41

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Angular Diameter change of Venus and Mars

« on: March 28, 2017, 04:37:34 PM »

Of course there aren't. The minute prediction of the coming solar eclipse and detailed information about where it can be observed is a proof of your [Citation needed] claim.

Just go to NASA's eclipse website  -> Resources -> Eclipses and the Soros where we read:

"The periodicity and recurrence of eclipses is governed by the Saros cycle, a period of approximately 6,585.3 days (18 years 11 days 8 hours). It was known to the Chaldeans as a period when lunar eclipses seem to repeat themselves, but the cycle is applicable to solar eclipses as well."

That is the only method given for finding the eclipse on that entire website. The modern astronomers at NASA are not using orbital models. They are using a method created thousands of years ago by the Ancient Babylonians, a society of people who believed that the earth was flat.

I see.

42

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Angular Diameter change of Venus and Mars

« on: March 28, 2017, 04:28:53 PM »

You might want to run that by with some of your developer friends, TextWarrior for instance.

You don't think it's possible to make a javascript that can repeat a pattern?

Other than that, please keep up the defense. This thread is becoming my favorite thread as well. You rarely get to see someone make such a fool of himself, repeatedly.

What defense? The RE side consists solely of claiming that there are accurate orbital models when there are not.

Of course there aren't. The minute prediction of the coming solar eclipse and detailed information about where it can be observed is a proof of your [Citation needed] claim.

43

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Angular Diameter change of Venus and Mars

« on: March 28, 2017, 03:59:45 PM »

Tom,  making observations and predictions based on observational periods is not a model.  Tycho Brahe,  who was brilliant at observation,   never did generate a model that accurately fit with his own observations.  That didn't happen until Kepler who was Brahe's student.

No. There has never been an orbital model which could predict things with accuracy. 

Secondly, the naked eye is unable to resolve angular diameter smaller than one arc minute.  Galileo was first to notice the changing angular diameter of Mars via a telescope.  That didn't happen until  the early 1600s.  Your statement that we have been able to to predict the change in angular diameter of Mars for 1000's of years is absolutely false.

I didn't make the statement that we have been able to predict the change in angular diameter of mars for thousands of years. Please read more carefully next time.

You seem to be struggling with the concept of a model.  Observations are not models.  Periodic observations over hundreds of years are not models.  Models are explanations for the historical observations.  A model is tested for its accuracy by using it to make predictions.  If the predictions do not line up with the periodic observations then it needs to be adjusted.  The models of Aristotle, Ptolemy, Copernicus, and Brahe all had errors.  Some large and some small.  It wasn't until Kepler proposed elliptical orbits that the modeling began to accurately fit with the periodic observations.

Kepler never created an orbital model which could predict the location of things in the sky. I don't know what you are talking about, but it is nonsense. The only way astronomers predict occurrences in the sky is with the pattern finding method.

Lastly, are you able to look at the Java Script for the predictions for the upcoming eclipse?  If you are,  you will see that it's not pulling from a historical record.

It is possible to make a Javascript to predict the date of a next celestial event based on the pattern of occurrence. This is a pattern-based model, and not a geometric or orbital based model. Orbital based models would be more of a proof of mechanism for the matter of RE vs FE, but orbital models have never been accurate enough to match prediction to observation.

You might want to run that by with some of your developer friends, TextWarrior for instance.

Other than that, please keep up the defense. This thread is becoming my favorite thread as well. You rarely get to see someone make such a fool of himself, repeatedly.

44

Flat Earth Community / Re: Shaquille O'Neal believes that the earth is flat

« on: March 27, 2017, 11:09:26 PM »

Tom, I'm going to do you a favor and link you three videos an acquaintance of mine did. There's no magical flat earth explanations for what you see in these videos.

Filming Turning Torsoe in Malmö from different distances.


Flat surface meets observing from ground level


Proof that the horizon is below eye level


Have fun!

45

Flat Earth Community / Re: Shaquille O'Neal believes that the earth is flat

« on: March 27, 2017, 04:04:12 PM »

To you perhaps, being biased. To me, the most simple explanation is the one coming from the source it self. That way, you don't have to hypothesize. If anything, it has strengthened his brand in my opinion. "Shaq picking on people with no sense on reality" - There's a fair amount of humor to that

The source made two contradictory statements. One  of them was under durress. I find it hard to believe why anyone would think that a duressed statement is more credible over one which was not.

"One of them was made under duress. I have to believe that, otherwise it would appear we made a mistake" you mean.

I believe he gives less shits about public opinion on this matter than you obviously do.

But you know what Tom, I'm not here to change your view on the world. In that regard, you're way out of reach. We both are. I'm here to talk about the science of flat earth. To get explanations and facts that globe earth doesn't explain. Testable, verifiable theories and facts. I've seen exactly zero of those. For a community having such a hard time explaining even the most simple observations in a satisfactory manner that globe earth doesn't explain, one would think you have bigger problems than debating whether or not a basketball star played a trick on the public.

I guess the tiny, tiny battles are worth debating for you because you make so little impact. Social Media statistics are all cool and dandy if you're a TextWarrior, but you guys are making no impact whatsoever, simply because your explanations reek of unicorns.

Shaq obviously knew that.

46

Flat Earth Community / Re: Shaquille O'Neal believes that the earth is flat

« on: March 27, 2017, 03:53:44 PM »

It's not really that complicated. Shaq made two statements. Only one of them was under duress.

Why should we think the statement made under duress is better than the one which was not?

You obviously wouldn't since the "statement" made under "duress" doesn't support your cause. That's basically why you're OK about making a fool of yourself trying to hypothesize about his "sudden change of heart" while the rest of us enjoy what he did for what it is. You know, the simple explanation, something you'd normally hold very dear.

The simplest explanation is that the statement which was not made under duress is the most credible.

To you perhaps, being biased. To me, the most simple explanation is the one coming from the source it self. That way, you don't have to hypothesize. If anything, it has strengthened his brand in my opinion. "Shaq picking on people with no sense of reality" - There's a fair amount of humor to that

47

Flat Earth Community / Re: Shaquille O'Neal believes that the earth is flat

« on: March 27, 2017, 03:48:39 PM »

It's not really that complicated. Shaq made two statements. Only one of them was under duress.

Why should we think the statement made under duress is better than the one which was not?

You obviously wouldn't since the "statement" made under "duress" doesn't support your cause. That's basically why you're OK about making a fool of yourself trying to hypothesize about his "sudden change of heart" while the rest of us enjoy what he did for what it is. You know, the simple explanation, something you'd normally hold very dear.

48

Flat Earth Community / Re: Shaquille O'Neal believes that the earth is flat

« on: March 27, 2017, 02:52:27 PM »

I'm going to let you stay in the belief that you've won this argument, not pointing out that the majority is laughing at you trying to defend your way out the fact that you got played. Everybody wins!

The sun is out, I'm in a good mood, and your online characters are making this day even better. I'm a nice guy like that.

Have a good one!

49

Flat Earth Community / Re: Shaquille O'Neal believes that the earth is flat

« on: March 27, 2017, 07:18:15 AM »

We all know that there's a horde of people who's job is to literally know Shaq's character that were just waiting for a claim like this from him.

Analysists have been eagerly waiting for a chance to analyze every single public move Shaq would make on supporting the flat earth theory.

You should all be writing movie scripts. You're very creative! That explanation is even more of a fairy tale than the flat earth theory is.

50

Flat Earth Community / Re: Shaquille O'Neal believes that the earth is flat

« on: March 25, 2017, 06:26:24 AM »

It's pretty obvious that this isn't Shaq's type of humor.

Are you sure about that, Tom?  After all, his Ed. D. dissertation was on humor, wasn't it?

Shaq like jokes, but all of his jokes tend to cause people to laugh at the end, not leave people thinking that he is a serial killer. The type of humor here is uncharacteristic of everything he has ever done.

Hahaha!

51

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Angular Diameter change of Venus and Mars

« on: March 24, 2017, 07:27:22 PM »

If you don't have anything relevant to the topic of the earth's shape, then I don't see the purpose of continuing. It is a waste of time to try and figure out the why this and why that for every countless thing that happens in the universe.

But the topic is about the change in angular size of Venus and Mars, can we agree on this much?

52

Flat Earth Community / Re: Shaquille O'Neal believes that the earth is flat

« on: March 24, 2017, 07:12:30 PM »

It's pretty obvious that this isn't Shaq's type of humor. If this is Shaq's character then show us where he has done anything similar. You can't because he hasn't.

Haha, how is that a proof of anything exactly!?

It is a proof that you are a moron for repeating that we simply don't understand Shaq's character.

I didn't repeat that at all, "moron", I'm simply implying you might have misjudged his character, with a very high probability. You're talking about a human being here, not an Oracle. I can only deduct from the tone in your reply that you feel really deceived by Shaq.

From one serious human being to another, I really think you need help. I mean this in the least arrogant and hostile manner, Tom.

53

Flat Earth Community / Re: Shaquille O'Neal believes that the earth is flat

« on: March 24, 2017, 06:50:11 PM »

It's pretty obvious that this isn't Shaq's type of humor. If this is Shaq's character then show us where he has done anything similar. You can't because he hasn't.

Haha, how is that a proof of anything exactly!? So now prominent flat earthers have no spine? Give me a break, nobody can be this dense. You dispute just about every single argument, proven theory and observable fact about the globe earth, yet you naively assume that Shaq is converted but took back his statements about the shape of the earth because of public pressure.

Are you going to tell me that you didn't for a second think you just got trolled by Shaq?

54

Flat Earth Community / Re: Shaquille O'Neal believes that the earth is flat

« on: March 24, 2017, 05:28:05 PM »

Or, maybe you guys just didn't know the character of Shaq really well and jumped the gun on bragging about his support.

I'm fairly familiar with Shaq and this was quite obviously out of character for him. The media (who follow him quite closely) have pointed out this much, too. But hey, something something if it makes your life easier, right?

I'm telling you though, you got played. Period.

Dude, saying "period!!!!" as the be-all-end-all of a conversation is so outdated. You should be saying "*drops mic*" these days. It will make you seem more right, especially if you're just presenting baseless claims.

Haha, what a pointless reply, and you know it.

It's OK. For the FES, his "brand" being "hurt" is the natural explanation for this turnaround. For the rest of us, it's another nail in the coffin.

I have to say, I'm surprised you made the announcement in the first place. First of all, the quotes by Shaq is filled with errors in general. Secondly, it's Shaq. Smells fishy to me all in all.

55

Flat Earth Community / Re: Shaquille O'Neal believes that the earth is flat

« on: March 24, 2017, 03:39:58 PM »

How is that a more relevant point when it comes to Shaq, but not the other celebrities supposedly backing FES?

You're just looking for excuses, Tom. You guys got played and you jumped in feet first.

It was to be expected that something was going to break with that kind of overwhelming ridicule, either Shaq's career, or some kind of backtrack on his position. Shaq chose to try and save his career.

Yes, keep telling yourself that. Or, maybe you guys just didn't know the character of Shaq really well and jumped the gun on bragging about his support.

If it makes your life easier that he succumbed to the pressure, fine. Have it your way. I'm telling you though, you got played. Period.

Either way, it makes you look even more stupid. You defending this makes it even worse on you as an individual. For each reply of yours in this thread, you're making a lot of people's Friday very, very enjoyable, including mine. Gotta say.

56

Flat Earth Community / Re: Shaquille O'Neal believes that the earth is flat

« on: March 24, 2017, 03:31:52 PM »

Really Tom? Really?

I mean, I know it hurts that all of you used Shaq's statement and tried to fuel your position in the public with being" backed by a celebrity". Now this is a conspiracy too, and Shaq "obviously" caved in to pressure.

I guess the joke is on you.

The entire world was mocking him. He was going to either go with it, or backtrack and try to save face. When you question the status quo you are mocked and ridiculed.

How is that a more relevant point when it comes to Shaq, but not the other celebrities supposedly backing FES?

You're just looking for excuses, Tom. You guys got played and you jumped in feet first.

57

Flat Earth Community / Re: Shaquille O'Neal believes that the earth is flat

« on: March 24, 2017, 08:25:33 AM »

Shaq obviously caved in to pressure since the story went world wide and was hurting his brand and the NBA. If this is his joking style show us where he has ever made a similar "joke".

Really Tom? Really?

I mean, I know it hurts that all of you used Shaq's statement and tried to fuel your position in the public with being" backed by a celebrity". Now this is a conspiracy too, and Shaq "obviously" caved in to pressure.

I guess the joke is on you.

58

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Angular Diameter change of Venus and Mars

« on: March 24, 2017, 07:22:13 AM »

So, you don't know why it happens?

Why should it matter any more than should the temperature of Uranus matter?

This is not really a topic of discussion. If you can show that this is some kind of round earth proof, we would look into it. When we are asked what puts the sun into motion, for example, the standard reply is that the mechanism is presently unknown to us, but the motion is apparent. We base knowledge on empiricism here, not wild theories.

Ok, so Tom, let's change the narrative a bit.

Say a person out of genuine curiosity asks you a question about an observation, for instance an observed change of angular size of a celestial object, right? Can you just answer what causes this instead of saying "that's not important". Obviously, it's important to this person and he or she is asking what he believes to be an authority on the subject, namely the people who are supposed to be able to answer this.

Forget about hostility, this is a genuine question. I mean, if you don't know simply just say "I/we don't know". There's nothing wrong with that. But you can't say "I fail to see why this is important". An observation has been made and someone is asking for an explanation from the very people who are supposed to be able to answer.

Let's even assume flatout were undecided on the shape of the earth or the model that describes our solar system. He now knows how one model explains that particular phenomenon, he's seeking an explanation in regards to another model.

I'd like to know this too to be honest.

59

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Traveling from Australia to South America Across "Antarctica"

« on: March 11, 2017, 09:39:21 PM »

First I need to know: How do you know the ice wall exists, despite the fact you've never traveled that part of the earth?

Does any one of any merit have anything to say? Anyone?...

60

Flat Earth Community / Re: Random Questions

« on: March 08, 2017, 08:00:44 AM »

Lol. TTIOH, you are rapidly becoming my favorite flat earther. This is gold.

He's not a flat earther, he's undecided. It's not easy being a creationist in that regard.

Is he, though?  Is he undecided?  That's easy to SAY, but on matters relevant to the shape of the earth I don't believe I have ever seen him question or challenge a FE post, nor have I seen him agree with an RE post.  If I'm wrong about that, I would love to be reminded of when either of those happened.

I concur, I'm merely loosely citing his own words.