Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« on: April 25, 2019, 08:10:41 PM »
A person on Antarctica (any research stationed there) can see 24 hours of sunlight, circling around, during solstice.  Care to explain how it is possible in a flat earth model?  It is pretty simple on spherical planet model.  See below a 360° pictures in Antarctica.



The opposite happens on Arctic, from November 13 to January 29 there is no visible Sun, not even twilight, since it goes 12 degrees below the horizon, during this time the whole Arctic becomes dark for 11 weeks.  Care to explain about that in a flat earth model?

Both are quite simply to explain, including precise math calculation, even predictions, using the spherical planet model.

Below, Arctic 24 hours of sun all around in June, 360° pictures.


Re: Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« Reply #1 on: April 28, 2019, 07:19:48 AM »
No replies lol.

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Offline Baby Thork

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Re: Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« Reply #2 on: April 28, 2019, 12:14:42 PM »
How about you read the FAQ, and then ask why no one can be bothered to answer your question?
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Re: Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« Reply #3 on: April 28, 2019, 05:44:56 PM »
That's something I asked here years ago. Nobody could explain it, so they said it was not true. Good luck on trying to have anyone to answer your questions here.

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Re: Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« Reply #4 on: April 28, 2019, 05:46:35 PM »
How about you read the FAQ, and then ask why no one can be bothered to answer your question?

What in the FAQ or wiki addresses this phenomena? I have never found anything specific to this.
Not much is known about the celestial bodies and their distances.

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Re: Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« Reply #5 on: April 28, 2019, 07:55:25 PM »
How about you read the FAQ, and then ask why no one can be bothered to answer your question?
I did. It says nothing about this in the FAQ, so I looked in the Wiki. Big surprise! Nothing about it. So, that being said, how can 24 hour sun in Antarctica be possible on a flat earth?
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Re: Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« Reply #6 on: April 28, 2019, 08:45:25 PM »
Quote
How about you read the FAQ, and then ask why no one can be bothered to answer your question?

I cannot see anything that explicitly addresses this in the FAQ page either. Indirectly though and related to this question, the FAQ page does show an animation of the Sun circling over a flat Earth. The extent of the daylight area due to the Sun does reach the circumference (or edge) of the flat Earth circular surface. That would mean the Antarctic is in daylight for 24 hours. As the Sun moves back north (radius of solar orbiting circle decreases) so the Antarctic region would be placed into 24 hour night. That corresponds to southern hemisphere winter.

What the animation does not account for though is the variation in the Suns altitude during a 24 hour period near for example the December solstice. In the animation the Sun follows a circular path and so its distance from the 'edge' of the flat Earth is constant. To an observer in Antarctica or near the SP region, that would mean they would see the Sun circle the horizon at constant altitude. That is not what is observed in reality.  Perhaps there is another FE model which does account for this variation in solar altitude during a 24 hour period?
« Last Edit: April 28, 2019, 08:48:00 PM by manicminer »

Re: Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« Reply #7 on: April 29, 2019, 06:06:47 PM »
Quote
How about you read the FAQ, and then ask why no one can be bothered to answer your question?

I cannot see anything that explicitly addresses this in the FAQ page either. Indirectly though and related to this question, the FAQ page does show an animation of the Sun circling over a flat Earth. The extent of the daylight area due to the Sun does reach the circumference (or edge) of the flat Earth circular surface. That would mean the Antarctic is in daylight for 24 hours. As the Sun moves back north (radius of solar orbiting circle decreases) so the Antarctic region would be placed into 24 hour night. That corresponds to southern hemisphere winter.

What the animation does not account for though is the variation in the Suns altitude during a 24 hour period near for example the December solstice. In the animation the Sun follows a circular path and so its distance from the 'edge' of the flat Earth is constant. To an observer in Antarctica or near the SP region, that would mean they would see the Sun circle the horizon at constant altitude. That is not what is observed in reality.  Perhaps there is another FE model which does account for this variation in solar altitude during a 24 hour period?

Something wrong with your explanation. 

First that the Flat Earth's Sun never goes much further from the vertical over the Equator, so, for an observer over Antarctica, it will be far away always, never close by.  Even for flat Earth model, the edge will be at 12738km from the center, or 6369km from the Equator, the Sun will be only at 4800km up (over the Equator), so, the observer angle for the closest Sun would be around 37° at Noon time and 14.1° at Midnight, hypotenuse will be 7975km at Noon and 19700km at Midnight.   

Second, if the observer is with his back to the "ice wall" and facing towards the North Pole, he might see the Sun very low on horizon at some time, but the Sun will NOT circle the observer's back, right?  To do so, the Sun would need to go outside the flat Earth model for a long distance, and keep close to the horizon on the observer's back.   Imagine yourself sit over the public benches of a stadium, watching a game happening in the mid field, how some players would run around your back?  Impossible, right? The game field is happening way over your front, the same as the Sun over the middle Equator of flat Earth model.  So, the explanation doesn't work.  I think you didn't understood, those pictures are a 360° composition during 24 hours time period, with the photographer rotating himself in a full circle, facing the Sun.

Re: Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« Reply #8 on: April 29, 2019, 08:03:56 PM »
The biggest challenge here is making the model of the FE as it stands accurately reflect real world experience.  I agree that if you call Antarctica the entire circumference of a flat disk then quite simply the Sun as it is shown on the FE model cannot be and will not be visible continuously over a 24 hr period from any one point on the circumference. 

I have read posts by FE believers which state that because of that they don't beleive that the Sun can be visible over the horizon continously for 24 hours and therefore any photos/videos that show that to be the case are wrong or have been faked. How about the other possibility that the FE model is wrong?

Lots of people have been to the Antarctic region now, many of whom have no interest whatsoever in FE theories and will confirm without a moment hesitation that the Sun never sets over Antarctica on and around the December solstice.




Re: Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« Reply #9 on: April 29, 2019, 08:10:41 PM »
The biggest challenge here is making the model of the FE as it stands accurately reflect real world experience.  I agree that if you call Antarctica the entire circumference of a flat disk then quite simply the Sun as it is shown on the FE model cannot be and will not be visible continuously over a 24 hr period from any one point on the circumference. 

I have read posts by FE believers which state that because of that they don't beleive that the Sun can be visible over the horizon continously for 24 hours and therefore any photos/videos that show that to be the case are wrong or have been faked. How about the other possibility that the FE model is wrong?

Lots of people have been to the Antarctic region now, many of whom have no interest whatsoever in FE theories and will confirm without a moment hesitation that the Sun never sets over Antarctica on and around the December solstice.
This is one of the things that the Bi-Polar Model approaches at least better. https://wiki.tfes.org/Bi-Polar_Model It has other issues, but provides Antarctica as its own continent and allows for the possibility of a 24-hour daylight period for both North and South pole areas.

Re: Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« Reply #10 on: April 29, 2019, 08:51:14 PM »
So reading between the lines of this bi-polar model description, you could almost be forgiven for getting the feeling that it is a subtle attempt to make a flat Earth behave more like a spherical Earth but falling short of admitting that the popular FE model might actually be wrong.

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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« Reply #11 on: April 29, 2019, 09:00:45 PM »
Search for the book the Anti-Newtonian. Flat Earth Theory started with multiple poles and Rowbotham simplified it to one pole due to lack of evidence. Multiple poles have been been theorized for hundreds of years.
« Last Edit: April 29, 2019, 09:13:28 PM by Tom Bishop »

Re: Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« Reply #12 on: April 29, 2019, 09:14:57 PM »
Lack of evidence for what?  I'm not sure multiple poles are necessary. Two are enough I would have thought. That would produce the 'bi-polar' magnetic field pattern that reflects the true nature of the Earths magnetic field.

Re: Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« Reply #13 on: April 29, 2019, 09:34:16 PM »
FE bipolar map creates another set of havoc for FErs and complicates even more.  Starting with the extreme dimensional deformed United States and Australia, following by a Sun's path completely impossible (two Suns?), with a totally wrong Equatorial line - you can not ride it straight and end up where started, airplane flight paths from San Francisco to Japan or China impossible to be a shorten path over Pacific, magnetic field lines would be a mess, no magnet exists with such shape.

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Re: Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« Reply #14 on: April 29, 2019, 09:40:29 PM »
Multiple pole FE or most notably, a bi-polar FE, gets blown up quite quickly with just the path of the sun which is not what we observe. Let alone where the moon is in all this:

One of the FE models is that of a disk with two poles, also known as "Antarctica as a Continent" model. This better explains seasons, especially that of the areas south of the equator, but it, too, has an interesting problem.

That problem is this: during the southern summer many places north of the equator should see a very discernible backtracking of the sun. The sun has always been observed to rise in the east and make a steady westward progression until it sets (unless, of course, you're in one of those places during one of those times that the sun never sets).

The Bi-polar model clearly indicates otherwise. The to-scale diagram below is for the equinox, when the sun shifts 'gears' from the north pole to the south pole. The indicated angles around the point of observation are for bearings (away from north) for each position of the sun (except E, which is the point at which the sun 'switches gears').

From when the sun rises to Point R, the bearing of the sun is constantly increasing, as you can see. However, at Point R the sun switches direction and heads eastward until it sets. At the most it's only a few degrees, but at the very least it's unnoticeable.

However, the distance the sun travels in that time, from Point R to setting, is enough to take hours--2 hours and 47 minutes in my case--in which the sun would appear to not be moving across the sky.

I, living here a few years now, have never experienced such a thing--either the sun stopping nearly 3 hours before sunset or it backtracking for nearly 3 hours before sunset. Since this model is so far off observations, it can be safely thrown into the garbage.


P.S. Also, if sunsets and sunrises are caused, as FE claims, by distance to and from the sun, then it should be noted that the distance between me and the sunrise and the distance between me and the sunset (indicated by the red and blue dotted circles respectively) differ by 69.2% of the distance between the equator and the north pole
Not much is known about the celestial bodies and their distances.

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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« Reply #15 on: April 29, 2019, 11:35:51 PM »
The Wiki has a section for the equinoxes:

Quote
==Eastward Sunrise==

Q. How the sun can rise from near the east under this configuration?
A. An answer to this query may be that it is similar to its operation in the standard Monopole model. When we observe the sun, we are observing its projection upon the atmolayer. The sun which is seen is local and individual to each observer. Accordingly, the easterly sunrise is a consequence of the following:

  • The points along the edges of the sun's circular area of light are sunrise (or sunset).
  • Our vision is very limited. One cannot see infinitely into the distance.
  • The edge of the sun's circular area of light is approaching the observer from the Eastward from his or her position.

Sunrise will occur from an Eastward direction as a natural consequence of the observer's limited range of vision. The sun's circular area of light generally intersects the observer's area of vision from an Eastward direction. During Equinox the sun's circular area of light is pivoting around the Northern and Southern poles in a figure eight. The points along the edge of the sun's area of light are close to traveling along the observer's latitude line as it intersects the observer's viewing area, even if the sun is not, and will intersect and appear from near the East in initial bearing.

If a cloud were traveling along the circle of your latitude line, and you only see it when it is close to you, would you see it appear from the east or near the east? The same explanation for this occurrence is given for the local sun and the manifestation of its initial Eastward bearing. The points along the edge of sun's area of light are projections of the sun which will appear to the observer once in his or her viewing range.

For additional details see: https://wiki.tfes.org/Equinox#A_Flat_Earth_Equinox
« Last Edit: April 29, 2019, 11:40:14 PM by Tom Bishop »

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Re: Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« Reply #16 on: April 30, 2019, 12:02:50 AM »
The Wiki has a section for the equinoxes:

Quote
==Eastward Sunrise==

Q. How the sun can rise from near the east under this configuration?
A. An answer to this query may be that it is similar to its operation in the standard Monopole model. When we observe the sun, we are observing its projection upon the atmolayer. The sun which is seen is local and individual to each observer. Accordingly, the easterly sunrise is a consequence of the following:

  • The points along the edges of the sun's circular area of light are sunrise (or sunset).
  • Our vision is very limited. One cannot see infinitely into the distance.
  • The edge of the sun's circular area of light is approaching the observer from the Eastward from his or her position.

Sunrise will occur from an Eastward direction as a natural consequence of the observer's limited range of vision. The sun's circular area of light generally intersects the observer's area of vision from an Eastward direction. During Equinox the sun's circular area of light is pivoting around the Northern and Southern poles in a figure eight. The points along the edge of the sun's area of light are close to traveling along the observer's latitude line as it intersects the observer's viewing area, even if the sun is not, and will intersect and appear from near the East in initial bearing.

If a cloud were traveling along the circle of your latitude line, and you only see it when it is close to you, would you see it appear from the east or near the east? The same explanation for this occurrence is given for the local sun and the manifestation of its initial Eastward bearing. The points along the edge of sun's area of light are projections of the sun which will appear to the observer once in his or her viewing range.

For additional details see: https://wiki.tfes.org/Equinox#A_Flat_Earth_Equinox

Unfortunately there is no evidence that the sun (or moon) is a "projection upon the atmolayer", whatever that even means exactly, no one has ever explained. Nor is there any evidence that it moves like a jetski or a racecar being that's it's 3000 miles high in the sky. On the flat earth model I would see it rise from my north east, off the coast of Sierra Leone. That is not is what is observed.
Greater still, it doesn't explain the observable 24 hours of sunlight.

Explanations should match observations. The wiki does not.
Not much is known about the celestial bodies and their distances.

Re: Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« Reply #17 on: April 30, 2019, 12:03:04 AM »
If 24 hours of sun above the horizon during the summer solstice in Antarctica is a real phenomenon one wonders why the only available video of the event depicts what looks suspiciously like the sun was cut and pasted on the video, what with the completely static rays of light.
« Last Edit: April 30, 2019, 12:21:08 AM by George Jetson »

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Offline Bad Puppy

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Re: Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« Reply #18 on: April 30, 2019, 12:45:29 AM »
If 24 hours of sun above the horizon during the summer solstice in Antarctica is a real phenomenon one wonders why the only available video of the event depicts what looks suspiciously like the sun was cut and pasted on the video, what with the completely static rays of light.


Because they're lens flares created by the camera lens filter, and there's a good chance that whatever lens filter is being used has consistent optics throughout its surface?
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Re: Antarctica shows 24 hours of sunlight.
« Reply #19 on: April 30, 2019, 12:55:04 AM »
If 24 hours of sun above the horizon during the summer solstice in Antarctica is a real phenomenon one wonders why the only available video of the event depicts what looks suspiciously like the sun was cut and pasted on the video, what with the completely static rays of light.

What makes you think it’s the only video?

Here’s a 5 day time-lapse:



Here’s 15 days of sunlight:



Just some more random ones:


Not much is known about the celestial bodies and their distances.