Saddam Hussein

Re: Prosecuted for rap lyrics
« Reply #20 on: January 24, 2015, 07:44:32 PM »
You're cramming several completely unrelated points into one weird, incoherent argument, Rushy.  Hate speech, incitement, and threats are all very different things, and in any event, none of them are what this guy is being charged with.  He's being charged under under this odd law:

http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/cacode/PEN/3/1/7/8/s182.5

If the law is so broad that music or other speech is being interpreted as "promotion" or a "benefit" of gang activity, then it's unconstitutional and needs to be struck down.

Ghost of V

Re: Prosecuted for rap lyrics
« Reply #21 on: January 24, 2015, 07:45:04 PM »
No.

You didn't even read the OP or the argument, did you? No one spoke a single word about using a singer's lyrics as evidence that he committed a different crime. This is about whether or not this singer's lyrics are defined as hate speech with intent to incite violence.


No.

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Offline Rushy

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Re: Prosecuted for rap lyrics
« Reply #22 on: January 24, 2015, 07:47:12 PM »
You're cramming several completely unrelated points into one weird, incoherent argument, Rushy.  Hate speech, incitement, and threats are all very different things, and in any event, none of them are what this guy is being charged with.  He's being charged under under this odd law:

http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/cacode/PEN/3/1/7/8/s182.5

If the law is so broad that music or other speech is being interpreted as "promotion" or a "benefit" of gang activity, then it's unconstitutional and needs to be struck down.

pfft I don't care about that.

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Re: Prosecuted for rap lyrics
« Reply #23 on: January 24, 2015, 07:48:15 PM »
No.

You didn't even read the OP or the argument, did you? No one spoke a single word about using a singer's lyrics as evidence that he committed a different crime. This is about whether or not this singer's lyrics are defined as hate speech with intent to incite violence.


No.

No matter how wrong Rushy is, please add some content to a new posts in this mostly serious forum.

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Re: Prosecuted for rap lyrics
« Reply #24 on: January 24, 2015, 07:50:10 PM »
Actually, after reading through the thread again and looking up some articles, it seems that Rushy is right in fact. My apologies.

Vauxy, you are wrong it seems.

Saddam Hussein

Re: Prosecuted for rap lyrics
« Reply #25 on: January 24, 2015, 07:53:15 PM »
It is common to assume that Rushy is wrong, but in this case, he might actually be right.  This is indeed hate speech to incite terroristic acts.  It looks like Vauxy is just wrong.

Ghost of V

Re: Prosecuted for rap lyrics
« Reply #26 on: January 24, 2015, 07:58:20 PM »
Actually, after reading through the thread again and looking up some articles, it seems that Rushy is right in fact. My apologies.

Vauxy, you are wrong it seems.

I acknowledged that in my previous post. Doesn't change the fact that Rushy is wrong and supporting communism. It's arguably very similar, because Tiny Doo had no connections to the shootings. Freedom of speech and artistic expression should protect Tiny Doo from this kind of nonsense. As far as I can tell, the rapper has no connection to any of the nine shootings apart from some lyrics. I don't understand how Eminem can rap about killing his wife and not be prosecuted, yet this guy can rap about unrelated incidents and be prosecuted. Is it because he's black?

Saddam Hussein

Re: Prosecuted for rap lyrics
« Reply #27 on: January 24, 2015, 08:05:17 PM »
Actually, after reading through the thread again and looking up some articles, it seems that Rushy is right in fact. My apologies.

Vauxy, you are wrong it seems.

I acknowledged that in my previous post. Doesn't change the fact that Rushy is wrong and supporting communism. It's arguably very similar, because Tiny Doo had no connections to the shootings. Freedom of speech and artistic expression should protect Tiny Doo from this kind of nonsense. As far as I can tell, the rapper has no connection to any of the nine shootings apart from some lyrics. I don't understand how Eminem can rap about killing his wife and not be prosecuted, yet this guy can rap about unrelated incidents and be prosecuted. Is it because he's black?

People getting away with a crime previously is no defense.

Ghost of V

Re: Prosecuted for rap lyrics
« Reply #28 on: January 24, 2015, 08:09:18 PM »
Actually, after reading through the thread again and looking up some articles, it seems that Rushy is right in fact. My apologies.

Vauxy, you are wrong it seems.

I acknowledged that in my previous post. Doesn't change the fact that Rushy is wrong and supporting communism. It's arguably very similar, because Tiny Doo had no connections to the shootings. Freedom of speech and artistic expression should protect Tiny Doo from this kind of nonsense. As far as I can tell, the rapper has no connection to any of the nine shootings apart from some lyrics. I don't understand how Eminem can rap about killing his wife and not be prosecuted, yet this guy can rap about unrelated incidents and be prosecuted. Is it because he's black?

People getting away with a crime previously is no defense.


Not when no crime took place. Eminem did not kill his wife, only talked about it in his lyrics. Creative license protects him from prosecution. Could Eminem be prosecuted?


Dreeben said no. Eminem is saying that "at a concert where people are going to be entertained. This is a critical part of the context. It wasn't as if he stated to her in private or on a Facebook page after having received a protection from abuse order. It wasn't as if he appropriated a style or rap that wasn't anything that he had been doing previously in the marriage and all of a sudden tried to express violent statements that way," Dreeben said. "In the context, I think any reasonable person would conclude at a minimum that there is ambiguity about these statements being a serious intention of expression to do harm. And this is critical here. We're talking about an area in which if the jury finds that it's ambiguous, it has to acquit."


Tiny Doo does not commit the crimes he sings about. He has no previous record. The nine shootings he is being charged with inciting have nothing to do with him. The prosecution cannot even connect the two things. Therefore, the nine shootings are irrelevant in this case and the charges against Tiny Doo should be dropped. Do the gang members say that Tiny Doo's lyrics motivated them to commit the crime? No. Was Tiny Doo involved in the crime? No. Did Tiny Doo sing about it before it happened? Yes, but how is that relevant when he was not involved in the actual crimes being committed?

Would Bob Marley be charged from the grave if someone shot a sheriff?
« Last Edit: January 24, 2015, 08:11:06 PM by Vauxhall »

Saddam Hussein

Re: Prosecuted for rap lyrics
« Reply #29 on: January 24, 2015, 08:12:40 PM »
Of course not.  He's dead.

Ghost of V

Re: Prosecuted for rap lyrics
« Reply #30 on: January 24, 2015, 08:13:37 PM »
Of course not.  He's dead.

650 previously undiscovered bugs were found in his dreads after death.

One of the lyrics in question here is:

"Ain't no safety on this pistol I'm holding" and the prosecution considers this a  "direct correlation to what the gang has been doing." Is this not ridiculous to anyone else?

Absurd. This sounds like a witch hunt more than anything.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2015, 08:22:46 PM by Vauxhall »

Saddam Hussein

Re: Prosecuted for rap lyrics
« Reply #31 on: March 08, 2015, 01:32:13 AM »
The same case has expanded its net to include some random guy:

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2015/03/san-diego-man-with-no-criminal-record-faces-life-in-prison-for-flashing-gang-signs-on-facebook/

The "gang signs" they're talking about are probably just him pointing at someone.

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Re: Prosecuted for rap lyrics
« Reply #32 on: March 08, 2015, 06:05:30 AM »

The same case has expanded its net to include some random guy:

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2015/03/san-diego-man-with-no-criminal-record-faces-life-in-prison-for-flashing-gang-signs-on-facebook/

The "gang signs" they're talking about are probably just him pointing at someone.

The prosecutors are walking a fine line here. It seems to be nothing but frivolous nonsense. Hell, I threw up the dub when I was a teenager. Thankfully, I didn't get arrested when biggie was popped in LA.