Re: Trump
« Reply #740 on: February 20, 2017, 12:15:38 AM »
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/19/world/europe/last-night-in-sweden-trumps-remark-baffles-a-nation.html

Does he just say things assuming nobody will question him or fact-check him?

He knows that his supporters won't care. They explain it away. The important thing is manufacturing a narrative that the world is a scary, dangerous place, and only Trump can protect them.

*

Online la xasop

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 6337
  • Professional computer somebody
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #741 on: February 20, 2017, 12:24:25 AM »
He knows that his supporters won't care. They explain it away. The important thing is manufacturing a narrative that the world is a scary, dangerous place, and only Trump can protect them.

On the contrary, most Trump supporters I know love to talk about things he's legitimately done wrong. The trouble is that for every legitimate fuckup of his, there are ten fake news stories about him being literally Hitler, so it appears at first glance as though they "explain away" any criticism.
when you try to mock anyone while also running the flat earth society. Lol

*

Online Lord Dave

  • *
  • Posts: 5834
  • Grumpy old man.
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #742 on: February 20, 2017, 06:01:48 AM »
Please help Preisdent Trump take the fight back to the dishonest MSM!

https://gop.com/mainstream-media-accountability-survey/


https://action.donaldjtrump.com/mainstream-media-accountability-survey/


He made a new one.
Mostly the same queations, bit longer, and with three CAPTCHAs.


I guess they think the answers must be from bots...

Re: Trump
« Reply #743 on: February 20, 2017, 06:17:10 AM »
"5. On which issues does the mainstream media do the worst job of representing Republicans? (Select as many that apply.)

12. Were you aware that a poll was released revealing that a majority of Americans actually supported President Trump's temporary restriction executive order?

14. Do you believe that contrary to what the media says, raising taxes does not create jobs?

16. Do you believe that the media wrongly attributes gun violence to Second Amendment rights?"

fucking lol good survey 69/69 would respond again
I have visited from prestigious research institutions of the highest caliber, to which only our administrator holds with confidence.

*

Offline Ghost Spaghetti

  • *
  • Posts: 908
  • Don't look in that mirror. It's absolutely furious
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #744 on: February 20, 2017, 02:22:25 PM »
Wow, it's rare to see such ineptly put-together polls outside of high-school science fairs. Every question is number 1, and some of the questions are so clumsily worded I'm not even 100% sure what answer the leading question is leading me to.

"1.Do you believe that the mainstream media does not do their due diligence fact-checking before publishing stories on the Trump administration?"

Do I, or do I not believe, they do not do their due diligence?

It's like something out of the mouth of Sir Humphrey Appleby.

*

Online Lord Dave

  • *
  • Posts: 5834
  • Grumpy old man.
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #745 on: February 20, 2017, 02:28:59 PM »
Apparently the reason they had a new survey was...

"maintream media outlets have viciously attacked it...and thousands of Democrats have taken it to try to sabotage the results."

(that ... is in the e-mail.  This is word for word)

So yeah.... he didn't like the answers and this is "Strictly people who agree with me only!" survey.

*

Offline Pete Svarrior

  • e
  • Planar Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 12113
  • (>^_^)> it's propaganda time (◕‿◕✿)
    • View Profile
    • The Flat Earth Society
Re: Trump
« Reply #746 on: February 20, 2017, 02:34:52 PM »
So yeah.... he didn't like the answers and this is "Strictly people who agree with me only!" survey.
Well, if he's asking his supporters how they feel about things, getting responses from people who feel the opposite way is probably quite unhelpful.
Read the FAQ before asking your question - chances are we've already addressed it.
Follow the Flat Earth Society on Twitter and Facebook!

<Parsifal> I like looking at Chinese Wikipedia with Noto installed
<Parsifal> I don't understand any of it but the symbols look nice

Re: Trump
« Reply #747 on: February 20, 2017, 02:40:13 PM »
So yeah.... he didn't like the answers and this is "Strictly people who agree with me only!" survey.
Well, if he's asking his supporters how they feel about things, getting responses from people who feel the opposite way is probably quite unhelpful.

Why does he only want answers from his supporters? Is he not the president of the entire United States? It seems like how Americans feel about the media should be the question, not how do the people that I know already support me feel about the media.

And even if it were a poll for his supporters only, the questions are still loaded with assumptions about the media. So what exactly is the point? To make himself feel good about himself by using loaded questions directed only at his supporters?
« Last Edit: February 20, 2017, 02:41:58 PM by trekky0623 »

Re: Trump
« Reply #748 on: February 20, 2017, 03:41:24 PM »
i'm struggling to think of any way in which this questionnaire could possibly be helpful
I have visited from prestigious research institutions of the highest caliber, to which only our administrator holds with confidence.

*

Online Lord Dave

  • *
  • Posts: 5834
  • Grumpy old man.
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #749 on: February 20, 2017, 03:45:24 PM »
So yeah.... he didn't like the answers and this is "Strictly people who agree with me only!" survey.
Well, if he's asking his supporters how they feel about things, getting responses from people who feel the opposite way is probably quite unhelpful.


Basicaly what Trekky said.  The survey's only use is going to be to throw it out at the media with "see?  I was right!".  He's manufacturing evidence and is getting mad when there is no way to stop non-supporters from doing the survey.

*

Online Lord Dave

  • *
  • Posts: 5834
  • Grumpy old man.
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #750 on: February 20, 2017, 04:48:58 PM »
i'm struggling to think of any way in which this questionnaire could possibly be helpful

Easy.

*At a Rally in Florida, Donald Trump holds up a report* "I have here, in my hand, absolute proof that the Mainstream Media is LYING to you.  95% of people who took my survey agree with me, that the Mainstream Media is lying!  And corrupt!  We will take it to the courts and we will make them report properly."

It helps Trump and only Trump.  At least to his supporters.  Which is going to make them feel justified in their distrust of the media.  Which is basically what Trump wants cause if people don't trust the media, well... he can say whatever the fuck he wants.

Hell, people think that Sweden is covering up the crimes by Muslims!  It's insane!*
(Trump later clarified that he was referring to a Fox News segment.)

*I say this on The Flat Earth Society forum, fully understanding that irony
« Last Edit: February 20, 2017, 04:51:07 PM by Lord Dave »

Re: Trump
« Reply #751 on: February 20, 2017, 06:14:10 PM »
http://www.politico.com/story/2017/02/white-house-nsc-aide-craig-deare-dismissed-235175
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/white-house-donald-trump-sack-craig-deare-advisor-latino-policies-oval-office-us-president-michael-a7589626.html

Craig Deare, NSC's senior director for Western Hemisphere Affairs, dismissed for criticizing the administration.

"Deare harshly criticized the president and his chief strategist Steve Bannon and railed against the dysfunction paralyzing the Trump White House, according to a source familiar with the situation. He complained in particular that senior national security aides do not have access to the president — and gave a detailed and embarrassing readout of Trump's call with Mexican President Enrique Peña Nieto."

Whitehouse spokesperson on the situation: "If you don't support the President's agenda then you shouldn't have a job in the White House"

Can't have any non-bootlickers.

*

Online Снупс

  • Planar Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 1863
  • I summon my love back to me
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #752 on: February 20, 2017, 08:38:58 PM »
He knows that his supporters won't care. They explain it away. The important thing is manufacturing a narrative that the world is a scary, dangerous place, and only Trump can protect them.

On the contrary, most Trump supporters I know love to talk about things he's legitimately done wrong. The trouble is that for every legitimate fuckup of his, there are ten fake news stories about him being literally Hitler, so it appears at first glance as though they "explain away" any criticism.

If it makes you feel any better, most of the Trump supporters I personally know refuse to recognize almost any fault and more or less just agree with everything he does, so it's not like these "explain away" folks are hardly real. Yeah, yeah, "obv extreme exists on any side", just saying, the anecdotal evidence goes both ways.
Quote from: garygreen date=1480782226
i also took an online quiz that said i was a giraffe.  and i guess you're dumb enough to believe that i must be because the internet said so.

*

Offline Pete Svarrior

  • e
  • Planar Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 12113
  • (>^_^)> it's propaganda time (◕‿◕✿)
    • View Profile
    • The Flat Earth Society
Re: Trump
« Reply #753 on: February 20, 2017, 09:14:16 PM »
Why does he only want answers from his supporters? Is he not the president of the entire United States?
He's also the leader of a self-defined movement to uproot the status quo of the USA. Now, whether he should be a leader of such a movement and whether or not it creates a conflict of interest with his presidency are interesting questions, but ones that were clearly disregarded when this survey was produced. Both in the e-mail and the survey, he quite clearly addresses the "people" behind that movement. There should be a time and place to listen to opponents, but it doesn't have to always be the case.

And even if it were a poll for his supporters only, the questions are still loaded with assumptions about the media.
The phrasing of the questions is far from ideal, but most of the "loaded" questions are along the lines of "do you agree with this statement?" They're clearly there to compare and contrast the sentiment of the MAGA movement's leadership and its core supporters.

So what exactly is the point?
Probably to figure out whether or not his core supporter base agrees with the recent developments of his movement. That his opponents still violently oppose him is obvious and largely immutable. Whether or not his current supporter base is having second thoughts is something worth looking into.

Not listening to your supporters is an easy mistake to make, and one that costs political careers. Just look at the Labour Party in the UK, or the Democratic Party in the USA.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2017, 09:16:28 PM by SexWarrior »
Read the FAQ before asking your question - chances are we've already addressed it.
Follow the Flat Earth Society on Twitter and Facebook!

<Parsifal> I like looking at Chinese Wikipedia with Noto installed
<Parsifal> I don't understand any of it but the symbols look nice

*

Offline honk

  • *
  • Posts: 2044
  • resident goose
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #754 on: February 20, 2017, 10:45:42 PM »
The phrasing of the questions is far from ideal, but most of the "loaded" questions are along the lines of "do you agree with this statement?" They're clearly there to compare and contrast the sentiment of the MAGA movement's leadership and its core supporters.

They're hardly going to disagree when they're being this heavily pushed into the desired answers. That doesn't mean that those answers are necessarily going to be reflective of the respondents' behavior, voting habits, or even their true beliefs.

Quote
Not listening to your supporters is an easy mistake to make, and one that costs political careers.

Manipulating your supporters into telling you what you want to hear isn't what I would call listening to them.
ur retartet but u donut even no it and i walnut tell u y

*

Online Снупс

  • Planar Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 1863
  • I summon my love back to me
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #755 on: February 20, 2017, 11:04:58 PM »
My favourite ones are the ones like "Do you agree with the President’s decision to break with tradition by giving lesser known reporters and bloggers the chance to ask the White House Press Secretary questions?" and "Do you agree with President Trump’s media strategy to cut through the media’s noise and deliver our message straight to the people?", where they give you a clear narrative and ask you to agree or disagree with whether it's good or bad, not whether it's true.
Quote from: garygreen date=1480782226
i also took an online quiz that said i was a giraffe.  and i guess you're dumb enough to believe that i must be because the internet said so.

*

Offline Pete Svarrior

  • e
  • Planar Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 12113
  • (>^_^)> it's propaganda time (◕‿◕✿)
    • View Profile
    • The Flat Earth Society
Re: Trump
« Reply #756 on: February 20, 2017, 11:14:58 PM »
Manipulating your supporters into telling you what you want to hear isn't what I would call listening to them.
You have yet to demonstrate that they're being manipulated. They're being asked whether or not they agree with the things the Trump administration says. Talking the working class down as easily-manipulated fools is the speciality of the left, and the reason why they got BTFO globally recently.
Read the FAQ before asking your question - chances are we've already addressed it.
Follow the Flat Earth Society on Twitter and Facebook!

<Parsifal> I like looking at Chinese Wikipedia with Noto installed
<Parsifal> I don't understand any of it but the symbols look nice

*

Offline honk

  • *
  • Posts: 2044
  • resident goose
    • View Profile
Re: Trump
« Reply #757 on: February 20, 2017, 11:52:49 PM »
You have yet to demonstrate that they're being manipulated.

It's an extremely manipulative survey, so it stands to reason that the people responding to it are being manipulated. This article does a good job of pointing out some of the psychological tricks that are used to sway answers, like acquiescence bias, the bandwagon effect, using negative words to invoke negative responses, etc. There's a reason why professional polling organizations frame their questions using very neutral, formal language - it can and does have an effect on how people answer.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2017, 02:54:07 AM by honk »
ur retartet but u donut even no it and i walnut tell u y

Re: Trump
« Reply #758 on: February 21, 2017, 01:00:09 AM »
It helps Trump and only Trump.  At least to his supporters.  Which is going to make them feel justified in their distrust of the media.  Which is basically what Trump wants cause if people don't trust the media, well... he can say whatever the fuck he wants.

i see what you mean, but even that seems like a waste of time.  those folks already buy into the cult of personality.

They're being asked whether or not they agree with the things the Trump administration says.

are you saying that this survey is methodologically sound data science, or are you saying that it doesn't matter if it's good data science or not?
I have visited from prestigious research institutions of the highest caliber, to which only our administrator holds with confidence.

*

Offline Pete Svarrior

  • e
  • Planar Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 12113
  • (>^_^)> it's propaganda time (◕‿◕✿)
    • View Profile
    • The Flat Earth Society
Re: Trump
« Reply #759 on: February 21, 2017, 02:03:05 AM »
are you saying that this survey is methodologically sound data science, or are you saying that it doesn't matter if it's good data science or not?
I definitely don't think it's sound data science. I don't think they're trying to do anything remotely close to science.
Read the FAQ before asking your question - chances are we've already addressed it.
Follow the Flat Earth Society on Twitter and Facebook!

<Parsifal> I like looking at Chinese Wikipedia with Noto installed
<Parsifal> I don't understand any of it but the symbols look nice