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Offline Pongo

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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #340 on: October 24, 2024, 02:13:49 PM »
Why did you mash two sides of the argument?

You know, I thought about this before I hit post but I thought to myself, “nah, surely they won’t misconstrue what I’m saying and see it for what it is; a critique of the argument.”

The fault is mine, I expected too much. My bee.

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Offline Rushy

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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #341 on: October 24, 2024, 02:22:25 PM »
Since everyone is interested in evidence, I think it'd be quite easy for Harris to provide some. I'd prefer a video of Harris walking me through each step of operating the kitchen tools at McDonald's. Preferably, this would be every machine, but I think just the fryer and grill would be enough.

It's also optional, but encouraged, that Harris herself provide me with a quarter-pounder w/ cheese meal (supersized) for my consumption. That way, not only does she prove that she worked there, but she can also prove to me what her skill level was while doing so. If the meal pleases me, I would consider voting for Harris.

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Offline Roundy

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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #342 on: October 24, 2024, 04:58:15 PM »
Since everyone is interested in evidence...
I mean, I'm not interested in evidence that Harris worked a menial job 40 years ago, and like Action80 said I doubt many people are, because who cares? It doesn't seem to matter to anyone except Trump and his brainwashed followers, who of course care because they let Trump do their thinking for them. Other than that, and maybe the occasional pedantic internet troll here and there, truly, nobody gives a shit.
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Offline Rushy

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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #343 on: October 24, 2024, 05:11:12 PM »
I mean, I'm not interested in evidence that Harris worked a menial job 40 years ago, and like Action80 said I doubt many people are, because who cares? It doesn't seem to matter to anyone except Trump and his brainwashed followers, who of course care because they let Trump do their thinking for them. Other than that, and maybe the occasional pedantic internet troll here and there, truly, nobody gives a shit.

Of course, Roundy, we've already established that you don't need evidence to believe things. I think that's the running theme in any topic you discuss. It would be more acceptable in a religious context, but here in the land of facts it's not quite as desirable. And, while there seems to be an awful lot of "who cares lol" posts, in actuality quite a few of you care. If you did not care, then my "Harris obviously didn't work at McDonald's" posts would go just as unanswered as my "Harris' policies are unpopular" post did. I think it's quite clear which issues you care about and which ones you don't, but that's not as clear to you as it is to me.

The fact of the matter is that all of you seem to care far too much about whether Harris worked at McDonald's (she didn't). The mere suggestion that she didn't added several pages to this thread. Now, you can accept that she didn't, because she didn't, -OR- we can continue this circus, where I ask for evidence that she worked there and you get upset by the cognitive dissonance of you believing she did despite not having any proof of it.

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Online honk

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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #344 on: October 24, 2024, 06:34:55 PM »
No, the fact that people care about whether or not the subject is worth caring about is not automatically evidence that they care about the subject itself. Those are two different things. To put it another way, if I made a thread saying that Trump wears pink underwear, and you responded by asking who even cares, that would not in and of itself be evidence that you cared about whether or not Trump wears pink underwear.
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Offline Rushy

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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #345 on: October 24, 2024, 06:45:06 PM »
No, the fact that people care about whether or not the subject is worth caring about is not automatically evidence that they care about the subject itself. Those are two different things. To put it another way, if I made a thread saying that Trump wears pink underwear, and you responded by asking who even cares, that would not in and of itself be evidence that you cared about whether or not Trump wears pink underwear.

If everyone chimed in to talk about how much they didn't care about a topic in every thread, then all threads would constantly be filled with nonsensical posts of people informing everyone how very much they do not care. I think you can see why this would get out of hand rapidly.

As I already pointed out, this thread is filled with posts that no one cared about and did not respond to (because they do not care!) However, they immensely care about Harris' work history. Lots of regulars came to the thread, only to insist that they do not care in the slightest... while making long posts about how the evidence could exist but doesn't matter. It really makes me think.

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Offline Roundy

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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #346 on: October 24, 2024, 06:46:11 PM »
It's a tiny, insignificant speck of an issue, because nobody had any reason to make it an issue in the first place. Republicans are arguing that nobody cares about January 6 anymore because issues, meanwhile we have McDonaldsgate, gtfo with this bullshit  ::)
Dr. Frank is a physicist. He says it's impossible. So it's impossible.
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Offline Rushy

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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #347 on: October 24, 2024, 06:52:34 PM »
It's a tiny, insignificant speck of an issue, because nobody had any reason to make it an issue in the first place. Republicans are arguing that nobody cares about January 6 anymore because issues, meanwhile we have McDonaldsgate, gtfo with this bullshit  ::)

No is forcing you to talk about Harris and her lack of McDonald's work experience. All I did was cast doubt on the subject, as Trump himself and many others in his campaign have. If you don't want to talk about it, that's fine. Making incessant posts to the tune of "I Do Not Care About This Ha Ha Ha" does not add anything to the thread. You can talk about whatever election-related topic you like. You can ignore the McDonald's posts. You're an adult. Stop whining.

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Offline Pongo

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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #348 on: October 24, 2024, 08:13:30 PM »
Since everyone is interested in evidence...
I mean, I'm not interested in evidence that Harris worked a menial job 40 years ago…

I like to know as many true things as possible and as few false things as possible. If someone makes a claim, I — and people who care about truth — would like them to be able to back their assertions up with evidence.

For example, if someone said in a job interview that they had certain skills or went to school, I think it’s reasonable to be able to back that up with facts. Harris is interviewing for a job right now and some of us would like to know if what she is saying is true.

If you don’t care if what she says is true, or if knowingly knowing false things is not a problem for you then I have no beef with that. You do you my man. But don’t come around here asserting that your Roundy-tinted life view should apply to anyone else.

We care about facts and truth. Sometimes that means verifying a person’s claims.

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Offline AATW

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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #349 on: October 24, 2024, 08:29:44 PM »
If someone makes a claim, I — and people who care about truth — would like them to be able to back their assertions up with evidence.
I agree with the principle of that, I just don't know how you'd expect that to be possible in this instance.
Kamela Harris is 60. I wouldn't really expect her to have kept any records from a temporary job she claims to have had 40 years ago. The organisation she claims to have worked for have said they don't keep any records going back that far.

So all we're left with is how credible you believe her to be and how credible you believe that claim to be.
Unless someone who knew her from that time comes forward to confirm or deny her claim - in which case if it's the former the people determined to disbelieve her will say they're lying anyway.
Tom: "Claiming incredulity is a pretty bad argument. Calling it "insane" or "ridiculous" is not a good argument at all."

TFES Wiki Occam's Razor page, by Tom: "What's the simplest explanation; that NASA has successfully designed and invented never before seen rocket technologies from scratch which can accelerate 100 tons of matter to an escape velocity of 7 miles per second"

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Offline Lord Dave

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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #350 on: October 24, 2024, 09:05:07 PM »
Unless someone who knew her from that time comes forward to confirm or deny her claim - in which case if it's the former the people determined to disbelieve her will say they're lying anyway.
They did.  But its been largely ignored.
« Last Edit: October 24, 2024, 10:26:55 PM by Lord Dave »
The conviction will get overturned on appeal.

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Offline Roundy

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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #351 on: October 24, 2024, 09:38:43 PM »
It's a tiny, insignificant speck of an issue, because nobody had any reason to make it an issue in the first place. Republicans are arguing that nobody cares about January 6 anymore because issues, meanwhile we have McDonaldsgate, gtfo with this bullshit  ::)

No is forcing you to talk about Harris and her lack of McDonald's work experience. All I did was cast doubt on the subject, as Trump himself and many others in his campaign have. If you don't want to talk about it, that's fine. Making incessant posts to the tune of "I Do Not Care About This Ha Ha Ha" does not add anything to the thread. You can talk about whatever election-related topic you like. You can ignore the McDonald's posts. You're an adult. Stop whining.

Excuse me? That this is a ludicrously silly thing to argue about is an opinion, and I have the right to express it. The only one whining here is you because I expressed an opinion you don't seem to like. So sorry.
Dr. Frank is a physicist. He says it's impossible. So it's impossible.
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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #352 on: October 25, 2024, 02:02:29 AM »
Firstly, it's extremely unlikely that the IRS is hanging onto records of the income tax that a fast-food worker paid forty years ago; secondly, there's no good reason (both in the sense of Kamala's political interests and the public interest) to ask them to try to verify Kamala's McDonald's employment; thirdly, that's not a thing the IRS would do even if there was a good reason to verify Kamala's McDonald's employment; and fourthly, Trump and his supporters would immediately label any evidence the IRS produced as fabricated, so what would even be the point? Nobody who isn't already a ride-or-die Trump fan doubts that Kamala worked at McDonald's when she was younger, because it's entirely believable and would be an utterly pointless thing to lie about.

Wow, what a convent slew of semi-plausible excuses.

“IRS doesn’t have it”
“If they do have it, it doesn’t matter”
“If it does matter, they won’t release it”
“If they do release it, then it’s fabricated”
“If it isn’t fabricated, then it’s not relevant”

It reminds me of the narcissist’s prayer. Which I guess is fitting for Kamala.

What are you even talking about? I explained that there were several reasons that the IRS can't "verify" whether or not Kamala worked at McDonald's, and also correctly pointed out that even if they could offer any evidence, Trump supporters would immediately label it fake. The main idea behind the narcissist's prayer is that the various excuses offered are contradictory, and therefore indicate the speaker's insincerity. In this case, however, the "excuses," as you call them, are all true and all apply at the same time.

No, the fact that people care about whether or not the subject is worth caring about is not automatically evidence that they care about the subject itself. Those are two different things. To put it another way, if I made a thread saying that Trump wears pink underwear, and you responded by asking who even cares, that would not in and of itself be evidence that you cared about whether or not Trump wears pink underwear.

If everyone chimed in to talk about how much they didn't care about a topic in every thread, then all threads would constantly be filled with nonsensical posts of people informing everyone how very much they do not care. I think you can see why this would get out of hand rapidly.

As I already pointed out, this thread is filled with posts that no one cared about and did not respond to (because they do not care!) However, they immensely care about Harris' work history. Lots of regulars came to the thread, only to insist that they do not care in the slightest... while making long posts about how the evidence could exist but doesn't matter. It really makes me think.

But that's not what anyone is saying. It's not caring about whether or not Kamala worked at McDonald's, it's caring about the fact that people are trying to turn this into a big controversy and demanding that Kamala somehow "prove" what any normal person would accept at face value. You say that you don't believe anything without first seeing evidence of it, but that's simply not true. Every single person who lives in a society accepts without question plausible things they're told on a daily basis without demanding evidence of it first. If someone told you they went to Vegas last week on vacation, you'd believe them. If someone told you that they were having a bad day, you'd believe them. And when Kamala says that as a college student, she worked at McDonald's, normal people believe her, because it's entirely plausible and not the kind of thing that anyone could reasonably be expected to make up. Again, what if Trump wears pink underwear? You can care deeply about the fact that people are trying to make a big deal about whether or not Trump wears pink underwear without caring about whether or not Trump wears pink underwear.

Thank you for reminding me about responding to you about the popularity of Democratic and Republican positions. I was distracted by this nonsensical controversy.
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Offline Pete Svarrior

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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #353 on: October 25, 2024, 09:19:18 AM »
Giving up on your attempt this easily, eh?
Not at all - you're welcome to address my points whenever you're ready. Just, y'know, things I actually said and not things I didn't. If you need a recap, just shout.

So far, 3 out of your 3 reasons to distrust Harris have turned out to either be incongruent with reality, or to require Harris to be Weird. You seem to really want to make that mean that we should trust Harris instead, but that's not what I've ever suggested. It just means you said some silly things. It is possible for you to be wrong and dumb, and for Harris to not be telling the truth at the same time.
« Last Edit: October 25, 2024, 09:23:02 AM by Pete Svarrior »
Read the FAQ before asking your question - chances are we already addressed it.
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Offline Action80

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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #354 on: October 25, 2024, 11:37:01 AM »
If anything, I am more pissed about Harris flat-out lying to everyone about the economy.

She is one messed-up lying, cunt of a woman.

If that is what she identifies as today, that is...
To be honest I am getting pretty bored of this place.

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Offline AATW

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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #355 on: October 25, 2024, 12:36:14 PM »
If anything, I am more pissed about Harris flat-out lying to everyone about the economy.
The US economy is pretty strong. That isn't an opinion, it's just numbers:

https://www2.deloitte.com/us/en/insights/economy/us-economic-forecast/united-states-outlook-analysis.html

Also. You understand that things outside the US's control affect things?
Tom: "Claiming incredulity is a pretty bad argument. Calling it "insane" or "ridiculous" is not a good argument at all."

TFES Wiki Occam's Razor page, by Tom: "What's the simplest explanation; that NASA has successfully designed and invented never before seen rocket technologies from scratch which can accelerate 100 tons of matter to an escape velocity of 7 miles per second"

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Offline Rushy

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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #356 on: October 25, 2024, 02:04:59 PM »
Excuse me? That this is a ludicrously silly thing to argue about is an opinion, and I have the right to express it. The only one whining here is you because I expressed an opinion you don't seem to like. So sorry.

You came here to engage in the discussion while also insisting you don't care about it. You do it quite a lot, to a point where it's becoming the only thing you do. If it bothers you that I'm pointing it out then I suggest you stop doing it.

So far, 3 out of your 3 reasons to distrust Harris have turned out to either be incongruent with reality, or to require Harris to be Weird. You seem to really want to make that mean that we should trust Harris instead, but that's not what I've ever suggested. It just means you said some silly things. It is possible for you to be wrong and dumb, and for Harris to not be telling the truth at the same time.

So far, all you've stated is your opinion that a lack of evidence isn't a big deal because you can imagine ways my evidence doesn't matter. While it's a fascinating methodology of argument, it's not a particularly stimulating one.

How about this, maybe dredge up something that says statistically what sort of jobs people put on what sort of applications. I'm sure they covered how to support arguments in your education at some point. I don't think I need to go over that process with you, do I?

But that's not what anyone is saying. It's not caring about whether or not Kamala worked at McDonald's, it's caring about the fact that people are trying to turn this into a big controversy and demanding that Kamala somehow "prove" what any normal person would accept at face value. You say that you don't believe anything without first seeing evidence of it, but that's simply not true. Every single person who lives in a society accepts without question plausible things they're told on a daily basis without demanding evidence of it first. If someone told you they went to Vegas last week on vacation, you'd believe them. If someone told you that they were having a bad day, you'd believe them. And when Kamala says that as a college student, she worked at McDonald's, normal people believe her, because it's entirely plausible and not the kind of thing that anyone could reasonably be expected to make up. Again, what if Trump wears pink underwear? You can care deeply about the fact that people are trying to make a big deal about whether or not Trump wears pink underwear without caring about whether or not Trump wears pink underwear.

Thank you for reminding me about responding to you about the popularity of Democratic and Republican positions. I was distracted by this nonsensical controversy.

I think I asked for reasonable evidence for whether Kamala worked at McDonald's. Your silly dodging of the issue with vague hypotheticals is not relevant to the discussion.

Thank you for reminding me about responding to you about the popularity of Democratic and Republican positions. I was distracted by this nonsensical controversy.

Yeah you better.

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Offline AATW

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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #357 on: October 25, 2024, 02:52:41 PM »
I think I asked for reasonable evidence for whether Kamala worked at McDonald's.
Which we all know you're immediately going to call fake or lies.
Tom: "Claiming incredulity is a pretty bad argument. Calling it "insane" or "ridiculous" is not a good argument at all."

TFES Wiki Occam's Razor page, by Tom: "What's the simplest explanation; that NASA has successfully designed and invented never before seen rocket technologies from scratch which can accelerate 100 tons of matter to an escape velocity of 7 miles per second"

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Offline Pongo

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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #358 on: October 25, 2024, 03:54:38 PM »
I think I asked for reasonable evidence for whether Kamala worked at McDonald's.
Which we all know you're immediately going to call fake or lies.

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Offline Action80

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Re: US Presidential Election 2024
« Reply #359 on: October 25, 2024, 04:44:24 PM »
If anything, I am more pissed about Harris flat-out lying to everyone about the economy.
The US economy is pretty strong. That isn't an opinion, it's just numbers:

https://www2.deloitte.com/us/en/insights/economy/us-economic-forecast/united-states-outlook-analysis.html

Also. You understand that things outside the US's control affect things?
Once again, it seems you do not understand how Mr. and Mrs. John Q. Public define the word "economy."

Their definition has absolutely jack shit to do with the bullshit source you provided.

I call it a bullshit source strictly because of how the average American views the economy.

And no doubt there are outside forces. Again, nobody in the US gives a fuck about that and those outside forces have nothing to do with the lying cunt.
« Last Edit: October 25, 2024, 04:48:52 PM by Action80 »
To be honest I am getting pretty bored of this place.