*

Offline honk

  • *
  • Posts: 2005
  • resident goose
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #3960 on: June 28, 2019, 05:00:00 AM »
ur retartet but u donut even no it and i walnut tell u y

*

Offline Fortuna

  • *
  • Posts: 2179
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #3961 on: June 28, 2019, 06:28:49 AM »
The democrats are outright trying to buy votes now. This is fucking hilarious to watch.

-Free healthcare
-Free healthcare for illegals (in California at least)
-Free college
-Free money for black people
-Free money for gays
-Free money every month for doing nothing

« Last Edit: June 28, 2019, 06:31:56 AM by Fortuna »

*

Offline Lord Dave

  • *
  • Posts: 5763
  • Grumpy old man.
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #3962 on: June 28, 2019, 07:31:44 AM »
The democrats are outright trying to buy votes now. This is fucking hilarious to watch.

-Free healthcare
-Free healthcare for illegals (in California at least)
-Free college
-Free money for black people
-Free money for gays
-Free money every month for doing nothing



Did an actual candidate offer all that or some rando on the street?

*

Offline Rushy

  • Planar Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 7240
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #3963 on: June 28, 2019, 01:49:05 PM »
Did an actual candidate offer all that or some rando on the street?

You must be out of the loop, Dave.

-Free healthcare

All of them.
-Free healthcare for illegals (in California at least)

All of the candidates that were presented in the second debate raised their hand in support. Not sure about the first.

-Free college

This is Bernie and Warren. Someone else might have? Not that anyone else matters.

-Free money for black people
-Free money for gays

I'm sure at least one candidate supports reparations but I don't know which one. Never heard about free money for gays, though.

-Free money every month for doing nothing

Yang. His stance is $1000 per month basic income to all Americans, forever.



*

Offline Lord Dave

  • *
  • Posts: 5763
  • Grumpy old man.
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #3966 on: June 29, 2019, 07:27:29 AM »
Did an actual candidate offer all that or some rando on the street?

You must be out of the loop, Dave.

-Free healthcare

All of them.
-Free healthcare for illegals (in California at least)

All of the candidates that were presented in the second debate raised their hand in support. Not sure about the first.

-Free college

This is Bernie and Warren. Someone else might have? Not that anyone else matters.

-Free money for black people
-Free money for gays

I'm sure at least one candidate supports reparations but I don't know which one. Never heard about free money for gays, though.

-Free money every month for doing nothing

Yang. His stance is $1000 per month basic income to all Americans, forever.

Ok, I thought a single candidate promised all that at once.  Knew about Yang.  Its not a bad idea, just impractical in America.


Warren
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/elizabeth-warren-promises-reparations-for-gay-couples

Wow.

Why?  Its not that bad.  Its basically just letting people redo old taxes because they weren't allowed to do it the correct way before.

*

Offline Pete Svarrior

  • e
  • Planar Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 11957
  • (>^_^)> it's propaganda time (◕‿◕✿)
    • View Profile
    • The Flat Earth Society
Re: Trump
« Reply #3967 on: June 29, 2019, 08:41:42 AM »
https://www.facebook.com/228735667216/posts/10156812133102217/

Nice - with that out of the way no one could possibly claim that Trump supports Russian election interference.
Read the FAQ before asking your question - chances are we've already addressed it.
Follow the Flat Earth Society on Twitter and Facebook!

<Parsifal> I like looking at Chinese Wikipedia with Noto installed
<Parsifal> I don't understand any of it but the symbols look nice

*

Offline Lord Dave

  • *
  • Posts: 5763
  • Grumpy old man.
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #3968 on: June 29, 2019, 09:08:23 AM »
https://www.facebook.com/228735667216/posts/10156812133102217/

Nice - with that out of the way no one could possibly claim that Trump supports Russian election interference.
And see how firm he was with his finger?  Russia wouldn't dare meddle now.

*

Offline Rushy

  • Planar Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 7240
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #3969 on: June 29, 2019, 02:20:51 PM »
Why?  Its not that bad.  Its basically just letting people redo old taxes because they weren't allowed to do it the correct way before.

"the correct way". The correct way is to not let gays marry. The purpose of state-sanctioned marriage incentives is to stabilize families for the purpose of reproduction. Gays cannot reproduce and are therefore inherently worthless for the state to subsidize. I don't think straight marriages that produce no children should enjoy subsidization, either.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2019, 02:22:23 PM by Rushy »

*

Offline markjo

  • Purgatory
  • *
  • Posts: 4764
  • Zetetic Council runner-up
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #3970 on: June 29, 2019, 05:03:27 PM »
Why?  Its not that bad.  Its basically just letting people redo old taxes because they weren't allowed to do it the correct way before.

"the correct way". The correct way is to not let gays marry. The purpose of state-sanctioned marriage incentives is to stabilize families for the purpose of reproduction. Gays cannot reproduce and are therefore inherently worthless for the state to subsidize. I don't think straight marriages that produce no children should enjoy subsidization, either.
You haven't been keeping up with modern medicine, have you?  In vitro fertilization and surrogate wombs means that there is no need for traditional male-female pair bonding for reproduction.  Or, gay couples can simply adopt otherwise unwanted babies.  Saying that gays are incapable of forming stable families is exceedingly ignorant.

Then again, encouraging overpopulation and increasing competition for finite resources isn't a good thing either.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2019, 05:06:48 PM by markjo »
Abandon hope all ye who press enter here.

Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.

If you can't demonstrate it, then you shouldn't believe it.

*

Offline Rushy

  • Planar Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 7240
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #3971 on: June 29, 2019, 06:56:08 PM »
You haven't been keeping up with modern medicine, have you?  In vitro fertilization and surrogate wombs means that there is no need for traditional male-female pair bonding for reproduction.  Or, gay couples can simply adopt otherwise unwanted babies.  Saying that gays are incapable of forming stable families is exceedingly ignorant.

Here's a compromise: gay marriage can stay but only for couples who adopt.

Then again, encouraging overpopulation and increasing competition for finite resources isn't a good thing either.

Birth rates are below replacement rate in nearly all Western countries. We're not looking at overpopulation, we're looking at a population decline. A shrinking population will result in economic recession (or worse) when the current generations reach retirement age with no workers there to pay their social security dues.

*

Offline markjo

  • Purgatory
  • *
  • Posts: 4764
  • Zetetic Council runner-up
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #3972 on: June 29, 2019, 07:45:48 PM »
Then again, encouraging overpopulation and increasing competition for finite resources isn't a good thing either.
Birth rates are below replacement rate in nearly all Western countries. We're not looking at overpopulation, we're looking at a population decline.
That may be true, but the population of the rest of the world is most certainly on the rise.

A shrinking population will result in economic recession (or worse) when the current generations reach retirement age with no workers there to pay their social security dues.
Here's a dirty word for you: immigration.
Abandon hope all ye who press enter here.

Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.

If you can't demonstrate it, then you shouldn't believe it.

*

Offline Lord Dave

  • *
  • Posts: 5763
  • Grumpy old man.
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #3973 on: June 29, 2019, 09:11:57 PM »
Why?  Its not that bad.  Its basically just letting people redo old taxes because they weren't allowed to do it the correct way before.

"the correct way". The correct way is to not let gays marry. The purpose of state-sanctioned marriage incentives is to stabilize families for the purpose of reproduction. Gays cannot reproduce and are therefore inherently worthless for the state to subsidize. I don't think straight marriages that produce no children should enjoy subsidization, either.

What state subsidizes?  The Earned Child Tax Credit only applies when you have children, not for being married.  The benefit of filing married jointly is to potentially get into a lower tax bracket.  Your incomes become one and are taxed on a different scale than single filers.  Its not a huge difference but it could mean the difference between owing taxes and not.  It's meant as a way to limit paperwork from the IRS, not promote family cohesion.

*

Offline Rushy

  • Planar Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 7240
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #3974 on: June 29, 2019, 09:38:04 PM »
That may be true, but the population of the rest of the world is most certainly on the rise.

Thanks to copious amounts of foreign food aid and little or no education aid to third world countries.

Here's a dirty word for you: immigration.

Yes, it's exactly what the UN thinks will solve the problem. However, all you're really doing is flooding the country with uneducated low class workers. This causes the bottom to fall out of the middle class, which is happening across the US due to worker overages. To top it off, many Dem presidential candidates want to tax the middle class to provide for the very same low skilled workers that are flooding the system. It's what lost them the election in 2016, it's what will cause them to lose yet again. Once the Dems figure out that "tax the rich" doesn't mean you should increase taxes on people who only make 80k a year, then maybe they'll stop falling apart at the seams.

What state subsidizes?  The Earned Child Tax Credit only applies when you have children, not for being married.  The benefit of filing married jointly is to potentially get into a lower tax bracket.  Your incomes become one and are taxed on a different scale than single filers.  Its not a huge difference but it could mean the difference between owing taxes and not.  It's meant as a way to limit paperwork from the IRS, not promote family cohesion.

There's no effective difference between a subsidy and a tax cut. To cut someone's taxes is to subsidize their behavior. To reward people for adding no extra value to society is untenable to the future of that society. A state interested in maintaining the well being of its people should only subsidize behavior that leads to the continuation of the state and society at large. It's why I don't support national healthcare unless we ban unhealthy behaviors, such as obesity, drugs, and homosexuality. If you make it the state's business to pay for your healthcare, then you make it the state's business to punish you for choosing unhealthy lifestyles. You can't have one without the other or the healthcare system is doomed to failure. The lack of this kind of long term thinking is what is causing the slow degradation of Western nations. It's why Western nations have such amazing healthcare systems and yet such unhealthy populations.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2019, 09:40:50 PM by Rushy »

*

Offline Rama Set

  • *
  • Posts: 6671
  • Round and round...
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #3975 on: June 30, 2019, 12:32:22 AM »
Marriage is subsidized by the state because of antiquated religious involvement with government. The notion that it is there to subsidize and promote family stability is an ad how rationalization.

*

Offline honk

  • *
  • Posts: 2005
  • resident goose
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #3976 on: June 30, 2019, 02:02:29 AM »
https://thinkprogress.org/trump-believes-western-liberalism-literally-means-liberals-on-the-west-coast-b9f8e2ac6fe0/

The headline is an exaggeration, and of course this is far from the dumbest thing Trump has said. I just find it very amusing that Trump would think Putin was talking about liberals in California.
ur retartet but u donut even no it and i walnut tell u y

*

Offline Lord Dave

  • *
  • Posts: 5763
  • Grumpy old man.
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #3977 on: June 30, 2019, 08:01:33 AM »
What state subsidizes?  The Earned Child Tax Credit only applies when you have children, not for being married.  The benefit of filing married jointly is to potentially get into a lower tax bracket.  Your incomes become one and are taxed on a different scale than single filers.  Its not a huge difference but it could mean the difference between owing taxes and not.  It's meant as a way to limit paperwork from the IRS, not promote family cohesion.

There's no effective difference between a subsidy and a tax cut. To cut someone's taxes is to subsidize their behavior. To reward people for adding no extra value to society is untenable to the future of that society. A state interested in maintaining the well being of its people should only subsidize behavior that leads to the continuation of the state and society at large. It's why I don't support national healthcare unless we ban unhealthy behaviors, such as obesity, drugs, and homosexuality. If you make it the state's business to pay for your healthcare, then you make it the state's business to punish you for choosing unhealthy lifestyles. You can't have one without the other or the healthcare system is doomed to failure. The lack of this kind of long term thinking is what is causing the slow degradation of Western nations. It's why Western nations have such amazing healthcare systems and yet such unhealthy populations.
First off, I'm still waiting for the tax credit on being married.  What's it called?  If you want to call "married being in a differnet tax scale" then sure but it's really not.
https://smartasset.com/taxes/taxes-single-vs-married
If you notice, having two people with the same income doesn't really help.  Their effective tax rate is going to be about the same.

Ex:
I make $40,000 a year.
My wife amkes $40,000 a year.
Separately we pay...

10% up to $9,525
12% from $9,526 to $38,700
22% from $38,701 to $40,000

Which totals....
952.5 + 3500.88 + 285.78 = $4,739.16 (x2) = $9,478.32

Jointly we'd have..
10% up to $19,050
12% from $19,051 to $77,400
22% from $77,401 to $80,000

1905 + 7001.88 + 571,78 = $9,478.66



Huh... look at that... it's actually 34 cents MORE if you file married.  Not much of a tax credit is it?
This, of course, is before tax deductions.  But the deductions are just double the single ones so... Yeah.

*

Offline Rushy

  • Planar Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 7240
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #3978 on: June 30, 2019, 02:55:14 PM »
Marriage is subsidized by the state because of antiquated religious involvement with government. The notion that it is there to subsidize and promote family stability is an ad how rationalization.

The notion that marriage is not for the sole purpose of the continuation of society is only proposed by people who have no understanding of society. It is no coincidence that all human societies developed marriage arrangements, many of those societies existed long before any organized religion. To say marriage is a result of religion is putting the cart before the horse. Religion put a spiritual purpose to marriage in addition to the already existing societal reasons.

First off, I'm still waiting for the tax credit on being married.  What's it called?  If you want to call "married being in a differnet tax scale" then sure but it's really not.
https://smartasset.com/taxes/taxes-single-vs-married
If you notice, having two people with the same income doesn't really help.  Their effective tax rate is going to be about the same.

At 40k a year you'd never make it into the 38k+ or 77k+ brackets because at the very least you're taking a standard deduction. I suggest you depend on a real tax consultant to make decisions on your taxes instead of RandomTerribleWebsiteThatMightBeOutdated.org

*

Offline Rama Set

  • *
  • Posts: 6671
  • Round and round...
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #3979 on: July 01, 2019, 04:32:31 PM »
Marriage is subsidized by the state because of antiquated religious involvement with government. The notion that it is there to subsidize and promote family stability is an ad how rationalization.

The notion that marriage is not for the sole purpose of the continuation of society is only proposed by people who have no understanding of society.

Lol

Quote
It is no coincidence that all human societies developed marriage arrangements, many of those societies existed long before any organized religion. To say marriage is a result of religion is putting the cart before the horse.

Well good thing no one said that!

Quote
Religion put a spiritual purpose to marriage in addition to the already existing societal reasons.

You are really trying hard to attack an argument I just didn’t make. I wast discussing marriage as an overall human phenomenon throughout all of history. I was talking about the ensconcing on marriage in the tax laws of the USA.

If marriage is as meritorious as you are saying there is no need to incentivize it, because it’s usefulness will be self-evident. But monogamous marriage is neither ubiquitous or necessary. Stable social units are. Sometimes those are established by marriages sometimes not.