[Tom Bishop]

"we are currently clean on opsec" literal lol, fucking idiots.

super looking forward to tom's pathetic equivocations on how gabbard and ratcliffe didn't just straight up lie to congress.

This leaked info was useless, just a vague attack time a couple hours out, with no targets, coordinates, or details. Based on what was shared the target could have been a person, a airfield, or a building. You think that's enough for the Houthis to scramble and dodge a precision strike? Please. It's like me saying, "I'm punching someone in New York tomorrow afternoon." Good luck stopping it without knowing who or where or how to stop it. The attack still landed, right on target. This "war plan" scare is nonsense. Even if some spy saw it, they’d get nothing actionable.

Pete Hegseth weighed the risks and used an encrypted, government-approved app to brief his superiors. That’s within tolerance for a Secretary of Defense dealing with a weak opponent like this. Houthis had no actionable intel from this, and even if they did, our tech and military superiority renders it moot. Quit clutching your pearls. The US doesn't lose sleep over Yemen, and neither should you.

[Lord Dave]

But you know what I am?  I'm an IT person.  Yes, they could have put in a backdoor into chips if said chip maker allows it. But know what that means? Means your phone has it too.

My phone company freely admits that they work with the intelligence agencies. Leaked documents have revealed a "highly collaborative" and "extreme willingness to help" relationship.

Yes and?  If the government wanted it, they wouldn't need to ask for it.  And yes there are back doors programmed into some devices like apple.  Phone companies allow meta data to be sent to the government or help unlock phones.

And there are people all across the world who make it their life mission to find these backdoors.

That's an easy one. Plausible deniability, programmer/manufacturer defect. Tell your stooges to get smarter about it next time.

But even if they do exist, even if such a backdoor exists... that means they're hackable to everyone else too.  Back doors open for everyone, not just whoever made them.

They likely have thought of that. Ever heard of password protection? You could simply have the system respond to a specific signal or pattern. Even Trojan Horse server software found on the dark web employ passwords in their clients to prevent control by others.

Also... you do know that China makes their own stuff, right?

You're talking about Chinese manufacturers. They are making the technology from templates they got somewhere. They did not invent the templates and fundamentals. They did not invent telecommunication protocols, C Language, standard libraries, hardware random number generators, fundamental silicon components, all of which could potentially have hidden flaws perpetuated from its progeny. All of that technology and software has fundamental American design and code in it from its birthplace of the US and the Silicon Valley.

This entire section is from a place of ignorance.  You haven't a god damn clue how chips work, how software works, how anything related to computers work. Stop pretending like you do.

[Action80]

To quote LD, everyone here talking about how they feel about Trump:

This is... really, really stupid

[AATW]

Pete Hegseth weighed the risks

lol

[Lord Dave]

Pete Hegseth weighed the risks

lol

Hmmm... Unknown number... Should I invite them?  Should I not? Where did this - eh it's fine.  *Invite.*

[DuncanDoenitz]

TV was invented by a Scotsman. 

Ergo, all TVs are copied from Scottish technology, and Scotland can close down TVs worldwide if it suits their agenda for world domination. 

[AATW]

Pete Hegseth weighed the risks

lol

Hmmm... Unknown number... Should I invite them?  Should I not? Where did this - eh it's fine.  *Invite.*

This is the point Tom is flailing around desperately refusing to acknowledge.
First it was the standard Trump kneejerk response: well it's only the journalist's word for it. FAKE NEWS!
Then when they realised it was true it was: They have the right to declassify anything they want. Which, even if true, is irrelevant because that's not what happened here.
And now it's "Well, they didn't disclose anything which could have jeopardised the mission". Which is debatable, and also irrelevant.

The point here is the level of seriousness and competence this demonstrates at the highest level of the US government. How the fuck did a journalist who has no security clearance get added into the chat and no-one noticed at any point as they discussed the details of a live military operation. I don't think "oh whoopsie-doodle, mistakes happen!" is an adequate response here. Tom may be OK with that level of incompetence at that level, I don't think many other people are.

[Action80]

To quote LD, everyone here talking about how they feel about Trump:

This is... really, really stupid

[Lord Dave]

Pete Hegseth weighed the risks

lol

Hmmm... Unknown number... Should I invite them?  Should I not? Where did this - eh it's fine.  *Invite.*

This is the point Tom is flailing around desperately refusing to acknowledge.
First it was the standard Trump kneejerk response: well it's only the journalist's word for it. FAKE NEWS!
Then when they realised it was true it was: They have the right to declassify anything they want. Which, even if true, is irrelevant because that's not what happened here.
And now it's "Well, they didn't disclose anything which could have jeopardised the mission". Which is debatable, and also irrelevant.

The point here is the level of seriousness and competence this demonstrates at the highest level of the US government. How the fuck did a journalist who has no security clearance get added into the chat and no-one noticed at any point as they discussed the details of a live military operation. I don't think "oh whoopsie-doodle, mistakes happen!" is an adequate response here. Tom may be OK with that level of incompetence at that level, I don't think many other people are.

Yeah. I can understand a "opps, I added you to the wrong group." Kinda thing that lasts a few seconds.

Or
"I added 100 people at once and put in the wrong number by mistake for one" which at 100 people wouldn't be easy to notice.  But 18?  How the fuck do you not know all 18 people on such a conversation?


Also, who was he trying to add?  And why didn't notice they didn't get added?

Or....
Did the editor use social engineering to trick Mike into inviting him?  Which would be so...so much worse.

[Action80]

Tom may be OK with that level of incompetence at that level, I don't think many other people are.

Actually , the people that matter are okay with it.

You may go now.

[markjo]

Tom may be OK with that level of incompetence at that level, I don't think many other people are.

Actually , the people that matter are okay with it.

That’s even worse.  Incompetence should never be tolerated at such a high level. 

[AATW]

Tom may be OK with that level of incompetence at that level, I don't think many other people are.

Actually , the people that matter are okay with it.

That’s even worse.  Incompetence should never be tolerated at such a high level.

Exactly this.
That level of incompetence and lack of seriousness at the highest level of US government is both hilarious and deeply worrying. The fact that the incompetence is tolerated and defended makes it worse.

[Tom Bishop]

I don't see how this personal liberal view of how operational secrecy should he handled has any merit. It appears that you have just made it up on the spot that officials can't give out operational details of ongoing conflicts at all. It does not match how it has been handled in previous conflicts against weak opponents:

https://abcnews.go.com/International/story?id=80360&page=1

Anti-Taliban Troops Ready for Offensive on Caves
December 4, 2001

Dec. 4 -- The assault against the Taliban intensified today as the U.S. military and opposition troops prepared to attack a cave complex in eastern Afghanistan where Osama bin Laden may be holed up.

The developments in Afghanistan came as delegates of four factions holding talks near the German city of Bonn agreed on a blueprint for a broad-based interim government.

In Afghanistan, a senior Northern Alliance commander told ABCNEWS he was preparing about 1,500 of his troops, along with U.S. special forces on the ground, to attack the Tora Bora cave complex near the eastern city of Jalalabad today.

Wow, it's almost like you don't know what you are talking about at all.

[honk]

This wasn't an interview or an authorized release to the media. It was a mistake. A clumsy, reckless mistake by incompetent people.

[Tom Bishop]

This wasn't an interview or an authorized release to the media. It was a mistake. A clumsy, reckless mistake by incompetent people.

You would be making the same argument if Pete Hegseth told the VP in the chat that he was preparing to attack terrorists in caves, just like what was published. It turns out, you guys don't know what actually needs to stay secret.

[AATW]

I don't see how this personal liberal view of how operational secrecy should he handled has any merit.

Liberal view 
Honestly, the ridiculous holes you are digging yourself into.

This is nothing to do with anyone's politics. This was a group chat set up to discuss a particular mission.
Leaving aside whether they should be using Signal for this purpose, the point you keep failing to acknowledge is
THEY INVITED A FUCKING JOURNALIST WHO HAD NO SECURITY CLEARANCE IN TO THE CHAT BY ACCIDENT.
And, worse, no-one noticed throughout the chat.

If you think that lack of seriousness and level of incompetence is acceptable at the highest level of the US Government then OK then.
It's a strange position, but OK. If Trump thinks that level of incompetence is acceptable then holy shit!
But this is what happens when you have someone like Trump making appointments based on loyalty rather then competence.

We all know how you'd be posting had this happened on Biden's watch. Stop embarrassing yourself.

[Action80]

Once again, the people that actuallymatter are okay with it.

Ipso facto, anyone outside of the people thatactuallymatter have nothing to offer re: competence.

[Action80]

Once again, the people that actually matter are okay with it.

Ipso facto, anyone outside of the people that actually matter have nothing relevant to offer as to competence.

[AATW]

Once again, the people that actually matter are okay with it.

Which, as has been explained to you, makes things worse.
Not only are the top levels of your government grossly incompetent, they also don't care about that incompetence.
Not great, is it?

[honk]

I could have dismissed virtually every criticism of Biden by saying "The people who matter don't care about this." It's a blatant appeal to authority.