The Islamic veil debate.
« on: October 07, 2022, 06:07:02 PM »
The death of Mahsa Amini in Iran and resulting demonstrations have people yet again debating what the Qur'an says about veiling. I had a closer look at two verses on the subject, and although a less ambiguous directive from Allah would have saved a lot of uncertainty, it looks to me as though the Qur'an does indeed encourage full-body covering, as opposed to merely 'modest' dress.

The word for word translation of verse 33:59 (The Quranic Arabic Corpus - Word by Word Grammar, Syntax and Morphology of the Holy Quran) says that believing woman should "draw over themselves their outer garments" so that they "should be known and not harmed".

The first underlined phrase seems to define an extra, outer layer of covering, and the second supports that interpretation by indicating that the degree of body coverage should be obvious enough to make Muslim women stand out from others.

Verse 24:31 is long-winded and harder to follow, but it also commands Muslim women to cover themselves to a greater degree than they do at home. They are told to, "draw their headcovers over their bosoms", and to not "display their adornment" except to family members and household staff. The inclusion of non-blood male relatives, such as fathers-in-law and nephews, in the list of those to whom a woman may "display her adornment" is crucial to defining the difference between acceptable dress in the home vs. when out. I think it's safe to assume that a Muslim women would already be modestly dressed in her father-in-law's presence, so to insist on even further coverage when outside the house is consistent with saying that she must bring her head covering down as far as her already covered bosoms, which, by definition, would also cover her face.

IMO, those verses are more suggestive of full-body veiling than not.
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Offline Rushy

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Re: The Islamic veil debate.
« Reply #1 on: October 07, 2022, 06:20:38 PM »
Imagine basing societal decisions on an ancient text written by a child raping warlord.

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Offline Алёна

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Re: The Islamic veil debate.
« Reply #2 on: October 07, 2022, 06:22:20 PM »
The great pedophile Mohammed (piss be upon him) says rape is ok.
Seriously. He married a 9 year old and legally raped her (it says that if a man wants to have sex his wife must obey his orders regardless of consent)
Professional procrastinator.

Re: The Islamic veil debate.
« Reply #3 on: October 07, 2022, 06:44:18 PM »
Imagine basing societal decisions on an ancient text written by a child raping warlord.

.... as is done is several Islamic theocracies.
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Offline Алёна

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Re: The Islamic veil debate.
« Reply #4 on: October 07, 2022, 06:56:45 PM »
(Quote from the other forum)
Well thats like saying the scammer mega church pastors speak for the rest of crhistianity

You aren't given the position of cleric in Islam if you don't speak for Islam

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1126556/Muslim-cleric-tells-Australians-Husbands-allowed-rape-beat-wives.html

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Samir Abu Hamza, who runs an Islamic centre in Melbourne, ridiculed Australian laws banning forced sex within marriage.

Hamza told a male audience in Sydney: 'Amazing, how can a person rape his wife?'

He added that wives must immediately respond to their husbands' sexual demands.


Or how about the position of 'Mufti'
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/cleric-says-uncovered-women-like-abandoned-meat/DGOFFH3CQ64S7DT7NXEU4QN6CA/

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SYDNEY - Women who do not cover up are similar to abandoned "meat" making them responsible for sexual attacks, a senior Islamic cleric has said.

The Mufti of Australia, Sheik Taj Aldin Alhilali, has outraged female Muslim leaders with comments he made during a Ramadan sermon to 500 worshippers in Sydney last month.

"If you take out uncovered meat and place it outside on the street, or in the garden or in the park, or in the backyard without a cover, and the cats come and eat it ... whose fault is it, the cats or the uncovered meat?" the sheik asked.

"The uncovered meat is the problem. If she was in her room, in her home, in her hajib [Islamic headdress], no problem would have occurred."

He also alluded to the Sydney rapes in 2000 where four women were separately gang-raped by a group of young Muslim men, including Bilal Skaf, who originally received a 55-year sentence, later reduced.

He said there were women who "sway suggestively" and wore make-up and inappropriate clothes, "and then you get a judge without mercy and gives you 65 years".

The sheik went on to say women were "weapons" used by "Satan" to control men and when it comes to adultery the responsibility falls on the woman 90 per cent of the time.


The fuckwit had to walk back the comments after the entire country was outraged and his fellow Muslim leaders embarrassed. It doesn't change how his thoughts stem from Islamic values which are entirely incompatible with modern day Western values

Professional procrastinator.

Re: The Islamic veil debate.
« Reply #5 on: October 07, 2022, 07:33:59 PM »

Hamza told a male audience in Sydney: 'Amazing, how can a person rape his wife?'

He added that wives must immediately respond to their husbands' sexual demands.


That comes from verse 2:223, "Yusuf Ali: Your wives are as a tilth unto you; so approach your tilth when or how ye will".

Consent not required per Allah.
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Offline Алёна

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Re: The Islamic veil debate.
« Reply #6 on: October 07, 2022, 07:35:34 PM »

Hamza told a male audience in Sydney: 'Amazing, how can a person rape his wife?'

He added that wives must immediately respond to their husbands' sexual demands.


That comes from verse 2:223, "Yusuf Ali: Your wives are as a tilth unto you; so approach your tilth when or how ye will".

Consent not required per Allah.

So men can legally rape women?
Fuck Islam, fuck religions, and fuck you.
Professional procrastinator.

Re: The Islamic veil debate.
« Reply #7 on: October 07, 2022, 07:39:43 PM »

Hamza told a male audience in Sydney: 'Amazing, how can a person rape his wife?'

He added that wives must immediately respond to their husbands' sexual demands.


That comes from verse 2:223, "Yusuf Ali: Your wives are as a tilth unto you; so approach your tilth when or how ye will".

Consent not required per Allah.

So men can legally rape women?
Fuck Islam, fuck religions, and fuck you.

I'm with you on 2 out of 3, but what's your problem with me? Do you think I'm endorsing marital rape?
Devout and strictly adherent Atheist.

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Offline Алёна

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Re: The Islamic veil debate.
« Reply #8 on: October 07, 2022, 07:41:49 PM »

Hamza told a male audience in Sydney: 'Amazing, how can a person rape his wife?'

He added that wives must immediately respond to their husbands' sexual demands.


That comes from verse 2:223, "Yusuf Ali: Your wives are as a tilth unto you; so approach your tilth when or how ye will".

Consent not required per Allah.

So men can legally rape women?
Fuck Islam, fuck religions, and fuck you.

I'm with you on 2 out of 3, but what's your problem with me? Do you think I'm endorsing marital rape?

For a sec I thought you were spreading terrorism on this forum like a guy on the other forum.
Sorry about that.
STOP PROMOTING TERRORISM.
Professional procrastinator.

Re: The Islamic veil debate.
« Reply #9 on: October 07, 2022, 07:43:09 PM »

Hamza told a male audience in Sydney: 'Amazing, how can a person rape his wife?'

He added that wives must immediately respond to their husbands' sexual demands.


That comes from verse 2:223, "Yusuf Ali: Your wives are as a tilth unto you; so approach your tilth when or how ye will".

Consent not required per Allah.

So men can legally rape women?
Fuck Islam, fuck religions, and fuck you.

I'm with you on 2 out of 3, but what's your problem with me? Do you think I'm endorsing marital rape?

For a sec I thought you were spreading terrorism on this forum like a guy on the other forum.
Sorry about that.
STOP PROMOTING TERRORISM.

I'm not promoting it. I'm showing where Muslims get this crap from so you'll be informed.
Devout and strictly adherent Atheist.

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Offline Алёна

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Re: The Islamic veil debate.
« Reply #10 on: October 07, 2022, 07:44:31 PM »

Hamza told a male audience in Sydney: 'Amazing, how can a person rape his wife?'

He added that wives must immediately respond to their husbands' sexual demands.


That comes from verse 2:223, "Yusuf Ali: Your wives are as a tilth unto you; so approach your tilth when or how ye will".

Consent not required per Allah.

So men can legally rape women?
Fuck Islam, fuck religions, and fuck you.

I'm with you on 2 out of 3, but what's your problem with me? Do you think I'm endorsing marital rape?

For a sec I thought you were spreading terrorism on this forum like a guy on the other forum.
Sorry about that.
STOP PROMOTING TERRORISM.

I'm not promoting it. I'm showing where Muslims get this crap from so you'll be informed.

I'm saying that to people who are promoting it.
I gotta say that they saw what Mohammad (piss be upon him) was doing with little girls and thought "hey, we should legalize child rape and pedophilia".

Professional procrastinator.

Re: The Islamic veil debate.
« Reply #11 on: October 07, 2022, 07:50:37 PM »

Hamza told a male audience in Sydney: 'Amazing, how can a person rape his wife?'

He added that wives must immediately respond to their husbands' sexual demands.


That comes from verse 2:223, "Yusuf Ali: Your wives are as a tilth unto you; so approach your tilth when or how ye will".

Consent not required per Allah.

So men can legally rape women?
Fuck Islam, fuck religions, and fuck you.

I'm with you on 2 out of 3, but what's your problem with me? Do you think I'm endorsing marital rape?

For a sec I thought you were spreading terrorism on this forum like a guy on the other forum.
Sorry about that.
STOP PROMOTING TERRORISM.

I'm not promoting it. I'm showing where Muslims get this crap from so you'll be informed.

I'm saying that to people who are promoting it.

Okay. All good.

Quote
I gotta say that they saw what Mohammad (piss be upon him) was doing with little girls and thought "hey, we should legalize child rape and pedophilia".

The sad fact is that if Mohamed did it, then it's already defacto legalized.
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Offline Алёна

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Re: The Islamic veil debate.
« Reply #12 on: October 07, 2022, 07:53:09 PM »
"Mohammad is the messenger of God"
And he's telling you to shut the fuck up.
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Offline J-Man

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Re: The Islamic veil debate.
« Reply #13 on: October 08, 2022, 07:05:07 PM »
I like Jalapeno Goat Cheese :)
What kind of person would devote endless hours posting scientific facts trying to correct the few retards who believe in the FE? I slay shitty little demons.