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Offline Fortuna

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Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #100 on: April 04, 2015, 07:57:42 PM »
In the realm of science, "we haven't found em yet" means they don't exist.

No, it doesn't. As somebody said earlier, there is nothing wrong with saying "we don't know" in the "realm of science".

Yes it does. Otherwise it's religion.
I stopped going to the gym because of Trump. Now I can't open jars

Ghost of V

Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #101 on: April 04, 2015, 07:58:23 PM »
In the realm of science, "we haven't found em yet" means they don't exist.

No, it doesn't. As somebody said earlier, there is nothing wrong with saying "we don't know" in the "realm of science".

Yes it does. Otherwise it's religion.

Religion claims to know for certain. "I don't know" - how is that certain? If you think that anyone here is claiming 100% that aliens exist, you've misunderstood the entire premise of this conversation and are basically trolling at this point.

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Offline Particle Person

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Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #102 on: April 04, 2015, 08:01:43 PM »
In the realm of science, "we haven't found em yet" means they don't exist.

No, it doesn't. As somebody said earlier, there is nothing wrong with saying "we don't know" in the "realm of science".

Yes it does. Otherwise it's religion.

How is the claim "we don't know if ET life exists" religious in any way?
Your mom is when your mom and you arent your mom.

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Offline Fortuna

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Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #103 on: April 04, 2015, 08:13:16 PM »
In the realm of science, "we haven't found em yet" means they don't exist.

No, it doesn't. As somebody said earlier, there is nothing wrong with saying "we don't know" in the "realm of science".

Yes it does. Otherwise it's religion.

Religion claims to know for certain. "I don't know" - how is that certain? If you think that anyone here is claiming 100% that aliens exist, you've misunderstood the entire premise of this conversation and are basically trolling at this point.

It's your personal belief that life exists outside of earth, but you can't pass this off as anything scientific or verifiable. It's important that you recognize that the evidence for God existing and the evidence for extraterrestrial life are essentially the same. Both bodies of evidence boil down to "it seems like the case".
I stopped going to the gym because of Trump. Now I can't open jars

Ghost of V

Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #104 on: April 04, 2015, 08:16:24 PM »
My personal belief is pretty much irrelevant. I was simply telling you that the possibility of life is not an unscientific concept.

How does God "seem to be the case"?

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Offline Fortuna

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Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #105 on: April 04, 2015, 08:33:33 PM »
I was simply telling you that the possibility of life is not an unscientific concept.


Possibility is unscientific. Science only cares about probability, which brings us back to the Drake equation and how generations of ignorant people have tried to solve it without enough information.
I stopped going to the gym because of Trump. Now I can't open jars

Ghost of V

Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #106 on: April 04, 2015, 08:41:06 PM »
I was simply telling you that the possibility of life is not an unscientific concept.


Science only cares about probability, which brings us back to the Drake equation and how generations of ignorant people have tried to solve it without enough information.

And?
« Last Edit: April 04, 2015, 08:58:12 PM by Vauxhall »

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Offline Particle Person

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Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #107 on: April 04, 2015, 08:48:01 PM »
Possibility is unscientific.

mind === blown up
Your mom is when your mom and you arent your mom.

Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #108 on: April 04, 2015, 09:35:34 PM »
In the realm of science, "we haven't found em yet" means they don't exist.

No, it doesn't. As somebody said earlier, there is nothing wrong with saying "we don't know" in the "realm of science".

Yes it does. Otherwise it's religion.

Religion claims to know for certain. "I don't know" - how is that certain? If you think that anyone here is claiming 100% that aliens exist, you've misunderstood the entire premise of this conversation and are basically trolling at this point.

It's your personal belief that life exists outside of earth, but you can't pass this off as anything scientific or verifiable. It's important that you recognize that the evidence for God existing and the evidence for extraterrestrial life are essentially the same. Both bodies of evidence boil down to "it seems like the case".

Ummm... God can't be proven or disproven.  Which is why it's not scientific.
Life outside the solar system can be proven or disproven.

Also, if we found life on say... Mars (microbial) wouldn't that prove aliens exist?  Aliens being any form of life not from Earth.  Why say "the solar system" anyway?  Surely you mean "just earth" right?

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Offline Rushy

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Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #109 on: April 04, 2015, 09:45:09 PM »
Life outside the solar system can be proven or disproven.

Disproving life outside the solar system is technically possible, but completely unfeasible. You'd have to search the entire universe. Saying that makes it scientific would be no different than me saying God is on another planet, we just haven't been to it yet.

Ghost of V

Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #110 on: April 04, 2015, 09:50:11 PM »
Life outside the solar system can be proven or disproven.

Disproving life outside the solar system is technically possible, but completely unfeasible. You'd have to search the entire universe. Saying that makes it scientific would be no different than me saying God is on another planet, we just haven't been to it yet.

If we had met a god and knew that gods existed then it would be scientific to search for gods on another planet. That's why your analogy is retarted. Because life does not equal God. God is a made up fantasy. No evidence. Life is right under our noses. We can quite easily prove that life exists (within reason).

So drop this God shit. It's basically a big strawman. And yes Rushy, I know what that means.

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Offline Fortuna

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Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #111 on: April 04, 2015, 10:14:33 PM »
can't be proven or disproven.  Which is why it's not scientific.

Well done.

We can currently prove ET life exists just as much as we can prove god exists: we can't. Unless you were planning on taking your Prius to go look.
I stopped going to the gym because of Trump. Now I can't open jars

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Offline Rushy

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Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #112 on: April 04, 2015, 10:16:09 PM »
If we had met a god and knew that gods existed then it would be scientific to search for gods on another planet. That's why your analogy is retarted. Because life does not equal God. God is a made up fantasy. No evidence. Life is right under our noses. We can quite easily prove that life exists (within reason).

So drop this God shit. It's basically a big strawman. And yes Rushy, I know what that means.

What evidence can you bring forth that shows life on Earth is not a special case?

Ghost of V

Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #113 on: April 04, 2015, 10:26:38 PM »
If we had met a god and knew that gods existed then it would be scientific to search for gods on another planet. That's why your analogy is retarted. Because life does not equal God. God is a made up fantasy. No evidence. Life is right under our noses. We can quite easily prove that life exists (within reason).

So drop this God shit. It's basically a big strawman. And yes Rushy, I know what that means.

What evidence can you bring forth that shows life on Earth is not a special case?

I have no direct evidence, which I've admitted several times. Can you produce some evidence that shows that life on Earth is a special case? I think that's the bigger assumption here considering everything we know about the universe. You're going to say "because we've only found life on Earth", right?

Are you trying to say that the entire field of Astrobiology is a scientific farce with no merit?
« Last Edit: April 04, 2015, 10:29:14 PM by Vauxhall »

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Offline Rushy

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Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #114 on: April 04, 2015, 10:32:33 PM »
I have no direct evidence, which I've admitted several times. Can you produce some evidence that shows that life on Earth is a special case? I think that's the bigger assumption here considering everything we know about the universe. You're going to say "because we've only found life on Earth", right?

I have one case of planet that has life. You have one case of planet that has life. The difference between us is that you're busy claiming you have more theoretical cases but you can't even provide evidence to support that they exist.

Are you trying to say that the entire field of Astrobiology is a scientific farce with no merit?

The name itself is a misnomer, considering you can't study astronomical life if you don't have any to begin with.

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Offline Rama Set

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Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #115 on: April 04, 2015, 10:46:38 PM »
can't be proven or disproven.  Which is why it's not scientific.

Well done.

We can currently prove ET life exists just as much as we can prove god exists: we can't. Unless you were planning on taking your Prius to go look.

Of course we can prove it. That we haven't does not mean we can't.
You don't get races of anything ... accept people.

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Offline Fortuna

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Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #116 on: April 04, 2015, 10:48:26 PM »
can't be proven or disproven.  Which is why it's not scientific.

Well done.

We can currently prove ET life exists just as much as we can prove god exists: we can't. Unless you were planning on taking your Prius to go look.

Of course we can prove it. That we haven't does not mean we can't.

We just don't do it because it doesn't interest us very much, huh?
I stopped going to the gym because of Trump. Now I can't open jars

Ghost of V

Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #117 on: April 04, 2015, 10:50:22 PM »
I have no direct evidence, which I've admitted several times. Can you produce some evidence that shows that life on Earth is a special case? I think that's the bigger assumption here considering everything we know about the universe. You're going to say "because we've only found life on Earth", right?

I have one case of planet that has life. You have one case of planet that has life. The difference between us is that you're busy claiming you have more theoretical cases but you can't even provide evidence to support that they exist.

Are you trying to say that the entire field of Astrobiology is a scientific farce with no merit?

The name itself is a misnomer, considering you can't study astronomical life if you don't have any to begin with.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_ignorance

Do you have a good reason for assuming that life does not exist outside our solar system? Despite the fact that other possibly hospitable planets have been detected?


We just don't do it because it doesn't interest us very much, huh?

Once we have starships, we'll let you know.  ::)
« Last Edit: April 04, 2015, 10:55:48 PM by Vauxhall »

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Offline Rama Set

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Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #118 on: April 04, 2015, 11:02:40 PM »
can't be proven or disproven.  Which is why it's not scientific.

Well done.

We can currently prove ET life exists just as much as we can prove god exists: we can't. Unless you were planning on taking your Prius to go look.

Of course we can prove it. That we haven't does not mean we can't.

We just don't do it because it doesn't interest us very much, huh?

You can't force a radio signal from an alien civilization to get to Earth. You have to wait for it. But people are looking.
You don't get races of anything ... accept people.

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Offline Fortuna

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Re: Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« Reply #119 on: April 04, 2015, 11:09:30 PM »
can't be proven or disproven.  Which is why it's not scientific.

Well done.

We can currently prove ET life exists just as much as we can prove god exists: we can't. Unless you were planning on taking your Prius to go look.

Of course we can prove it. That we haven't does not mean we can't.

We just don't do it because it doesn't interest us very much, huh?

You can't force a radio signal from an alien civilization to get to Earth. You have to wait for it. But people are looking.

So until one comes, if one ever does, we can't prove it.
I stopped going to the gym because of Trump. Now I can't open jars