İntikam

Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« on: June 22, 2016, 06:11:38 AM »
Strawberry moon occurs about 49 years period. Astronoms say that it is occuring by 70 years period.

The last Strawberry moon occured on 21 June 2016

Before one Strawberry moon occurred on 21 June 1967, it means 49 years.

Popular scies calculating the next strawberry moon will occur on 21 june 2062. it means 46 years.

They are calculating and saying a date that wrong.

Therewithal popular scies can't explain why the strawberry moon occurs. They just calculating the time just by looking the occuring time periods. Popular science has no any real reason for strawberry moon occurs.

So the orbit of the moon is wrong. because the orbital system is completely wrong and fake. The scientists are liar and cheater.



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Offline Woody

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Re: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« Reply #1 on: June 22, 2016, 06:40:34 AM »
Are you saying astronomers are lying and not lying at the same time?

They are accurately predicting when the next will occur, but lying how often it happens?

How are they predicting when it happens?  There seems to be a 3 year difference in what you pointed out.  How are they aware of that difference in advance without a working model?

I also assume you know about what an average is.  So if we have an event that happens on a average of every 70 years does not mean it happens every 70 years.  There will be times when the duration between the event occurring will be shorter or longer than that.

 

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Offline Rounder

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Re: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« Reply #2 on: June 22, 2016, 01:00:56 PM »
This cracks me up, because I came to TFES this morning to present the Strawberry Moon as evidence FOR the round earth!  And to share the below photo, which I found at space.com (of course)  It's a shame Intikam won't see it, it's some eye candy!



First, notice how crisp the detail is across the moon's disk.  How un-glare-like it is.  This goes against one of Tom Bishop's favorite optical theories, how "glare" can supposedly explain the apparent size of sun and moon remaining the same despite large differences in distance between object and observer.
Second, notice the distortion of the moon's shape as it nears the horizon.  It flattens out slightly.  This is in opposition to another FE optical theory which is meant to explain how the sun and moon 'appear' to set while actually remaining some 3000 miles above the flat earth.  We are told that as the light's path length increases, the light bends, appearing to emanate from a location lower than the true location, until finally that light hits the ground instead of reaching our eyes and viola, sunset!  While RE acknowledge that refraction is a real thing (and indeed, explains the flattening effect seen here) we do not agree that it can do what FE claims it can.  This photo, and uncounted others online, show why: in the FE bendy light optical model, light bends not at all (or at least very little) when coming straight down, and bends up (making the object appear lower) by more and more as the angle approaches the horizontal.  From this it follows that as the object appears to near the horizon, the bendy light effect gets stronger and stronger.  If a differential of this effect can be seen in a small angular span, such as the diameter of the moon's disc, then the moon's disk would show a stretching top to bottom of the moon's apparent shape instead of the compression we see here.
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Offline rabinoz

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Re: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2016, 01:03:47 PM »
Strawberry moon occurs about 49 years period. Astronoms say that it is occuring by 70 years period.

The last Strawberry moon occured on 21 June 2016

Before one Strawberry moon occurred on 21 June 1967, it means 49 years.

Popular scies calculating the next strawberry moon will occur on 21 june 2062. it means 46 years.

They are calculating and saying a date that wrong.

Therewithal popular scies can't explain why the strawberry moon occurs. They just calculating the time just by looking the occuring time periods. Popular science has no any real reason for strawberry moon occurs.

So the orbit of the moon is wrong. because the orbital system is completely wrong and fake. The scientists are liar and cheater.

İntikam  you claim that "Astronoms say that it is occuring by 70 years period". Please show me where any astronomer said that. If you accuse someone of lying and cheating you had better have very good evidence for it!

I found one reference that said "See the First Summer Solstice Full Moon in Nearly 70 Years", but that is NOT "Astronomers saying that it is occurring in a 70 year period".

I found another June solstice full moon in 2016, but again that is NOT "Astronomers saying that it is occurring in a 70 year period".

Strictly the solstice is not just a particular day, but a particular day and time, and likewise for the full moon.
This sometimes leads to an ambiguity because the solstice and the full moon can occur on the same day in some parts of the world and not others.

Of course astronomers know exactly when strawberry, harvest, blood, honey or raspberry full moons occur, don't be so silly! (Yes I chucked in one spurious moon - which?)

So another of İntikam's famous claims of "lying scientists" falls flat and all he does is prove himself one, again!

I know he won't read MY post but I have said it and I mean it.

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Offline rabinoz

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Re: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2016, 01:12:28 PM »
This cracks me up, because I came to TFES this morning to present the Strawberry Moon as evidence FOR the round earth!  And to share the below photo, which I found at space.com (of course)  It's a shame Intikam won't see it, it's some eye candy!


First, notice how crisp the detail is across the moon's disk.  How un-glare-like it is.  This goes against one of Tom Bishop's favorite optical theories, how "glare" can supposedly explain the apparent size of sun and moon remaining the same despite large differences in distance between object and observer.
Second, notice the distortion of the moon's shape as it nears the horizon.  It flattens out slightly.  This is in opposition to another FE optical theory which is meant to explain how the sun and moon 'appear' to set while actually remaining some 3000 miles above the flat earth.  We are told that as the light's path length increases, the light bends, appearing to emanate from a location lower than the true location, until finally that light hits the ground instead of reaching our eyes and viola, sunset!  While RE acknowledge that refraction is a real thing (and indeed, explains the flattening effect seen here) we do not agree that it can do what FE claims it can.  This photo, and uncounted others online, show why: in the FE bendy light optical model, light bends not at all (or at least very little) when coming straight down, and bends up (making the object appear lower) by more and more as the angle approaches the horizontal.  From this it follows that as the object appears to near the horizon, the bendy light effect gets stronger and stronger.  If a differential of this effect can be seen in a small angular span, such as the diameter of the moon's disc, then the moon's disk would show a stretching top to bottom of the moon's apparent shape instead of the compression we see here.
I reduced you picture size otherwise my little bit might be overshadowed by you beautiful picture - and we can't have that!

 ;D But, I thought that the moon size shrunk to zero on the horizon (so some say - mainly Youtube videos)
or is magnified by "glare" to be the same size as when overhead (says the Tom Bishop) - they sure cover all bases.  ;D

İntikam

Re: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2016, 01:57:58 PM »
Are you saying astronomers are lying and not lying at the same time?

They are accurately predicting when the next will occur, but lying how often it happens?

How are they predicting when it happens?  There seems to be a 3 year difference in what you pointed out.  How are they aware of that difference in advance without a working model?

I also assume you know about what an average is.  So if we have an event that happens on a average of every 70 years does not mean it happens every 70 years.  There will be times when the duration between the event occurring will be shorter or longer than that.

If is it a right model, then It should not be surprises like this. If  astronomers are saying 70 years period, then it must be 70; if  astronomers are saying 49 years, then it must be 49 years. this is how science. This is not science , it's a fallacy . such as coffee fortune .


Offline Unsure101

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Re: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« Reply #6 on: June 23, 2016, 03:23:02 AM »
This cracks me up, because I came to TFES this morning to present the Strawberry Moon as evidence FOR the round earth!  And to share the below photo, which I found at space.com (of course)  It's a shame Intikam won't see it, it's some eye candy!


That surely is a beautiful photo Rounder.

Really makes you wonder how on a flat earth the moon can stay so well defined as it moves around in a circular path about the north pole.
Certainly the moon would never "set" as a near perfect circle, but appear more of an elipse.

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Offline rabinoz

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Re: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« Reply #7 on: June 23, 2016, 10:38:02 AM »
Are you saying astronomers are lying and not lying at the same time?

They are accurately predicting when the next will occur, but lying how often it happens?

How are they predicting when it happens?  There seems to be a 3 year difference in what you pointed out.  How are they aware of that difference in advance without a working model?

I also assume you know about what an average is.  So if we have an event that happens on a average of every 70 years does not mean it happens every 70 years.  There will be times when the duration between the event occurring will be shorter or longer than that.

If is it a right model, then It should not be surprises like this. If  astronomers are saying 70 years period, then it must be 70; if  astronomers are saying 49 years, then it must be 49 years. this is how science. This is not science , it's a fallacy . such as coffee fortune .
I thought I carefully explained it in: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon ! « Reply #3 on: June 22, 2016, 01:03:47 PM » .

Don't blame if you won't read it and so make a fool of yourself!

While we are on the topic, please explain how you predict "Strawberry or even Blood" moons in your "Flat Earth Astronomy"?
If you can't do that you are a hypocrite and have no right to criticise.

But, you have not yet shown where these astronomers have claimed a 70 years period. In fact it is meaningless to claim a fixed period because some countries can have this "Strawberry moon", while other do not.

But it is useless correcting İntikam,he never accepts correction. But I am quite happy if TFES swallow all this rubbish.
It will guarantee that the Flat Earth idea never get wide acceptance.

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Offline Woody

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Re: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« Reply #8 on: June 23, 2016, 10:43:23 AM »
Are you saying astronomers are lying and not lying at the same time?

They are accurately predicting when the next will occur, but lying how often it happens?

How are they predicting when it happens?  There seems to be a 3 year difference in what you pointed out.  How are they aware of that difference in advance without a working model?

I also assume you know about what an average is.  So if we have an event that happens on a average of every 70 years does not mean it happens every 70 years.  There will be times when the duration between the event occurring will be shorter or longer than that.

If is it a right model, then It should not be surprises like this. If  astronomers are saying 70 years period, then it must be 70; if  astronomers are saying 49 years, then it must be 49 years. this is how science. This is not science , it's a fallacy . such as coffee fortune .
I thought I carefully explained it in: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon ! « Reply #3 on: June 22, 2016, 01:03:47 PM » .

Don't blame if you won't read it and so make a fool of yourself!

While we are on the topic, please explain how you predict "Strawberry or even Blood" moons in your "Flat Earth Astronomy"?
If you can't do that you are a hypocrite and have no right to criticise.

But, you have not yet shown where these astronomers have claimed a 70 years period. In fact it is meaningless to claim a fixed period because some countries can have this "Strawberry moon", while other do not.

But it is useless correcting İntikam,he never accepts correction. But I am quite happy if TFES swallow all this rubbish.
It will guarantee that the Flat Earth idea never get wide acceptance.

I am assuming he read somewhere they happen about every 70 years on average. 

What I find hard to understand the people he is claiming are lying about how often they occur are not lying when telling people when they will occur.

   

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Offline Rounder

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Re: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« Reply #9 on: June 23, 2016, 12:43:19 PM »
Strawberry moon occurs about 49 years period. Astronoms say that it is occuring by 70 years period.

The last Strawberry moon occured on 21 June 2016

Before one Strawberry moon occurred on 21 June 1967, it means 49 years.

Popular scies calculating the next strawberry moon will occur on 21 june 2062. it means 46 years.

They are calculating and saying a date that wrong.

Well, to be more accurate here, it is the media who are wrong, not astronomers or scientists.  Popular web sites and other media outlets seem to have all missed the 1967 event for some reason.  Here's one that did not miss it.


Quote
Therewithal popular scies can't explain why the strawberry moon occurs. They just calculating the time just by looking the occuring time periods. Popular science has no any real reason for strawberry moon occurs.

So the orbit of the moon is wrong. because the orbital system is completely wrong and fake. The scientists are liar and cheater.

The irony here is staggering to witness.  It is FE which can't explain why anything in the solar system happens!  It is FE which calculates the time just by looking at the occuring time periods!  Given the orbital parameters derived from long observation, we RE types can calculate exactly when a given celestial event will occur, and where it can be seen. 

Witness for example the recent transit of Mercury across the sun's disc.  The path taken across the sun and the exact timing was calculated by RE years in advance.  FE could perhaps have given us a date based on 'occuring time periods' but how would it know the exact path?  Without knowing the orbits involved, as far as FE is concerned it might as well have been a bug crawling across the big spotlight in the sky.

Witness for example the upcoming 2017 total solar eclipse.  The path of the shadow across the United States and the timing have been calculated years in advance, and a ground path determined down to accuracies measured in meters.  The best FE can do is, what?  Maybe a date?  FE has no method of explaining, much less predicting, how much of an eclipse we will get on any given eclipse date, nor why that date IS an eclipse date, nor what time the shadow will be at a given location.
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Offline CableDawg

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Re: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« Reply #10 on: June 25, 2016, 02:18:48 AM »
Strawberry moon occurs about 49 years period. Astronoms say that it is occuring by 70 years period.

The last Strawberry moon occured on 21 June 2016

Before one Strawberry moon occurred on 21 June 1967, it means 49 years.

Popular scies calculating the next strawberry moon will occur on 21 june 2062. it means 46 years.

They are calculating and saying a date that wrong.

Therewithal popular scies can't explain why the strawberry moon occurs. They just calculating the time just by looking the occuring time periods. Popular science has no any real reason for strawberry moon occurs.

So the orbit of the moon is wrong. because the orbital system is completely wrong and fake. The scientists are liar and cheater.

The full moon (regardless of arbitrary cultural name such as strawberry moon) and the summer solstice coincide approximately every 70 years. 

You are the liar and cheater in that you are attempting to twist what you've read and make it fit your argument.

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Offline rabinoz

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Re: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« Reply #11 on: June 25, 2016, 11:43:47 AM »
Strawberry moon occurs about 49 years period. Astronoms say that it is occuring by 70 years period.

The last Strawberry moon occured on 21 June 2016

Before one Strawberry moon occurred on 21 June 1967, it means 49 years.

Popular scies calculating the next strawberry moon will occur on 21 june 2062. it means 46 years.

They are calculating and saying a date that wrong.

Therewithal popular scies can't explain why the strawberry moon occurs. They just calculating the time just by looking the occuring time periods. Popular science has no any real reason for strawberry moon occurs.

So the orbit of the moon is wrong. because the orbital system is completely wrong and fake. The scientists are liar and cheater.

The full moon (regardless of arbitrary cultural name such as strawberry moon) and the summer solstice coincide approximately every 70 years. 

You are the liar and cheater in that you are attempting to twist what you've read and make it fit your argument.
And as usual blaming "popular science".

Re: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« Reply #12 on: July 05, 2016, 04:21:53 PM »
This cracks me up, because I came to TFES this morning to present the Strawberry Moon as evidence FOR the round earth!  And to share the below photo, which I found at space.com (of course)  It's a shame Intikam won't see it, it's some eye candy!


That surely is a beautiful photo Rounder.

Really makes you wonder how on a flat earth the moon can stay so well defined as it moves around in a circular path about the north pole.
Certainly the moon would never "set" as a near perfect circle, but appear more of an elipse.

Interesting how it clearly changes shape and size though

Re: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« Reply #13 on: July 05, 2016, 04:34:06 PM »
This cracks me up, because I came to TFES this morning to present the Strawberry Moon as evidence FOR the round earth!  And to share the below photo, which I found at space.com (of course)  It's a shame Intikam won't see it, it's some eye candy!


That surely is a beautiful photo Rounder.

Really makes you wonder how on a flat earth the moon can stay so well defined as it moves around in a circular path about the north pole.
Certainly the moon would never "set" as a near perfect circle, but appear more of an elipse.

Interesting how it clearly changes shape and size though

Ok, I'll bite. By how much does it change in size? By how much does it change in shape?

Re: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« Reply #14 on: July 05, 2016, 06:31:00 PM »


I don't know, I'd say, about this much.

Re: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« Reply #15 on: July 05, 2016, 07:27:40 PM »


I don't know, I'd say, about this much.

First of all, you were super imprecise with your "outline" of the lower moon.

1. Use a thinner line, so you can be more precise.
2. Don't fill it in with a green color. The filled in color just hides the lack of precision.

Second of all, you chose a moon that was partially behind the horizon. A significant chunk of the bottom is being obscured. And yet you still outlined it with an ellipse...

I cut out the bottom moon and overlayed it directly over the top one. This shows how imprecise you were.



Notice several discrepancies between the overlay and the moon below it:
1. Bottom: The moon is partially obscured by the horizon, obviously.
2. Top right: The moon is partially obscured by the moon above it, obviously.
3. Bottom right: Here is where the shape does actually change slightly. This is an expected result of refraction very near to the horizon.

Or, if you prefer a table of measurements:

I labelled the moons 1 (bottom) to 8 (top). If there is a dash (-), it means that diameter was partially obscured, so I couldn't measure it.

moon    horizontal diameter    vertical diameter
1           -                                  -
2           59 pixels                   -
3           59 pixels                   53 pixels
4           59 pixels                   55 pixels
5           60 pixels                   55 pixels
6           59 pixels                   56 pixels
7           59 pixels                   55 pixels
8           59 pixels                   -

Remarkably consistent! The only outlier is #3. It's vertical diameter is slightly less than the others. This is consistent with what we expect from refraction: the size in the vertical direction will appear slightly smaller. (i.e. it will appear slightly squashed). #2 would also probably have a smaller vertical diameter, but since it is partially behind the horizon, we can't precisely measure it.
« Last Edit: July 05, 2016, 08:12:31 PM by TotesNotReptilian »

Re: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« Reply #16 on: July 05, 2016, 07:41:02 PM »
Here is an example of refraction distorting the image very close to the horizon:



And in the opposite direction:



Which direction it gets distorted in depends on the weather conditions. The moon (#2) is being distorted like the first image.
« Last Edit: July 05, 2016, 07:43:39 PM by TotesNotReptilian »

Re: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« Reply #17 on: July 05, 2016, 07:50:00 PM »
Ah, refraction. The answer to all life's mysteries.

Re: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« Reply #18 on: July 05, 2016, 08:04:05 PM »
Ah, refraction. The answer to all life's mysteries.

Not really. However, you should probably take it into account when making precise measurements of faraway objects near the horizon.

Are you trying to argue that refraction should not be taken into account here?
Are you arguing that refraction doesn't exist?
« Last Edit: July 05, 2016, 08:09:16 PM by TotesNotReptilian »

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Offline rabinoz

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Re: Round Earth Debunk: Strawberry moon !
« Reply #19 on: July 05, 2016, 09:11:59 PM »

I don't know, I'd say, about this much.

So what!
According to the Flat Earth the distance to the moon should vary from about 3,000 miles when overhead to  something like 9,000 miles when "setting" (it depends on where the observer and moon are).

The apparent size of the moon when setting should therefore be about one third the size it is when overhead. Not only that, this change should occur gradually over the whole time, not in the last few minutes before setting.

If there is a slight change just as it sets it is due to your favourite refraction - yes it is real and very well documented as you very well know.

I have taken my own photos, while much higher resolution than those and the size of the moon changes very little! That is a fact.

The first photo is a bit of an odd man as the camera settings were a little different and while it still show as 1600 mm in the EXIF information, I suspect it might be 1774 mm (the next step).
The following photos were taken (not all on the same day) recently and show the moon at quite different altitudes:


(0) Date: May 22, 2016 at 17:43 EAST
Moon at Alt 2.3°,  Az 107.5°, size  0.56°
   

(1) Date: May 24, 2016 19:36 EAST
Moon at Alt 6.3°, Az 107.7°,  size  0.52°
   

(2) Date: May 24, 2016 at 20:16 EAST
Moon at Alt 14.5°, Az 103.6°,  size  0.52°
   


(3) Date: May 24, 2016 at 20:57 EAST
Moon at Alt 23.1°, Az  99.6°,  size  0.52°
   

(4) Date: May 25, 2016 at 06:46 EAST
Moon at Alt 26.5°, Az  262.1°,  size  0.50°
   

(5) Date: May 24, 2016 at 22:16 EAST
Moon at Alt 37.8°, Az  92.7°,  size  0.52°
   


(6)Date: June 21, 2016 at 23:12  EAST
Strawberry Moon+1 at Alt 67.1°, Azm 70.8°, size 0.53°
   

(7) Date: May 19, 2016 at 22:08 EAST
Moon at Alt 71.5°, Azm 0.1°,  size  0.52°
   

(8)Date: June 20, 2016 at 23:38 EAST
Strawberry Full Moon - at Alt 80.2°, Azm 23.4°, size  0.52x°


I suppose I did not need to show so many photos, but some are completely unable to accept the most solid evidence!

The moon stays (almost) the same size from rising (well 2.3°) to virtually overhead (at an Altitude of 80.2°).