[kindhonestbutnotabeliever]

I am not a believer but I am still curious while not being hostile.

I feel we can prove that the earth is round with one of these balloons, http://sentintospace.com/products-page/balloons/ultimate-balloon-3000g/#ad-image-0.

These are rated to go to 40km above the earth before popping, attach a Go pro and a GPS (we know GPS's work). When the balloon pops find the Gopro and look at the images for yourself. People have already done this but when you do this you can know no conspiracy has taken place.

Post the images, unedited please, on the forum and we can discuss them. If the earth is round you shouldn't be able to see antarctica at either end, if you can only see a portion of the earth an it drops off then it is round. (not that it will still look like a flat disk, as viewing a sphere through 2D image will give a disk.) what's important is the proportion of the earth you can see and what the atmosphere looks like. Also any images of the sun would be great!

[Rounder]

If it's just that easy, go do it yourself.  We look forward to your results.

[CableDawg]

If it's just that easy, go do it yourself.  We look forward to your results.

It really is that easy.

Multiple scientific communities around the world regularly fund and mount expeditions/experiments to test, prove, validate, disprove or invalidate a wide variety of ideas, theories and predictions.

Are you saying that the FE society doesn't have the wherewithal or the dedication to do the same for the support of their cause?

The FE society standing on and claiming the zetetic method to be valid and superior to the scientific method without producing any theories, experiments, testable predictions or evidence to support their claims is no different and just as detrimental as the ID community standing on and claiming The Discovery Institute as a scientific institute without producing any theories, experiments, testable predictions or evidence to support their claims.

[geckothegeek]

Here is a simple test you can do to determinate one way to telll if the earth is a flat disc or a round globe.

Go down to any beach on any ocean - The Pacific Ocean or The Atlantic Ocean will do. Be sure to do this on a clear, calm day.
Look out to sea.
If the horizon is  just an indistinct blur that fades away at an infinite distance-no matter how high you are above that beach- that proves the  earth is  a flat disc as flat earth cliaims.
If you see a definite line where the sea and sky meet on the horizon and the distance to that horizon is greater the higher you are above that beach that proves the earth is a globe as round-or-globe earth claims .

Another test you can perform.:
See if you can see if you can spot a ship as it sails out of sight beyond the horizon.
If you can "restore" or return that ship to full view with a telescope - hull to mast - that  proves the earth is a flat disc and there is no curvature of the earth as flat earth  claims.
If that ship disappears over the horizon - hull first and the last you see as that ship disappears over the horizon are the tops of its masts-and you can not "recover" that ship to full view with a telescope - that proves the earth is a globe because of the curvature of the earth- that proves the earth is a globe as round earth claims.

[kindhonestbutnotabeliever]

If it's just that easy, go do it yourself.  We look forward to your results.

You wouldn't believe me! The only way for you to know is to do it yourself. Because you are the ones believing in the conspiracy, I don't believe in the conspiracy so I am happy to look at the photos from other people who have done this.

I'm not trying to be argumentative but that's my perspective, if you're willing to believe photos from other who have done this, I'm happy to discuss over these photos, But only if you accept them as non-edited. If you won't accept this then you have to take the photos for yourself.

[BlueMoon]

If it's just that easy, go do it yourself.  We look forward to your results.

You wouldn't believe me! The only way for you to know is to do it yourself. Because you are the ones believing in the conspiracy, I don't believe in the conspiracy so I am happy to look at the photos from other people who have done this.

I'm not trying to be argumentative but that's my perspective, if you're willing to believe photos from other who have done this, I'm happy to discuss over these photos, But only if you accept them as non-edited. If you won't accept this then you have to take the photos for yourself.

Even if you showed them pictures, it wouldn't be good enough for them.  The curvature will be ambiguous. 


I'm still not sure why the existence of satellites isn't proof enough for them.  They are visible all over the earth, their altitudes are verifiable from the ground, and under most circumstances, their position and orbit can be defined with only six orbital elements, which refer to elliptical Kepler orbits, and which can be applied to moons and planets, including our own.  Not once in that process do you have to consult aether current charts or whatever.  Maybe the DIY should be "find a satellite and track it, then find and provide its Two Line Element set." 

[rabinoz]

If it's just that easy, go do it yourself.  We look forward to your results.

You wouldn't believe me! The only way for you to know is to do it yourself. Because you are the ones believing in the conspiracy, I don't believe in the conspiracy so I am happy to look at the photos from other people who have done this.

I'm not trying to be argumentative but that's my perspective, if you're willing to believe photos from other who have done this, I'm happy to discuss over these photos, But only if you accept them as non-edited. If you won't accept this then you have to take the photos for yourself.

Even if you showed them pictures, it wouldn't be good enough for them.  The curvature will be ambiguous. 

I'm still not sure why the existence of satellites isn't proof enough for them.  They are visible all over the earth, their altitudes are verifiable from the ground, and under most circumstances, their position and orbit can be defined with only six orbital elements, which refer to elliptical Kepler orbits, and which can be applied to moons and planets, including our own.  Not once in that process do you have to consult aether current charts or whatever.  Maybe the DIY should be "find a satellite and track it, then find and provide its Two Line Element set."

No, satellites won't convince anyone. This is a bit of "interchange" between Woody and the FE expert Tom Bishop.

[How are they obviously space ships in orbit around a globe? . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Figuring out where satellite dishes are pointed will give evidence of space travel.  The dishes are directional antennas that are pointing towards a satellite in geostationary orbit, so were are told.  It is not that complicated to figure out where two or more dishes receiving a signal from the same satellite are pointed.  Where the imaginary lines intersect or get close to intersecting(if you are not too meticulous gathering the data) is evidence where the signal is coming from. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . You can take long exposures of the night sky where geostationary satellites are said to be. As shown on the right -> . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . IMHO if the search for truth is TFES objective they really do not seem to be trying too hard to seek out that truth.  My guess one reason not doing two or more of the above is that it will offer evidence that space travel happens, those pictures from space agencies are real and that is damning evidence against the Earth being flat. Nothing about that tells us that they are obviously space ships in orbit around a globe earth.

FEers just don't have the nous to realise the significance of the little stationary "lights in the sky" amid the streaks of the star trails.

[BlueMoon]

If it's just that easy, go do it yourself.  We look forward to your results.

You wouldn't believe me! The only way for you to know is to do it yourself. Because you are the ones believing in the conspiracy, I don't believe in the conspiracy so I am happy to look at the photos from other people who have done this.

I'm not trying to be argumentative but that's my perspective, if you're willing to believe photos from other who have done this, I'm happy to discuss over these photos, But only if you accept them as non-edited. If you won't accept this then you have to take the photos for yourself.

Even if you showed them pictures, it wouldn't be good enough for them.  The curvature will be ambiguous. 

I'm still not sure why the existence of satellites isn't proof enough for them.  They are visible all over the earth, their altitudes are verifiable from the ground, and under most circumstances, their position and orbit can be defined with only six orbital elements, which refer to elliptical Kepler orbits, and which can be applied to moons and planets, including our own.  Not once in that process do you have to consult aether current charts or whatever.  Maybe the DIY should be "find a satellite and track it, then find and provide its Two Line Element set."

No, satellites won't convince anyone. This is a bit of "interchange" between Woody and the FE expert Tom Bishop.

[How are they obviously space ships in orbit around a globe? . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .Figuring out where satellite dishes are pointed will give evidence of space travel.  The dishes are directional antennas that are pointing towards a satellite in geostationary orbit, so were are told.  It is not that complicated to figure out where two or more dishes receiving a signal from the same satellite are pointed.  Where the imaginary lines intersect or get close to intersecting(if you are not too meticulous gathering the data) is evidence where the signal is coming from. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .You can take long exposures of the night sky where geostationary satellites are said to be. As shown on the right -> . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .IMHO if the search for truth is TFES objective they really do not seem to be trying too hard to seek out that truth.  My guess one reason not doing two or more of the above is that it will offer evidence that space travel happens, those pictures from space agencies are real and that is damning evidence against the Earth being flat. Nothing about that tells us that they are obviously space ships in orbit around a globe earth.

FEers just don't have the nous to realize the significance of the little stationary "lights in the sky" amid the streaks of the star trails.

Well, to be fair, there are plenty of other satellites they could look at.  Geostationary sats aren't always the easiest to notice. 

[UnionsOfSolarSystemPlanet]

Well, to be fair, there are plenty of other satellites they could look at.  Geostationary sats aren't always the easiest to notice.

Look at the flat Earthers responses http://forum.tfes.org/index.php?topic=4554.0

I am not a believer but I am still curious while not being hostile.

I feel we can prove that the earth is round with one of these balloons, http://sentintospace.com/products-page/balloons/ultimate-balloon-3000g/#ad-image-0.

These are rated to go to 40km above the earth before popping, attach a Go pro and a GPS (we know GPS's work). When the balloon pops find the Gopro and look at the images for yourself. People have already done this but when you do this you can know no conspiracy has taken place.

Post the images, unedited please, on the forum and we can discuss them. If the earth is round you shouldn't be able to see antarctica at either end, if you can only see a portion of the earth an it drops off then it is round. (not that it will still look like a flat disk, as viewing a sphere through 2D image will give a disk.) what's important is the proportion of the earth you can see and what the atmosphere looks like. Also any images of the sun would be great!

Well this is kinda done by both sides hundreds of times already, with each other arguing about the camera lenses and perspective stuff. We can't get anymore notable evidence from this one more time.