Offline Blanko

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Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #60 on: December 12, 2013, 07:13:49 PM »
Motherfuckers!  I bought these games for twenty dollars just a couple of weeks ago, and now they're fucking free?

http://www.gog.com/promo/fallout_series_giveaway_winter_promo_2013

Fuck!  Shit!  Goddammit!

Just found that and am trying to get through how waterlogged their servers are at the moment. Are they for Steam or do you have to use some crappy GOG client?

Neither, they're stand-alone downloads.

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Offline Crudblud

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Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #61 on: December 12, 2013, 07:15:27 PM »
I managed to get them on my account, although I had to attempt to login several times before I could actually get on it. Anyway, I understand that once the game is on your account you can download it any time?

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Offline Snupes

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Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #62 on: December 12, 2013, 07:19:49 PM »
Motherfuckers!  I bought these games for twenty dollars just a couple of weeks ago, and now they're fucking free?

http://www.gog.com/promo/fallout_series_giveaway_winter_promo_2013

Fuck!  Shit!  Goddammit!

Just found that and am trying to get through how waterlogged their servers are at the moment. Are they for Steam or do you have to use some crappy GOG client?

Neither, they're stand-alone downloads.

That's not so bad, then. Would've preferred Steam for convenience, but.
Quote from: garygreen date=1480782226
i also took an online quiz that said i was a giraffe.  and i guess you're dumb enough to believe that i must be because the internet said so.

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Offline Lemon

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Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #63 on: December 12, 2013, 09:02:53 PM »
I really want lonesome road. I want to do a new Legion Save and get a lot of the Lanius-copy gear. It's unique enough that it fits into the Legion Style without looking like you're a rip off. Actually, it might be good to RP receiving it for saving Caesar's life, if you do. And the Blade of the West will be good stuff.
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Offline Crudblud

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Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #64 on: December 15, 2013, 03:09:35 AM »
I shall resume my super-serious discussion with Crudblud later, btw.

Ooh, ooh, is it my turn? H-here I go: Ahem.

Since they keep putting in the Enclave, but the amount of people gets smaller and smaller, I do hope we get one last Enclave soldier, with one leg and 3 fingers. In Fallout 5, there can be an ear found somewhere named Enclave.

I missed this before, somehow. Upon reading it just now I almost sprayed coffee all over my monitor.

Saddam Hussein

Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #65 on: December 17, 2013, 11:48:53 PM »
lore lore lore

Come to think of it, I don't know if I really have much left to say.  I understand your point about the lore, and I agree with your concern of Bethesda basically trying to turn the franchise into some kind of sci-fi TES, what with all the dumb clichés and transparent efforts to make it all "epic" and shit.  Nevertheless, I feel somewhat more optimistic about the future of the franchise than you do.  Bethesda has shown itself to be capable of improvement in the past, and has indeed improved considerably since F3 came out, as we saw with Skyrim.  And when it comes to the lore and worldbuilding, well, whatever the motivation was behind recycling those elements from the previous games, be it laziness, pandering, or genuinely thinking that it was the best way to bring the franchise into the mainstream, they certainly won't be able to do it again.  They're going to have to be more original for the next one, as apparently they were for the DLC.

Speaking of the DLC, thanks for those mini-reviews.  I was planning on jumping into them right after I was done with NV, but now I'm feeling a little burned-out from that shitty game engine, so that might wait a while.  Oh, and I suppose I'll give a serious response to your Lonesome Road commentary at some point, and I'll put it here so as to not clutter up that other thread.
« Last Edit: November 11, 2015, 12:58:03 AM by Saddam Hussein »

Saddam Hussein

Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #66 on: December 18, 2013, 08:52:16 PM »
In before bawing about how Bethesda sucks at Fallout.

I see that I shall have to start this off.  Behold, this is what Bethesda has reduced Fallout to:

http://forums.bethsoft.com/topic/1165312-there-isnt-that-much-epicness-is-this-game/

:D

moar

http://forums.bethsoft.com/topic/1478950-obsidian-should-work-on-their-own-fallout-series/?p=23154488

Quote
Honestly, I think both Bethesda and Obsidian should work together on Fallout games. They both have great ideas and elements which would just be perfect. This is what I mean:
 
...
 
Bethesda
--------------
-More "Fallout" atmosphere
-storyline
-better balanced karma system
-perks
-Three Dog talking about Lone Wanderer's actions & choices
-more "emotional" (like the "Good" ending of Fallout 3)
-houses being more customizable & companion to give you a haircut
-Armored Vault 101 Jumpsuit (love it) & weapons
-better craftable weapons (Railway Rifle, Deathclaw Gauntlet, ect.)

I giggled.

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Offline Lemon

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Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #67 on: December 18, 2013, 10:29:54 PM »

Quote from: idiot
-Three Dog talking about Lone Wanderer's actions & choices


what
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Saddam Hussein

Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #68 on: December 19, 2013, 04:24:41 AM »
All right, while it was hilarious to just give a nonchalant one-liner reply to Crudblud's defense of LR, here's a more serious response:

And now I've beaten Lonesome Road.  To once more quote Sir Drainsalot:

Quote
Lonesome road reminded me a lot of DM - started off well then slowly died. At least the combat wasn't quite to head-bashingly frustrating. But the latter half has all the hallmarks of a ran-out-of-time-and-money job. A sandbox game reduced to a single linear path? Check. Entire plot threads dangled and then forgotten about? Check. Disappointing final boss showdown? Oh yes, without the effort to even animate the guys face, so we'll just stick a mask on there. It says something that the best character in there was an eyebot.

And here's something from Chris:

Quote
I didn't like Lonesome Road, I thought it prescribed too much of your character's back-story. By the time my courier got there he wouldn't have done half the things Ullyses accused him of. I also didn't like the really linear path and the lack of humour.

There was some cool new equipment in this one, like that rocket launcher.  The combat was fairly challenging.  And I really liked the harsh, bleak environment, which seemed like the ideal setting to finally close out the game's story.  That's about all the good things I can say for this one.  I actually feel a little bad for criticizing Honest Hearts after playing this.  I mean, for fuck's sake, this add-on doesn't just feel rushed, it feels unfinished!  Where are the sidequests?  Where are the other characters?  Where are the opportunities for exploration?  Where's the roleplaying?  Where's the opening introduction so we know what the fuck is going on?  Where's the setup for why the Courier is even bothering to do all this shit in the first place?  I'm doing it because I want to play through the DLC, of course, but surely there has to be some kind of in-universe motivation for the character, right?

Speaking of characters and their motivations, Ulysses sucked.  I think Obsidian really wanted to portray him as a super-deep and complex character whose quest to destroy the player is totally understandable, but it didn't work.  At best, he came across as a deranged nut.  And his feud with the Courier had no personal resonance with me at all, because of the simple fact that I had nothing to do with what happened to the Divide.  It was in the past!  Now, if they could have played around with the timeline a bit and tied the destruction of the Divide to something that happened during the main story, something that the Courier did while being controlled by the player, then maybe it could have worked.  But to simply make up an event that predates the main story and expect the player to feel any kind of guilt or responsibility for it?  No.  That's just stupid.

NV, more than any other game in the series so far, is about the past, nostalgia, resisting change; its namesake a relic of the Old World kept in working order by Mr House, a man who can't let go; the central event the battle at Hoover Dam, people across the Mojave fearing the inevitable change that will come no matter who is victorious. In keeping with this theme, all the DLC is in some way about people like Mr House: Thinktank, Elijah, Dog, Dean Domino, Joshua Graham and so on, they all want to cling to what is lost forever. Ulysses is the most extreme example, his tenuous grip on the Old World is his raison d'être, he is adorned with its symbols and resides in a place that likely resembles the world in 2077 (the closest he can physically come to the pre-war world), taking refuge from the chaos of the Divide inside a nuclear missile silo, the physical cause of the Old World's destruction. The final conflict of Lonesome Road is symbolic of the final death of the Old World, Ulysses being something like a steadfast cell, if you will, resisting the death and rot that has consumed the rest of the body. There are countless other examples of this throughout the game: a man who thinks himself a god (recalling Caligula) trying to unite the tribes in a simulacrum of Ancient Rome; the BoS resisting necessary change in the face of sure death; Enclave remnants trying but ultimately failing to leave behind their militaristic past; a ghoul who remains forever attached to a lost love and a former life; former soldiers of The Master's army seeking his likeness and dominion in Tabitha, Marcus and even Father Elijah in Dog's case—there are many more besides.

In LR we learn that a package The Courier delivered to the Divide a long time ago was in fact a bomb of some sort, sent by whom and for what reason we do not know. Ulysses doesn't know either, so who else has he, in his nostalgic madness, to blame but the one who made the delivery? When he sees that The Courier would be next in line after him for the Platinum Chip delivery, he quits the job so that they will take it, knowing that he is effectively signing their death warrant. When this plan fails, his obsession and desire for revenge grows even stronger, and he decides to do the job himself, calling The Courier out to one of the most inhospitable places in the west, knowing that, if they don't die on their way there, he will do everything in his power to destroy them with his own hands. Ultimately he cannot do this and, one way or another, lets go of the past. This fits with the idea that The Courier is the agent of change and bringer of closure to the inhabitants of the Mojave, with LR as the ultimate act of closure and Hoover Dam as the ultimate act of change.

First of all, I should probably clarify my criticism of Ulysses being insane.  It wasn't so much that his motives were irrational, but that his presentation was so one-dimensional, so "generic crazy bad guy," that he was never able to appear as complex or sympathetic as his history suggests he should be.  Like the way he talks in such a weird cryptic fashion, almost never telling the Courier anything outright, and all that pseudo-philosophical bullshit he keeps spouting that never actually adds up to anything meaningful.  This guy would really prefer to play pretentious mind games than talk straight to someone he hates as much as the Courier?  And the voice acting, too - that dull, flat, emotionless monotone.  There's not a hint of passion to him - no anger, no sadness, nothing.  If you're going to give us a character with all this baggage, then you've got to fucking sell it.  Needless to say, Obsidian did not sell this one.

Anyway, you made a few slight mistakes with the lore here.  We, along with Ulysses, do know who bombed the Divide and why.  It was the NCR, and they did it in desperation to stop the Legion from getting their hands on all the weaponry stored there.  (Also, the Courier didn't deliver a bomb itself, but a detonator to activate the ICBMs that were already there.)  In fact, the main reason Ulysses lures the Courier to the Divide isn't to kill him, but to trick him into bringing him ED-E, which (who?) he can use to activate the nuclear missiles and have his revenge on the parties that he views to be the real culprits, the NCR and the Legion.  That, by itself, I thought was a fairly decent idea.  But that just makes it all the more annoying that there's no real in-universe motivation for the Courier to be going on this trip, which might justify his blunder of bringing ED-E to Ulysses.  Yeah, they can try to justify it with "but Ulysses passed the assignment on to you, why is this?" but it really just comes down to the Courier crossing the Divide and fighting off hordes of monsters basically on a whim.

And on the subject of passing the assignment to the Courier, it's not like Ulysses had any knowledge of Benny's plan to steal the platinum chip and murder its carrier or anything.  No, he was just assuming that crossing the wasteland itself would be too much for an experienced courier, which makes...no sense at all.  Yeah, the implication when the subject was first raised with Johnson Nash in Primm was definitely that Ulysses knew what was about to go down, but that was no doubt one of the many things they had to cut when they rushed through LR, so they fell back on the weak "well the wasteland is dangerous derp" explanation.

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Offline Rushy

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Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #69 on: December 19, 2013, 04:36:58 AM »
that just makes it all the more annoying that there's no real in-universe motivation for the Courier to be going on this trip

Using this logic you can more or less destroy every Bethesda game ever made. "Why the fuck am I even doing this, again?"

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Offline Lemon

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Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #70 on: December 19, 2013, 07:49:54 PM »
that just makes it all the more annoying that there's no real in-universe motivation for the Courier to be going on this trip

Using this logic you can more or less destroy every Bethesda game ever made. "Why the fuck am I even doing this, again?"

Because evil dragon
NOTHING TO SEE HERE. IGNORE RAMA SET.

Saddam Hussein

Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #71 on: December 23, 2013, 03:08:44 AM »
Crudblud still hasn't replied.  Hmm...what bait to use next.

Hey, Crudblud, it's funny how you apparently don't like this game, and yet you spent all that time and (presumably) money playing the DLC.  You are literally Blanko.

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Offline Crudblud

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Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #72 on: December 23, 2013, 12:42:16 PM »
Crudblud still hasn't replied.  Hmm...what bait to use next.

Hey, Crudblud, it's funny how you apparently don't like this game, and yet you spent all that time and (presumably) money playing the DLC.  You are literally Blanko.

I received the GOTY edition of F3 as a gift. As for LR, you present some good points, and I have been thinking about my response.

Saddam Hussein

Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #73 on: December 23, 2013, 01:58:54 PM »
But I thought you were a big fan of the franchise!  Shouldn't you have gotten it as soon as it came out?

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Offline Crudblud

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Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #74 on: December 23, 2013, 03:51:46 PM »
But I thought you were a big fan of the franchise!  Shouldn't you have gotten it as soon as it came out?
If you'd played the previous attempt to convert Fallout into an action game, you wouldn't have been too eager to get it either.

Saddam Hussein

Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #75 on: December 23, 2013, 07:25:41 PM »
So, given the current state of the franchise, F3 was actually an improvement?

Offline Blanko

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Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #76 on: December 23, 2013, 07:29:57 PM »
Crudblud still hasn't replied.  Hmm...what bait to use next.

Hey, Crudblud, it's funny how you apparently don't like this game, and yet you spent all that time and (presumably) money playing the DLC.  You are literally Blanko.

Not true, I spend money on games I never even start playing to begin with.

Offline Blanko

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Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #77 on: December 23, 2013, 08:48:28 PM »
ok


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Offline Crudblud

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Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #78 on: December 23, 2013, 08:56:16 PM »
So, given the current state of the franchise, F3 was actually an improvement?
Brotherhood of Steel was just a spin-off, not part of the main series. The original Fallout 3, more commonly known by its codename Van Buren, was ~50% complete in 2003, then Bethesda bought the rights to the franchise and it was canned.

In other words: no.

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Offline Lemon

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Re: Survivor2299
« Reply #79 on: December 23, 2013, 09:21:48 PM »
I've tried to play the older Fallouts. Terribly bad by today's standards, really. I've come to expect more than the games give.
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