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Messages - AllAroundTheWorld

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Remind you of anyone?


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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Trump
« on: September 24, 2021, 04:18:59 PM »
Or maybe the reporters just lied and published that Joe Biden won the count
lol. OK, who had
"ThE rEpOrTeRs WeRe LyInG"
in the Tom sweepstake?
This is quite a fun game  ;D

3
Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Trump
« on: September 24, 2021, 04:00:06 PM »
Any day now.  Evidence of massive voter fraud.  Any day.  The truth will come out. 

#STOPTHESTEAL

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/arizona-audit-results-reveal-donald-trump-lost-to-joe-biden-by-even-bigger-margin/ar-AAOLCft?li=BBnb7Kz

Bahahaha. I can’t wait to see the cope.
I always enjoy trying to guess how Tom will respond to stuff like this.
My money's on claiming the auditors are somehow corrupt or something. Or they were only given access to the votes that "they" wanted the auditors to see (whoever "they" are).

4
Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« on: September 24, 2021, 02:23:09 PM »
The unvaccinated lose a significant health risk to the unvaccinated
I guess you meant "pose" but do they, though? Is it significant? We are talking about a virus with a CFR of 1% and that risk is skewed heavily towards older people and is also the CFR of an unvaccinated population. I agree people not taking the vaccination are stubborn idiots, but I don't believe they are a significant risk to anyone.

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Again, it’s worth pointing out that numerous vaccines are required to participate in society to different degrees
Is that true? I don't know what it's like in the States. I was vaccinated against all kinds of things when I was a kid.
I can't remember ever being asked about it - I mean, maybe in the context of a medical appointment but to go to the shops or to the theatre or to any venue? Since when has living a day to day life required any vaccination or being asked to prove vaccination status.

5
Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« on: September 24, 2021, 11:04:46 AM »
YOU might have a reasonable point. Tom does not. Your desire to try and be inclusive to his vapid arguemwnts does no favors. If you want to make a point about “Tier 2” people then do so.
Well of course he doesn't. He's a troll who people really should stop feeding.
My desire was to try and steer us back to a reasonable discussion. And I already made my point.
I don't think the unvaccinated pose a significant risk to the public given that we now have a largely vaccinated population.
Ergo I don't think they should be denied access to malls or theatres or denied treatment (while agreeing about the way people are triaged, that's just basic medicine)

6
Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« on: September 24, 2021, 10:01:06 AM »
Interesting. Let me know when people have started preventing liberals and gays from buying food at supermarkets.

Nice propaganda. There is no law in France banning people from buying food or water. They are not allowed to enter malls. Some malls have groceries. Stop with the hysteria.
Once you've seen one shopping centre you've seen the mall...
(The mall, them all, see...oh if I have to explain it...)

Tom seems to have gone full Helen Lovejoy (won't someone please think of the unvaccinated).
Clearly we're not heading for a genocide
But if you strip away the trolling and hyperbole, I think there's a reasonable point about a 2 tier society which I have concerns about.
I mean, how much risk are the unvaccinated anyway? That's hard to quantify, but I would suggest it's not that high.

7
Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« on: September 22, 2021, 11:58:20 AM »
You, Rama, AATW, xasop, junker, will soon pay the price for your indolence.
Oh yes? What would that price would be?

8
Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« on: September 22, 2021, 09:27:15 AM »
I don't remember 2019 being when Covid started
Where do you think the "19" in "COVID-19" came from?
To be fair to Tom, my graph was showing Covid deaths which didn't start in 2019 - in the US at least.
But to be fair to me, it was bleedin' obvious that the labels were the wrong way round when showing the leading causes of deaths over the last few years and the impact Covid had last year.

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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« on: September 21, 2021, 10:11:06 AM »
And why is it suggesting that there was Covid in 2015?
Sigh...

OK, fair enough, I did get the labels the wrong way around. The orange line is the total deaths from those causes excluding Covid.
The blue line is adding Covid. My mistake, but obvious enough that I'd expect most people to have worked it out on their own.

Obviously Covid deaths only occurred from 2020 which is why you can't see the blue line before that.
The point is your assertion is that deaths from other causes increased last year too. As the split out data shows, that's true for some causes and not others - some actually went down. But overall deaths in 2020 were a little higher than in 2019 - although it should be noted that that is part of a general rising trend. When you add in Covid though the difference is clear.

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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« on: September 21, 2021, 09:22:20 AM »
It keeps going around and around because you neglect to account for the deaths that were up generally during the pandemic
The graphs above literally show that ???
You are trolling and gaslighting, you are clearly not interested in serious debate.
You've basically admitted you treat this place as a debating society where you take the contrary opinion as an intellectual exercise.

11
Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« on: September 21, 2021, 07:46:05 AM »
I think I finally found Tom's source code:

10 TROLL
20 IGNORE RESPONSE
30 GOTO 10

Conversations just go round and round. He's been shown the data which proves it's not just Covid deaths being overcounted that explains the death rate over the last year.
Here's the UK age corrected all cause mortality rate over the last 30 years. Clear falling trend until last year. And it'll be interesting to see this year's as the death rate was 42% above average in mid-Feb this year because of Covid. Well, it's either Covid or a lot of motorcycle accidents for some reason:



And here's the data from the US which shows that some other causes of mortality have increased and others decreased but overall if you take out Covid there's nothing out of the ordinary going on. It's the Covid deaths which explain the abnormal death rate:



Tom will continue to ignore this or explain it away somehow, it's probably best not to feed the troll. There's no prospect of advancing the conversation in any sensible way, it just goes round and round.

12
Flat Earth Theory / Re: Will Inspiration4 convince Flat Earth believers?
« on: September 19, 2021, 06:28:24 AM »
The rocket you saw was an unmanned missile that blew up somewhere in upper atmosphere and the interior shots of spacecraft are filmed in a studio probably in Elon Musk basement.
And your evidence for any of that is…?

13
Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« on: September 17, 2021, 11:46:00 AM »
How many people currently have co morbidities in America? Many millions. Heart disease, diabetes, cancer etc. People with these afflictions that get covid and die in short order? Covid could well be a contributing factor in their early death. If you have a bad heart but take care of yourself, you can live for years. But if some anti masking covid infected muppet coughs at you, that could be the death blow as it pushes you over the edge

Lets hope someone like that crosses your path. Karma needs to give you a swift kick up the arse
Tom's distain for the old and ill is somewhat disturbing.
Is this what Republicans are generally like?

14
Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« on: September 16, 2021, 08:48:33 PM »
You are the one cherry picking, by telling us that we need to only look at the survival rate for the critically ill.
Are you just gaslighting me now?
I literally said above:

Quote
you take out all the old people who are already ill then the chances of survival are pretty good.
But that's a pretty dishonest way of calculating the fatality rate, you have to consider everyone.

I don’t see how I could have been any clearer.

Quote
Not everyone is very ill. The survival rate is very high for the general population. The people dying of this are the sick and feeble.
So…basically, fuck old and ill people, right?

I’ve shown the data which demonstrates that this was a situation which demanded a response. Whether the response has been correct is a different discussion.
And of course deaths is a pretty blunt metric. There’s also people who might not die but are taking up hospital beds and people with long Covid.

Your indifference towards people you regard as unimportant is pretty shocking.

15
Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« on: September 16, 2021, 08:36:06 PM »
There is no cherry picking involved.

The survival rate is what it is.
Yes. And it isn’t 99.7%.
That figure came from data which excludes the most vulnerable people.
The overall CFR is around 1%

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The vaccine tailed off, uh?

Doesn't work, uh?
So two things here. The “it” in my sentence was clearly referring to the rollout of the vaccine, not the vaccine itself.
What does “the vaccine tailed off” even mean?
And secondly there is some indication that the efficacy of the vaccine does decrease over time, hence the talk of booster jabs.

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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« on: September 16, 2021, 06:15:04 PM »
Yeah, I am sure natural immunity has absolutely nothing to do with it.
Given that the vast majority of the people now ending up in hospital or dying are the unvaccinated then you are correct, natural immunity has nothing to do with it.
Oh, really.

Seems Israel is just a fluke, uh.

No, it’s not a fluke. The numbers are getting high there and it took me two minutes to find some data which may indicate why:

Quote
The share of the population having received one dose increased from 50% in February to only 68% in September. Children aged 12-15 have been included in the rollout since June 2021, yet despite this, currently only 62% of the population have had two doses.

https://theconversation.com/israel-was-a-leader-in-the-covid-vaccination-race-so-why-are-cases-spiralling-there-166945

So yeah, they started off well with their vaccine rollout but it tailed off and they still have a lot of unvaccinated people.
So what’s your point?

17
Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« on: September 16, 2021, 06:08:03 PM »
Hmm. Yes, I think it’s probably best not to feed Troll and Troller. But for all their attempts to divert, the data I’ve presented on the impact of Covid is pretty clear. As is the cherry picking dishonesty required to arrive at the “99.7%” survival rate.

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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« on: September 16, 2021, 05:27:16 PM »
Yeah, I am sure natural immunity has absolutely nothing to do with it.
Given that the vast majority of the people now ending up in hospital or dying are the unvaccinated then you are correct, natural immunity has nothing to do with it.

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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« on: September 16, 2021, 05:25:26 PM »
There wasn't a worldwide lockdown for the flu.
No, because the CFR is significantly lower for the flu than it is Covid.

Quote
Since you are comparing Covid to that
I am not. Or only in as much as patiently explaining that there are other diseases which generally don’t kill young and healthy people but can be dangerous for old and ill people. Flu and Covid are similar in that regard, but the CFR for Covid is significantly higher in all age groups which is why it caused such an extreme worldwide response.

Quote
it looks like you have debunked and discredited yourself.
Your inability to deal with the data and points I have made is noted.

20
Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« on: September 16, 2021, 04:34:16 PM »
Totally preventable with a vaccine
Written as if that could actually be known.

Here's the UK data. Note the clear correlation between Cases, Hospitalisations and Deaths over the winter and the much weaker correlation now. There is still some correlation, but the numbers are significantly lower:



I'm sure the vaccination data at the bottom which coincides with those much lower numbers is just a coincidence.

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