke, what's the protocol for American police if someone comes in their station screaming with a knife? Your colleague gunned down an aussie woman for approaching the police car after calling for help after all!



Tell me that's not a tear jerker!

Every country deals with people armed with knives as lethal threats. This is a extremely specific outcome that is not taught anywhere in the world.
Isaiah 40:22 "It is he that sitteth upon the CIRCLE of the earth"

Scripture, science, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue

Evolutionism is a religion. Can dumb luck create a smart brain?

Please PM me to explain sunsets.

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Offline Luke 22:35-38

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Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #25 on: November 15, 2018, 07:17:19 AM »
So no response defending the idea that US cops are militaristic.
US Police are, for the most part militaristic.

Once police were removed from a walking beat patrol of the streets and placed in a squad car and behind a set of sunglasses, it has, for the most part, become more normalized for even police to view themselves this way.

What's the deal with sunglasses? If you're going to be out in the sun all day, especially without a hat, of course you're going to wear sunglasses.
Isaiah 40:22 "It is he that sitteth upon the CIRCLE of the earth"

Scripture, science, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue

Evolutionism is a religion. Can dumb luck create a smart brain?

Please PM me to explain sunsets.

Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #26 on: November 15, 2018, 08:58:02 AM »
https://www.npr.org/2018/11/13/667252788/police-fatally-shoot-black-security-guard-who-detained-suspected-shooter

American police: Literally shooting anyone with a gun, even a 2nd amendment loving citizen in uniform.

We don't know the details to make any conclusions of it.


Yeah we do.
Crazy gunman opened fire in a bar.  Security guard with a gun pins him and holds a gun to his head.  Cops show up and kill the security guard, who was wearing his uniform.


Its literaly in the article linked.  What else are you suggesting, the cops were told the gunman wore a security officer uniform?

We don't what did the guard did with his firearm or if the officer gave warnings or if he saw the uniform.

Is it standard practice for police to fire on a person without verifying the target?

Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #27 on: November 15, 2018, 10:31:58 AM »
https://www.npr.org/2018/11/13/667252788/police-fatally-shoot-black-security-guard-who-detained-suspected-shooter

American police: Literally shooting anyone with a gun, even a 2nd amendment loving citizen in uniform.

We don't know the details to make any conclusions of it.


Yeah we do.
Crazy gunman opened fire in a bar.  Security guard with a gun pins him and holds a gun to his head.  Cops show up and kill the security guard, who was wearing his uniform.


Its literaly in the article linked.  What else are you suggesting, the cops were told the gunman wore a security officer uniform?

We don't what did the guard did with his firearm or if the officer gave warnings or if he saw the uniform.


Its in the article.  If not that then one of the others.


Guard pinned bad guy with his gun on the bad guy's head.
Officers gave warnings while everyone shouted that he was security.
The security guy's uniform was on his body so fucking hard to miss.

Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #28 on: November 15, 2018, 05:29:04 PM »
So no response defending the idea that US cops are militaristic.
US Police are, for the most part militaristic.

Once police were removed from a walking beat patrol of the streets and placed in a squad car and behind a set of sunglasses, it has, for the most part, become more normalized for even police to view themselves this way.

What's the deal with sunglasses? If you're going to be out in the sun all day, especially without a hat, of course you're going to wear sunglasses.
Nothing if it is sunny and they are required.

But many police i have seen maintain the glasses on approach even when conducting official business.

IMO, that is rude and unprofessional.

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Offline Luke 22:35-38

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Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #29 on: November 15, 2018, 11:14:03 PM »
https://www.npr.org/2018/11/13/667252788/police-fatally-shoot-black-security-guard-who-detained-suspected-shooter

American police: Literally shooting anyone with a gun, even a 2nd amendment loving citizen in uniform.

We don't know the details to make any conclusions of it.


Yeah we do.
Crazy gunman opened fire in a bar.  Security guard with a gun pins him and holds a gun to his head.  Cops show up and kill the security guard, who was wearing his uniform.


Its literaly in the article linked.  What else are you suggesting, the cops were told the gunman wore a security officer uniform?

We don't what did the guard did with his firearm or if the officer gave warnings or if he saw the uniform.

Is it standard practice for police to fire on a person without verifying the target?

No. Police are trained to reasonably make sure your target is actually a threat. I say reasonably because real life doesn't always give you a textbook clear threat.
Isaiah 40:22 "It is he that sitteth upon the CIRCLE of the earth"

Scripture, science, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue

Evolutionism is a religion. Can dumb luck create a smart brain?

Please PM me to explain sunsets.

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Offline Luke 22:35-38

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Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #30 on: November 15, 2018, 11:19:49 PM »
https://www.npr.org/2018/11/13/667252788/police-fatally-shoot-black-security-guard-who-detained-suspected-shooter

American police: Literally shooting anyone with a gun, even a 2nd amendment loving citizen in uniform.

We don't know the details to make any conclusions of it.


Yeah we do.
Crazy gunman opened fire in a bar.  Security guard with a gun pins him and holds a gun to his head.  Cops show up and kill the security guard, who was wearing his uniform.


Its literaly in the article linked.  What else are you suggesting, the cops were told the gunman wore a security officer uniform?

We don't what did the guard did with his firearm or if the officer gave warnings or if he saw the uniform.


Its in the article.  If not that then one of the others.


Guard pinned bad guy with his gun on the bad guy's head.
Officers gave warnings while everyone shouted that he was security.
The security guy's uniform was on his body so fucking hard to miss.

A lot of obvious things can be missed if you're tunnel visioned on a threat like a gun to a man's head. I'm not defending him, but I can see why he shot. The officer sees the gun to a man's head that can go off in a split second, the officer gave warnings to drop the gun, the guard doesn't, so the officer shoots.
Isaiah 40:22 "It is he that sitteth upon the CIRCLE of the earth"

Scripture, science, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue

Evolutionism is a religion. Can dumb luck create a smart brain?

Please PM me to explain sunsets.

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Offline Luke 22:35-38

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Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #31 on: November 15, 2018, 11:22:00 PM »
So no response defending the idea that US cops are militaristic.
US Police are, for the most part militaristic.

Once police were removed from a walking beat patrol of the streets and placed in a squad car and behind a set of sunglasses, it has, for the most part, become more normalized for even police to view themselves this way.

What's the deal with sunglasses? If you're going to be out in the sun all day, especially without a hat, of course you're going to wear sunglasses.
Nothing if it is sunny and they are required.

But many police i have seen maintain the glasses on approach even when conducting official business.

IMO, that is rude and unprofessional.

Do you take off your sunglasses when talking to police? What specific official business are you referring to?
Isaiah 40:22 "It is he that sitteth upon the CIRCLE of the earth"

Scripture, science, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue

Evolutionism is a religion. Can dumb luck create a smart brain?

Please PM me to explain sunsets.

Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #32 on: November 15, 2018, 11:30:35 PM »
https://www.npr.org/2018/11/13/667252788/police-fatally-shoot-black-security-guard-who-detained-suspected-shooter

American police: Literally shooting anyone with a gun, even a 2nd amendment loving citizen in uniform.

We don't know the details to make any conclusions of it.


Yeah we do.
Crazy gunman opened fire in a bar.  Security guard with a gun pins him and holds a gun to his head.  Cops show up and kill the security guard, who was wearing his uniform.


Its literaly in the article linked.  What else are you suggesting, the cops were told the gunman wore a security officer uniform?

We don't what did the guard did with his firearm or if the officer gave warnings or if he saw the uniform.


Its in the article.  If not that then one of the others.


Guard pinned bad guy with his gun on the bad guy's head.
Officers gave warnings while everyone shouted that he was security.
The security guy's uniform was on his body so fucking hard to miss.

A lot of obvious things can be missed if you're tunnel visioned on a threat like a gun to a man's head. I'm not defending him, but I can see why he shot. The officer sees the gun to a man's head that can go off in a split second, the officer gave warnings to drop the gun, the guard doesn't, so the officer shoots.


Which is why citizens with guns in public is a bad idea.

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Offline Luke 22:35-38

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Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #33 on: November 16, 2018, 09:08:53 AM »
https://www.npr.org/2018/11/13/667252788/police-fatally-shoot-black-security-guard-who-detained-suspected-shooter

American police: Literally shooting anyone with a gun, even a 2nd amendment loving citizen in uniform.

We don't know the details to make any conclusions of it.


Yeah we do.
Crazy gunman opened fire in a bar.  Security guard with a gun pins him and holds a gun to his head.  Cops show up and kill the security guard, who was wearing his uniform.


Its literaly in the article linked.  What else are you suggesting, the cops were told the gunman wore a security officer uniform?

We don't what did the guard did with his firearm or if the officer gave warnings or if he saw the uniform.


Its in the article.  If not that then one of the others.


Guard pinned bad guy with his gun on the bad guy's head.
Officers gave warnings while everyone shouted that he was security.
The security guy's uniform was on his body so fucking hard to miss.

A lot of obvious things can be missed if you're tunnel visioned on a threat like a gun to a man's head. I'm not defending him, but I can see why he shot. The officer sees the gun to a man's head that can go off in a split second, the officer gave warnings to drop the gun, the guard doesn't, so the officer shoots.


Which is why citizens with guns in public is a bad idea.

This is one example out 900,000 cops, millions of police interactions per week, and at least 100 million gun owners. The likelihood of this happening is quite rare. Besides, this was a security guard, he was supposed to be armed.
Isaiah 40:22 "It is he that sitteth upon the CIRCLE of the earth"

Scripture, science, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue

Evolutionism is a religion. Can dumb luck create a smart brain?

Please PM me to explain sunsets.

Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #34 on: November 16, 2018, 09:32:49 AM »
So no response defending the idea that US cops are militaristic.
US Police are, for the most part militaristic.

Once police were removed from a walking beat patrol of the streets and placed in a squad car and behind a set of sunglasses, it has, for the most part, become more normalized for even police to view themselves this way.

What's the deal with sunglasses? If you're going to be out in the sun all day, especially without a hat, of course you're going to wear sunglasses.
Nothing if it is sunny and they are required.

But many police i have seen maintain the glasses on approach even when conducting official business.

IMO, that is rude and unprofessional.

Do you take off your sunglasses when talking to police? What specific official business are you referring to?

I take of my sunglasses personally when I talk to anyone. It's simple courtesy. No power play

Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #35 on: November 16, 2018, 11:08:06 AM »
Do you take off your sunglasses when talking to police? What specific official business are you referring to?
I have seen police specifically ask persons to remove their sunglasses prior to continuing a conversation during a traffic stop.

Personally, I take off my sunglasses when I am conversing with anyone about anything. That is what I was taught as child. Look directly at the person to whom you are speaking.

Your last question is somewhat baffling in that police conduct, while on duty, official police business. If you care to further parse for clarification, traffic stops for instance.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2018, 11:13:06 AM by totallackey »

Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #36 on: November 16, 2018, 11:32:08 AM »
I live in the UK. We don't need sunglasses.  :'(
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Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #37 on: November 16, 2018, 12:36:36 PM »
This is one example out 900,000 cops, millions of police interactions per week, and at least 100 million gun owners. The likelihood of this happening is quite rare. Besides, this was a security guard, he was supposed to be armed.
Yes it is.  But the NRA would have us think that everyone should own a gun to kill anyone who tries to shoot someone in public. 
And yes, that's my point. A security guard, whose job it is to have a gun, was killed by police.  So what chance does a citizen in street clothes have?

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Offline Luke 22:35-38

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Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #38 on: November 18, 2018, 01:34:46 AM »
This is one example out 900,000 cops, millions of police interactions per week, and at least 100 million gun owners. The likelihood of this happening is quite rare. Besides, this was a security guard, he was supposed to be armed.
Yes it is.  But the NRA would have us think that everyone should own a gun to kill anyone who tries to shoot someone in public. 
And yes, that's my point. A security guard, whose job it is to have a gun, was killed by police.  So what chance does a citizen in street clothes have?

Depending on which reports you read, the gaurd was in street clothes except for his hat that said "security" on it. I have a security hat and on the front it has big bold letters and on the back it has smaller lettering that could be stitched on a name tag. Depending on the angle which the officer approached from, he could've easily missed the lettering. Also a key note here is the fact that the officer gave warnings but the gaurd didn't heed them. So it wasn't really a matter of whether you're wearing street clothes or not in this instance but rather putting the gun down when told to.
Isaiah 40:22 "It is he that sitteth upon the CIRCLE of the earth"

Scripture, science, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue

Evolutionism is a religion. Can dumb luck create a smart brain?

Please PM me to explain sunsets.

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Offline Luke 22:35-38

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Re: American Police vs British Police
« Reply #39 on: November 18, 2018, 01:37:45 AM »
So no response defending the idea that US cops are militaristic.
US Police are, for the most part militaristic.

Once police were removed from a walking beat patrol of the streets and placed in a squad car and behind a set of sunglasses, it has, for the most part, become more normalized for even police to view themselves this way.

What's the deal with sunglasses? If you're going to be out in the sun all day, especially without a hat, of course you're going to wear sunglasses.
Nothing if it is sunny and they are required.

But many police i have seen maintain the glasses on approach even when conducting official business.

IMO, that is rude and unprofessional.

Do you take off your sunglasses when talking to police? What specific official business are you referring to?

I take of my sunglasses personally when I talk to anyone. It's simple courtesy. No power play

I doubt the officer is playing some type of power play if he refuse to take his shades. It could simply be that it's sunny out and he doesn't want to keep squinting his eyes.
Isaiah 40:22 "It is he that sitteth upon the CIRCLE of the earth"

Scripture, science, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue

Evolutionism is a religion. Can dumb luck create a smart brain?

Please PM me to explain sunsets.