[AATW]

Both responses are now forbidden in FLA?

Probably not in practice, but the law is so vaguely worded that it could be read like that.

None of the homophobic bigots who have an issue with the second response have an issue with the first. It’s unsurprising to see them double down on their lies about that, rather than admit their bigotry.

[Tom Bishop]

1st grader Timmy, after Xmas break, asks Mrs. Smith, his teacher, what she did for Christmas.
Mrs. Smith: "Well Timmy, my husband and I drove up to see his grandparents in snowy Vermont. It was a winter wonderland, just like the North Pole where Santa lives with Mrs. Claus and all of the elves..."

1st grader Timmy, after Xmas break, asks Mr. Smith, his teacher, what he did for Christmas.
Mr. Smith: "Well Timmy, my husband and I drove up to see his grandparents in snowy Vermont. It was a winter wonderland, just like the North Pole where Santa lives with Mrs. Claus and all of the elves..."

Both responses are now forbidden in FLA? I wonder if now you can't even mention that Santa has a wife too...

Actually study.com tells teachers not to discuss relationships and family matters with children to be professional in the classroom. This is not hard to understand.

A college course Student Teaching in Elementary School provides a Student Teaching Handbook for teacher candidates, which states on p.16 -

"Avoid discussion of your personal life with students."

Sounds pretty straight forward to me. Not sure why you are having a hard time understanding this.

[Tom Bishop]

In an article part of the Teacher Education and Professional Development Commons at Fort Hays State University it says that sharing your sexual orientation with students is inappropriate:

https://scholars.fhsu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?&httpsredir=1&article=1585&context=alj

A Survival Guide: Seven Practices All Beginning Tactices All Beginning Teachers Should Know

...

Rule #6: Students are Not Your Friends-Recognize the Line

'The relationship between a student and a teacher is a close one, but remember to draw the line.
Students, by nature, are intrinsically interested in their teachers. They are naturally curious and want to
know everything about you. Indeed, many students will come to admire their teachers greatly. However,
do not mistake respect and admiration with personal friendships. Indeed, while many teachers may
friendly towards students, it is “important for…students to understand that [teachers are] not their friend
or, at least, not the same way their peers are (Johnston, 2005, C1). Students are not your peers, so it is
important to draw a line with them. It is important to care for the well being of students, but it is also
important not to share too much information, especially as it relates to one’s personal life. Discussing
one’s personal life with students or intimate details of one’s life is not appropriate. Surface information
is generally safe but to discuss personal experiences (i.e., a hard divorce, psychological challenges,
living situations, sexual orientation, etc…) is not appropriate and demonstrates poor professional
judgment. In addition, when students are seeking advice or counsel, remember to limit personal advice
and refer them to school professionals on staff. It is okay to listen (of course), but avoid providing
students with a To Do List of actions they should take. Teachers are typically not licensed psychologist,
psychiatrist or counselors. Therefore, do not assume that role. The role of a teacher is to teach and
nurture a child’s development, but that role is limited in scope (Benton, 2004). Giving a student who is
in need of professional advice, the wrong advice could not only endanger that student, but could
jeopardize your career legally. So again, listen but use good judgment, and when in doubt, seek
support from your administrative team. Be mindful to report abuse or neglect allegations or
support from your administrative team.'

[honk]

It's interesting how that second article mentions a hard divorce as an example of something that's too personal to share - not just a divorce, but a hard divorce. Does that mean that teachers can mention that they're divorced? It must, right? Otherwise, the article would have just used divorce as an example, not specifically a hard divorce. So if divorce can be shared, then logically marital status in general can be shared, as it would be pretty silly for one type of marital status to be appropriate but not others. And if marital status can be shared, doesn't that mean that the gender of the spouse will logically be shared? Technically, I guess the article could be recommending that teachers refer to their spouses in entirely gender-neutral terms. But I really, really doubt it. It seems far more likely to me that the article is really just talking about LGBT people when it recommends not sharing their sexual orientation, which plays into the double standard that's at the heart of this subject: the idea that being straight is nice, normal, and uncontroversial, while being gay or trans is inherently sexual, inherently outré, and inherently inappropriate for children.

[Tom Bishop]

It is inappropriate to discuss the teacher's boyfriend or husband or partner at all. It is inappropriate to talk about your sexual orientation at all. It has nothing to do with double standards. Your personal life is your own business and not for students. They are there to learn the course material. As a teacher they are not your own children. You do not have a right or responsibility to expose them to your sexual orientation. Students are there under oversight of the state or the school, who dictate what they are exposed to.

UC Davis

FACULTY CODE OF CONDUCT

Do not discuss your personal life with students

Kirkland College

Do not discuss your personal life with students

Arizona University - Graduate Studies Handbook

Code of Conduct

Avoid discussing your personal life with your students

An article about Florida education standards from 2019 before the bill:

When faculty become licensed, they agree to follow a code of ethics of the education profession in Florida. The code of ethics lists all the ways in which faculty must properly interact with students to avoid legal complications.

This document states “Do NOT flirt with students, Do NOT discuss your personal life with students,” and “Do NOT make telephone calls or write notes of a personal nature to students.”

These rules should must be followed for all students, even if the student is 18 or older.

Office of Professional Standards - Dade Public Schools

Do not discuss your personal life with students (husband, wife, dating, etc.).

CliffsNotes FTCE Professional Education Test with CD-ROM, 2nd Edition

Chapter 6: Competency 6: Ethics

Do not discuss your personal life with students, even outside of the classroom.

Al-Mamoor School

Do not discuss your personal life with students. It is your responsibility to keep students on task
and only stick to the subject matter that is being taught

It is extremely simple. The students are there to learn the course material, not to be exposed to the teacher's personal life or the teacher's sexual orientation.

[stack]

If it's already in all of the ethics, code of conduct literature, why this new law?

[AATW]

If it's already in all of the ethics, code of conduct literature, why this new law?

Because none of this stuff means what the homophobic bigots want to pretend it means.
None of them have ever had a problem with a teacher mentioning their spouse. But suddenly when the spouse is the same sex as the teacher they need to protect little Johnny from knowing about this perversion. Although obviously it’s them who has the problem, not little Johnny. Kids don’t have this sort of bigotry, they learn it. Hopefully these sorts of attitudes will die out with the bigots.

[Tom Bishop]

If it's already in all of the ethics, code of conduct literature, why this new law?

The bill isn't only about teachers talking about themselves.

https://www.npr.org/2022/03/28/1089221657/dont-say-gay-florida-desantis

Public school teachers in Florida are banned from holding classroom instruction about sexual orientation or gender identity after Florida's Gov. Ron DeSantis, a Republican, signed the controversial "Parental Rights in Education" bill.

The bill, which some opponents have called "Don't Say Gay," was signed by DeSantis on Monday. It reads, "Classroom instruction by school personnel or third parties on sexual orientation or gender identity may not occur in kindergarten through grade 3 or in a manner that is not age-appropriate or developmentally appropriate for students in accordance with state standards."

Supporters of the legislation say it's meant to allow parents to determine when and in what way to introduce LGBTQ topics to their children. It also gives parents an option to sue a school district if the policy is violated.

During a press conference ahead of signing the law, DeSantis said teaching kindergarten-aged kids that "they can be whatever they want to be" was "inappropriate" for children.

[Action80]

If it's already in all of the ethics, code of conduct literature, why this new law?

Because none of this stuff means what the homophobic bigots want to pretend it means.
None of them have ever had a problem with a teacher mentioning their spouse. But suddenly when the spouse is the same sex as the teacher they need to protect little Johnny from knowing about this perversion. Although obviously it’s them who has the problem, not little Johnny. Kids don’t have this sort of bigotry, they learn it. Hopefully these sorts of attitudes will die out with the bigots.

What does the statement "Do not discuss your personal life with students," mean if it does not mean exactly what it states?

[Rama Set]

What does the statement "Do not discuss your personal life with students," mean if it does not mean exactly what it states?

When does a remark, or example become a discussion?  By any definition of the several I have just read, a teacher mentioning something about themselves would not constitute a discussion. A discussion requires parties to exchange ideas about the topic.

[AATW]

What does the statement "Do not discuss your personal life with students," mean if it does not mean exactly what it states?

Well, it's open to interpretation isn't it? What do you regard as "personal life"?
One of the pieces of guidance Tom posted said something about not mentioning a hard divorce. And sure, that is quite personal.
But the fact that you're married - if someone asks you that are you seriously saying you're reticent to answer because it's personal? It's a pretty basic piece of information.

You need to ask yourself honestly - do you have an issue with a male teacher telling pupils they're married...or does it only become an issue for you if they're married to a man?

[Rama Set]

From the site Tom cited:

Talking about your personal life is a great way to build a rapport with your students, but oversharing can cause serious issues.

Now I’m fairly certain no one here is recommending a teacher overshare details about their life or involve students in the events of their life, if you are speak up, but sharing some details can be an easy way to connect with students both in an interpersonal way or by way of educational analogy.

[Action80]

What does the statement "Do not discuss your personal life with students," mean if it does not mean exactly what it states?

When does a remark, or example become a discussion?  By any definition of the several I have just read, a teacher mentioning something about themselves would not constitute a discussion. A discussion requires parties to exchange ideas about the topic.

True, but discussions commence with the uttering of a remark by one party.

I fail to understand why a remark concerning one's personal sexual orientation is necessary in a public education institution.

[Action80]

What does the statement "Do not discuss your personal life with students," mean if it does not mean exactly what it states?

Well, it's open to interpretation isn't it? What do you regard as "personal life"?
One of the pieces of guidance Tom posted said something about not mentioning a hard divorce. And sure, that is quite personal.
But the fact that you're married - if someone asks you that are you seriously saying you're reticent to answer because it's personal? It's a pretty basic piece of information.

You need to ask yourself honestly - do you have an issue with a male teacher telling pupils they're married...or does it only become an issue for you if they're married to a man?

I do not need to ask myself anything at all.

Anyone wasting their time and my money not performing the job for which they are hired, within all designated guidelines and parameters, should be dismissed.

I don't give a shit what the topic is.

[Action80]

The blog at study.com is nothing to rely on regarding the legality of such discussions and job responsibilities.

Someone will bring an EEOC complaint in the US or a lawsuit regarding sexual harassment regarding this entire situation and probably soon.

[AATW]

I do not need to ask myself anything at all.

If you have an issue with a male teacher telling a pupil that they have a husband, but don't have an issue with them telling the pupil they have a wife then I'd suggest it's you who has the problem. You may have grown up in a world where men couldn't marry men - my parents grew up in a world where it was actively illegal. But that's not the world we live in now.

Isn't this common sense? I wouldn't expect a teacher to be discussing the details of their sex life or marriage issues with kids, but just mentioning they have a husband is hardly going to start a discussion with a 6 year old about gay sex. What problem are we actually solving here?

[Clyde Frog]

What problem are we actually solving here?

The problem is those uppity gays with all the rainbows and letters refusing to just be quiet and pretend they don't exist, of course. They are making the good, God-fearing Christians uncomfortable, which is incredibly disrespectful of them, and they must be stopped.

[Rama Set]

What does the statement "Do not discuss your personal life with students," mean if it does not mean exactly what it states?

When does a remark, or example become a discussion?  By any definition of the several I have just read, a teacher mentioning something about themselves would not constitute a discussion. A discussion requires parties to exchange ideas about the topic.

True, but discussions commence with the uttering of a remark by one party.

I fail to understand why a remark concerning one's personal sexual orientation is necessary in a public education institution.

No one said it was necessary.

[Rama Set]

The blog at study.com is nothing to rely on regarding the legality of such discussions and job responsibilities.

Someone will bring an EEOC complaint in the US or a lawsuit regarding sexual harassment regarding this entire situation and probably soon.

I agree, but Tom cited it as a source so I wanted to point out that his own source paints a more nuanced picture than he would like.

[Action80]

I do not need to ask myself anything at all.

If you have an issue with a male teacher telling a pupil that they have a husband, but don't have an issue with them telling the pupil they have a wife then I'd suggest it's you who has the problem. You may have grown up in a world where men couldn't marry men - my parents grew up in a world where it was actively illegal. But that's not the world we live in now.

Isn't this common sense? I wouldn't expect a teacher to be discussing the details of their sex life or marriage issues with kids, but just mentioning they have a husband is hardly going to start a discussion with a 6 year old about gay sex. What problem are we actually solving here?

If frogs had wings, then Clyde wouldn't be bumping his ass on the ground while moderating elsewhere either, but the issue here is not about what problems you may think I have or the problems that I KNOW you have.

The issue is about the legality of discussing things relative to sexuality with children pre-K through 3rd grade.

You are for it.

I am not.

End of story.