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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: Distance debate based on poll results
« Reply #60 on: September 06, 2017, 09:18:32 PM »
What are we judging?

The debate is what we are judging.

I've got basic structure for a debate, along with grading rubric for the judge along with judging criteria to help guide what is being looked for. I would suggest 3 judges, one confirmed RE, one confirmed FE, and one as neutral as possible. Scores can be averaged among what the three give, though each should be attempting to be as impartial as possible. I would suggest in addition the thread should be highly moderated with the notice on the front that anyone posting other than Tom/3D will have the post deleted and warned they will receive a ban of length so they will not return before the period for debate is over if found posting a second time. Debate period to be 1, maybe 2 weeks depending on if we want a set number of 'rounds' or just let them go for a while and declare time for closing statements the day or so before the final day.

And what about the debate is being judged?

Re: Distance debate based on poll results
« Reply #61 on: September 06, 2017, 09:27:57 PM »
What are we judging?

The debate is what we are judging.

I've got basic structure for a debate, along with grading rubric for the judge along with judging criteria to help guide what is being looked for. I would suggest 3 judges, one confirmed RE, one confirmed FE, and one as neutral as possible. Scores can be averaged among what the three give, though each should be attempting to be as impartial as possible. I would suggest in addition the thread should be highly moderated with the notice on the front that anyone posting other than Tom/3D will have the post deleted and warned they will receive a ban of length so they will not return before the period for debate is over if found posting a second time. Debate period to be 1, maybe 2 weeks depending on if we want a set number of 'rounds' or just let them go for a while and declare time for closing statements the day or so before the final day.

And what about the debate is being judged?
The idea was for it to be a formal debate. Rules, scoring, judges. An informal debate will never work here, because neither side is likely to change their view on things. But a formal debate isn't about changing the mind of the other side, it's about cohesively presenting your point and your side, while countering the points of the other side and showing why they are incorrect. The format is Side A presents a starting argument, usually laying out the points they will be discussing. Side B follows suit. Side A presents first arguments citing sources and information. Side B does the same. Side A then has a chance to rebut side B's points, and provide counter examples that either throw doubt upon Side B's points, or disprove evidence presented in some manner. Side B then does the same. This can be done more than once, but in a 'standard' debate structure it is just done this one time. Side A then presents closing arguments, wrapping up the arguments they presented before, showing how everything ties together, etc. This is usually more about their arguments, than refuting their opponent, but some of the latter can be done. Side B then does the same thing. Each section of the debate is scored based on a rubric of some kind, potentially like the one I posted. The winner is the one who scored the most points, or had the highest average among the judges scores. Usually there's only a single judge for these kinds of things, but to attempt to reduce the effect of personal bias, I suggested we use three. One for each 'position' although a neutral judge is of course the most difficult to find. Obviously ideally each judge should be as impartial as possible and stick to the rubric, but personal biases will affect how one feels about the validity or strength of arguments. Hence the suggestion/request for more than one.

Re: Distance debate based on poll results
« Reply #62 on: September 06, 2017, 09:39:35 PM »
What are we judging?

The debate is what we are judging.

I've got basic structure for a debate, along with grading rubric for the judge along with judging criteria to help guide what is being looked for. I would suggest 3 judges, one confirmed RE, one confirmed FE, and one as neutral as possible. Scores can be averaged among what the three give, though each should be attempting to be as impartial as possible. I would suggest in addition the thread should be highly moderated with the notice on the front that anyone posting other than Tom/3D will have the post deleted and warned they will receive a ban of length so they will not return before the period for debate is over if found posting a second time. Debate period to be 1, maybe 2 weeks depending on if we want a set number of 'rounds' or just let them go for a while and declare time for closing statements the day or so before the final day.
Quality or proven factual accuracy?

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Offline juner

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Re: Distance debate based on poll results
« Reply #63 on: September 07, 2017, 02:38:46 AM »

As 3D was first to take up the mantle, let him go with the Tides, If C Squirrel is happy to be the RE judge we need to know the FE one (Parsifal?), I think finding someone who is neutral will be difficult so a long-standing participant who has some respect here (rules me out), I would trust Junker to know who is a good fence sitter and be able to approach them.

For future debates, each side take it in turns to forward a subject and champion.

I can ask Secret User to judge if this actually comes to fruition. She is a seasoned debater herself and has acted as a judge for several debates, including one held at Stanford University, so I would say she is more than qualified.

Offline 3DGeek

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Re: Distance debate based on poll results
« Reply #64 on: September 07, 2017, 06:15:19 PM »

As 3D was first to take up the mantle, let him go with the Tides, If C Squirrel is happy to be the RE judge we need to know the FE one (Parsifal?), I think finding someone who is neutral will be difficult so a long-standing participant who has some respect here (rules me out), I would trust Junker to know who is a good fence sitter and be able to approach them.

For future debates, each side take it in turns to forward a subject and champion.

I can ask Secret User to judge if this actually comes to fruition. She is a seasoned debater herself and has acted as a judge for several debates, including one held at Stanford University, so I would say she is more than qualified.

So the formal subject should be something like:  "How does the Flat Earth hypothesis explain the pattern of ocean tides?" - and Tom gets first shot at it.

I suggest we start TWO threads - one to which only Tom and I will post - and another for the "audience" to comment on.

I guess we'll bounce questions and answers back and forth until it's clear that either a conclusion or an impasse has been reached and neither side has more to add to the debate.   We should probably play that one by ear until we've done more rounds of this.

« Last Edit: September 07, 2017, 06:18:11 PM by 3DGeek »
Hey Tom:  What path do the photons take from the physical location of the sun to my eye at sunset?