The Queen
« on: September 08, 2022, 01:14:26 PM »
Under "medical supervision". The family have all gone to visit her.
Even BBC1 have suspended all programming till 6pm.
Doesn't sound good :(
Tom: "Claiming incredulity is a pretty bad argument. Calling it "insane" or "ridiculous" is not a good argument at all."

TFES Wiki Occam's Razor page, by Tom: "What's the simplest explanation; that NASA has successfully designed and invented never before seen rocket technologies from scratch which can accelerate 100 tons of matter to an escape velocity of 7 miles per second"

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Online Rushy

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Re: The Queen
« Reply #1 on: September 08, 2022, 01:56:05 PM »
Do not worry, mortal, your leader is simply preparing for the journey back to the homeworld.

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Offline Iceman

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Re: The Queen
« Reply #2 on: September 08, 2022, 02:03:40 PM »
It had been starting to actually feel like she’d love forever. End of an era for sure.

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Offline Crudblud

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Re: The Queen
« Reply #3 on: September 08, 2022, 04:43:04 PM »
It had been starting to actually feel like she’d love forever. End of an era for sure.
Don't worry Iceman, the Queen's love for her subjects is eternal.

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Offline Iceman

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Re: The Queen
« Reply #4 on: September 08, 2022, 05:36:54 PM »
I feel her love this day, as I did on my first day, as I will all my days.

She’ll be missed. Despite what I think of royalty in general and their uselessness in modern society, she’s always seemed like a pretty nice lady.

A lot of money is about to look different. Yuck.

Re: The Queen
« Reply #5 on: September 08, 2022, 06:22:25 PM »
Well, shit.
I mean, she was 96 so fair enough.

Have a fair amount of affection for the monarchy. I’m in on the joke, I know they’re an anachronism in the modern world but I am a fan of all the pomp
And ceremony. But a lot of that affection is because of the Queen who, whatever you think of the institution, has been a tireless servant of the country for over 70 years.

All feels a bit weird, most people haven’t been through this in their lifetime, you’d have to be around 80 to remember the last succession.
Tom: "Claiming incredulity is a pretty bad argument. Calling it "insane" or "ridiculous" is not a good argument at all."

TFES Wiki Occam's Razor page, by Tom: "What's the simplest explanation; that NASA has successfully designed and invented never before seen rocket technologies from scratch which can accelerate 100 tons of matter to an escape velocity of 7 miles per second"

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Offline crutonius

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Re: The Queen
« Reply #6 on: September 08, 2022, 06:27:17 PM »
I'm torn.

She seemed like a decent person.  I will miss her.

At the same time, big picture, the UK, a powerful and modern nation with strong protections for individual liberty, has a fucking monarchy?  Is there some sort of magic sword involved in all this?


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Offline xasop

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Re: The Queen
« Reply #7 on: September 08, 2022, 06:40:02 PM »
At the same time, big picture, the UK, a powerful and modern nation with strong protections for individual liberty, has a fucking monarchy?
That's not a contradiction at all — constitutional monarchies tend to reinforce democracy because the monarch cannot be given any real power without seriously damaging the nation's legitimacy as a democracy on the world stage. Furthermore, constitutional monarchs are usually apolitical, whereas presidents are very often politicians even in presidential systems where they do not wield executive authority, meaning they may not be seen as representing the entire population.

Just look at France or the United States to see how easily a presidential democracy can be corrupted by centralising executive authority in a single office that is not accountable to any legislature. That could never happen in a constitutional monarchy without strong pushback from society, to put it mildly.

The narrative that monarchs are undemocratic comes, quite frankly, from people who do not understand politics.
when you try to mock anyone while also running the flat earth society. Lol

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Offline Roundy

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Re: The Queen
« Reply #8 on: September 08, 2022, 07:28:23 PM »
You know Charles is all "It's about bloody time!"
Dr. Frank is a physicist. He says it's impossible. So it's impossible.
My friends, please remember Tom said this the next time you fall into the trap of engaging him, and thank you. :)

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Online Rushy

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Re: The Queen
« Reply #9 on: September 08, 2022, 07:28:56 PM »
The narrative that monarchs are undemocratic comes, quite frankly, from people who do not understand politics.

The existence of monarchs is undemocratic. That you've swallowed a long line of propaganda about monarchy is only representative of your own ignorance and hilarious opinion. Having your head of state, even if they have no official power, be someone who just so happened to be born to the correct person at the correct time should be an international embarrassment rather than a symbol of unity.

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Offline xasop

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Re: The Queen
« Reply #10 on: September 08, 2022, 07:29:41 PM »
The existence of monarchs is undemocratic. That you've swallowed a long line of propaganda about monarchy is only representative of your own ignorance and hilarious opinion.
I'm sorry, was there supposed to be a point in there?
when you try to mock anyone while also running the flat earth society. Lol

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Online Rushy

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Re: The Queen
« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2022, 07:30:54 PM »
The existence of monarchs is undemocratic. That you've swallowed a long line of propaganda about monarchy is only representative of your own ignorance and hilarious opinion.
I'm sorry, was there supposed to be a point in there?

My point is that you have none at all. You just rambled on about basic royal propaganda then said anyone who has an opposing opinion is "from people who do not understand politics" before they even have a chance to state it. It's pathetic. Do better.

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Offline xasop

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Re: The Queen
« Reply #12 on: September 08, 2022, 07:33:05 PM »
My point is that you have none at all. You just rambled on about basic royal propaganda
I presented arguments to support my position, which is more than you have done.

then said anyone who has an opposing opinion is "from people who do not understand politics" before they even have a chance to state it.
So your response was... to not state any argument at all? What exactly are you trying to accomplish here?
when you try to mock anyone while also running the flat earth society. Lol

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Online Rushy

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Re: The Queen
« Reply #13 on: September 08, 2022, 07:36:25 PM »
I presented arguments to support my position, which is more than you have done.

You didn't present arguments, you rambled a bit about basic monarchist propaganda. Your post contained no data, no references, nothing that even remotely constitutes an argument. It's at best just a bad opinion, at worst, a photocopy of someone else's.

So your response was... to not state any argument at all? What exactly are you trying to accomplish here?

Pointing out your continued inability to formulate legible points. I'm not arguing with you, as that's a waste of time. I'm stating that you are not worth arguing with and that isn't a waste of time.

Re: The Queen
« Reply #14 on: September 08, 2022, 07:43:44 PM »
At the same time, big picture, the UK, a powerful and modern nation with strong protections for individual liberty, has a fucking monarchy?  Is there some sort of magic sword involved in all this?

I quite like Stephen Fry's take on it.
In one of his autobiographies he relates how as a teenager he broke his nose, which is why it's a bit wonky. When he started to become successful and got money he thought about getting it fixed and then he reconsidered, figuring that although it does look a bit odd it was part of him, so he left it. He says he views the monarchy the same, yes it is a bit out of place in a modern world but it's part of us as a nation and quite an important part. If I started a country now I wouldn't have a monarchy, it would be a weird thing to do. But removing it now...I kinda feel we'd be poorer for it as a nation.
All that said, a lot of that feeling is because of the Queen. I wonder how attitudes towards the monarchy will change with Charles who people don't have so much time for.
Tom: "Claiming incredulity is a pretty bad argument. Calling it "insane" or "ridiculous" is not a good argument at all."

TFES Wiki Occam's Razor page, by Tom: "What's the simplest explanation; that NASA has successfully designed and invented never before seen rocket technologies from scratch which can accelerate 100 tons of matter to an escape velocity of 7 miles per second"

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Offline xasop

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Re: The Queen
« Reply #15 on: September 08, 2022, 07:44:15 PM »
You didn't present arguments, you rambled a bit about basic monarchist propaganda. Your post contained no data, no references, nothing that even remotely constitutes an argument. It's at best just a bad opinion, at worst, a photocopy of someone else's.
This is a web forum, not an academic journal. If you wanted to further the discussion, you could have engaged in good faith instead of calling my arguments "propaganda" for no justifiable reason. All of your responses so far have been completely pointless, even if your criticisms of my post were valid.

Pointing out your continued inability to formulate legible points. I'm not arguing with you, as that's a waste of time. I'm stating that you are not worth arguing with and that isn't a waste of time.
Actually, you're just wasting everyone's time, mine included. If your next post doesn't contain something more substantial, I will just cease replying.
when you try to mock anyone while also running the flat earth society. Lol

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Online Rushy

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Re: The Queen
« Reply #16 on: September 08, 2022, 08:17:22 PM »
This is a web forum, not an academic journal. If you wanted to further the discussion, you could have engaged in good faith instead of calling my arguments "propaganda" for no justifiable reason. All of your responses so far have been completely pointless, even if your criticisms of my post were valid.

You: "noooooo people have to engage in good faith!"

Also you: "The narrative that monarchs are undemocratic comes, quite frankly, from people who do not understand politics."

You can't "engage in good faith" by immediately calling everyone who disagrees with you "people who do not understand politics." You've just presupposed everyone who disagrees with you is wrong before they've even stated an opposing position. It comes across as very obviously egotistical. There will be lots of people who won't reply to you because they don't wish to interact with you. I've replied to point out your horrible behavior.

Actually, you're just wasting everyone's time, mine included. If your next post doesn't contain something more substantial, I will just cease replying.

I hereby order you not to respond to this post.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2022, 08:19:18 PM by Rushy »

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Offline rooster

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Re: The Queen
« Reply #17 on: September 08, 2022, 08:31:11 PM »
So your response was... to not state any argument at all? What exactly are you trying to accomplish here?
This is Rushy's new tactic.

Anyway, it's pretty surreal that she's gone. The royal family as a whole is gross but this is obviously a big moment. I'm curious to see what it's going to be like with Charles.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2022, 09:10:21 PM by rooster »

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Offline crutonius

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Re: The Queen
« Reply #18 on: September 08, 2022, 08:36:04 PM »
At the same time, big picture, the UK, a powerful and modern nation with strong protections for individual liberty, has a fucking monarchy?
That's not a contradiction at all — constitutional monarchies tend to reinforce democracy because the monarch cannot be given any real power without seriously damaging the nation's legitimacy as a democracy on the world stage. Furthermore, constitutional monarchs are usually apolitical, whereas presidents are very often politicians even in presidential systems where they do not wield executive authority, meaning they may not be seen as representing the entire population.

Just look at France or the United States to see how easily a presidential democracy can be corrupted by centralising executive authority in a single office that is not accountable to any legislature. That could never happen in a constitutional monarchy without strong pushback from society, to put it mildly.

The narrative that monarchs are undemocratic comes, quite frankly, from people who do not understand politics.

I admit I do have my biases as an American.  However I'm not seeing how a monarchy factors into the UK's success as a democracy.  Their status as a democracy exists at the pleasure of the queen, now the king.  The legal constraints on the monarchy appear too weak to really stop them dissolving parliament and nullifying any rule of law at their whim. 

The narrative that monarchs are undemocratic comes, quite frankly, from people who do not understand politics.

Oh.  I was confused.  I wasn't aware that England voted to install Elizabeth as the queen.

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Offline J-Man

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Re: The Queen
« Reply #19 on: September 08, 2022, 08:39:45 PM »
I have several coins with her face on them. She'll live as long as I do.
What kind of person would devote endless hours posting scientific facts trying to correct the few retards who believe in the FE? I slay shitty little demons.