Offline Pinky

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How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« on: October 23, 2018, 01:40:46 PM »
According to UA,FE accelerates upwards at 9.81 m/s². That means, it would have reached relativistic velocity within less than a year and we are currently travelling very close to light-speed.

The stars are travelling at negligible velocities and independently from Flat Earth. That means, when the photons enter our moving frame of reference, they will get a blue-shift.
1. Element-specific spectral lines of the stars, of our Sun, of gas-lamps in the lamp, they would all be different from each other (bc blueshift) if UA were true. Except they are identical.
2. The blueshift would mean that starlight coming from directly above would be blue or violet. As we are moving close to light-speed, it is reasonable to assume, that the blue-shift has already shifted starlight beyond the visible range. Accordingly, if UA were true, there would be no starlight coming from directly above.



Could you please update your wiki? Thx.

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Online Pete Svarrior

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Re: How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« Reply #1 on: October 23, 2018, 01:43:23 PM »
The stars are travelling at negligible velocities and independently from Flat Earth.
This is in direct contradiction with UAT. (Well, depending on frame of reference, but we all know what you meant)
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Offline Rushy

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Re: How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« Reply #2 on: October 23, 2018, 01:57:47 PM »
The stars are travelling at negligible velocities and independently from Flat Earth.

It's called Universal Acceleration, not "Earth's Disc Acceleration". The stars are accelerating, along with the rest of the universe.

1. Element-specific spectral lines of the stars, of our Sun, of gas-lamps in the lamp, they would all be different from each other (bc blueshift) if UA were true. Except they are identical.
2. The blueshift would mean that starlight coming from directly above would be blue or violet. As we are moving close to light-speed, it is reasonable to assume, that the blue-shift has already shifted starlight beyond the visible range. Accordingly, if UA were true, there would be no starlight coming from directly above.

The fact that it's Universal Acceleration means the frame of reference is universal. The stars are accelerating along with the Earth's disc, so there is no blue-shift or red-shift that can be caused by UA.

MattyWS

Re: How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« Reply #3 on: October 23, 2018, 02:11:41 PM »
If the whole universe is accelerating why aren't individual people and objects on earth also accelerating with it? We are after all a part of the universe.

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Offline Rushy

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Re: How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« Reply #4 on: October 23, 2018, 02:20:48 PM »
If the whole universe is accelerating why aren't individual people and objects on earth also accelerating with it? We are after all a part of the universe.

We are accelerating with it, upwards, at about 9.81 m/s/s. If you're asking why we're not accelerating at precisely the same instant as the rest of the universe, well, that's because the Earth's disc is between us and the Davis Plane.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2018, 02:22:59 PM by Rushy »

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Offline RonJ

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Re: How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« Reply #5 on: October 23, 2018, 02:37:22 PM »
Constant acceleration requires a constant force.  It is said that the earth is being accelerated by a force from unspecified dark energy on the bottom of the disk.  You can easily see with your own eyes the moon and sun.  Those objects are said to be roughly 3000 miles above the earth's surface.  Since the sun & moon can always be seen above the earth they must also be in constant acceleration as well.  The question now is what is causing that acceleration?  Is it the same dark energy?  That dark energy would have to be present between the earth and the moon. The dark energy would have to cause the same constant acceleration independent of surface area and mass.  If that dark energy is present between the earth's surface and the sun & moon why doesn't anyone on earth experience that force as well?  Airplanes above the earth should feel it.  It should be measurable.  We all should be high jump champions. 
For FE no explanation is possible, for RE no explanation is necessary.

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Offline Rushy

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Re: How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« Reply #6 on: October 23, 2018, 02:50:01 PM »
Constant acceleration requires a constant force.  It is said that the earth is being accelerated by a force from unspecified dark energy on the bottom of the disk.  You can easily see with your own eyes the moon and sun.  Those objects are said to be roughly 3000 miles above the earth's surface.  Since the sun & moon can always be seen above the earth they must also be in constant acceleration as well.  The question now is what is causing that acceleration?  Is it the same dark energy?  That dark energy would have to be present between the earth and the moon. The dark energy would have to cause the same constant acceleration independent of surface area and mass.  If that dark energy is present between the earth's surface and the sun & moon why doesn't anyone on earth experience that force as well?  Airplanes above the earth should feel it.  It should be measurable.  We all should be high jump champions.

The flows of force wrap around the Earth's disc, putting the Earth and its inhabitants in a sort of "bubble".


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Offline RonJ

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Re: How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« Reply #7 on: October 23, 2018, 03:34:41 PM »
If the flow of force wraps around the edge of the flat earth, it would be significant.  Such a force would have to be felt by everything in the bubble, just like you said.  That force has the power to accelerate the sun and moon at the same rate as the earth.  Aircraft don't seem to feel that force.  If they did you could fly off the surface of the earth and just cut back radically on your engines.  The only force you would need would be to keep you going horizontally against the friction of the air.  The dark energy force would then accelerate your aircraft upward and support you just like it does with the sun and moon.  High altitude balloons should also be supported.  You wouldn't need to depend on the buoyancy of the atmosphere anymore.   If the dark force somehow flows around the edges of the earth like water around a disk in a pipe, I would expect a lot of turbulence as the forces recombine at the top of the earth.  That turbulence would cause the sun and moon to bounce around quite a bit in their orbits.  Since that isn't observable then I would expect a very smooth flow of that energy thru the earth and to the sun & moon. That should also affect everyone anywhere.  You should be able to jump up and then just hang there because the dark force would support you.  So far I can't make that work.
For FE no explanation is possible, for RE no explanation is necessary.

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Online Pete Svarrior

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Re: How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« Reply #8 on: October 23, 2018, 03:59:18 PM »
Such a force would have to be felt by everything in the bubble, just like you said.
Yes. This force is conventionally known as weight.

You should be able to jump up and then just hang there because the dark force would support you.  So far I can't make that work.
I'm not particularly fit. Hell, I'm very unfit. But somehow I doubt that any human on Earth is capable of jumping into outer space.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2018, 04:01:11 PM by Pete Svarrior »
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MattyWS

Re: How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« Reply #9 on: October 23, 2018, 04:29:55 PM »
If the whole universe is accelerating why aren't individual people and objects on earth also accelerating with it? We are after all a part of the universe.

We are accelerating with it, upwards, at about 9.81 m/s/s. If you're asking why we're not accelerating at precisely the same instant as the rest of the universe, well, that's because the Earth's disc is between us and the Davis Plane.
What exactly is the Davis Plane? A google search yields nothing.

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Offline Baby Thork

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Re: How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« Reply #10 on: October 23, 2018, 04:35:48 PM »
It could be that the earth, stars etc are all stationary ... and it is the universe rushing past.

Think of a wind tunnel. It exactly simulates the wing of an aircraft travelling through the air. But the wing is actually still and the air rushes past instead.

So maybe the earth is fixed ... and there is some kind of cosmic draught or etheric wind pinning things to the floor. And we call this gravity.

Or, if we were circling an intergalactic drain we'd get faster and faster and faster until we finally get flushed down the plug hole.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2018, 04:38:14 PM by Baby Thork »
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Offline JCM

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Re: How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« Reply #11 on: October 23, 2018, 04:37:28 PM »
Wouldn’t the stars revolving the earth in a circle above and below us indicate they are not in UA?  I am trying to picture the entire universe doing cartwheels around the earth while accelerating upwards...   How would that be possible?  Why are they slowing down then speeding up to go below us then above us with perfect timing?

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Offline Baby Thork

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Re: How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« Reply #12 on: October 23, 2018, 04:39:06 PM »
Wouldn’t the stars revolving the earth in a circle above and below us indicate they are not in UA?  I am trying to picture the entire universe doing cartwheels around the earth while accelerating upwards...   How would that be possible?  Why are they slowing down then speeding up to go below us then above us with perfect timing?

Space (the vacuum) moves, the things in it don't? The consequence is gravity.
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Offline JCM

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Re: How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« Reply #13 on: October 23, 2018, 04:40:23 PM »
It could be that the earth, stars etc are all stationary ... and it is the universe rushing past.

Think of a wind tunnel. It exactly simulates the wing of an aircraft travelling through the air. But the wing is actually still and the air rushes past instead.

So maybe the earth is fixed ... and there is some kind of cosmic draught or etheric wind pinning things to the floor. And we call this gravity.

Or, if we were circling an intergalactic drain we'd get faster and faster and faster until we finally get flushed down the plug hole.

If the earth is stationary then the stars are moving around us with perfect angular momentum maintaining their distances.  You can’t have a stationary Earth and stationary stars, or are you suggesting the Earth is rotating?

Offline JCM

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Re: How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« Reply #14 on: October 23, 2018, 04:42:09 PM »
Except the same stars are rising and setting, nothing is “rushing” past us.  It is periodic in nature.

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Offline RonJ

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Re: How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« Reply #15 on: October 23, 2018, 04:48:46 PM »
I don't think anyone could jump into outer space as well.  That wasn't what the theory would say either.  If a dark force were accelerating the earth and was flowing around the edge and enveloping everyone and everything in a bubble, then that force should be felt on the surface of the earth.  Anything with mass would also be accelerated by the dark force at the same rate as the earth.   In that case, since everything and everyone is being accelerated at the same rate as the earth you wouldn't need the acceleration of the earth to keep you on the surface.  The only way the proposed theory would work would be if the earth was being accelerated by the dark force and everything else on the surface was not.  That way the earth would be the thing that would be accelerating up and transferring that force of acceleration to every mass on the surface.  Then everything would have weight and if you jumped up, you would come down again.  Of course, the dark force could flow around the edge of the earth and recombine somewhere above the surface of the earth and not produce any acceleration of anything on the surface.  The question then becomes, just where does that happen?  Would airplanes or high altitude balloons ever get into the flow of the dark force?  The dark force would also have to have the property that everything regardless of mass or surface area be accelerated at the same rate.  Otherwise the sun & moon would either fly off into space, or come crashing down to the earth's surface.  Either event wouldn't be nice.
For FE no explanation is possible, for RE no explanation is necessary.

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Online Pete Svarrior

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Re: How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« Reply #16 on: October 23, 2018, 04:55:59 PM »
That wasn't what the theory would say either.
No, that's precisely what it says. If you want to jump up so high that you become weightless, you'd have to jump into the field affected by UA. Also known as outer space.
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Offline RonJ

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Re: How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« Reply #17 on: October 23, 2018, 05:29:31 PM »
I would then presume that the moon is in the field affected by UA.  Otherwise the distance between the earth and moon would change.  Now, if you are on the moon's surface facing the earth, and in the field, you would be weightless on the moon.  Both you and the moon would be in the same UA field and would experience the same acceleration and baring any outside force remain the same relative distance away.  You could then float above the surface of the moon.   Now, if the moon would have a little gravity then an astronaut could then actually walk on the surface.  But then if the moon had some gravity it would tend to crash down to the surface of the earth.  That could be prevented only if the UA force had a larger effect on the moon's mass than on the earth's mass.  Things are starting to get complicated.  You need some kind of equations that explain all the forces, just like you have with the gravity paradigm.
For FE no explanation is possible, for RE no explanation is necessary.

MattyWS

Re: How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« Reply #18 on: October 23, 2018, 05:47:13 PM »
I think I understand now, FES are mistaking gravity for magnetism.

Objects like the moon wouldn't come crashing down to the earth because it's orbiting. To put it as simply as possible, if you could throw a baseball so hard toward the horizon that by the time is starts falling back to the ground, it had already started to leave the planet, it's still going to fall to the planet... This is where it gets interesting, it falls to the ground but the ground is also constantly curving down (away from the ball) relatively to the ball. So the ball cannot catch up with the ground. This is basically orbit. A constant orbit is basically the same as an object falling toward something but being slung away at the same time's

It's the same as those charity coin collecting boxes where you throw the coin in and watch it whirl around that hole in the middle. Obviously the coin eventually falls into the hole because it's also being affected by earth's gravity as well as the force you gave it.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2018, 05:49:32 PM by MattyWS »

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Offline RonJ

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Re: How to disprove Universal Acceleration with your bare eyes:
« Reply #19 on: October 23, 2018, 05:53:51 PM »
With the flat earth model the moon doesn't orbit around the earth, it orbits above it.  The same goes for the sun.  It's not gravity that keeps everything on the earth, it's the constant acceleration of the earth.  The effects of throwing a baseball would be exactly the same with gravity or universal acceleration.  Of course if you threw the ball hard enough it would disappear off the earth's edge and I have no idea what would happen to it next. 
For FE no explanation is possible, for RE no explanation is necessary.