Sailing a Columbian ship to the edge.

Yaakov ben Avraham · « **on:** January 15, 2014, 03:27:36 AM »

Greeting. I am writing my dissertation on Christopher Columbus, & although it focusses on his religious beliefs, I need to know as much as possible about sailing theory in the XVI Century. Although most people believed the world to be round, Columbus himself eventually believed it was pear-shaped! But, lets assume the world were flat, & he had reached the edge. What would have happened @ that point? This is where I get confused. Any thoughts? I need AS MUCH DATA AS POSSIBLE. So don't hold back!

Alchemist21 · « **Reply #1 on:** January 15, 2014, 04:05:38 AM »

Depends on what model you use. He either hits Antarctica, freezes out in the dark waters somewhere, or hits the Firmament.

jroa · « **Reply #2 on:** January 15, 2014, 04:13:40 AM »

Antartica is the rim continent, known to the REers as the ice wall. It would have prevented him from reaching the edge.

Tintagel · « **Reply #3 on:** January 15, 2014, 12:44:35 PM »

The most common model has the continent of Antarctica wrapped around the edge like an ice wall. Of course, given the course that Columbus was on, he'd not have reached this ice wall, as he was traveling in a circle around the disc.

Some of us, myself included, support the infinite plane model, where there is no edge.

Yaakov ben Avraham · « **Reply #4 on:** January 15, 2014, 03:15:14 PM »

Tintagel, I have heard of the Infinite Plane concept, but what is it? Forgive me if that sounds like a stupid question, but do break it down for me.

Tintagel · « **Reply #5 on:** January 15, 2014, 03:50:51 PM »

Quote from: Yaakov ben Avraham on January 15, 2014, 03:15:14 PM

Tintagel, I have heard of the Infinite Plane concept, but what is it? Forgive me if that sounds like a stupid question, but do break it down for me.

Just as it sounds, the earth extends forever. Some still use the monopole disc model, but simply contend that beyond antarctica, the earth just keeps going.

My model is slightly more esoteric in that my infinite plane loops back onto itself, and therefore Antarctica is a distinct continent.

Thork · « **Reply #6 on:** January 15, 2014, 04:44:33 PM »

Would you not be better focussing your studies on prevailing winds, places like the Azores and filling the boat with limes?

I think things like that will score you more heavily than the prospect he may or may not have know earth's shape.

Alchemist21 · « **Reply #7 on:** January 15, 2014, 09:13:33 PM »

Tintagel, there would probably be an ice wall on an infinite plane earth. It doesn't have to be Antarctica, but the water would all freeze without any sunlight.

Yaakov ben Avraham · « **Reply #8 on:** January 15, 2014, 10:11:51 PM »

Alchemist, would it? It doesn't 5 miles deep, where no sunlight penetrates, & animals produce their own light sources to see.

Thork · « **Reply #9 on:** January 15, 2014, 10:33:41 PM »

Just as an aside a popular reference to Columbus thinking the earth was round and everyone else thinking it was flat comes from Gershwin & Gershwin's song titled "They all Laughed" famously danced to by Frank Sinatra in "Shall We Dance" amongst others.

The second verse goes as follows
They all laughed at Christopher Columbus
When he said the world was round
They all laughed when Edison recorded sound
They all laughed at Wilbur and his brother
When they said that man could fly

Now I can tell you people did not laugh when Edison recorded sound. In fact it was hailed as one of the greatest industrial achievements of all time when he did it.
I can also tell you that no one laughed at the Wright brothers.

Yaakov ben Avraham · « **Reply #10 on:** January 15, 2014, 10:47:07 PM »

& the idea that everyone except Columbus thought the world was flat was popularised by Washington Irving.

Thork · « **Reply #11 on:** January 15, 2014, 10:49:34 PM »

Which brings me to the question why are you writing about Columbus thinking the earth was flat?

Yaakov ben Avraham · « **Reply #12 on:** January 16, 2014, 03:28:31 AM »

No, Thork. Columbus did not think the Earth was flat, nor am I writing about that. In fact, toward the end of his life, he began to believe it was pear-shaped! I'm actually writing about Columbus' religious beliefs. But Ms. Garwood believes that Charles Johnson believed that Columbus was actually a Flatter. In fact, she quotes Johnson saying so. Right now, I'm @ the very beginning of my research, so I'm gathering ALL information about Columbus I can, no matter how extraneous it may seem. @ some point, any data may be useful to have. I am a Rounder, but understanding FET may even help in terms of the whole history behind Columbus' thought process (though he was a REer as well, until he got the pear idea).

Thork · « **Reply #13 on:** January 16, 2014, 04:51:50 PM »

I'm still not convinced that Johnson said that.

Yaakov ben Avraham · « **Reply #14 on:** January 16, 2014, 05:11:44 PM »

Well, I gave you all the data I had on her quote. You probably have access to the FE newsletter that she referenced in note 59 of her book of Ch. 9. I'm not sure what else you want me to suggest or do.

Thork · « **Reply #15 on:** January 16, 2014, 08:16:16 PM »

Why can't you just post the quotation? Why is that so hard rather than making everyone who reads the thread dig about looking for a book somewhere?

Yaakov ben Avraham · « **Reply #16 on:** January 16, 2014, 09:38:21 PM »

The problem w/ that is that the relevant quote in Garwood's book is quite lengthy, & spread out across several paragraphs. This makes quoting it hard to do, especially on my phone!

BillyBob · « **Reply #17 on:** January 17, 2014, 02:15:54 PM »

Columbus knew that the world was round. He did not try to sail off the edge, retards.

Yaakov ben Avraham · « **Reply #18 on:** January 17, 2014, 02:35:43 PM »

We know this, schmuck. Toward the end of his life, he actually thought it was pear-shaped. The question is theoretical.

BillyBob · « **Reply #19 on:** January 17, 2014, 02:40:08 PM »

Columbus brought a bunch of barbarians back to the civilized land. Schmuck.