tellytubby

Earth precision and solar declination
« on: June 04, 2019, 10:46:35 PM »
This link takes you to a section of Zetetic Astronomy in which SBR describes his seasonal observations of the altitude of the Sun.

http://www.sacred-texts.com/earth/za/za25.htm

This part of SBRs book is an over-worded description of the Suns seasonal change in declination from -23.5N to -23.5S and back again.  He also describes additional and much smaller variations in the max and min observed altitude of the Sun from his observation place over several years.

In line with SBRs faithful belief in the Earth being flat, he accounts for his observations using a diagram that is shown in Fig 60 on the same page,  However would he not see exactly the same thing by considering a spherical Earth which is tilted by 23 degrees to its orbital plane?  And by the same token he is also describing the Earths polar axis 'wobble' known as precesion which accounts for the longer term variations he describes.

So why should these observations provide evidence to SBR about the Earth being flat? Because they can be equally accounted for using RET as described above as well.
« Last Edit: June 04, 2019, 10:49:08 PM by tellytubby »

Re: Earth precision and solar declination
« Reply #1 on: June 05, 2019, 05:03:41 AM »
So why should these observations provide evidence to SBR about the Earth being flat? Because they can be equally accounted for using RET as described above as well.

Correct.

However, now that you have mentioned the sun's declination, you are going to have to explain this.

This is the orbital CORIOLIS EFFECT formula:

dto = 4AvosinΦcosδ/Rc2 = 4AΩosinΦcosδ/c2

R = 150,000,000 km and A = Lh

Cosδ is the sun's declination factor; however, on the day of the spring or autumn equinox, cosδ = 1.


Please explain to your readers why the orbital CORIOLIS EFFECT is not being registered by the GPS satellites.

This is the question that none of the physicists in the world can answer without resorting to MLET (modified Lorentz ether theory).

Re: Earth precision and solar declination
« Reply #2 on: June 05, 2019, 05:08:48 AM »
Please explain to your readers why the orbital CORIOLIS EFFECT is not being registered by the GPS satellites.

This is the question that none of the physicists in the world can answer without resorting to MLET (modified Lorentz ether theory).
Could you please elaborate? What do you mean by "the orbital CORIOLIS EFFECT"?
Edit: Upon reflection, I am able to infer that you are referring to the Earth's orbit around the Sun. Since that is a rotating frame of reference, anything moving perpendicular to that rotation will feel a (tiny) coriolis effect. If viewed from within the rotating reference frame, that would feel like a coriolis force. Something moving away from the Sun would behave as if it felt a force "slowing it" wrt the Earth and heading towards the Sun the opposite. Is that what you're talking about?
How does that relate to GPS exactly?
« Last Edit: June 05, 2019, 05:28:11 AM by ICanScienceThat »

Re: Earth precision and solar declination
« Reply #3 on: June 05, 2019, 08:30:05 AM »
Light beams in an interferometer in rotation will be subjected to the Coriolis effect (a deflection of the beams) and to the Sagnac effect (variable velocity).

Rotation: either the Earth rotates around its own axis, or the ether drift rotates above the surface of the Earth.

There are two Coriolis effects: rotational and orbital.

Rotational effect: due to the Coriolis force of rotation of the Earth.

Orbital effect: due to the Coriolis force of rotation while in orbit around the Sun.


Here is how the rotational Coriolis effect is derived:

https://www.ias.ac.in/article/fulltext/pram/087/05/0071

Here is how the orbital Coriolis effect is derived:

http://www.conspiracyoflight.com/Michelson-Gale/Michelson_1904.pdf

The Coriolis effect formula involves AN AREA and the ANGULAR VELOCITY.


GPS satellites record/register ONLY the rotational Coriolis force.

In fact, GPS functions even because the orbital Coriolis force is not being registered.



https://web.archive.org/web/20170808104846/http://qem.ee.nthu.edu.tw/f1b.pdf

This is an IOP article.

The author recognizes the earth's orbital Coriolis is missing whereas the earth's rotational Coriolis is not.

He uses GPS and a link between Japan and the US to prove this.

In GPS the actual magnitude of the Sagnac correction
due to earth’s rotation depends on the positions of
satellites and receiver and a typical value is 30 m, as the
propagation time is about 0.1s and the linear speed due
to earth’s rotation is about 464 m/s at the equator. The
GPS provides an accuracy of about 10 m or better in positioning.
Thus the precision of GPS will be degraded significantly,
if the Sagnac correction due to earth’s rotation
is not taken into account. On the other hand, the orbital
motion of the earth around the sun has a linear speed of
about 30 km/s which is about 100 times that of earth’s
rotation. Thus the present high-precision GPS would be
entirely impossible if the omitted correction due to orbital
motion is really necessary.


In an intercontinental microwave link between Japan and
the USA via a geostationary satellite as relay, the influence
of earth’s rotation is also demonstrated in a high-precision
time comparison between the atomic clocks at two remote
ground stations.
In this transpacific-link experiment, a synchronization
error of as large as about 0.3 µs was observed unexpectedly.


Meanwhile, as in GPS, no effects of earth’s orbital motion
are reported in these links, although they would be
easier to observe if they are in existence. Thereby, it is evident
that the wave propagation in GPS or the intercontinental
microwave link depends on the earth’s rotation, but
is entirely independent of earth’s orbital motion around
the sun or whatever. As a consequence, the propagation
mechanism in GPS or intercontinental link can be viewed
as classical in conjunction with an ECI frame, rather than
the ECEF or any other frame, being selected as the unique
propagation frame. In other words, the wave in GPS or the
intercontinental microwave link can be viewed as propagating
via a classical medium stationary in a geocentric
inertial frame.


The calculations performed for the LISA space antenna/satellite prove that the orbital Coriolis effect is 30 times greater than the rotational Coriolis effect in that case.


Faced with these facts, relativists have denied (believe it or not) that the satellites actually orbit the Sun.

"The motion of the earth's orbit is also a sagnac effect. We should see light path distance differentials caused by the orbit just like we see if for earth's rotation.

The orbital path is simply longer and nothing else.

The earth - sun orbital frame is a sagnac rotating frame.

The Sagnac correction for the earth's rotation is applied because as the light moves toward the receiver, the receiver rotates with the earth changing the distance the signal travels.

In the same light, if the unit had been at the equator at noon, then it should see the full effect of the Sagnac effect of the earth's revolution around the sun.
In other words, assume a satellite is low on the horizon in the east at the equator.

We should measure a sagnac correction for the earth's rotation on its axis and a sagnac correction of the earth's rotation/revolution around the sun.
If sagnac is true for the earth's rotation, then light travels at one speed c. the speed of light cannot be increased by circular motion and presumably not by linear motion either.

If light travels at one speed c, then as the earth moves in it's revolution loop at 30k/s, while light moves c through space, the unit at the equator at noon would move with the earth' rotation and the earth's revolution cutting the distance the signal must travel to meet the unit.
The earth is rotating at 1000 mph. This shows up in GPS as c+v and c-v as you would expect with Sagnac.

All that is fine.

When the satellite emits at c, the earth rotates the receiver at v and so a correction is needed.

This is all OK.

Now, the earth is revolving around the sun at 67000 mph, as we are told by the heliocentrists.

Let's say the unit is at the equator and the satellite is low on the horizon in the east at noon.

That means the unit is traveling at the orbital speed of the earth at 67,000 MPH.

The satellite emits at one speed c in space. While the light travels through space toward the unit at c, the unit moves with the earth at 67,000 MPH. The unit cuts the distance that the light must travel.

This is not being seen by any experiements nor GPS."


tellytubby

Re: Earth precision and solar declination
« Reply #4 on: June 05, 2019, 06:41:01 PM »
All this stuff about the Coriolis effect, GPS etc etc all sounds fascinating but is not relevant in the context of my question because in Rowbothams day there was no such thing as GPS.  I will look into all of that in due course. 

Taking ourselves back to the time of SBR, my question was I believe, why should Rowbotham have considered that his observations of the motion of the Sun proved that the Earth was flat.

Declination of course is a measurement of the Suns observed position, relative to the celestial equator on the celestial sphere. So for a given location (England in Rowbothams case) any variation of that declination would have resulted in a variation in the observed altitude of the Sun above the horizon.  Rowbotham so often speaks as if his observations prove his flat Earth belief when in fact, in the majority of examples, they don't.

« Last Edit: June 05, 2019, 06:43:07 PM by tellytubby »

Re: Earth precision and solar declination
« Reply #5 on: June 11, 2019, 10:02:33 PM »
Sandokhan, again, ignoring frame of reference.
What is the tire speed on top and bottom, on a 100km/h running car?  The bottom of the time is touching the ground.