Flat Earth Theory Is WRONG!
« on: December 27, 2016, 10:42:15 PM »
Below are some of the major reasons that flat earth people believe in flat earth theory, and how they are wrong:

First, the flat earth model: a flat disk with the north pole at the center and the south pole as a wall of ice surrounding the disk.

1) The earth's horizon looks flat | really? just because it looks flat does not mean it is flat..... (there's a common saying: don't judge a book by its cover).

2) Satellite photos, and the moon landings were faked | this could be true, but because we cannot prove nor deny this, we cannot use this evidence to prove either point; round or flat earth.

3) Gravity does not exist, the earth is just acceleration upwards at 9.8 meters per second per second | while this may be true, if the earth were just accelerating upwards at 9.8 meters per second per second, it would have already reached the speed of light (it would have taken 354 days). If the earth were at or near the speed of light, we would not be able to see any stars near the wall of ice (south pole).

4) Earth accelerates upwards due to dark energy | dark energy does indeed accelerate things away from it, but if dark energy exists (a highly theoretical idea that hasn't been proven yet), why cant the basic force of gravity exist (a force known to man for 2000 years or more).

5) If the earth were a sphere, you could see the curvature | yes! you can see the curvature in some cases! however, the earth is not a perfect sphere, and is distorted by many factors, including buildings, mountains, and other things that stick up out of the ground that can cause it to be harder to see earth's curvature
Technical explanation: our eyes, and our brains, perceive two vertical things (such as buildings) as perpendicular. this causes our brain to perceive a piece of land with two buildings as flat because our brains thinks that the buildings are parallel, and the ground, which is perpendicular to both buildings as flat. However, this is just an optical illusion that is caused by your brain's tendency to assume things are parallel or perpendicular.

6) Both the Bible and the Quran says the earth is flat | while it is true that Job 38:14, Psalm 96:10, and Psalm 104:5 from the bible as well as Sura Al-Kahf (18:47), and Sura An-Naml (27:61) from the Quran claims the earth is flat, it is not. Remember that these books were written a very long time ago, during a time when western science has just been torched to the ground (yes, I'm talking about the fall of the greek city states), and was written about people who were considered radical and crazy at their times. I'm not saying that any religion is wrong, but to invoke religion into a matter of science is too medival aged.

This sums up my rant on why the earth is NOT flat.

Just remember, there is a million evidence that science provides as proof of a round earth. It may not always be right, but the fundamentals of our universe should never be forgotten.

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Re: Flat Earth Theory Is WRONG!
« Reply #1 on: December 28, 2016, 12:51:23 AM »
Below are some of the major reasons that flat earth people believe in flat earth theory, and how they are wrong:

First, the flat earth model: a flat disk with the north pole at the center and the south pole as a wall of ice surrounding the disk.

1) The earth's horizon looks flat | really? just because it looks flat does not mean it is flat..... (there's a common saying: don't judge a book by its cover).

2) Satellite photos, and the moon landings were faked | this could be true, but because we cannot prove nor deny this, we cannot use this evidence to prove either point; round or flat earth.

3) Gravity does not exist, the earth is just acceleration upwards at 9.8 meters per second per second | while this may be true, if the earth were just accelerating upwards at 9.8 meters per second per second, it would have already reached the speed of light (it would have taken 354 days). If the earth were at or near the speed of light, we would not be able to see any stars near the wall of ice (south pole).

4) Earth accelerates upwards due to dark energy | dark energy does indeed accelerate things away from it, but if dark energy exists (a highly theoretical idea that hasn't been proven yet), why cant the basic force of gravity exist (a force known to man for 2000 years or more).

5) If the earth were a sphere, you could see the curvature | yes! you can see the curvature in some cases! however, the earth is not a perfect sphere, and is distorted by many factors, including buildings, mountains, and other things that stick up out of the ground that can cause it to be harder to see earth's curvature
Technical explanation: our eyes, and our brains, perceive two vertical things (such as buildings) as perpendicular. this causes our brain to perceive a piece of land with two buildings as flat because our brains thinks that the buildings are parallel, and the ground, which is perpendicular to both buildings as flat. However, this is just an optical illusion that is caused by your brain's tendency to assume things are parallel or perpendicular.

6) Both the Bible and the Quran says the earth is flat | while it is true that Job 38:14, Psalm 96:10, and Psalm 104:5 from the bible as well as Sura Al-Kahf (18:47), and Sura An-Naml (27:61) from the Quran claims the earth is flat, it is not. Remember that these books were written a very long time ago, during a time when western science has just been torched to the ground (yes, I'm talking about the fall of the greek city states), and was written about people who were considered radical and crazy at their times. I'm not saying that any religion is wrong, but to invoke religion into a matter of science is too medival aged.

This sums up my rant on why the earth is NOT flat.

Just remember, there is a million evidence that science provides as proof of a round earth. It may not always be right, but the fundamentals of our universe should never be forgotten.

In response to #3, no, it wouldn't reach the speed of light. It would asymptotically approach the speed of light, but never reach it.

I didn't see any reason to continue reading after that.

Re: Flat Earth Theory Is WRONG!
« Reply #2 on: December 28, 2016, 01:03:50 AM »
"In response to #3, no, it wouldn't reach the speed of light. It would asymptotically approach the speed of light, but never reach it."

I left that out for simplicity, but yes you are right, it would approach the speed of light, and then the force of gravity would weaken, as the acceleration of the earth would slow down unless the force applied to the earth increased (which due to point 4, whould mean a spontaneous appearance of more dark energy).
« Last Edit: December 28, 2016, 01:17:39 AM by RandomDotOrg »

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Re: Flat Earth Theory Is WRONG!
« Reply #3 on: December 28, 2016, 01:34:12 AM »

I left that out for simplicity, but yes you are right, it would approach the speed of light, and then the force of gravity would weaken, as the acceleration of the earth would slow down unless the force applied to the earth increased (which due to point 4, whould mean a spontaneous appearance of more dark energy).

I think you're confusing coordinate acceleration and proper acceleration. The UA theory does have its flaws, but this isn't one of them.

Re: Flat Earth Theory Is WRONG!
« Reply #4 on: December 28, 2016, 01:49:11 AM »
"I think you're confusing coordinate acceleration and proper acceleration. The UA theory does have its flaws, but this isn't one of them."

Well, according to Einstein's Theory of Special Relativity, as an object approaches the speed of light, its mass becomes larger and larger. Therefore, in order for the object to continue to accelerate, the force applied must grow (f=ma, as the mass increases, so must the force).

Re: Flat Earth Theory Is WRONG!
« Reply #5 on: December 28, 2016, 08:37:10 AM »
"I think you're confusing coordinate acceleration and proper acceleration. The UA theory does have its flaws, but this isn't one of them."

Well, according to Einstein's Theory of Special Relativity, as an object approaches the speed of light, its mass becomes larger and larger. Therefore, in order for the object to continue to accelerate, the force applied must grow (f=ma, as the mass increases, so must the force).

In the reference frame of the accelerating body (earth in this scenario) you just appear to continue to accelerate  at the same rate. However from an observer reference frame ("stationary" relative to the earth) the acceleration of the earth gets less and less as it approaches the speed of light (effectively consistent with a constant force applied to an object increasing in mass). What both reference frames will see is that time will have slowed to a virtual standstill in other reference frame.
We don't observe that about the Stars so you'd have to conclude they were accelerating with us.
So you can imagine UAE scenario consistent with special relativity but this is obviously cherry picking a bit of science while chucking much of the rest away in proposing a flat earth.

You could suggest it's rather strange that flat earthists have used a bit of science (special relativity) that is really not self evidently understandable and certainly not possible to demonstrate by normal observation to help "explain" a flat earth. In contrast there is some very much easier science and straight forward observations that can be done to demonstrate earth is a globe (e.g. observation of the sun and moon and stars, ships going below the horizon, distances on the globe etc)
« Last Edit: December 28, 2016, 03:30:24 PM by Algebraist »

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Re: Flat Earth Theory Is WRONG!
« Reply #6 on: December 28, 2016, 04:27:40 PM »
It IS a good website to explore the ideas about how the earth would have to be IF the earth was a flat disc, etc.
You're really determined to keep spreading this lie to every newcomer, aren't you?

Perhaps a discussion is needed to see if we need a rule against deliberately scaring off those who come here to discuss, for example by way of deceptively misrepresenting our purpose or demographics.
Read the FAQ before asking your question - chances are we already addressed it.
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Re: Flat Earth Theory Is WRONG!
« Reply #7 on: December 28, 2016, 06:54:01 PM »
This sums up my rant on why the earth is NOT flat.

Most of your points are just rebuttals of points made by flat earthers. None of them are actually evidence that the earth is not flat.

"I think you're confusing coordinate acceleration and proper acceleration. The UA theory does have its flaws, but this isn't one of them."

Well, according to Einstein's Theory of Special Relativity, as an object approaches the speed of light, its mass becomes larger and larger. Therefore, in order for the object to continue to accelerate, the force applied must grow (f=ma, as the mass increases, so must the force).

The strength of gravity according to UA would be proportional to "a", in that formula, not "f".

It IS a good website to explore the ideas about how the earth would have to be IF the earth was a flat disc, etc.
You're really determined to keep spreading this lie to every newcomer, aren't you?

Perhaps a discussion is needed to see if we need a rule against deliberately scaring off those who come here to discuss, for example by way of deceptively misrepresenting our purpose or demographics.

No need to make a new rule. Just warn/ban for off-topic or spammy posts. Almost every single post he makes includes this unsolicited, off-topic, assertion.

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Re: Flat Earth Theory Is WRONG!
« Reply #8 on: December 28, 2016, 09:10:42 PM »
It IS a good website to explore the ideas about how the earth would have to be IF the earth was a flat disc, etc.
You're really determined to keep spreading this lie to every newcomer, aren't you?

Perhaps a discussion is needed to see if we need a rule against deliberately scaring off those who come here to discuss, for example by way of deceptively misrepresenting our purpose or demographics.



No need to make a new rule. Just warn/ban for off-topic or spammy posts. Almost every single post he makes includes this unsolicited, off-topic, assertion.

I agree with TNR. If administration wants to review adding a new rule to encompass things like this, then so be it. In the mean time, I've split the post and warned the user. The next time he attempts to poison the well for others, it will be a ban.