Re: Investigating FE Jupiter
« Reply #20 on: June 06, 2019, 10:11:38 PM »
Interesting.  You do realize, of course, Hydrogen has only one electron, right? less than that, no energy wave, no element.  You also do realize that spectroscopy identifies Hydrogen as the most abundant element in the visible universe, right?

Mendeleev assumptions predates the concepts of atomic number and electron configuration, so much improvement to be done on those tables.  Here at university we use to say that assumption is the mother or failure, and it really is.

So, are you saying that Mendeleev table is your proof of the very dense region between Sun and Jupiter ?  Is that your base material for this discussion ?

tellytubby

Re: Investigating FE Jupiter
« Reply #21 on: June 07, 2019, 08:33:54 AM »
To follow on from what Spherical has said, all elements are identified by the number of protons in the nucleus.

The single electron in the H atom ties in with the single proton that lies in (or represents in this case) the nucleus.

So it is actually physically impossible to have  an element that is lighter than hydrogen. You can't have an atomic nucleus comprising of less than a single proton. To the best of my knowledge anyway. Spherical is that right?


tellytubby

Re: Investigating FE Jupiter
« Reply #23 on: June 07, 2019, 10:11:01 AM »
Yes and a proton is made up of sub particles called quarks. It is still a proton though and it is the proton or atomic number that defines the element.

A Hydrogen atom nucleus consists of just a single proton and that defines it as the lightest of all the elements.

Unless you can demonstrate how you can have an atomic nucleus made up from less than a single proton?
« Last Edit: June 07, 2019, 10:14:41 AM by tellytubby »

Re: Investigating FE Jupiter
« Reply #24 on: June 07, 2019, 11:22:57 AM »
A Hydrogen atom consists of 18 subquarks.



HYDROGEN ATOM: 18 SUBQUARKS - 9 LAEVOROTATORY AND 9 DEXTROROTATORY subquarks

A proton is made up of NINE laevorotatory subquarks - an electron is actually comprised of NINE dextrorotatory subquarks (called now preons).

However, modern science has mistakenly named a SINGLE dextrorotatory subquark as an electron and has ascribed THE TOTAL charge of the NINE corresponding subquarks as the total negative charge of a single electron, thus confusing the whole matter.


Ether = elements made up of NINE (baryons), SIX (mesons), THREE (quarks) and ONE subquark.





A subquark has some 14 billion bosons arranged in strings.

The subquark waves are transversal.

The boson strings are longitudinal.

KORONIUM is a gas at the baryon level (NINE subquarks).

NEWTONIUM is the subquark itself.

Walter Russell, one of Tesla's best friends, created a new periodic table of elements, taking into account the ELEMENTS FORMED BY THE E2, E3 AND E4 subquark configuration. That is, there are plenty of other elements before Hydrogen.

http://www.meta-synthesis.com/webbook/35_pt/russell_1.gif

http://www.meta-synthesis.com/webbook/35_pt/russell_2.gif
« Last Edit: June 07, 2019, 11:26:01 AM by sandokhan »

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Re: Investigating FE Jupiter
« Reply #25 on: June 07, 2019, 12:17:05 PM »
Interesting.  You do realize, of course, Hydrogen has only one electron, right? less than that, no energy wave, no element.  You also do realize that spectroscopy identifies Hydrogen as the most abundant element in the visible universe, right?

Define H+ and H- and come back to me about having no electrons means no element.

Some reading you might enjoy ...
http://yourwatermatters.com/water-treatment-guide/hydrogen-whats-the-difference-between-h-h2-h-h-and-oh/
Rate this post.      👍 6     👎 1

Re: Investigating FE Jupiter
« Reply #26 on: June 07, 2019, 04:40:27 PM »
Of course we can discuss that Hydrogen with no electron becomes H+ and that is commonly known as simple "proton", not more hydrogen, the chemical element.  But discussing this will derail the main subject of this thread, about Jupiter.  Lets keep focus.

What is the evidence of a dense substance between Sun and Jupiter that change its visible size?
Some people may confuse the word "evidence" with something written in a paper.

I can write "John is the assassin" and deliver the paper to the judge to incriminate John, that is not considered evidence, except if I can disclose where John hide the body or the weapon with his incriminatory fingerprints.  Evidence and proof is when you can duplicate the experiment, replay several times and obtain the same results, or, when the byproduct of the experience is a non contestable situation, non prima-facie.  For example, empty beer bottles inside your car is not evidence that you are driving under influence, but enough evidence to give authority to the officer to conduct a sobriety test.  A letter delivered to the police saying that someone saw empty bottles inside your car, will not dispatch a cruiser to intercept you in the street, not enough evidence, a picture of you drinking while driving, maybe.  When you read something in a paper, old books, etc, it means nothing, except if you can duplicate that with the correct tools.  Paper hold records of said previous experiments, but not evidence at all about the truth of those experiments, and the scientific validity of it.

What scientific experiments one can do at a lab or at kitchen table and obtain results to prove this very dense substance between Sun and Jupiter?
« Last Edit: June 07, 2019, 06:31:46 PM by spherical »

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Offline WellRoundedIndividual

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Re: Investigating FE Jupiter
« Reply #27 on: June 07, 2019, 05:14:02 PM »

Walter Russell, one of Tesla's best friends, created a new periodic table of elements, taking into account the ELEMENTS FORMED BY THE E2, E3 AND E4 subquark configuration. That is, there are plenty of other elements before Hydrogen.

I thought you said someone else made a correct Periodic table. There is more than one correct Periodic table now?
BobLawBlah.

tellytubby

Re: Investigating FE Jupiter
« Reply #28 on: June 07, 2019, 06:46:19 PM »
Practically all, if not all of Sandokhans links that he includes point to the forum of the 'other' flat earth society. Mostly to his own posts in fact. I assume then he is counting these links as evidence for what he says.  I cannot find any information relating to what he is talking about outside of the flat earth society domain. It is almost as if he has re-invented science and particle physics in particular in his mind so that it conforms to his own flat Earth theory. Anyone can produce some diagrams descriptions with pen and ink but that doesn't in itself prove anything.

What I need is some current and independent sources that support all of this. All such references that I have looked up talk about subquarks as being hypothetical, as in their existence is so far unconfirmed. Or ideas which once were considered but which have long since been discarded in favour of the current standard model.

Quote
Jupiter has the same diameter as that of the Sun, Moon, Black Sun, Shadow Moon. It is discoidal in shape, as are its satellites.

Maybe this is true in flat Earth land but it certainly isn't in the real world. Nowhere near.  And on the subject of flights, I flew to NY and back just over a month ago and we had a real-time display of the aircrafts altitude all the way through the flight.  The maximum altitude we achieved was 41,000ft.  It was shown on all the screens on the backs of all the seats.  No mistaking that.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2019, 06:52:49 PM by tellytubby »

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Re: Investigating FE Jupiter
« Reply #29 on: June 07, 2019, 06:55:02 PM »
An altimeter actually includes an aneroid barometer which measures the atmospheric pressure (actually it measures the effect of the dextrorotatory ether waves). A radar altimeter uses radio signals. Both methods do not take into account the layers of aether which exist above 5 km in altitude which influence both the pressure reading and also the distance travelled by the radar waves.

You are faced with the very same problem that baffled Dr. Stuart D. Bale (UC Berkeley):



If you want anyone to believe you that Mount Everest measures 8.84 km, you must explain the huge temperatures in the solar corona:

No you don't. Dr Bale's study of solar wind produced by the Sun's corona has literally nothing to do with determining the height of Everest, or Jupiter. And there is no measurement of various 'layers of aether' above or below 5 km of altitude or wherever. You're mixing a whole bunch of random stuff together to create a bucket of slop psuedoscience.
Not much is known about the celestial bodies and their distances.

Re: Investigating FE Jupiter
« Reply #30 on: June 07, 2019, 07:09:47 PM »
Dr Bale's study of solar wind produced by the Sun's corona has literally nothing to do with determining the height of Everest, or Jupiter.

But it does.

This is KORONIUM:



This is NEWTONIUM:



Both are lighter than Hydrogen elements.

Both fill the space between the two domes (where Jupiter and the Sun both orbit), along with other etheric elements. Above 5 km, the etheric elements/laevorotatory subquark waves are much denser than are to be found next to the surface of the Earth.

That is why the distances/angular sizes of the planets currently listed by the RE could not possibly be true since we are dealing with a DIFFERENT index of refraction for each such lighter than Hydrogen element.


Re: Investigating FE Jupiter
« Reply #31 on: June 07, 2019, 08:00:15 PM »
Sorry, Koronium and Newtonium do not make part of the only scientifically recognizable Periodic Table of Elements. Those hypothetical elements were dismissed in 1939, sorry.  Koronium and Newtonium does not exist, pictures represent just solar corona. Nothing is lighter than Hydrogen, discuss this is the same as assume caws can fly.

Nice pictures of the 2017 eclipse though.  Solar corona is always beautiful, hot plasma and magnetic fields create fantastic humongous unimaginable loops bigger than Earth.

Still waiting for your solid evidences about this heavy dense region between Sun and Jupiter.

===

Koronium , newtonium - a hypothetical chemical element proposed at the turn of the 19th and 20th century, whose presence was explained by the occurrence of one of the emission lines in the spectrum of the solar corona .

According to Fraunhofer's theory created around 1814, a given set of dark lines in the solar spectrum is associated with a specific element. During the solar eclipse on August 7, 1869, Charles Young and William Harkness discovered in the corona spectrum an emission line of low intensity in its green part. Young identified her as an iron lineNo. 1474 on the Kirchoff scale. This, however, raised doubts, as the presence of iron in the corona should be manifested by the occurrence of several hundred spectral lines. The observations of the eclipse from 1898 made it possible to determine that the wavelength of the mysterious line is 5303 Å. In order to explain it, a hypothesis appeared about the existence of an unknown element that complemented the radiation spectrum of the Sun's corona with its radiation - hence the name of the crowns [1] . The first such presumption is attributed to Dmitry Mendeleev about 1902 (the scholar later proposed a different name for the hypothetical element: newtonium ) [2] .

It was not until 1939 that Walter Grotrian and Bengt Edlén showed that the 5303 Å line is a band forbidden by the radiation of strongly ionized iron atoms (Fe 13+ )


« Last Edit: June 07, 2019, 08:01:58 PM by spherical »

Re: Investigating FE Jupiter
« Reply #32 on: June 07, 2019, 08:12:03 PM »
Those hypothetical elements were dismissed in 1939, sorry.

But they were not, this is the entire crux of the matter.

To this day, modern astronomy cannot explain the necessary huge temperatures in the solar corona (as hot as the core itself):

KORONIUM, the lighter than hydrogen element (ether):

https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=30499.msg2057945#msg2057945

https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=30499.msg2058259#msg2058259

https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=30499.msg2064256#msg2064256

NEWTONIUM, the lighter than hydrogen element (ether):

https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=30499.msg2064764#msg2064764

https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=30499.msg2065771#msg2065771

A total debunking of magnetic reconnection/Edlen's claims.


Macarios

Re: Investigating FE Jupiter
« Reply #33 on: June 07, 2019, 08:35:42 PM »
You haven't done your homework on commercial/military flights. None fly above some 9 km; commercial flights only reach 6-8 km in altitude.

Ok, there is Solar noon on April 11, in Abuja, Nigeria, Sun is 12 km above the ground, directly over head (subsolar point is there).
Latitude 9 degrees north.

At the same moment in Nice, 2400 km to the north there's also Solar noon.
Latitude 43.75 degrees north.

Under what angle at that moment people in Nice see the Sun above the horizon?
Maybe ArcTan(12/2400) = 0.28 degrees?

How come in reality they see it under the angle of [90 - (43.75 - 9)] = 55.25 degrees?

And if they are 20 times farther from Sun, why they don't receive 400 times less energy?

(EDIT: My apologies, 2400 / 12 is not 20, it is 200. People in Nice should receive 40 000 times less energy from Sun at that moment.)

~~~~~

And just one more detail:

SOLAR DISK: THE IMPOSSIBILITY OF A SPHERICALLY SHAPED SUN

Which way is the Sun disk oriented, and why the observer simultaneously positioned elsewhere doesn't see it as ellipse?

~~~~~

Interesting stuff, don't you think?

.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2019, 08:44:45 PM by Macarios »

Re: Investigating FE Jupiter
« Reply #34 on: June 07, 2019, 08:41:47 PM »
The shape of the Sun cannot possibly be spherical:

https://forum.tfes.org/index.php?topic=14947.msg194515#msg194515

Your numbers are based on A SPHERICAL Sun (149.6 million km distance), therefore they are worthless.

Convince yourself that the existence of the ether cannot be denied anymore, the RUDERFER experiment:

https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=30499.msg1846721#msg1846721

Therefore, your numbers, whatever they are, CANNOT BE TRUE: you must account for the index of refraction of the ether.


Macarios

Re: Investigating FE Jupiter
« Reply #35 on: June 07, 2019, 08:47:40 PM »
The shape of the Sun cannot possibly be spherical:

https://forum.tfes.org/index.php?topic=14947.msg194515#msg194515

Your numbers are based on A SPHERICAL Sun (149.6 million km distance), therefore they are worthless.

Convince yourself that the existence of the ether cannot be denied anymore, the RUDERFER experiment:

https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=30499.msg1846721#msg1846721

Therefore, your numbers, whatever they are, CANNOT BE TRUE: you must account for the index of refraction of the ether.

My numbers are based on the following:
- Sun 12 km above ground - based on your own claim.
- Distance from Abuja to Nice, 2400 km - based on most common Flat Earth map: Gleason's map.
- April 11 Subsolar point at Solar noon in Abuja - based on local observation regardless the shape of Earth or Sun.
- April 11 Sun elevation of 55.25 degrees in Nice at the moment of Solar noon - based on local observation regardless the shape of Earth or Sun.

If you don't believe it, the next time when subsolar point will be in Abuja is Sep 1. Call people there and in Nice to measure Sun for you.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2019, 08:57:21 PM by Macarios »

Re: Investigating FE Jupiter
« Reply #36 on: June 07, 2019, 09:04:33 PM »
Again, your numbers are based on a spherical Sun, Earth-Sun distance of 149.6 million km.

If those numbers are wrong and the shape of the Sun is different, it means something else is going on.

Here is a similar thread, the effect of ether on the North Star, seen from Alaska and from the equator:

https://forum.tfes.org/index.php?topic=9797.msg153989#msg153989

Here is the ultimate proof:

Sirius - Earth distance: less than 50 km:

https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=30499.msg1795032#msg1795032

Sirius meridian transit points data:

https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=30499.msg1939662#msg1939662

HOW or WHY does Sirius keep up so precisely with the exponentially increasing rate of precession?

How can Sirius' proper motion stay synched up so precisely with precession, when the rate of precession itself is changing?


If any local force in here the "heliocentrical" solar system drove up the rate of precession, it would NOT also drive up the proper motion of Sirius across the sky.


In the official theory of astrophysics, Sirius is 8.6 LIGHT YEARS from Earth.

THAT IS 81 TRILLION KILOMETERS.

And yet it keeps up precisely with the exponential increase of the rate of precession.


The index of refraction of the ether changes everything: all I have to do, as I have done, is to prove the existence of ether, and your numbers become useless.

Macarios

Re: Investigating FE Jupiter
« Reply #37 on: June 07, 2019, 09:10:01 PM »
Again, your numbers are based on a spherical Sun, Earth-Sun distance of 149.6 million km.

Are we having conversation here?
Or are you talking with yourself?

I just told you what are my numbers based on.
Literally NONE is based on shape of Earth or Sun.

Read again:
Quote

- Sun 12 km above ground - based on your own claim.
- Distance from Abuja to Nice, 2400 km - based on most common Flat Earth map: Gleason's map.
- April 11 Subsolar point at Solar noon in Abuja - based on local observation regardless the shape of Earth or Sun.
- April 11 Sun elevation of 55.25 degrees in Nice at the moment of Solar noon - based on local observation regardless the shape of Earth or Sun.

tellytubby

Re: Investigating FE Jupiter
« Reply #38 on: June 07, 2019, 09:25:52 PM »
Following on from your posted images of two solar eclipses showing the solar corona, here is a document concerning a scientific account of the composition of the solar corona.  You can do a search for yourself and you will find that neither your koronium or newtonium 'elements' are mentioned once.

https://mafiadoc.com/the-composition-of-the-solar-corona-solar-wind-and-solar-energetic-_5b838d28097c47e2778b463e.html

You state that your green image shows koronium and the red image shows newtonium. However you would equally get this appearance if you simply imaged a solar eclipse with a red filter and a green filter.  So how do they show evidence of the presence any particular element in the solar corona?

No solar astrophysicist will deny that we still have much to learn about the Sun and its temperature variations across different atmospheric layers.  The underlying reasons why the upper chromosphere is hotter that the lower chromosphere and why the corona gets hotter still is an ongoing area of research.

Ultimately though what all this has to do with Sphericals original question about FE Jupiter I haven't a clue.  Incidentally, I believe you asked about the 'unknown' reasons for internal heating of Jupiter.  This is actually of known origin and is observed in all the giant planets which support multiple moons.

Re: Investigating FE Jupiter
« Reply #39 on: June 08, 2019, 04:45:01 AM »
The Gleason map is not the correct map at all. The correct FE map is the global Piri Reis map (bipolar map).

North Star, observed on a flat earth, from Alaska and from the equator:

https://forum.tfes.org/index.php?topic=9797.msg153989#msg153989





Now, use those numbers/calculations and see what you get.

There is a huge distortion caused by the ether, that is why you cannot just use angles and simple trigonometry to reach a conclusion about the distance to the Sun: you need to know the index of refraction of the ether.

Here is the ultimate proof:

Sirius - Earth distance: less than 50 km:

https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=30499.msg1795032#msg1795032

Sirius meridian transit points data:

https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=30499.msg1939662#msg1939662

HOW or WHY does Sirius keep up so precisely with the exponentially increasing rate of precession?

How can Sirius' proper motion stay synched up so precisely with precession, when the rate of precession itself is changing?


If any local force in here the "heliocentrical" solar system drove up the rate of precession, it would NOT also drive up the proper motion of Sirius across the sky.


In the official theory of astrophysics, Sirius is 8.6 LIGHT YEARS from Earth.

THAT IS 81 TRILLION KILOMETERS.

And yet it keeps up precisely with the exponential increase of the rate of precession.