Offline Frocious

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Re: Sun over a flat Earth
« Reply #20 on: March 13, 2018, 05:17:16 AM »
Maybe now would be a good time to invite any flat earthers here to view these four videos.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JgY8zNZ35uw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TeMooNFtFJk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EJ0EKJWyl_g
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rmXP4Q2ZpI

Maybe everyone else here has already seen them but I just discovered them. They are the best, most well developed refutations of FET I've seen, though they are more than a bit condescending (and somewhat humorous, to boot). They deal with the subject at hand in great depth, as well as related subjects. If a flat earther thinks he can refute the math or the geometry, I would invite them to give it a shot.

I actually find these videos quite annoying. Aside from the condescending tone, a lot of it is straw man stuff.
He's arguing at times against a position that the FES don't actually take, but there are some good points in there.

I don't doubt that FE'ers would take offense at the tone, but he makes many valid points. I'm curious specifically which of his arguments you believe aren't actually FE beliefs.
From video 1: I'm also unsure on the "Distances on land are accurate" as the only person to comment on them appears to hold we don't actually know any distances for sure. Also as a note, though he's never come out and said it point blank, it's heavily implied that geometry doesn't work at longer distances. We've also been told that no one actually knows how fast planes are flying, and they simply follow their headings as per normal without question.

I believe CHL says that the "distances must be the same" because distances are distances -- we DO know how long a foot is, or how long a mile is. So long as a FE'r and a RE'r know how long a yard is, they will come up with the same distance for a football field for example. Basically he's giving FE'rs the benefit of the doubt when it comes to their mile-by-mile measurement abilities, which might not be the best choice. It would be great if he would have tackled the whole "we don't know what distances are" argument, though... that probably would have been something!

Offline Scroogie

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Re: Sun over a flat Earth
« Reply #21 on: March 13, 2018, 10:22:48 AM »

Also as a note, though he's never come out and said it point blank, it's heavily implied that geometry doesn't work at longer distances.

This is a point that could (should?) be laid to rest by the FE community, as they have used that same geometry (at long distances) to "divine" the altitudes and diameters of the sun and moon and were satisfied with the results. Given the minute size of their universe there aren't many distances longer than those in the cosmos.

Re: Sun over a flat Earth
« Reply #22 on: March 13, 2018, 11:24:07 AM »
I'm sure he does make claims about things that are not "universally believed within the FE community" since there is virtually nothing that is "universally believed within the FE community". Look at the state of "FE theory". The flat Earth is finite, or infinite. There is one pole, or maybe two. Inconsistent diagrams and explanations of how things work, moon phases, eclipses, sunsets, how light travels. Let's look at the map, or wait, there is no agreed map. Let's talk about the distance a plane flies. Well we can't since we don't have a map.
Well, quite. I said this in my post. There is no coherent flat earth model so in some ways that makes it hard to refute.
But he is making claims about their beliefs which don't actually match the flat earth views - although I would say that their actual beliefs are quite hard to determine. The model outlined in the Wiki is fundamentally flawed and I've always struggled on here to get any coherent responses when those flaws have been pointed out.

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Let's face it. His videos are well done and present many valid points, and your response is basically a way to find complaint about the video in general so that you have an excuse to dismiss it instead of trying to answer any points factually. Because you can't.
Dude. Did you even read my last paragraph? The one you quoted? It's pretty clear from that I am not a flat earther.
My complaints about the video are a level of straw man argument and the smug, condescending tone.
That doesn't mean that everything in those videos is wrong, a lot is right.
"This is literally just a few people talking about it for a brief time every day on their spare time. That’s the flat earth movement" - Tom Bishop

Offline mtnman

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Re: Sun over a flat Earth
« Reply #23 on: March 13, 2018, 03:25:35 PM »

Dude. Did you even read my last paragraph? The one you quoted? It's pretty clear from that I am not a flat earther.
My complaints about the video are a level of straw man argument and the smug, condescending tone.
That doesn't mean that everything in those videos is wrong, a lot is right.
Yes, I read the last paragraph. But must have mistaken your point of view. Thought you were coming from a FE belief standpoint, trying to undermine CHL's arguments.

I used to read and post here quite a bit a few months back, been away for a while and not sure where everyone's coming from. My apologies.