Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #20 on: April 25, 2016, 08:18:44 PM »
Tom is right. All the computer science professors at University were too incompetent to be coding monkeys after they got their degrees, so they had no choice but to get their doctorates so they could make something of themselves.
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Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #21 on: April 25, 2016, 08:25:41 PM »
I think he is talking about elementary and secondary school teachers. 
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Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #22 on: April 25, 2016, 08:59:29 PM »
Yeah, he was explicitly not talking about university professors.
Dr. Frank is a physicist. He says it's impossible. So it's impossible.
My friends, please remember Tom said this the next time you fall into the trap of engaging him, and thank you. :)

Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #23 on: April 26, 2016, 01:42:34 PM »
So this horseshit came up in my fb newsfeed this morning.

Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #24 on: April 26, 2016, 08:43:01 PM »
Yeah, he was explicitly not talking about university professors.

For my entire life I've heard teachers complain that they get paid far too little for teaching. They are defended by many as heroes who are educating our children, who gave us our own education, and should be paid highly for this.

But what are teachers, really? At the lowest levels, preschool and kindergarten, teachers are little more than babysitters who read children stories.
At the elementary, middle, high school, and college level the job role is essentially the same. Teachers remain babysitters who merely read children different books, whether it's a story about Martin Luther King, or about the periodic table. Other authors wrote those books, and did the research behind it. The teacher didn't do any of those things. The teacher is simply repeating the teachings of others. Most of the time they have their students do homework from the book and use exam handouts from the publisher (who graciously does not watermark the handouts). So why do they deserve large amounts of money for what is essentially a babysitting job?

In addition, teachers are frankly the losers of academia. Rather than contributing to an academic profession like their respected counterparts, they are reading stories to children. It's pathetic. Why should they be paid highly for that?


And yet he includes College professors in his opening post.
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Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #25 on: April 26, 2016, 10:13:06 PM »
Yeah, he was explicitly not talking about university professors.

For my entire life I've heard teachers complain that they get paid far too little for teaching. They are defended by many as heroes who are educating our children, who gave us our own education, and should be paid highly for this.

But what are teachers, really? At the lowest levels, preschool and kindergarten, teachers are little more than babysitters who read children stories.
At the elementary, middle, high school, and college level the job role is essentially the same. Teachers remain babysitters who merely read children different books, whether it's a story about Martin Luther King, or about the periodic table. Other authors wrote those books, and did the research behind it. The teacher didn't do any of those things. The teacher is simply repeating the teachings of others. Most of the time they have their students do homework from the book and use exam handouts from the publisher (who graciously does not watermark the handouts). So why do they deserve large amounts of money for what is essentially a babysitting job?

In addition, teachers are frankly the losers of academia. Rather than contributing to an academic profession like their respected counterparts, they are reading stories to children. It's pathetic. Why should they be paid highly for that?


And yet he includes College professors in his opening post.

Right because of course colleges and universities are exactly the same thing.
Dr. Frank is a physicist. He says it's impossible. So it's impossible.
My friends, please remember Tom said this the next time you fall into the trap of engaging him, and thank you. :)

Thork

Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #26 on: April 26, 2016, 10:54:24 PM »
Jobs aren't paid by necessity. In fact, I would say the opposite is true. We need garbage persons, construction crews, truck drivers, etc to make society function. Yet, these people aren't paid that great. Conversely, do we need another programmer at Google? Do we need an all-star quarterback for our home team?
Well you've kind of hit on the answer there. Jobs are paid on their productivity. A garbage man doesn't offer the economy very much. A programmer at Google does. Divide the number of Google programmers by the amount of money google rakes in ... they bring in a lot each. A quarterback even more. How many shirts does that guy sell? How many people tune in and watch the game + adverts because he's there. He brings in more for the club than developers do for google ... and gets paid a shit load more too.

And then we come to teachers. You teach a bunch of 10 years olds long division. How much GDP are those kids going to subsequently add this quarter because of those efforts? School teachers contribute absolutely zero to the economy. Less so than a McDonalds worker, and yet they still get paid more. If anything teachers are paid too much.

Now you could take the view that without teachers there would be no google developers nor quarterbacks from colleges nor McDonalds workers who can count money to use a till, and that all wealth is derived from teachers ... but that is just stupid talk.

The truth is some teachers add to GDP, the ones who train foreign students and those who pay tuition fees to colleges. Its not a huge amount, but its why they get a bit more than McDonlads workers and less than Google developers. Teachers get what they deserve.

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Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #27 on: April 26, 2016, 11:28:28 PM »
I didn't realize that so many people were so well-versed in the profession of teaching. These are truly some thoughtful and original opinions.

Thork

Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #28 on: April 26, 2016, 11:29:33 PM »
I didn't realize that so many people were so well-versed in the profession of teaching. These are truly some thoughtful and original opinions.
Those who can't, teach ... and you just got schooled.   :-B

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Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #29 on: April 26, 2016, 11:34:14 PM »
I didn't realize that so many people were so well-versed in the profession of teaching. These are truly some thoughtful and original opinions.
Those who can't, teach ... and you just got schooled.   :-B

What about the ones that did, and then started teaching when they got done doing? I just don't get it. Perhaps you have a few more proverbs that I can learn from.


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Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #30 on: April 27, 2016, 03:43:20 AM »

And then we come to teachers. You teach a bunch of 10 years olds long division. How much GDP are those kids going to subsequently add this quarter because of those efforts? School teachers contribute absolutely zero to the economy. Less so than a McDonalds worker, and yet they still get paid more. If anything teachers are paid too much.


You have never heard of future value?  A 10 year old kid, with a good education and once an adult, will likely add close to a million dollars or more to the economy, over their life.  In fact, if your google programmer did not learn long division in school, there might not be google programmers.

Sorry everyone, I fell for the troll.
Th*rk is the worst person on this website.

Thork

Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #31 on: April 27, 2016, 06:14:33 AM »

And then we come to teachers. You teach a bunch of 10 years olds long division. How much GDP are those kids going to subsequently add this quarter because of those efforts? School teachers contribute absolutely zero to the economy. Less so than a McDonalds worker, and yet they still get paid more. If anything teachers are paid too much.


You have never heard of future value?  A 10 year old kid, with a good education and once an adult, will likely add close to a million dollars or more to the economy, over their life.  In fact, if your google programmer did not learn long division in school, there might not be google programmers.

Sorry everyone, I fell for the troll.
Why do you need to educate the child? If the child is not educated to become a google programmer, you can import an immigrant from another country to do it. Therefore any effort to educate in America is a waste of time and money. Children have become a massive waste to the economy. It is why higher education for women, contraception, abortion, divorce, homosexuality and every single other anti-baby policy are enforced by the government. They are outsourcing birth to the 3rd world. Why have an expensive American child, when you can import a Mexican one that cost nothing to raise to fill the hole in the economy? American teachers are part of the waste. Cutting their wages and providing a terrible education for Americans has no draw backs. Americans can wait the tables and wash the cars of the rich immigrant workers for a lower national education budget + fight the wars as poorly paid soldiers to protect those well paid immigrant jobs.
« Last Edit: April 27, 2016, 06:26:51 AM by Dr David Thork »

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Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #32 on: April 27, 2016, 01:33:15 PM »

And then we come to teachers. You teach a bunch of 10 years olds long division. How much GDP are those kids going to subsequently add this quarter because of those efforts? School teachers contribute absolutely zero to the economy. Less so than a McDonalds worker, and yet they still get paid more. If anything teachers are paid too much.


You have never heard of future value?  A 10 year old kid, with a good education and once an adult, will likely add close to a million dollars or more to the economy, over their life.  In fact, if your google programmer did not learn long division in school, there might not be google programmers.

Sorry everyone, I fell for the troll.
Why do you need to educate the child? If the child is not educated to become a google programmer, you can import an immigrant from another country to do it. Therefore any effort to educate in America is a waste of time and money. Children have become a massive waste to the economy. It is why higher education for women, contraception, abortion, divorce, homosexuality and every single other anti-baby policy are enforced by the government. They are outsourcing birth to the 3rd world. Why have an expensive American child, when you can import a Mexican one that cost nothing to raise to fill the hole in the economy? American teachers are part of the waste. Cutting their wages and providing a terrible education for Americans has no draw backs. Americans can wait the tables and wash the cars of the rich immigrant workers for a lower national education budget + fight the wars as poorly paid soldiers to protect those well paid immigrant jobs.

These are truly some thoughtful and original opinions.
Th*rk is the worst person on this website.

Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #33 on: April 27, 2016, 02:25:48 PM »
Why do you need to educate the child? If the child is not educated to become a google programmer, you can import an immigrant from another country to do it. Therefore any effort to educate in America is a waste of time and money. Children have become a massive waste to the economy. It is why higher education for women, contraception, abortion, divorce, homosexuality and every single other anti-baby policy are enforced by the government. They are outsourcing birth to the 3rd world. Why have an expensive American child, when you can import a Mexican one that cost nothing to raise to fill the hole in the economy? American teachers are part of the waste. Cutting their wages and providing a terrible education for Americans has no draw backs. Americans can wait the tables and wash the cars of the rich immigrant workers for a lower national education budget + fight the wars as poorly paid soldiers to protect those well paid immigrant jobs.

Oh man that was a wild ride from start to finish.

Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #34 on: April 27, 2016, 08:10:56 PM »
Yeah, he was explicitly not talking about university professors.

For my entire life I've heard teachers complain that they get paid far too little for teaching. They are defended by many as heroes who are educating our children, who gave us our own education, and should be paid highly for this.

But what are teachers, really? At the lowest levels, preschool and kindergarten, teachers are little more than babysitters who read children stories.
At the elementary, middle, high school, and college level the job role is essentially the same. Teachers remain babysitters who merely read children different books, whether it's a story about Martin Luther King, or about the periodic table. Other authors wrote those books, and did the research behind it. The teacher didn't do any of those things. The teacher is simply repeating the teachings of others. Most of the time they have their students do homework from the book and use exam handouts from the publisher (who graciously does not watermark the handouts). So why do they deserve large amounts of money for what is essentially a babysitting job?

In addition, teachers are frankly the losers of academia. Rather than contributing to an academic profession like their respected counterparts, they are reading stories to children. It's pathetic. Why should they be paid highly for that?


And yet he includes College professors in his opening post.

Right because of course colleges and universities are exactly the same thing.

So when a high school student opts to take a college level course offered by their school (for example Calculus), it's not applicable as course credit at university?
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Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #35 on: April 28, 2016, 02:34:16 AM »
Right because of course colleges and universities are exactly the same thing.

I thought Americans referred to university as college.
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Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #36 on: April 28, 2016, 03:33:50 AM »
Right because of course colleges and universities are exactly the same thing.

I thought Americans referred to university as college.

The terms are frequently used synonymously. However, we still make a distinction between universities and colleges. Universities tend to be research institutions as well as offering undergraduate and graduate degrees. Colleges tend to focus on undergrad degrees and don't have the research capacity of universities. Colleges tend to be smaller campuses with smaller class sizes. There's probably a few other distinctions as well, but you get the idea.

Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #37 on: April 28, 2016, 04:49:43 AM »
Right because of course colleges and universities are exactly the same thing.

I thought Americans referred to university as college.

The terms are frequently used synonymously. However, we still make a distinction between universities and colleges. Universities tend to be research institutions as well as offering undergraduate and graduate degrees. Colleges tend to focus on undergrad degrees and don't have the research capacity of universities. Colleges tend to be smaller campuses with smaller class sizes. There's probably a few other distinctions as well, but you get the idea.

Also, universities are comprised of colleges. That's why you can say "I go to college" when you actually go to university and still be technically correct (in America). Usually the colleges are just a way of categorizing majors.

The university I go to actually only just got its university status a few years ago. It used to only be a college.

Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #38 on: April 28, 2016, 11:31:14 PM »

And then we come to teachers. You teach a bunch of 10 years olds long division. How much GDP are those kids going to subsequently add this quarter because of those efforts? School teachers contribute absolutely zero to the economy. Less so than a McDonalds worker, and yet they still get paid more. If anything teachers are paid too much.


You have never heard of future value?  A 10 year old kid, with a good education and once an adult, will likely add close to a million dollars or more to the economy, over their life.  In fact, if your google programmer did not learn long division in school, there might not be google programmers.

Sorry everyone, I fell for the troll.
Why do you need to educate the child? If the child is not educated to become a google programmer, you can import an immigrant from another country to do it. Therefore any effort to educate in America is a waste of time and money. Children have become a massive waste to the economy. It is why higher education for women, contraception, abortion, divorce, homosexuality and every single other anti-baby policy are enforced by the government. They are outsourcing birth to the 3rd world. Why have an expensive American child, when you can import a Mexican one that cost nothing to raise to fill the hole in the economy? American teachers are part of the waste. Cutting their wages and providing a terrible education for Americans has no draw backs. Americans can wait the tables and wash the cars of the rich immigrant workers for a lower national education budget + fight the wars as poorly paid soldiers to protect those well paid immigrant jobs.

Stop worrying about the state of education and start preparing for the crash of 2015.  It's going to be much worse.
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Re: Teachers deserve low pay
« Reply #39 on: April 29, 2016, 04:28:25 AM »

And then we come to teachers. You teach a bunch of 10 years olds long division. How much GDP are those kids going to subsequently add this quarter because of those efforts? School teachers contribute absolutely zero to the economy. Less so than a McDonalds worker, and yet they still get paid more. If anything teachers are paid too much.


You have never heard of future value?  A 10 year old kid, with a good education and once an adult, will likely add close to a million dollars or more to the economy, over their life.  In fact, if your google programmer did not learn long division in school, there might not be google programmers.

Sorry everyone, I fell for the troll.
Why do you need to educate the child? If the child is not educated to become a google programmer, you can import an immigrant from another country to do it. Therefore any effort to educate in America is a waste of time and money. Children have become a massive waste to the economy. It is why higher education for women, contraception, abortion, divorce, homosexuality and every single other anti-baby policy are enforced by the government. They are outsourcing birth to the 3rd world. Why have an expensive American child, when you can import a Mexican one that cost nothing to raise to fill the hole in the economy? American teachers are part of the waste. Cutting their wages and providing a terrible education for Americans has no draw backs. Americans can wait the tables and wash the cars of the rich immigrant workers for a lower national education budget + fight the wars as poorly paid soldiers to protect those well paid immigrant jobs.

Stop worrying about the state of education and start preparing for the crash of 2015.  It's going to be much worse.

Worse by a landslide
Th*rk is the worst person on this website.