21

Technology & Information / Re: Adding an email account to messaging apps

« on: July 29, 2014, 09:53:49 PM »

The messaging platform that everyone should be using is hangouts.

iMessage is cool, as long as you are only interested in messaging iPhone users.

BBM Messenger is cool, but nobody uses it and god it's ugly.

Hangouts is on iPhone and Android and you can use it from any computer. It also has hangout video chats which allows up to 10 people to all be videochatting at the same time. The videochat functionality uses Web RTC too which means that nobody has to install any software for it to work.

22

Flat Earth Theory / Re: How does Round Earth Theory explain the Selenelion?

« on: July 21, 2014, 12:15:53 AM »

Tom did say earlier in the thread that we know where the sun is because it is an eclipse, but we aren't really concerned with actual positions of the sun and moon, we are concerned with apparent positions.

Sorry, no. As I recall, you must be concerned with both accurate real and accurate apparent. Note when Tom ran away.

Agreed.

23

Technology & Information / Re: Facebook fraud

« on: July 20, 2014, 08:12:44 PM »

PP made this point from the start but it seems you may have glossed over it, if old site and new site both suffer from click farms, let's go ridiculous and say 50%, is 50% of 1k suddenly more than 50% of 4k?  When you factor in click farms, factor them in for both and this site's FB page is still more popular than the old site's FB page.

I did address this when I said that newer pages are more susceptible to farming.

24

Technology & Information / Re: Facebook fraud

« on: July 20, 2014, 06:15:07 PM »

I find it to be a strange thread. I feel like I've lost the debate even though it's been demonstrated that I am right about the OP.

25

Technology & Information / Re: Facebook fraud

« on: July 20, 2014, 05:52:40 PM »

You must engage.

And we have been. Again, you're probably not seeing the full picture, but you're eager to assume.

Eager to assume what? My assumption is that you are listed lower than the old site. I'm trying to help but it's coming off as criticism so everyone is being defensive. Currently, I'm trying to figure out how to get your G+ page on to the right column of a Google search result. There are ton of SEO experts available on G+ that know a lot about this stuff.

26

Technology & Information / Re: Facebook fraud

« on: July 20, 2014, 05:43:10 PM »

Look, the typical scenario works like this:

I just heard that there are people who believe the world is flat. I'm going to go Google that.

This is how people learn about things. Sure, people do use the facebook search box for a group but that doesn't happen unless they have already established an interest in that topic. They most likely already know about the society in that case. SEO can lead you to the forums based on your interest of flat earth in general.

Incorrect.  This is how people learn about things they already know about.  One can't google "flat earth society" if they've never heard of it.

what makes you think they need to google "flat earth society"?

I didn't say that.

If you turn on incognito mode and search for "is the earth flat" then the old society comes up as the 5th result while the new one appears half way down the second page. This is a pretty big deal for this site. I've offered a way to fix that and you're here trying to argue that facebook likes are valuable to someone other than click farms.

No.  You argued that the 4k likes on our Facebook page didn't mean anything about our activity or Facebook exposure.  Fixing the search engine stuff is a completely different matter irrelevant to all of Facebook.  Simply allowing google spider bots on our forum, putting in key words on each page's header, and altering our domain name to have flatearth in it would fix our ranking.

I still think Facebook likes are pointless. Search got wrapped into it because you tried to make the case that Facebook likes had an effect on SEO. They might on bing, but not on Google and that is what people use.

27

Technology & Information / Re: Facebook fraud

« on: July 20, 2014, 05:41:03 PM »

both forums are ignoring G+.

Incorrect.

Having a profile won't do anything. You must engage.

28

Technology & Information / Re: Facebook fraud

« on: July 20, 2014, 05:27:02 PM »

Look, the typical scenario works like this:

I just heard that there are people who believe the world is flat. I'm going to go Google that.

This is how people learn about things. Sure, people do use the facebook search box for a group but that doesn't happen unless they have already established an interest in that topic. They most likely already know about the society in that case. SEO can lead you to the forums based on your interest of flat earth in general.

Incorrect.  This is how people learn about things they already know about.  One can't google "flat earth society" if they've never heard of it.

what makes you think they need to google "flat earth society"?

I didn't say that.

If you turn on incognito mode and search for "is the earth flat" then the old society comes up as the 5th result while the new one appears half way down the second page. This is a pretty big deal for this site. I've offered a way to fix that and you're here trying to argue that facebook likes are valuable to someone other than click farms.

29

Technology & Information / Re: Facebook fraud

« on: July 20, 2014, 05:20:18 PM »

Look, the typical scenario works like this:

I just heard that there are people who believe the world is flat. I'm going to go Google that.

This is how people learn about things. Sure, people do use the facebook search box for a group but that doesn't happen unless they have already established an interest in that topic. They most likely already know about the society in that case. SEO can lead you to the forums based on your interest of flat earth in general.

30

Technology & Information / Re: Facebook fraud

« on: July 20, 2014, 05:15:34 PM »

Dave is right. If likes are worthless then no one would buy them and click farms would stop making money.

Again, we are talking about SEO, not its value to click farms.

So no one searches for groups on Facebook?

The facebook search engine. Brilliant.

31

Technology & Information / Re: Facebook fraud

« on: July 20, 2014, 04:18:58 PM »

http://searchenginewatch.com/article/2319951/Facebook-Likes-Shares-Dont-Impact-Google-Search-Rankings-Study

But +1's do. This is where this forum could get the upper hand on SEO over the old site. Since both forums are ignoring G+.

32

Technology & Information / Re: Facebook fraud

« on: July 20, 2014, 04:15:26 PM »

Dave is right. If likes are worthless then no one would buy them and click farms would stop making money.

Again, we are talking about SEO, not its value to click farms.

33

Technology & Information / Re: Facebook fraud

« on: July 20, 2014, 04:14:10 PM »

It's absurd how difficult simple concepts are on the FES. The like are mistakenly worth something to the buyer but they are actually worthless and the only benfit-or from click farms is the click farm that makes money off the likes. Because the like are not genuine, they are not real impressions and they don't turn into anything beneficial for the page owner. We are not talking about economics here. In that regard you would be correct, but this is about SEO.

I understand what you're saying perfectly.  I was merely refuting your claim that the likes were worthless. 

In fact, as PP alluded to, a like farm could randomly like your page multiple times.  This in turn makes you seemingly more popular to search engines than pages with fewer likes.  This, in turn, means that legitimate people will more likely visit your page and hopefully like it.  As the more people like it, the higher it goes in the search results and the more likely other people will see it and like it. 
Once the likes have reached a point where it's statistically unlikely to be mostly click farm likes, the page will thrive on it's own and any click farm likes become statistically irrelevant.

This would be true if Facebook likes had any impact on the only search engine that matters.

34

Technology & Information / Re: Facebook fraud

« on: July 20, 2014, 04:04:51 PM »

Its not a shitty argument. Its a worthwhile consideration that you are actually a victim of. Not all the likes are the result of it but its apparent that a large portion are.

Why?

I've read though this thread and the only evidence I can see is the country of origin and quantity.  Yet the motivation isn't there so why would people from Nigeria search for the flat earth society for the sole reason of artificially inflating our likes?

Because click farms like things at random even when they aren't paid for in an attempt to seem more authentic. This way their likes are not all for the same things.

Then to know that the likes aren't genuine you'd have to go through the profiles of everyone and determine if they are randomly liking shit or not.  Anything less is just a guess based on stereotyping of a nation.

Maybe. The point here is that likes are meaningless.

If likes were meaningless, why would like farms exist?

Because they were meaningful until like farms existed and most of all because there is monetary incentive for them to exist since people are under the impression that they matter even when they don't. There is no SEO for Facebook likes. The thing about Facebook is that likes do not typically turn into opportunities for a sale either, which makes them even more meaningless. Facebook is used for keeping in touch with friends and family and when people are doing that, ads are considered obtrusive. This is why Facebook has always had a difficult time monetizing their social network because it turns out that a social network is a terrible place to attempt a sale. When determining the best time to offer an ad one should consider intent. That's why search engines are a good place to offer them... because when people are INTENDING to make a purchase they are likely to search for items or items related to their search. Nobody thinks, "hey, I want to buy a computer, maybe Facebook is the place to look for one."

I think you just disproved your own point.  Remember, an item is worth what's someone will pay for it.

No. I'm not talking about what the item is worth to the person paying for it. I'm talking about the ends (which are worthless) and then means (which are paid for).

If likes were worthless then no one would buy them.
Clearly they are worth something.  And if the people running the page think they mean they're a good group then there must be people who are not running the page who agree.

It's absurd how difficult simple concepts are on the FES. The like are mistakenly worth something to the buyer but they are actually worthless and the only benfit-or from click farms is the click farm that makes money off the likes. Because the like are not genuine, they are not real impressions and they don't turn into anything beneficial for the page owner. We are not talking about economics here. In that regard you would be correct, but this is about SEO.

35

Technology & Information / Re: Facebook fraud

« on: July 20, 2014, 03:11:50 PM »

Its not a shitty argument. Its a worthwhile consideration that you are actually a victim of. Not all the likes are the result of it but its apparent that a large portion are.

Why?

I've read though this thread and the only evidence I can see is the country of origin and quantity.  Yet the motivation isn't there so why would people from Nigeria search for the flat earth society for the sole reason of artificially inflating our likes?

Because click farms like things at random even when they aren't paid for in an attempt to seem more authentic. This way their likes are not all for the same things.

Then to know that the likes aren't genuine you'd have to go through the profiles of everyone and determine if they are randomly liking shit or not.  Anything less is just a guess based on stereotyping of a nation.

Maybe. The point here is that likes are meaningless.

If likes were meaningless, why would like farms exist?

Because they were meaningful until like farms existed and most of all because there is monetary incentive for them to exist since people are under the impression that they matter even when they don't. There is no SEO for Facebook likes. The thing about Facebook is that likes do not typically turn into opportunities for a sale either, which makes them even more meaningless. Facebook is used for keeping in touch with friends and family and when people are doing that, ads are considered obtrusive. This is why Facebook has always had a difficult time monetizing their social network because it turns out that a social network is a terrible place to attempt a sale. When determining the best time to offer an ad one should consider intent. That's why search engines are a good place to offer them... because when people are INTENDING to make a purchase they are likely to search for items or items related to their search. Nobody thinks, "hey, I want to buy a computer, maybe Facebook is the place to look for one."

I think you just disproved your own point.  Remember, an item is worth what's someone will pay for it.

No. I'm not talking about what the item is worth to the person paying for it. I'm talking about the ends (which are worthless) and then means (which are paid for).

36

Technology & Information / Re: Facebook fraud

« on: July 20, 2014, 01:09:59 PM »

By the way pizaa, there are ways to climb past the old site in search results, at least on Google (and really, that's all that matters).

http://www.socialmediaexaminer.com/use-google-increase-search-rankings/

37

Technology & Information / Re: Facebook fraud

« on: July 20, 2014, 01:03:02 PM »

Its not a shitty argument. Its a worthwhile consideration that you are actually a victim of. Not all the likes are the result of it but its apparent that a large portion are.

Why?

I've read though this thread and the only evidence I can see is the country of origin and quantity.  Yet the motivation isn't there so why would people from Nigeria search for the flat earth society for the sole reason of artificially inflating our likes?

Because click farms like things at random even when they aren't paid for in an attempt to seem more authentic. This way their likes are not all for the same things.

Then to know that the likes aren't genuine you'd have to go through the profiles of everyone and determine if they are randomly liking shit or not.  Anything less is just a guess based on stereotyping of a nation.

Maybe. The point here is that likes are meaningless.

If likes were meaningless, why would like farms exist?

Because they were meaningful until like farms existed and most of all because there is monetary incentive for them to exist since people are under the impression that they matter even when they don't. There is no SEO for Facebook likes. The thing about Facebook is that likes do not typically turn into opportunities for a sale either, which makes them even more meaningless. Facebook is used for keeping in touch with friends and family and when people are doing that, ads are considered obtrusive. This is why Facebook has always had a difficult time monetizing their social network because it turns out that a social network is a terrible place to attempt a sale. When determining the best time to offer an ad one should consider intent. That's why search engines are a good place to offer them... because when people are INTENDING to make a purchase they are likely to search for items or items related to their search. Nobody thinks, "hey, I want to buy a computer, maybe Facebook is the place to look for one."

38

Technology & Information / Re: Facebook fraud

« on: July 20, 2014, 12:12:23 PM »

Its not a shitty argument. Its a worthwhile consideration that you are actually a victim of. Not all the likes are the result of it but its apparent that a large portion are.

Why?

I've read though this thread and the only evidence I can see is the country of origin and quantity.  Yet the motivation isn't there so why would people from Nigeria search for the flat earth society for the sole reason of artificially inflating our likes?

Because click farms like things at random even when they aren't paid for in an attempt to seem more authentic. This way their likes are not all for the same things.

Then to know that the likes aren't genuine you'd have to go through the profiles of everyone and determine if they are randomly liking shit or not.  Anything less is just a guess based on stereotyping of a nation.

Maybe. The point here is that likes are meaningless.

39

Technology & Information / Re: Facebook fraud

« on: July 20, 2014, 11:48:25 AM »

Its not a shitty argument. Its a worthwhile consideration that you are actually a victim of. Not all the likes are the result of it but its apparent that a large portion are.

Why?

I've read though this thread and the only evidence I can see is the country of origin and quantity.  Yet the motivation isn't there so why would people from Nigeria search for the flat earth society for the sole reason of artificially inflating our likes?

Because click farms like things at random even when they aren't paid for in an attempt to seem more authentic. This way their likes are not all for the same things.

40

Technology & Information / Re: Facebook fraud

« on: July 20, 2014, 04:23:20 AM »

I'm just typing out quick responses cause I don't have time for your bullshit

Why even post at all?

Cause it takes 5 seconds. See.