The Flat Earth Society

Other Discussion Boards => Philosophy, Religion & Society => Topic started by: J-Man on February 21, 2022, 10:20:53 PM

Title: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on February 21, 2022, 10:20:53 PM
NATO tonight is scratching heads.

Do nukes fly?

Maybe more than Brandon will need diapers?

https://www.rt.com/russia/550177-putin-decree-military-donbass/
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rama Set on February 21, 2022, 10:29:43 PM
You can’t invade Ukraine if you decide it’s not Ukraine anymore. *taps forehead*
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on February 21, 2022, 11:35:30 PM
Diaper Joe sends out a new law to all us Americans. I have no idea how I'll survive or the Ukrainians will get by now?

"Minutes later, White House press secretary Jen Psaki announced that President Joe Biden would soon issue an executive order banning Americans from investing, financing or trading in the Donetsk and Lugansk People’s Republics (DPR and LPR, respectively). "

https://www.rt.com/news/550180-us-sanctions-donbass-republics/
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: JSS on February 21, 2022, 11:39:54 PM
"Peacekeepers"

Putin wants peace at any cost, no matter how many Ukrainians he has to kill to get it?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Fortuna on February 22, 2022, 09:00:58 AM
Let's back an economically troubled nation with a giant ass nuclear arsenal further into a corner by imposing harsh sanctions. What could possibly go wrong? 
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rama Set on February 22, 2022, 12:42:29 PM
Let's back an economically troubled nation with a giant ass nuclear arsenal further into a corner by imposing harsh sanctions. What could possibly go wrong?

You think Putin will deploy nukes because his people are starving? That’s ridiculous. He doesn’t care. As long as he can find a way to keep him and his buddies rich, he is good.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on February 22, 2022, 01:07:37 PM
Didn't Germany basically do the same thing in 1938?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: JSS on February 22, 2022, 04:21:28 PM
Let's back an economically troubled nation with a giant ass nuclear arsenal further into a corner by imposing harsh sanctions. What could possibly go wrong?

Appeasing brutal expansionist dictators always goes well.

If he is willing to use nukes to get what he wants, he won't stop at Ukraine.  If he's that nuts, we're all fucked no matter what we do.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on February 22, 2022, 08:40:38 PM
Let's back an economically troubled nation with a giant ass nuclear arsenal further into a corner by imposing harsh sanctions. What could possibly go wrong?

Subs?  East/West/Gulf

https://www.popularmechanics.com/military/navy-ships/a19863945/here-are-all-the-submarines-of-the-russian-navy-in-one-infographic/

A new infographic shows the underwater might of the Russian Navy and its fleet of 72 submarines, one more than the U.S. Navy at the time of this writing.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: JSS on February 23, 2022, 12:23:21 AM
Anyone who thinks there can be a winner of a nuclear war between the US and Russia doesn't understand how nuclear weapons work. :-\
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Fortuna on February 23, 2022, 01:34:19 AM
Let's back an economically troubled nation with a giant ass nuclear arsenal further into a corner by imposing harsh sanctions. What could possibly go wrong?

Appeasing brutal expansionist dictators always goes well.

If he is willing to use nukes to get what he wants, he won't stop at Ukraine.  If he's that nuts, we're all fucked no matter what we do.

Nukes will be the only negotiation mechanism Russia will have if their economy is torn to shreds due to these super ultra harsh sanctions that are supposed to be coming. Indeed, they've already conducted ballistic missile drills and mentioned them in their recent political rhetoric.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on February 23, 2022, 02:10:39 AM
Let's back an economically troubled nation with a giant ass nuclear arsenal further into a corner by imposing harsh sanctions. What could possibly go wrong?

Appeasing brutal expansionist dictators always goes well.

If he is willing to use nukes to get what he wants, he won't stop at Ukraine.  If he's that nuts, we're all fucked no matter what we do.

Nukes will be the only negotiation mechanism Russia will have if their economy is torn to shreds due to these super ultra harsh sanctions that are supposed to be coming. Indeed, they've already conducted ballistic missile drills and mentioned them in their recent political rhetoric.

My math may be wrong but Germany pays about .60 euros for a cubic meter of nat gas, which will probably go to $ 2 euro since the fight is on.  Thats even with nord stream 1 intact. 3/4s of 40 mill homes use Russian gas. Good thing spring is almost here.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: JSS on February 23, 2022, 02:06:18 PM
On the positive side, anything that pushes countries to move away from oil and gas is a good thing. Russia is truly and totally screwed if the world stops buying their oil. That's well over half of their exports and nearly half of their entire economy.

Hopefully this will give Europe the kick in the pants they need to move away from being dependent on Russian oil and gas.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on February 23, 2022, 05:23:54 PM
On the positive side, anything that pushes countries to move away from oil and gas is a good thing. Russia is truly and totally screwed if the world stops buying their oil. That's well over half of their exports and nearly half of their entire economy.

Hopefully this will give Europe the kick in the pants they need to move away from being dependent on Russian oil and gas.

Oh trust me, they got that kick a while ago.  It just takes time to retrofit a few hundred million homes.

They refused norwegian gas and oil.  Which was annoying for Norway.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on February 24, 2022, 05:35:30 AM
This thread title aged poorly.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on February 24, 2022, 06:10:43 AM
This thread title aged poorly.

No kidding, shut dwn and control the air space, send the internet into deep space. Freeze, don't anybody move, hands above your heads. This looks like winning a war by the book, quickly.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Fortuna on February 24, 2022, 08:57:50 AM
If they really wanted to make some big city moves, NK would just start artillerying SK, China would take Taiwan, and Russia would keep rolling their tanks to Paris. And there's not a lot anyone could do about it.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on February 24, 2022, 11:29:12 AM
If they really wanted to make some big city moves, NK would just start artillerying SK, China would take Taiwan, and Russia would keep rolling their tanks to Paris. And there's not a lot anyone could do about it.

There is but everyone's afraid Putin would just nuke the world out of spite.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Dr Van Nostrand on February 24, 2022, 12:46:25 PM
If they really wanted to make some big city moves, NK would just start artillerying SK, China would take Taiwan, and Russia would keep rolling their tanks to Paris. And there's not a lot anyone could do about it.

There is but everyone's afraid Putin would just nuke the world out of spite.

Maybe the U.S should just surrender to Putin and become part of Russia.  That's what the Republicans want.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on February 24, 2022, 12:52:06 PM
If they really wanted to make some big city moves, NK would just start artillerying SK, China would take Taiwan, and Russia would keep rolling their tanks to Paris. And there's not a lot anyone could do about it.

There is but everyone's afraid Putin would just nuke the world out of spite.

Maybe the U.S should just surrender to Putin and become part of Russia.  That's what the Republicans want.
It is!
They are just... They are so anti-biden that they will literally hate on any move he does.
If he did two opposite actions in a week, Fox would call both the worst move ever.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on February 24, 2022, 08:54:36 PM
China is now taunting Taiwan...  Fat Boy in NK what you got? Rodman? #1 D evar

Do you think Putin will now embarrass the BigGuy with all the Ukrainian dirt sonny boy did?

War from the sidelines...sis boom bah !!!
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on February 24, 2022, 09:45:55 PM
China is now taunting Taiwan...  Fat Boy in NK what you got? Rodman? #1 D evar

Do you think Putin will now embarrass the BigGuy with all the Ukrainian dirt sonny boy did?

War from the sidelines...sis boom bah !!!
No.
That requires
1. There to be dirt.
2. Him to care.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: JSS on February 24, 2022, 10:31:48 PM
At this point Putin could show iron clad proof that he used financial blackmail on Trump and Republicans would just ignore it and pretend it never happened.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rama Set on February 24, 2022, 11:02:41 PM
At this point Putin could show iron clad proof that he used financial blackmail on Trump and Republicans would just ignore it and pretend it never happened.

They’d blame it on democrats, actually.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Fortuna on February 25, 2022, 01:04:58 AM
If they really wanted to make some big city moves, NK would just start artillerying SK, China would take Taiwan, and Russia would keep rolling their tanks to Paris. And there's not a lot anyone could do about it.

There is but everyone's afraid Putin would just nuke the world out of spite.

Yeah that's what I mean.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on February 25, 2022, 01:26:53 AM
No one comes to Ukraine's aid, their island is now a place where NO military weapons will be housed ever, except Putin's. This was quick and efficient with only a few lives lost, yes a few to many but from here on out, all lives are now protected by a super power. Enjoy your freedom !
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: xasop on February 25, 2022, 01:29:55 AM
island
what
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Clyde Frog on February 25, 2022, 01:41:19 AM
island
what
I'm not sure, but I suspect he means Snake Island. 13 Ukrainian soldiers were there, a Russian ship showed up and told them to surrender, they responded saying "Go fuck yourself" and then they got killed.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Fortuna on February 25, 2022, 03:06:51 AM
Thork, what are you doing in Ukraine you crazy bastard?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZcYlnXii3fE
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on February 25, 2022, 03:50:36 PM
Imagine believing Ukraine exists.  :-\
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on February 25, 2022, 06:04:30 PM
Well I guess it's over?  Gas flowing like crazy thru Ukraine, Gold hammered, stocks roaring back. Time for Taiwan?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on February 25, 2022, 06:55:08 PM
Well I guess it's over?  Gas flowing like crazy thru Ukraine, Gold hammered, stocks roaring back. Time for Taiwan?

I see no news that the fighting stopped. 
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: AllAroundTheWorld on February 25, 2022, 08:00:55 PM
Well if this doesn’t stop Putin in his tracks then I don’t know what will…

https://news.sky.com/story/russia-kicked-out-of-eurovision-after-ukraine-invasion-12551440
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rama Set on February 25, 2022, 08:21:48 PM
Well if this doesn’t stop Putin in his tracks then I don’t know what will…

https://news.sky.com/story/russia-kicked-out-of-eurovision-after-ukraine-invasion-12551440

Thork in shambles.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tom Bishop on February 26, 2022, 06:10:55 PM
I don't see any reason to assume that Putin is in the wrong.

https://twitter.com/Amy21407287/status/1497556324120514570
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: crutonius on February 26, 2022, 06:15:22 PM
I don't see any reason to assume that Putin is in the wrong.

https://twitter.com/Amy21407287/status/1497556324120514570

Um...

Fuck it. You do you. I guess someone needs to stick up for putin.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Dr Van Nostrand on February 26, 2022, 08:01:24 PM
I don't see any reason to assume that Putin is in the wrong.

https://twitter.com/Amy21407287/status/1497556324120514570

Um...

Fuck it. You do you. I guess someone needs to stick up for putin.

This is the new thing for Republicans. They have to support Putin and keep him happy, just like they do any of their other mega-donors.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on February 26, 2022, 08:23:10 PM
It's funny how an opinion is based on and "backed-up" by some rando who made a TikTok video. I'm sure that guy is representative of the entirety of the Ukraine population.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Iceman on February 26, 2022, 08:40:39 PM
Certainly not representative of:
- their PM “I don’t want a ride out, I want anti-tank ammo”
- their old women “I hope you carry sunflower seeds in your pockets so something good will come of your deaths”
- their border guards “go fuck yourself”
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tom Bishop on February 26, 2022, 08:52:35 PM
It's funny how an opinion is based on and "backed-up" by some rando who made a TikTok video. I'm sure that guy is representative of the entirety of the Ukraine population.

Why would he need to represent the entire Ukrainian population to have a valid viewpoint?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on February 26, 2022, 09:12:10 PM
It's funny how an opinion is based on and "backed-up" by some rando who made a TikTok video. I'm sure that guy is representative of the entirety of the Ukraine population.

Why would he need to represent the entire Ukrainian population to have a valid viewpoint?

What makes it valid? An opinion doesn't make for instant validity.

And apparently, if I'm reading your post right, you saying "I don't see any reason to assume that Putin is in the wrong," is supposed to be supported by one rando in a TikTok video? Is this what it has come to?

I mean pretty much any rando could say what this rando says about pretty much any country or population. Couldn't a rando say the exact same thing about Russia?

"Ukraine Russia is so evil, Ukrainian Russian people are so corrupt, so evil, such liars, thieves...The fact that President Biden and his son President Putin and his Oligarchs have corrupt dealings with Ukraine everyone and still get elected gives you a situation as to why Putin is invading NATO and the rest of the world has a problem with the invasion..."
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on February 26, 2022, 09:14:21 PM
I don't see any reason to assume that Putin is in the wrong.

https://twitter.com/Amy21407287/status/1497556324120514570
Right, because there is no mafia, corruption or lying going on in Russia. ::)
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tom Bishop on February 26, 2022, 09:21:28 PM
And apparently, if I'm reading your post right, you saying "I don't see any reason to assume that Putin is in the wrong," is supposed to be supported by one rando in a TikTok video? Is this what it has come to?

Actually the TikTok video argues that Putin is in the right. My comment was that I don't see any reason to assume that Putin is in the wrong. These are two different kinds of statements. There is a subtle difference there between the two statements, mine implicitly pointing out that there are a variety of opinions on this topic which does not necessitate that Putin is irremediably in the wrong on the situation.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: AllAroundTheWorld on February 26, 2022, 09:29:26 PM
What makes it valid? An opinion doesn't make for instant validity.
You know the answer to that.
It fits in with what Tom wants to believe and it’s a good troll. It’s just more cherry picking from him, the hell does “4th generation Ukrainian” mean anyway? From his accent I t’s obviously someone who has grown up in the US. One of my great grandparents was Italian. Never met her and gives me zero right to pontificate on going on in Italy. Trolls gotta troll.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on February 26, 2022, 09:33:15 PM
And apparently, if I'm reading your post right, you saying "I don't see any reason to assume that Putin is in the wrong," is supposed to be supported by one rando in a TikTok video? Is this what it has come to?

Actually the TikTok video argues that Putin is in the right. My comment was that I don't see any reason to assume that Putin is in the wrong. These are two different kinds of statements. There is a subtle difference there between the two statements, mine implicitly pointing out that there are a variety of opinions on this topic which does not necessitate that Putin is irremediably in the wrong on the situation.

So what you're saying is that there are differences of opinion as to whether it was right or wrong for Putin to invade Ukraine? Apparently, it was previously unclear, until you came along, that some people may assume Putin is in the right and some people may assume he is in the wrong. Well, I guess thanks for sharing your astute insights on the matter.
 
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tom Bishop on February 26, 2022, 09:36:32 PM
And apparently, if I'm reading your post right, you saying "I don't see any reason to assume that Putin is in the wrong," is supposed to be supported by one rando in a TikTok video? Is this what it has come to?

Actually the TikTok video argues that Putin is in the right. My comment was that I don't see any reason to assume that Putin is in the wrong. These are two different kinds of statements. There is a subtle difference there between the two statements, mine implicitly pointing out that there are a variety of opinions on this topic which does not necessitate that Putin is irremediably in the wrong on the situation.

So what you're saying is that there are differences of opinion as to whether it was right or wrong for Putin to invade Ukraine? Apparently, it was previously unclear, until you came along, that some people may assume Putin is in the right and some people may assume he is in the wrong. Well, I guess thanks for sharing your astute insights on the matter.

Yes, the difference of an opposite opinion would invalidate the opinion that Putin is in the wrong. With the presence of multiple opinions it cannot be said that Putin is definitely and irredeemably in the wrong.

There are lots of people in Russia and a world power government who support this event, and who don't think that they are in the wrong. You certainly should try to find out their reasoning before you jump to conclusions and make judgment.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on February 26, 2022, 09:48:38 PM
And apparently, if I'm reading your post right, you saying "I don't see any reason to assume that Putin is in the wrong," is supposed to be supported by one rando in a TikTok video? Is this what it has come to?

Actually the TikTok video argues that Putin is in the right. My comment was that I don't see any reason to assume that Putin is in the wrong. These are two different kinds of statements. There is a subtle difference there between the two statements, mine implicitly pointing out that there are a variety of opinions on this topic which does not necessitate that Putin is irremediably in the wrong on the situation.

So what you're saying is that there are differences of opinion as to whether it was right or wrong for Putin to invade Ukraine? Apparently, it was previously unclear, until you came along, that some people may assume Putin is in the right and some people may assume he is in the wrong. Well, I guess thanks for sharing your astute insights on the matter.

Yes, the difference of an opposite opinion would invalidate the opinion that Putin is in the wrong. With the presence of multiple opinions it cannot be said that Putin is definitely and irredeemably in the wrong.

Are you trying to say that opposing opinions cancel each other out? That neither can be correct or incorrect? Is it a 1-to-1 thing? Or if I have 1 opinion and you have amassed 10 opposing ones from 9 other people, your 10 trumps my 1? I'm trying to get a handle on this as it's not really making any sense.

There are lots of people in Russia and a world power government who support this event, and who don't think that they are in the wrong. You certainly should try to find out their reasoning before you jump to conclusions and make judgment.

What makes you think someone hasn't looked into the reasoning of an opposing opinion?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tom Bishop on February 26, 2022, 09:58:30 PM
Quote from: stack
What makes you think someone hasn't looked into the reasoning of an opposing opinion?

Probably because there are two sides to every story and we are only hearing one side. We know logically that Russian media and Russian government are giving an entirely different narrative which is not "lets be evil!", as is suggested to be the narrative by many in the West.

Quote from: stack
Are you trying to say that opposing opinions cancel each other out? That neither can be correct or incorrect? Is it a 1-to-1 thing? Or if I have 1 opinion and you have amassed 10 opposing ones from 9 other people, your 10 trumps my 1? I'm trying to get a handle on this as it's not really making any sense.

I have no idea that you are mumbling about. I am pointing out that there are multiple sides to a story and that the Russians probably do not think that they are doing bad and evil things unnecessarily.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on February 26, 2022, 10:23:18 PM
Russians probably do not think that they are doing bad and evil things unnecessarily.

How would you know this?

And "unnecessarily" is a strange term to be using. It's pretty clear and well documented, even in MSM, why Putin thinks it's "necessary". That has no correlation as to whether something is default bad/evil or not.

In any case, I think liquor purveyors’ opinion trumps your random TikTok guy’s...

(https://i.imgur.com/7ScNGo4.gif)

Russian vodka pulled from shelves in US, Canada bars, liquor stores: ‘Every small thing makes a difference’ (https://www.foxnews.com/us/russian-vodka-us-canada-bars-liquor-stores-shelves)
Liquor stores across the U.S. and Canada have started throwing out their stocks of Russian vodka in protest of President Vladimir Putin’s invasion of Ukraine, according to reports.

Gotta love Fox News for such in-depth reporting.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tom Bishop on February 26, 2022, 10:28:14 PM
Russians probably do not think that they are doing bad and evil things unnecessarily.

How would you know this?

Did I say that I did? I said probably. Russians probably have justifications for their actions and are not nodding their heads in acceptance that they are bad and evil. It is logical that they have their own narrative for their actions, and that the narrative is not "lets be evil". It is pretty idiotic to argue otherwise actually.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Dr Van Nostrand on February 26, 2022, 10:48:43 PM
Just because some Republicans want to support the expansion of the Soviet Union doesn't mean we want them invading our country. The same is probably true in Ukraine.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on February 26, 2022, 11:00:33 PM
Russians probably do not think that they are doing bad and evil things unnecessarily.

How would you know this?

Did I say that I did? I said probably. Russians probably have justifications for their actions and are not nodding their heads in acceptance that they are bad and evil. It is logical that they have their own narrative for their actions, and that the narrative is not "lets be evil". It is pretty idiotic to argue otherwise actually.

I still don't see what point you're trying to make. That some people may believe that their intentions are justified and not evil? So what? You could say the same thing about the Nazis. You could say the same thing about the US invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq. What's your point? That we shouldn't assume Putin's invasion is "evil-minded". Sure, let's do that. So what? What should we do?

What should we do when Putin starts tacitly threatening Sweden and Finland if they join NATO? Oh wait, he just did. Probably not the first time, but now what should we do?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on February 26, 2022, 11:16:43 PM
Russians probably have justifications for their actions and are not nodding their heads in acceptance that they are bad and evil. It is logical that they have their own narrative for their actions, and that the narrative is not "lets be evil".
Of course Putin justifies his actions in Ukraine and doesn't think that he's evil.  Then again, Stalin, Hitler and Mao had their justifications for all the people they killed and didn't think that they were evil either.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tom Bishop on February 26, 2022, 11:31:28 PM
I'm not so sure that the Jews were completely innocent in the Hitler situation.

https://rense.com/general84/declare.htm


It is certainly possible that Hitler took things too far in the end. But there are two sides to the beginning of that conflict, and Hitler didn't just randomly decide to imprison the Jews. Apparently the Jews declared a holy war against Germany.

And here in this case you are assuming that Ukraine is innocent, despite the general knowledge that there has been years of conflict with Russia leading up to this.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Fortuna on February 26, 2022, 11:37:42 PM
Conservatives defending Putin is hilarious. He's everything you hate about left-wing politicians only 10x worse.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on February 27, 2022, 01:18:08 AM
I'm not so sure that the Jews were completely innocent in the Hitler situation.

It is certainly possible that Hitler took things too far in the end.

“It’s certainly possible…”???
Seriously?

I question the reliability of your source narrator…Jeffry Rense, Rense.com:

Rense's radio program and website propagate conspiracy theories, including those of 9/11 conspiracists,[2] ufologists and advocates of the paranormal, the creation of diseases, chemtrails, evidence of advanced ancient technology, emergent energy technologies, and alternative medicine.

Rense's writings and website have been deemed pro-Nazi and antisemitic by the Anti-Defamation League and the Southern Poverty Law Center.[3][4]


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeff_Rense
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tom Bishop on February 27, 2022, 02:03:09 AM
I question the reliability of your source narrator…Jeffry Rense, Rense.com:

Rense's radio program and website propagate conspiracy theories, including those of 9/11 conspiracists,[2] ufologists and advocates of the paranormal, the creation of diseases, chemtrails, evidence of advanced ancient technology, emergent energy technologies, and alternative medicine.

Rense's writings and website have been deemed pro-Nazi and antisemitic by the Anti-Defamation League and the Southern Poverty Law Center.[3][4]


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeff_Rense

Yeah, so fake.  ::)

(https://i.imgur.com/gxtEJnF.jpg)

“It’s certainly possible…”???
Seriously?

Typically when your group declares war on another group you run the risk of dying when your opponent responds.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on February 27, 2022, 02:25:23 AM
I'm pretty sure that Hitler declared war on the Jews first.  Even so, how did that give him the right to invade Poland, France and pretty much the rest of Europe?

How does recognizing 2 breakaway territories (that Putin helped orchestrate) give Putin the right to force regime change in Ukraine despite being a violation of international law?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tom Bishop on February 27, 2022, 03:14:28 AM
I'm pretty sure that Hitler declared war on the Jews first.  Even so, how did that give him the right to invade Poland, France and pretty much the rest of Europe?

How does recognizing 2 breakaway territories (that Putin helped orchestrate) give Putin the right to force regime change in Ukraine despite being a violation of international law?

You were taught in school that Hitler was a cartoon villain who made naked acts of aggression and imprisoned and persecuted the Jews for no reason. Do you really think that it happened for absolutely no reason at all?

Per Poland, the Germans claimed that they were being harrassed and finally attacked (https://carolynyeager.net/gleiwitz-%E2%80%9Cfalse-flag%E2%80%9D-incident-pure-fiction).
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Iceman on February 27, 2022, 03:18:07 AM
Tom out here saying hitler was a little out of line in WWII like it would have been fine for Americans to have gassed every POW and citizen in internment camps because Pearl Harbor happened. Trollolol
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on February 27, 2022, 03:53:20 AM
You were taught in school that Hitler was a cartoon villain who imprisoned and persecuted the Jews for no reason at all and made naked acts of aggression. Do you really think that it happened for absolutely no reason at all?
Have you heard about Mein Kampf?  He explained exactly what he thought about the Jews and what he planned to do about them once he got the chance.

Per Poland, the Germans claimed that they were being harrassed and finally attacked (https://carolynyeager.net/gleiwitz-%E2%80%9Cfalse-flag%E2%80%9D-incident-pure-fiction).
Right.  Attacking one radio station justified taking over the whole country and the rest of Europe.  It seems that dictators have a problem with proportional responses.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tom Bishop on February 27, 2022, 03:56:58 AM
Tom out here saying hitler was a little out of line in WWII like it would have been fine for Americans to have gassed every POW and citizen in internment camps because Pearl Harbor happened. Trollolol

That's not how it works though. If you are at war you are only obligated to treat enemy POWs in a certain way if they have an agreement to treat your POWs in that way.

The Soviets didn't ratify the Geneva convention, for example. The Germans therefore treated the American and British POWs a lot better than the Soviet POWs, who they enslaved and slaughtered at will. Reminder that this is a war.

https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/the-treatment-of-soviet-pows-starvation-disease-and-shootings-june-1941january-1942

Quote
From the very beginning, German policy on the treatment of Soviet prisoners of war (POWs) was determined by Nazi ideology. German political and military leaders regarded Soviet POWs not only as racially less valuable but as potential enemies, obstacles in the German conquest of "living space." The Nazi regime claimed that it was under no obligation for the humane care of prisoners of war from the Red Army because the Soviet Union had not ratified the 1929 Geneva Convention on Prisoners of War, nor had it specifically declared its commitment to the 1907 Hague Convention on the Rules of War.

https://roanoke.com/archive/prisoner-of-war-s/article_5bda2cdf-63cc-5574-99e0-de12eb59bf91.html

Quote
World War II: Germans typically treated American POWs in alignment with the Geneva Convention of 1929, which first addressed POW issues.

https://www.h-net.org/reviews/showrev.php?id=9088

Quote
Still, as Vasilis Vourkoutiotis argues in this very structured study, the case of British and American POWs was unlike that of other POWs held by Nazi Germany and deserves to be examined in its own terms. The combination of three basic facts made it unique: Great Britain and the United States were never occupied by the Wehrmacht, the claim of British and American POWs to be protected by the 1929 Geneva Convention was never disputed by Germany (in contrast to the claim of captured Polish and Soviet soldiers), and there were numerous German POWs held by British and American forces (about three hundred thousand by the end of the war). Thus, whereas Soviet POWs captured by Germany were either murdered outright or held in atrocious conditions (resulting in mortality rates of around 60 percent), British and American POWs experienced treatment, "at a 'satisfactory' level or above," through most of the war (p. 195). Yet, as Vourkoutiotis correctly points out, this "did not necessarily mean that the requirements of the Geneva Convention were being met" (p. 195).

Therefore, the aim of Prisoners of War and the German High Command is straightforward: to examine to what degree the policies of the German High Command (Oberkommando der Wehrmacht or OKW) vis-=-vis British and American POWs consistently conformed to the stipulations of the Geneva Convention, and to investigate whether the de facto treatment followed OKW policies. Differently put, was it OKW policy that facilitated "satisfactory" material conditions in most of the camps, and was it the very same policy that resulted in a number of flagrant violations of the Geneva Convention. Thus, although the issue of OKW culpability in war crimes never receives more than a passing mention, it is implicitly present throughout the book.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on February 27, 2022, 04:17:40 AM
Tom out here saying hitler was a little out of line in WWII like it would have been fine for Americans to have gassed every POW and citizen in internment camps because Pearl Harbor happened. Trollolol

That's not how it works though. If you are at war you only treat enemy POWs in a certain way if they have an agreement to treat your POWs in that way.

The Soviets didn't ratify the Geneva convention, for example. The Germans therefore treated the American and British POWs a lot better than the Soviet POWs, who they enslaved and slaughtered at will. Reminder that this is a war.
Incorrect.  Germany signed the Geneva Convention and was therefore bound by its rules, even if the Soviets weren't.   Mein Kampf detailed what Hitler thought about the communists too and he hated the Communists almost as much as he hated the Jews.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: crutonius on February 27, 2022, 06:15:49 AM
I get the impression that Tom Bishop is the sort of guy who watches 300 and roots for Xerxes
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on February 27, 2022, 07:56:04 AM
Tom out here saying hitler was a little out of line in WWII like it would have been fine for Americans to have gassed every POW and citizen in internment camps because Pearl Harbor happened. Trollolol

That's not how it works though. If you are at war you are only obligated to treat enemy POWs in a certain way if they have an agreement to treat your POWs in that

Are you saying that everyone in Dachau, Auschwitz, etc we’re Soviet soldiers, enemy POWs?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: AllAroundTheWorld on February 27, 2022, 08:30:53 AM
Tom out here saying hitler was a little out of line in WWII like it would have been fine for Americans to have gassed every POW and citizen in internment camps because Pearl Harbor happened. Trollolol
It’s such blatant trolling I don’t know why anyone bothers to engage. I don’t know if he’s on commission for how many posts he can generate but he must be rich if so.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on February 27, 2022, 09:27:50 AM
Tom out here saying hitler was a little out of line in WWII like it would have been fine for Americans to have gassed every POW and citizen in internment camps because Pearl Harbor happened. Trollolol
It’s such blatant trolling I don’t know why anyone bothers to engage. I don’t know if he’s on commission for how many posts he can generate but he must be rich if so.
Yep.  Obvious troll is obvious.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on February 27, 2022, 09:43:39 AM
Tom out here saying hitler was a little out of line in WWII like it would have been fine for Americans to have gassed every POW and citizen in internment camps because Pearl Harbor happened. Trollolol
It’s such blatant trolling I don’t know why anyone bothers to engage. I don’t know if he’s on commission for how many posts he can generate but he must be rich if so.
Yep.  Obvious troll is obvious.

Super obvious. Even above the normal trolling level. It’s just funny to see actually how far he’ll go. Will he break through the holocaust denial troll barrier? We shall see.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on February 27, 2022, 10:54:22 AM
Tom out here saying hitler was a little out of line in WWII like it would have been fine for Americans to have gassed every POW and citizen in internment camps because Pearl Harbor happened. Trollolol
It’s such blatant trolling I don’t know why anyone bothers to engage. I don’t know if he’s on commission for how many posts he can generate but he must be rich if so.
Yep.  Obvious troll is obvious.

Super obvious. Even above the normal trolling level. It’s just funny to see actually how far he’ll go. Will he break through the holocaust denial troll barrier? We shall see.

The man has broken the "basic physics" troll barrier.
He has no barriers now.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tom Bishop on February 27, 2022, 02:00:28 PM
Yeah, "troll". I think you really mean that you have no rebuttal to the fact that the Jews as a race declared war on Germany before Germany declared official sanctions on the Jews.

Have you heard about Mein Kampf?  He explained exactly what he thought about the Jews and what he planned to do about them once he got the chance.

I've looked into that. It says nothing about murdering the Jews. The Nazi solution was originally to deport them.

https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/the-final-solution

Quote
Did the Nazis always plan to murder the Jews?

No. When the Nazis came to power in Germany in 1933, they did not have a plan to murder the Jews of Europe. However, the Nazis were antisemitic. They saw Jews in Germany as a problem. One of the major questions for the Nazis was: How do we get rid of the Jewish population in Germany? This was often referred to by the Nazis as the “Jewish Question.”

Mass murder was not the Nazis’ first solution to the “Jewish Question.” In fact, the Nazis experimented with a variety of anti-Jewish policies and plans. For example, throughout the 1930s, they tried to force Jews to emigrate.

Quote from: markjo
Right.  Attacking one radio station justified taking over the whole country and the rest of Europe.  It seems that dictators have a problem with proportional responses.

From what Hitler said in quotes from the previous link (https://carolynyeager.net/gleiwitz-%E2%80%9Cfalse-flag%E2%80%9D-incident-pure-fiction) the country was being harassed:

(https://i.imgur.com/YPKslFw.png)

It would be easy to see how that could escalate.

Also, everyone knew by that point that there was a war building up between the powers. It didn't just happen out of the blue. Hence why Poland would mobilize its army.

Here are some quotes to research:


Sounds pretty aggressive to me. I don't know why you are assuming that Poland was purely innocent in that situation, or the other Allied powers for that matter.


Feel free to perform a search on that. If Churchill really said that and felt that way, it can hardly be claimed that Hitler was truly making naked acts of aggression like popularly claimed.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: garygreen on February 27, 2022, 02:14:11 PM
a ukraine thread in which tim uses literal nazi propaganda to justify why it was okay to liquidate millions of jews simply for being jews.

sometimes i hate this forum.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Dr Van Nostrand on February 27, 2022, 03:04:20 PM
It was pretty clear historically that Hitler hated the Jews long before any of this Naxi propaganda was printed. It's the same hate boner that rages anti-Semites to shoot up synagogues today.
That's why people like Tom call Jewish people a 'race.' It's another way to make them different and hate on them.

Did anyone else notice that the original image in Tom's 2:03 post changed? It was literally and obviously a fake newspaper headline and now it's just a quote. I wonder if the hate mongers really fall for this stupid crap or if they just think they'll fool others with it.

 
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on February 27, 2022, 03:15:43 PM
It was pretty clear historically that Hitler hated the Jews long before any of this Naxi propaganda was printed. It's the same hate boner that rages anti-Semites to shoot up synagogues today.
That's why people like Tom call Jewish people a 'race.' It's another way to make them different and hate on them.

Did anyone else notice that the original image in Tom's 2:03 post changed? It was literally and obviously a fake newspaper headline and now it's just a quote. I wonder if the hate mongers really fall for this stupid crap or if they just think they'll fool others with it.

Tom is known for making quick posts then editing them when he realizes they'll break character or expose something obvious.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tom Bishop on February 27, 2022, 03:21:07 PM
The newspaper headline isn't fake.

Here is a copy of the front page on Archive.org: https://archive.org/details/judea-declares-war-on-germany_202006

(https://i.imgur.com/tzX6qun.jpg)

Here is another version of the newspaper with slightly different graphics on Archive.org which has the full paper: https://archive.org/details/Httpsarchive.orgdetailsJudeadeclareswarongermany/Daily%20Express%20-%20Judea%20Declares%20War%20on%20Germany/24-3-1933/Pagina%201%20-%20Portada/mode/1up

(https://i.imgur.com/mzLW3Tq.jpg)

Looks pretty real to me.

Next go to the Daily Express Archive at https://www.ukpressonline.co.uk/ukpressonline/?sf=express and search for the date "24/03/1933" in the date field. The graphic in the first result clearly has the same headline "Judea Declares War on Germany", although you need to subscribe to see the full paper:

(https://i.imgur.com/P47CCtn.png)

Are you saying that everyone in Dachau, Auschwitz, etc we’re Soviet soldiers, enemy POWs?

The Germans possibly could have seen them as enemy POWs like the Soviet POWs at the time. It seems possible that they could have seen them that way, yes. I wasn't there. But if you want to avoid being killed my advice would be not to declare war on people.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Dr Van Nostrand on February 27, 2022, 06:19:56 PM
This is what Hitler was saying in 1920 to cheering crowds...

"This is the first demand we must raise and do [reversal of the Versailles Treaty provisions]: that our people be set free, that these chains be burst asunder, that Germany be once again captain of her soul and master of her destinies, together with all those who want to join Germany. (Applause)

And the fulfillment of this first demand will then open up the way for all the other reforms.  And here is one thing that perhaps distinguishes us from you [Austrians] as far as our programme is concerned, although it is very much in the spirit of things: our attitude to the Jewish problem.

For us, this is not a problem you can turn a blind eye to-one to be solved by small concessions.  For us, it is a problem of whether our nation can ever recover its health, whether the Jewish spirit can ever really be eradicated.  Don't be misled into thinking you can fight a disease without killing the carrier, without destroying the bacillus.  Don't think you can fight racial tuberculosis without taking care to rid the nation of the carrier of that racial tuberculosis.  This Jewish contamination will not subside, this poisoning of the nation will not end, until the carrier himself, the Jew, has been banished from our midst. (Applause)



Hitler was a creature of hate. Your attempt to paint him as a persecuted soul defending his home is as wrong as painting the earth as flat.

But this really reveals how you actually feel about members of the 'Jewish race.'
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tom Bishop on February 27, 2022, 06:32:15 PM
I didn't say that Hitler was innocent in this. I said that the Jews were not completely innocent. I'm pretty sure that many politicians in the past have said that illegal aliens need to go, or that x group is a problem. That's not an act of war, however, and exists as rhetoric in a speech until acted upon. You could listen to another politician the next day saying that Soviets bad, or Muslims bad.

The fact remains that the Jews struck at Germany before official sanctions were placed against them.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on February 27, 2022, 06:41:34 PM
The fact remains that the Jews struck at Germany before official sanctions were placed against them.
What military force did the Jews use to strike at Germany?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on February 27, 2022, 09:56:57 PM
Are you saying that everyone in Dachau, Auschwitz, etc we’re Soviet soldiers, enemy POWs?

The Germans possibly could have seen them as enemy POWs like the Soviet POWs at the time. It seems possible that they could have seen them that way, yes. I wasn't there. But if you want to avoid being killed my advice would be not to declare war on people.

Let me get this straight. You're saying that if, for example, some Christians "declared war" on a country, that that targeted country should round up all the Christians they can find, lock them up, then mutilate, shoot, or gas them? And this is the outcome people should expect?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tom Bishop on February 27, 2022, 10:20:05 PM
Let me get this straight. You're saying that if, for example, some Christians "declared war" on a country, that that targeted country should round up all the Christians they can find, lock them up, then mutilate, shoot, or gas them? And this is the outcome people should expect?

Considering that it has happened numerous times before in holy wars and ethnic wars, yes, people should expect that it could be the outcome of a war.

Here are a few - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_cleansing_campaigns

Quote
146 BC: The Battle of Carthage was the main engagement of the Third Punic War between the Punic city of Carthage in what is now the country of Tunisia and the Roman Republic. It was a siege operation, starting sometime between 149 and 148 BC, and ending in the spring of 146 BC with the sack and complete destruction of the city of Carthage. In the spring of 146 BC, the Romans broke through the city wall, eventually after hours upon hours of house-to-house fighting, the Carthaginians surrendered. An estimated 50,000 surviving inhabitants were sold into slavery. The city was then leveled. The land surrounding Carthage was eventually declared ager publicus (public land), and it was shared between local farmers, and Roman and Italian ones.
..
350 AD: Ancient Chinese texts record that General Ran Min ordered the extermination of the Wu Hu, especially the Jie people, during the Wei–Jie war in the fourth century AD. People with racial characteristics such as high-bridged noses and bushy beards were killed; in total, 200,000 were reportedly massacred.[2]
..
1069-1070 William the Conqueror devastated Northern England in what is now known as the Harrying of the North. During the Campaign, William pillaged and destroyed numerous towns and cities; destroying all of the region's food supplies with the intent to starve its population during the winter. Only a quarter of Northern England's population remained after the war.
..
1290 AD: Edward I of England expelled all of the Jews who were living in England in 1290. Hundreds of Jewish elders were executed.[4]
..
From 1894 to 1896, in an effort to islamize the Ottoman Empire, Sultan Abdul Hamid II ordered the killing of ethnic Armenians (along with other Christian minorities) living in the Ottoman Empire, based on their religion.
..
During the Balkan Wars ethnic cleansings were carried out in Kosovo, Macedonia, Sanjak and Thrace, at first, they were committed against the Muslim population, but later, they were also committed against Christians, villages were burned and people were massacred.
..
The Armenian genocide which occurred during World War I was implemented in two phases: the wholesale killing of the able-bodied male population through massacres and forced labor, and the deportation of women, children, the elderly and the infirm to the Syrian Desert on death marches.
..
The Bolshevik regime killed or deported an estimated 300,000 to 500,000 Don Cossacks during the Russian Civil War, in 1919–1920.[52] Geoffrey Hosking stated "It could be argued that the Red policy towards the Don Cossacks amounted to ethnic cleansing.
..
The Holodomor (1932–1933) is considered by many historians as a genocidal famine perpetrated on the orders of Josef Stalin that involved widespread ethnic cleansing of ethnic Ukrainians in Soviet Ukraine.
..
In 1947, the Jammu Massacre took place. The event has been described as ethnic cleansing of Muslims in the Jammu region of Jammu and Kashmir.

Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: JSS on February 28, 2022, 02:12:17 AM
Now that the Ukraine invasion is probing to be a series of screw-ups by the Russian military, I wonder if Trump will finally stop calling Putin a genius.

It's well known that the one thing Trump hates most is a loser, and I have to imagine he will abandon his buddy Putin the moment it looks like he might be associated with losing.

I'll be watching the news to see the first signs of Trump doing a 180 and claiming he hardly knew the guy.  ::)
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on February 28, 2022, 04:02:05 AM
https://www.theburningplatform.com/2022/02/27/report-from-an-american-in-ukraine/

Different point of view from most.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on February 28, 2022, 05:41:02 AM
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/2/27/western-media-coverage-ukraine-russia-invasion-criticism
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on February 28, 2022, 05:46:43 AM
https://www.theburningplatform.com/2022/02/27/report-from-an-american-in-ukraine/

Different point of view from most.

I stopped watching after 40 seconds.
I don't see the invasion as not succeeding because infrastrructure is still standing.  I see it as not succeeding because they haven't taken a few major cities despite trying.  Despite everyone thinking Russia would roll over Ukraine. 
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Iceman on February 28, 2022, 01:30:36 PM
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/2/27/western-media-coverage-ukraine-russia-invasion-criticism

I read this yesterday and it was, admittedly, a sad reminded of how short my memory is…
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: AllAroundTheWorld on March 01, 2022, 09:05:16 AM
Submitted without comment...

(https://i.ibb.co/R3mh81y/HTPHUkraine.jpg)
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Fortuna on March 11, 2022, 01:51:20 AM
I wonder if this guy is still alive. It was posted several days ago on Plebbit.

(https://i.imgur.com/bHsGDL6.jpg)
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: AllAroundTheWorld on March 14, 2022, 04:37:53 PM
This’ll sort it out!

https://metro.co.uk/2022/03/14/elon-musk-challenges-vladimir-putin-to-face-him-in-single-combat-16272014/
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on March 14, 2022, 10:21:11 PM
This’ll sort it out!

https://metro.co.uk/2022/03/14/elon-musk-challenges-vladimir-putin-to-face-him-in-single-combat-16272014/
... that's just dumb.  Musk would be beaten to a pulp.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Fortuna on March 14, 2022, 11:46:03 PM
This’ll sort it out!

https://metro.co.uk/2022/03/14/elon-musk-challenges-vladimir-putin-to-face-him-in-single-combat-16272014/
... that's just dumb.  Musk would be beaten to a pulp.

I don't know. Elon is way bigger, younger and can probably download any fighting style into his brain.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Dr Van Nostrand on March 15, 2022, 11:50:42 AM
This’ll sort it out!

https://metro.co.uk/2022/03/14/elon-musk-challenges-vladimir-putin-to-face-him-in-single-combat-16272014/
... that's just dumb.  Musk would be beaten to a pulp.

I don't know. Elon is way bigger, younger and can probably download any fighting style into his brain.

Putin was killing people back when Elon was still in grade school.

Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Pete Svarrior on March 15, 2022, 03:05:27 PM
... that's just dumb.  Musk would be beaten to a pulp.
Don't say that like it's a bad thing.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on March 15, 2022, 05:52:24 PM
... that's just dumb.  Musk would be beaten to a pulp.
Don't say that like it's a bad thing.

It is a bad thing.
If he survives, he'll whine about it for decades.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on March 16, 2022, 07:59:28 PM
False flag coming?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IRJ4umS7dJA&t=310s
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Dr Van Nostrand on March 16, 2022, 08:47:19 PM
False flag coming?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IRJ4umS7dJA&t=310s

More hating America Propaganda from a communist sympathizer posted by a communist sympathizer.

This man's hateful rant is reflection on himself, particularly the "small penis energy" he talks about. Google this person, he's a loser.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Fortuna on March 21, 2022, 07:27:02 AM
If they really wanted to make some big city moves, NK would just start artillerying SK, China would take Taiwan, and Russia would keep rolling their tanks to Paris. And there's not a lot anyone could do about it.

Well this aged poorly. Russian tanks appear to be made out of cardboard.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on March 21, 2022, 08:37:50 PM
Russian tanks appear to be made out of cardboard.
I wouldn't necessarily criticize the quality of the Russian tanks.  One should take into account the vast resources put into a number of weapons systems whose sole function in life is to kill armored vehicles, especially tanks.  With man portable systems like Javelin and NLAW, who needs an A-10?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: xasop on March 21, 2022, 08:42:21 PM
It's a testament to enduring human stupidity that Putin has done more in the past month to motivate the West to reduce its reliance on unsustainable energy sources than half a century of climate science.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on March 22, 2022, 07:33:37 PM
It's a testament to enduring human stupidity that Putin has done more in the past month to motivate the West to reduce its reliance on unsustainable energy sources than half a century of climate science.

Maybe that was what the war on terror was about?  Make the Middle East so hated, we refuse their oil?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tom Bishop on March 23, 2022, 12:36:17 PM
Muh Ukraine

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=toGMjVVhkiM
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rama Set on March 23, 2022, 01:36:39 PM
Virtue signaling about the war in Ukraine:

(https://i.ibb.co/zPsD957/rn-Zl-JGXa7-GMl.png)
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on March 23, 2022, 05:09:39 PM
Muh Ukraine

Who is that guy in the video? And why should I listen to him?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on March 23, 2022, 08:49:15 PM
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/03/23/up-to-40000-russian-soldiers-killed-wounded-captured-or-mia-nato-says.html

Quote
between 7,000 and 15,000 Russian troops have died

To put this into perspective, 2,401 US troops were killed over the course of 20 years in Afghanistan.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Pete Svarrior on March 25, 2022, 03:35:10 PM
With peacekeeping operations like this one, who needs wars?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on March 25, 2022, 05:49:55 PM
This is peace keeping 101 mild version. The west and EU are scared sheetess from an economy no bigger than Texas. That's one BIG STICK !

Germany, Austria, and Hungary are acting as ‘brakes’ now, running for the hills. Arab countries have already said no mass to any sanctions.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on March 25, 2022, 07:48:23 PM
This is peace keeping 101 mild version. The west and EU are scared sheetess from an economy no bigger than Texas. That's one BIG STICK !

Germany, Austria, and Hungary are acting as ‘brakes’ now, running for the hills. Arab countries have already said no mass to any sanctions.

(https://www.transportenvironment.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/final-PR-2.png)
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on March 25, 2022, 08:23:00 PM
Russia told Poland, pay in rubles or no gas for you bitchez. Poland will crumble to mini texas gas and oil..lol Oh and the largest most sophisticated Nuke inventory in da world.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Pete Svarrior on March 25, 2022, 09:03:04 PM
Russia told Poland, pay in rubles or no gas for you bitchez.
That's not quite what happened. Putin told Gazprom to make it happen. Gazprom asked. Predictably, they got told that's not how contracts work.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: xasop on March 25, 2022, 09:16:34 PM
That's not quite what happened. Putin told Gazprom to make it happen. Gazprom asked. Predictably, they got told that's not how contracts work.
I think we're well past the point of Putin giving the slightest fuck about international law.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Pete Svarrior on March 25, 2022, 09:22:12 PM
I think we're well past the point of Putin giving the slightest fuck about international law.
Of course; but so far there is no indication that anyone will accept this unilateral change of contract.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on March 25, 2022, 10:18:29 PM
This is peace keeping 101 mild version. The west and EU are scared sheetess from an economy no bigger than Texas. That's one BIG STICK !
Not nearly as  big a stick as their nearly 6000 nuclear warheads.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on March 26, 2022, 12:43:25 AM
Russia has em where they want them. LNG is no walk in the park. It's compressed gas 600 to 1 and not really that safe. Now you need plants and pipelines to turn it back into natural gas while sending it on it's way. Will take years to build the seaport infrastructure. Russia doesn't need to import much from the west or EU. China is supplying most their needs. Germany who has already said No Mass sells em machinery and parts as they gobble gas. You could find new suppliers. These sanctions will backfire on the west and eu
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on March 26, 2022, 01:16:26 AM
Russia has em where they want them. LNG is no walk in the park. It's compressed gas 600 to 1 and not really that safe. Now you need plants and pipelines to turn it back into natural gas while sending it on it's way. Will take years to build the seaport infrastructure. Russia doesn't need to import much from the west or EU. China is supplying most their needs. Germany who has already said No Mass sells em machinery and parts as they gobble gas. You could find new suppliers. These sanctions will backfire on the west and eu

The US has sold LNG to the EU for decades. The new deal just means several billion more cubic meters of LNG (at a higher cost than Russian gas). The US is making a lot of money on this deal and no new infrastructure is needed. The only difference is more boats will be traveling across the Atlantic and... that's it.

It also means overall higher pressure for the EU to move away from fossil fuels in general. Once that happens, Russia, alongside the middle east, will die a little death. Then the West can finally move on from pretending these shithole countries actually matter beyond some black fluid they happen to have beneath their feet.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on March 26, 2022, 01:17:31 AM
Once Russia is done "demilitarizing" and "de-nazifing" Ukraine, I can't help but to wonder who is going to rebuild all the infrastructure, industry, housing, etc. that is currently being destroyed.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on March 26, 2022, 02:54:40 AM
Russia has em where they want them. LNG is no walk in the park. It's compressed gas 600 to 1 and not really that safe. Now you need plants and pipelines to turn it back into natural gas while sending it on it's way. Will take years to build the seaport infrastructure. Russia doesn't need to import much from the west or EU. China is supplying most their needs. Germany who has already said No Mass sells em machinery and parts as they gobble gas. You could find new suppliers. These sanctions will backfire on the west and eu

The US has sold LNG to the EU for decades. The new deal just means several billion more cubic meters of LNG (at a higher cost than Russian gas). The US is making a lot of money on this deal and no new infrastructure is needed. The only difference is more boats will be traveling across the Atlantic and... that's it.

It also means overall higher pressure for the EU to move away from fossil fuels in general. Once that happens, Russia, alongside the middle east, will die a little death. Then the West can finally move on from pretending these shithole countries actually matter beyond some black fluid they happen to have beneath their feet.

You might want to remove the your head from el kester, you are totally mistaken.  2030 is the best they hope for..hope a dope

https://www.naturalgasintel.com/can-the-united-states-really-send-more-lng-to-europe/
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on March 26, 2022, 02:58:10 AM
Once Russia is done "demilitarizing" and "de-nazifing" Ukraine, I can't help but to wonder who is going to rebuild all the infrastructure, industry, housing, etc. that is currently being destroyed.

No one ever really rebuilds these places, besides several billion peeps will be dead from the vaccine and new bio weapons they release.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on March 26, 2022, 03:22:02 AM
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/03/23/up-to-40000-russian-soldiers-killed-wounded-captured-or-mia-nato-says.html

Quote
between 7,000 and 15,000 Russian troops have died

To put this into perspective, 2,401 US troops were killed over the course of 20 years in Afghanistan.

too much lies and western media, you'll never learn.

More than 1,300 servicemen have been killed and nearly 4,000 injured in the offensive in Ukraine, the Russian military says

https://www.rt.com/russia/552708-ukraine-conflict-military-casualties/

This is why one must look at both sides because satan is a liar.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on March 26, 2022, 03:30:44 AM
You might want to remove the your head from el kester, you are totally mistaken.  2030 is the best they hope for..hope a dope

https://www.naturalgasintel.com/can-the-united-states-really-send-more-lng-to-europe/

I see you're a huge fan of linking articles you didn't read and that disagree with the point you're trying to make. Within a year, they're cutting gas imports from Russia by 2/3. That's an enormous hit to Russia's already devastated shithole economy. By this time next year they'll be lucky if they still have breadlines to stand in.

It hardly matters. By this time next year, Putin will be dead and this will all blow over as the Russian government is reorganized.

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/03/23/up-to-40000-russian-soldiers-killed-wounded-captured-or-mia-nato-says.html

Quote
between 7,000 and 15,000 Russian troops have died

To put this into perspective, 2,401 US troops were killed over the course of 20 years in Afghanistan.

too much lies and western media, you'll never learn.

More than 1,300 servicemen have been killed and nearly 4,000 injured in the offensive in Ukraine, the Russian military says

https://www.rt.com/russia/552708-ukraine-conflict-military-casualties/

This is why one must look at both sides because satan is a liar.

So, at best, a shithole fighting some other shithole lost 1300 people in a single month vs the US losing 2400 over the course of 20 years. Fascinating.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on March 26, 2022, 06:11:04 AM
Russia has em where they want them. LNG is no walk in the park. It's compressed gas 600 to 1 and not really that safe. Now you need plants and pipelines to turn it back into natural gas while sending it on it's way. Will take years to build the seaport infrastructure. Russia doesn't need to import much from the west or EU. China is supplying most their needs. Germany who has already said No Mass sells em machinery and parts as they gobble gas. You could find new suppliers. These sanctions will backfire on the west and eu

The US has sold LNG to the EU for decades. The new deal just means several billion more cubic meters of LNG (at a higher cost than Russian gas). The US is making a lot of money on this deal and no new infrastructure is needed. The only difference is more boats will be traveling across the Atlantic and... that's it.

It also means overall higher pressure for the EU to move away from fossil fuels in general. Once that happens, Russia, alongside the middle east, will die a little death. Then the West can finally move on from pretending these shithole countries actually matter beyond some black fluid they happen to have beneath their feet.

You might want to remove the your head from el kester, you are totally mistaken.  2030 is the best they hope for..hope a dope

https://www.naturalgasintel.com/can-the-united-states-really-send-more-lng-to-europe/

Norway is, of course, happy to sell Natural Gas to Europe. :D
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on March 27, 2022, 12:45:30 AM
You might want to remove the your head from el kester, you are totally mistaken.  2030 is the best they hope for..hope a dope

https://www.naturalgasintel.com/can-the-united-states-really-send-more-lng-to-europe/

I see you're a huge fan of linking articles you didn't read and that disagree with the point you're trying to make. Within a year, they're cutting gas imports from Russia by 2/3. That's an enormous hit to Russia's already devastated shithole economy. By this time next year they'll be lucky if they still have breadlines to stand in.

It hardly matters. By this time next year, Putin will be dead and this will all blow over as the Russian government is reorganized.

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/03/23/up-to-40000-russian-soldiers-killed-wounded-captured-or-mia-nato-says.html

Quote
between 7,000 and 15,000 Russian troops have died

To put this into perspective, 2,401 US troops were killed over the course of 20 years in Afghanistan.

too much lies and western media, you'll never learn.

More than 1,300 servicemen have been killed and nearly 4,000 injured in the offensive in Ukraine, the Russian military says

https://www.rt.com/russia/552708-ukraine-conflict-military-casualties/

This is why one must look at both sides because satan is a liar.

So, at best, a shithole fighting some other shithole lost 1300 people in a single month vs the US losing 2400 over the course of 20 years. Fascinating.

Putin would tip the sanction scale, not so much the death scale.

https://www.reddit.com/r/ROI/comments/tl3no9/10_wars_6_million_deaths_0_sanctions/
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on March 27, 2022, 01:49:46 AM
You might want to remove the your head from el kester, you are totally mistaken.  2030 is the best they hope for..hope a dope

https://www.naturalgasintel.com/can-the-united-states-really-send-more-lng-to-europe/

I see you're a huge fan of linking articles you didn't read and that disagree with the point you're trying to make. Within a year, they're cutting gas imports from Russia by 2/3. That's an enormous hit to Russia's already devastated shithole economy. By this time next year they'll be lucky if they still have breadlines to stand in.

It hardly matters. By this time next year, Putin will be dead and this will all blow over as the Russian government is reorganized.

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/03/23/up-to-40000-russian-soldiers-killed-wounded-captured-or-mia-nato-says.html

Quote
between 7,000 and 15,000 Russian troops have died

To put this into perspective, 2,401 US troops were killed over the course of 20 years in Afghanistan.

too much lies and western media, you'll never learn.

More than 1,300 servicemen have been killed and nearly 4,000 injured in the offensive in Ukraine, the Russian military says

https://www.rt.com/russia/552708-ukraine-conflict-military-casualties/

This is why one must look at both sides because satan is a liar.

So, at best, a shithole fighting some other shithole lost 1300 people in a single month vs the US losing 2400 over the course of 20 years. Fascinating.

Putin would tip the sanction scale, not so much the death scale.

https://www.reddit.com/r/ROI/comments/tl3no9/10_wars_6_million_deaths_0_sanctions/

What were the 10 wars? I count 3 and am missing 7. Not giving those folks pictured a bye (maybe Laura & Michelle) but not sure what the other ones are.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rama Set on March 27, 2022, 01:57:17 AM
https://www.infoplease.com/history/us/major-military-operations-since-world-war-ii

Here you go Stack.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on March 27, 2022, 03:05:01 AM
https://www.infoplease.com/history/us/major-military-operations-since-world-war-ii

Here you go Stack.
I think he might have been referring to this list of wars:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_Russia#Russian_Federation_(1991%E2%80%93present)
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rama Set on March 27, 2022, 09:45:03 AM
https://www.infoplease.com/history/us/major-military-operations-since-world-war-ii

Here you go Stack.
I think he might have been referring to this list of wars:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_Russia#Russian_Federation_(1991%E2%80%93present)

No. Jman linked to a post showing a picture of every president (and HRC) since 1988 and captioned “10 wars and 6 million dead” or something.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on March 27, 2022, 02:18:32 PM
https://www.reddit.com/r/ROI/comments/tl3no9/10_wars_6_million_deaths_0_sanctions/

So? The US is powerful and we do what we want. Russia is weak and we will not allow it to do what it wants. It's that simple. We collapsed the USSR because it was annoying and in the way. Russia should have learned to stay in its lane. Putin will be strung out like Gaddafi soon and it'll be his own fault.

Russia is unable to accept its own weakness; it's led by a man who is also unable to accept his own weakness and mortality.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on March 27, 2022, 03:07:48 PM
https://www.infoplease.com/history/us/major-military-operations-since-world-war-ii

Here you go Stack.
I think he might have been referring to this list of wars:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_Russia#Russian_Federation_(1991%E2%80%93present)

No. Jman linked to a post showing a picture of every president (and HRC) since 1988 and captioned “10 wars and 6 million dead” or something.
Right.  Russia was involved in at least 10 wars during that time and zero sanctions were imposed by those presidents.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on March 28, 2022, 05:18:59 PM
https://www.infoplease.com/history/us/major-military-operations-since-world-war-ii

Here you go Stack.

Aww, I see. I was thinking of the wars the US initiated.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on April 04, 2022, 02:27:21 AM
Ruble has recovered, Germany is about to go drunk with inflation as most the world as fiat dies globally. Meanwhile Russia has more gold than the US and coupled with China they control all physical gold now with 32,000 tons combined. I hope Biden didn't sell off the vault like the strategic oil reserves.

https://kingworldnews.com/russia-holds-more-gold-than-us-russia-and-china-now-possess-a-jaw-dropping-32000-tonnes-of-gold/
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on April 04, 2022, 04:49:53 AM
Ruble has recovered, Germany is about to go drunk with inflation as most the world as fiat dies globally. Meanwhile Russia has more gold than the US and coupled with China they control all physical gold now with 32,000 tons combined. I hope Biden didn't sell off the vault like the strategic oil reserves.

https://kingworldnews.com/russia-holds-more-gold-than-us-russia-and-china-now-possess-a-jaw-dropping-32000-tonnes-of-gold/

Are you in support of Russia and the invasion?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on April 04, 2022, 06:09:23 PM
I support JESUS.

I shop at Walmart so I guess you could say I support China :0) but don't we all in some form?

I don't vote and haven't for 30 years, Politicians are as corrupt as satan. I haven't watched TV and commercials for close to 20 years. I don't Facebook, twit, apple googley or any other controlling crap. I didn't  Nam, I went to college and met/hugged Hanoi Jane, she was HOT while smelling sooo sweet. I foster dad and had my brain shrunk by the State of Cali, so I could. They found me very acceptable.

I like alternative media and hate the deceit were fed by most social media outlets. They all sold out to satan.

The earth is FLAT, I've seen it.

Is Russian Vodka Good? If so, I support that. 
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on April 04, 2022, 06:35:31 PM
I support JESUS.

Was Jesus Russian? Would Jesus invade Ukraine?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Dr Van Nostrand on April 04, 2022, 07:55:49 PM
I support JESUS.

Dude, we've discussed this before. That voice in your head is not Jesus, it's your own delusional anger, fear,  self-righteousness and darkness.

By the way, Satan publishes a lot of information in the alternative media as well as the mainstream media.

You're just another pawn that Putin is using to slowly take control of this country just like he did in Venezuela. While you sit there and pontificate about your self-righteous Jesus power, corrupt politicians are taking power all around you. Seems like you're a really big man fighting Satan. What about fighting government corruption and Injustice in this world?

We're out here protecting your freedom to spread your judgment and condemnation on everyone around you.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on April 04, 2022, 08:31:41 PM
Russia is a shining beacon of civilization and beauty. Anyone who has been there will attest to that (or else).
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on April 04, 2022, 10:21:59 PM
I support JESUS.

Was Jesus Russian? Would Jesus invade Ukraine?

Jesus is GOD and yes he will invade Ukraine, one of the most corrupt countries in the world with the sword of truth in his mouth. You best have repented,  The gates are pretty damn narrow.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on April 04, 2022, 10:28:38 PM
I support JESUS.

Was Jesus Russian? Would Jesus invade Ukraine?

Jesus is GOD and yes he will invade Ukraine, one of the most corrupt countries in the world with the sword of truth in his mouth. You best have repented,  The gates are pretty damn narrow.

Isn't God God? Or are you referring to the Trinity thing? Jesus seems more of just his millennial offspring who thinks everyone should get a trophy.

So Jesus invaded Ukraine? Is Putin actually Jesus? I thought Dad was the wrathful one and the kid was more the peace, love, and understanding hippie type.

Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on April 04, 2022, 10:54:59 PM
I support JESUS.

Dude, we've discussed this before. That voice in your head is not Jesus, it's your own delusional anger, fear,  self-righteousness and darkness.

By the way, Satan publishes a lot of information in the alternative media as well as the mainstream media.

You're just another pawn that Putin is using to slowly take control of this country just like he did in Venezuela. While you sit there and pontificate about your self-righteous Jesus power, corrupt politicians are taking power all around you. Seems like you're a really big man fighting Satan. What about fighting government corruption and Injustice in this world?

We're out here protecting your freedom to spread your judgment and condemnation on everyone around you.

My freedom came from Jesus dieing on the cross, you game me nuttin. You spread death and destruction right?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on April 04, 2022, 11:33:18 PM
I support JESUS.

Was Jesus Russian? Would Jesus invade Ukraine?

Jesus is GOD and yes he will invade Ukraine, one of the most corrupt countries in the world with the sword of truth in his mouth. You best have repented,  The gates are pretty damn narrow.
Would you say that Russia is more corrupt or less corrupt than Ukraine?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on April 04, 2022, 11:51:35 PM
I support JESUS.

Was Jesus Russian? Would Jesus invade Ukraine?



Jesus is GOD and yes he will invade Ukraine, one of the most corrupt countries in the world with the sword of truth in his mouth. You best have repented,  The gates are pretty damn narrow.
Would you say that Russia is more corrupt or less corrupt than Ukraine?

https://www.investmentwatchblog.com/ukraine-is-the-most-corrupt-globalist-owned-country-in-the-world-its-literally-the-cabals-headquarters/

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Corruption is widespread in Ukrainian society.[1][2] In 2012 Ernst & Young put Ukraine among the three most-corrupt nations of the world—alongside Colombia and Brazil.[3]

Stop with your nonsense. 10% to the big guy
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on April 05, 2022, 12:01:14 AM
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Corruption is widespread in Ukrainian society.[1][2] In 2012 Ernst & Young put Ukraine among the three most-corrupt nations of the world—alongside Colombia and Brazil.[3]
So why hasn't Jesus (Russia) invaded Colombia or Brazil yet?

Stop with your nonsense. 10% to the big guy
Why do you think the Big Guy wants 10% of anything that I have? ???

Or do you mean 10% to the church (as if there's no corruption going on there)?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Pete Svarrior on April 05, 2022, 12:04:46 AM
Corruption is widespread in Ukrainian society. In 2012 Ernst & Young put Ukraine among the three most-corrupt nations of the world—alongside Colombia and Brazil.
My dude, that was before the Maidan uprising, the very same event that Russia is trying to undo. By supporting their invasion, you're proposing that the corruption in Ukraine should be restored. You have fallen for Satan's demonic tricks, hook, line, and sinker.

Why do you think the Big Guy wants 10% of anything that I have? ???
He's referencing the Hunter conspiracy theory, like the Satanic puppet he is. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10254295/What-Big-Guy-Joe-Biden-said-Hunters-business-partner-Tony-Bobulinski-discreet-hotel-meeting.html
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on April 05, 2022, 12:29:34 AM
Corruption is widespread in Ukrainian society. In 2012 Ernst & Young put Ukraine among the three most-corrupt nations of the world—alongside Colombia and Brazil.
My dude, that was before the Maidan uprising, the very same event that Russia is trying to undo. By supporting their invasion, you're proposing that the corruption in Ukraine should be restored. You have fallen for Satan's demonic tricks, hook, line, and sinker.

Why do you think the Big Guy wants 10% of anything that I have? ???
He's referencing the Hunter conspiracy theory, like the Satanic puppet he is. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10254295/What-Big-Guy-Joe-Biden-said-Hunters-business-partner-Tony-Bobulinski-discreet-hotel-meeting.html

You cherry pick the older opinion not the lastest. There are 10's of publications out there of their current corruption.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on April 05, 2022, 06:22:40 AM
Corruption is widespread in Ukrainian society. In 2012 Ernst & Young put Ukraine among the three most-corrupt nations of the world—alongside Colombia and Brazil.
My dude, that was before the Maidan uprising, the very same event that Russia is trying to undo. By supporting their invasion, you're proposing that the corruption in Ukraine should be restored. You have fallen for Satan's demonic tricks, hook, line, and sinker.

Why do you think the Big Guy wants 10% of anything that I have? ???
He's referencing the Hunter conspiracy theory, like the Satanic puppet he is. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10254295/What-Big-Guy-Joe-Biden-said-Hunters-business-partner-Tony-Bobulinski-discreet-hotel-meeting.html

You cherry pick the older opinion not the lastest. There are 10's of publications out there of their current corruption.

I googled "most corrupt countries", first link, not cherry-picked, as of 2022.

Russia ranks #46. Ukraine doesn't make the top 50. It's at #63:

Most Corrupt Countries 2022 (https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/most-corrupt-countries)
(https://i.imgur.com/umjRJ9i.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/6NIg3B6.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/3X3o0pk.png)

In another ranking from the Wharton School, Russia is #5 most corrupt:

(https://i.imgur.com/qCUPbe3.png)

I think your Jesus is mistaken.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Pete Svarrior on April 05, 2022, 08:52:13 AM
You cherry pick the older opinion not the lastest. There are 10's of publications out there of their current corruption.
Yes, it's a work in progress. Nonetheless, restoring evil to the region is not going to help.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on April 12, 2022, 06:19:19 PM
RT brought on watch for a false flag coming. We had Bucha nonsense which failed as Russia pulled out troops days before and Bucha was a russian sympathizer its alleged. Now we get Mariupol chemical attack. More fake news? why?

 https://www.foxnews.com/world/ukraine-marine-unit-in-mariupol-fighting-update-russian-military

RT ran news that Russian troops have had control of Mariupol for 5 weeks+ and that very high level military and political people are trapped inside the city. Some may even be Western/EU troops according to news. No foreign troops in mariupol..hmmm I pretty sure Putin is NEVER going to allow UN inspectors in to free these peeps. (fake chemmy or not) No Putin will use these peeps to show the world the lies, if they are true?

Ukraine has no more bullets in their revolver. They've played all the cards they have, waiting on the west and EU to run in and save the day?

https://www.rt.com/news/553772-pentagon-cant-confirm-mariupol-attack/
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on April 14, 2022, 07:51:20 PM
A Russian missile cruiser magically exploded all on its own. At least, that's what Russia would prefer you believe instead of it getting hit by a missile.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Pete Svarrior on April 14, 2022, 08:34:37 PM
A Russian missile cruiser magically exploded all on its own. At least, that's what Russia would prefer you believe instead of it getting hit by a missile.
I really hope the Russian military vessel actually went to fuck itself
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Kokorikos on April 15, 2022, 07:49:03 AM
A Russian missile cruiser magically exploded all on its own. At least, that's what Russia would prefer you believe instead of it getting hit by a missile.

It is still unconfirmed if it was hit or if it was caused by a fire on board.
I think that both alternatives are embarrassing for Russia.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on April 15, 2022, 01:32:28 PM
Russia sunk its warship to own the libs.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-61114843

The cosmic meme of a ship named Moscow blowing up due to Russian incompetence and sinking is one that is almost too good to be true. I almost wouldn't believe it had Russia not confirmed it themselves.

Also: "A furious ex-MP, Vladimir Bortko, said the sinking of the Moskva was grounds for war" Are Russian ex-MPs not aware that they're... already at war...?

Additionally:

"Russia says it has hit a plant making anti-aircraft and anti-ship missiles outside the Ukrainian capital, Kyiv" -BBC (https://www.bbc.com/news/live/world-europe-61101906)

Looks like Russia is trying to make sure none of its other ships magically blow up all on their own, too.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Pete Svarrior on April 15, 2022, 01:51:01 PM
Also: "A furious ex-MP, Vladimir Bortko, said the sinking of the Moskva was grounds for war" Are Russian ex-MPs not aware that they're... already at war...?
They're not. It's a special whatchamacallit, remember?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on April 15, 2022, 02:00:09 PM
Also: "A furious ex-MP, Vladimir Bortko, said the sinking of the Moskva was grounds for war" Are Russian ex-MPs not aware that they're... already at war...?
They're not. It's a special whatchamacallit, remember?

Ah right, of course, a special peacekeeping mission. There to keep the peace. Enforce the peace. It will be peaceful. Involuntarily peaceful.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Pete Svarrior on April 15, 2022, 02:35:57 PM
Ah right, of course, a special peacekeeping mission. There to keep the peace. Enforce the peace. It will be peaceful. Involuntarily peaceful.
(https://i.imgur.com/YmrzUTD.png)
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: junker on April 15, 2022, 03:31:14 PM
Also: "A furious ex-MP, Vladimir Bortko, said the sinking of the Moskva was grounds for war" Are Russian ex-MPs not aware that they're... already at war...?
They're not. It's a special whatchamacallit, remember?

Ah right, of course, a special peacekeeping mission. There to keep the peace. Enforce the peace. It will be peaceful. Involuntarily peaceful.


Quote from: Peacemaker
I cherish peace with all my heart. I don’t care how many men, women, and children I need to kill to get it.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on April 15, 2022, 06:13:35 PM
https://www.zerohedge.com/military/russian-long-range-bombers-strike-ukraine-1st-time-war

"Ukrainian defense ministry spokesman Oleksandr Motuzyanyk said Friday that bombs were dropped by Tu-22M3 aircraft over positions in the port city of Mariupol. "

(https://assets.zerohedge.com/s3fs-public/styles/inline_image_mobile/public/inline-images/Tu-22M3.jpg?itok=36ZiKp6w)

Mariupol will not be lost..Putin is containing the high level NATO boys and politicians.

Just ask this guy !

https://www.rt.com/russia/553933-british-captive-mariupol-ukraine-reality/

(https://cdni.russiatoday.com/files/2022.04/l/62596e9f2030275ab15cc0e5.jpg)
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on April 15, 2022, 06:38:06 PM
Imagine still going for the "Russia stronk" meme after they lose one of their best warships to a country that has no navy.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: JSS on April 15, 2022, 08:21:29 PM
Can you imagine what the rest of the world would be doing to Russia right now if it wasn't sitting on a stockpile of nukes?

They would have gotten kicked right back across the border and all their ships within range of Ukraine sunk in the first week. Any Russian plane coming close to the border would be flaming wreckage.

Putin sure has done a good job of showing the world just how outclassed they really are.

Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tom Bishop on April 16, 2022, 09:35:36 PM
Imagine still going for the "Russia stronk" meme after they lose one of their best warships to a country that has no navy.

They aren't just fighting Ukraine. Ukraine is receiving billions of $ in money and weapons from NATO and US-allied countries to fight Russia - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_foreign_aid_to_Ukraine_during_the_Russo-Ukrainian_War

It's in the tens of billions if you count all that up.

Recent from the US:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-04-13/biden-announces-800-million-weapons-package-for-ukraine

Quote
President Joe Biden is sending Ukraine $800 million in new firepower -- including artillery, helicopters, ammunition and other military hardware that will test the limits of how far aid can go without drawing the U.S. directly into the war.

-

Biden’s announcement will be the biggest test yet of how far the U.S. can go in supplying arms without spurring a Russian response. The package will for the first time include 18 155 mm Howitzer artillery systems, Pentagon spokesman John Kirby said Wednesday.

The U.S. will also send 10 counter-artillery radar systems, 200 M113 armored personnel carriers, 100 Humvees and 300 more Switchblade drones, according to a list released by the Pentagon. Ukrainians will require some training on radars and artillery systems, Kirby said.

The Pentagon will also send unmanned surface vessels for coastal defense as well as individual chemical-biological protective suits and detection systems.

The new shipment will add to more than $2.4 billion in security assistance the U.S. has provided to Ukraine since Biden took office last year, including $1.7 billion since Russia invaded Ukraine on Feb. 24.

Test the limits of direct warfare with Russia. Smart.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Fortuna on April 16, 2022, 09:51:53 PM
Russia got what they wanted. NATO isn't interfering directly. It's not anyone else's fault that their military sucks ass.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on April 16, 2022, 10:07:35 PM
Russia got what they wanted. NATO isn't interfering directly. It's not anyone else's fault that their military sucks ass.

That's one of the most ignorant statements I've ever seen. I'm American and Russia has a devastating nuclear sub fleet, that can sit right off my coasts not detected. They can literally dispose of life as we know it. Only an idiot would underestimate an opponent.

It's getting VERY close to game time. Grab your nut sack.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Fortuna on April 16, 2022, 10:30:17 PM
Russia has a devastating nuclear sub fleet, that can sit right off my coasts not detected.

Yes, and if they were actually that crazy they could just threaten nukes for anything.
"Give us this trade deal or else"
"Move US military bases out of Europe or else" etc...

Acquiescing to their every demand would be just as dangerous as marching US soldiers to Moscow.

Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on April 16, 2022, 11:16:11 PM
Russia got what they wanted. NATO isn't interfering directly. It's not anyone else's fault that their military sucks ass.

That's one of the most ignorant statements I've ever seen. I'm American and Russia has a devastating nuclear sub fleet, that can sit right off my coasts not detected. They can literally dispose of life as we know it. Only an idiot would underestimate an opponent.

It's getting VERY close to game time. Grab your nut sack.

Given that Russia can't even hold a city 50 miles from its border, you really think that their nuclear arsenal is capable of anything? Nuclear weapons are incredibly expensive to maintain. Submarines even more so. Russia can't afford to keep a single aircraft carrier operational annually. Their nuclear arsenal is likewise just a bunch of numbers on paper. They're not real. It costs the US approximately 50 billion dollars to maintain nuclear capabilities. That's almost the entirety of Russia's military budget.

Russia keeps threatening use of nuclear weapons. "We'll nuke Ukraine!" ... "We'll nuke Finland if they join NATO!" ... Well, guess what. I don't see any nukes. Russia a bad joke and it's time we deliver the punchline to their face.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Fortuna on April 16, 2022, 11:34:56 PM
Given that Russia can't even hold a city 50 miles from its border, you really think that their nuclear arsenal is capable of anything? Nuclear weapons are incredibly expensive to maintain. Submarines even more so. Russia can't afford to keep a single aircraft carrier operational annually. Their nuclear arsenal is likewise just a bunch of numbers on paper. They're not real. It costs the US approximately 50 billion dollars to maintain nuclear capabilities. That's almost the entirety of Russia's military budget.

Russia keeps threatening use of nuclear weapons. "We'll nuke Ukraine!" ... "We'll nuke Finland if they join NATO!" ... Well, guess what. I don't see any nukes. Russia a bad joke and it's time we deliver the punchline to their face.

Let's not do that either, though. You know, just in case they actually do work. If even 10% of them work it would be a bad time.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on April 16, 2022, 11:47:02 PM
Let's not do that either, though. You know, just in case they actually do work. If even 10% of them work it would be a bad time.

Fortunately our defense systems are decades ahead of Russia. This entire war is in part due to Russia getting mad about those very same defense systems being stationed in Romania and Poland, drastically reducing (and possibly eliminating) their first strike capabilities. Russia knows it probably can't do anything anymore and it has no way to 100% test it without risking itself getting obliterated in the process.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on April 17, 2022, 01:33:19 AM
I'm American and Russia has a devastating nuclear sub fleet, that can sit right off my coasts not detected. They can literally dispose of life as we know it. Only an idiot would underestimate an opponent.
Yes, Putin would be an idiot to underestimate America's devastating nuclear capabilities.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: JSS on April 17, 2022, 11:57:12 AM
Test the limits of direct warfare with Russia. Smart.

Putin is the one testing the limits here.

Do you think the entire world should just sit back and let a crazed dictator invade country after country? That's not smart.

Only a moron would think he's going to stop at Ukraine. He's already threatening more countries.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Dr Van Nostrand on April 17, 2022, 01:32:37 PM
When Russia says to you, "You're not allowed to join NATO." You know you need to join NATO.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on April 17, 2022, 02:30:23 PM
Putin says Happy Easter...Kinda

"In its ceasefire proposal, the Russian military said that the remaining troops are in a “hopeless situation, with virtually no food and water,” citing the contents of hundreds of radio intercepts on Saturday alone. The holed-up fighters allegedly “persistently request permission from the officials in Kiev to lay down their arms and surrender,” while the Ukrainian authorities “categorically forbid it under the threat of wartime executions,” Moscow claimed."

https://www.rt.com/russia/554005-russia-mariupol-surrender-terms/


When they surrender Mariupol today, Putin will have a Kangeroo court extract world wide knowledge of who was who inside.

Christ has Risen !

Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on April 17, 2022, 04:58:06 PM
Putin says Happy Easter...Kinda
Orthodox Easter is next Sunday.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: JSS on April 17, 2022, 10:10:55 PM
Putin says Happy Easter...Kinda

"In its ceasefire proposal, the Russian military said that the remaining troops are in a “hopeless situation, with virtually no food and water,” citing the contents of hundreds of radio intercepts on Saturday alone. The holed-up fighters allegedly “persistently request permission from the officials in Kiev to lay down their arms and surrender,” while the Ukrainian authorities “categorically forbid it under the threat of wartime executions,” Moscow claimed."

https://www.rt.com/russia/554005-russia-mariupol-surrender-terms/


When they surrender Mariupol today, Putin will have a Kangeroo court extract world wide knowledge of who was who inside.

Christ has Risen !

Oh yay, more lies from Putin's propaganda news website.  I just don't understand why people worship men like him.  What is the attraction?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on April 17, 2022, 10:26:25 PM
Putin says Happy Easter...Kinda

"In its ceasefire proposal, the Russian military said that the remaining troops are in a “hopeless situation, with virtually no food and water,” citing the contents of hundreds of radio intercepts on Saturday alone. The holed-up fighters allegedly “persistently request permission from the officials in Kiev to lay down their arms and surrender,” while the Ukrainian authorities “categorically forbid it under the threat of wartime executions,” Moscow claimed."

https://www.rt.com/russia/554005-russia-mariupol-surrender-terms/


When they surrender Mariupol today, Putin will have a Kangeroo court extract world wide knowledge of who was who inside.

Christ has Risen !

Oh yay, more lies from Putin's propaganda news website.  I just don't understand why people worship men like him.  What is the attraction?
Power.  Determination.  Decisiveness.
Everything others lack.  They see him what they want to be.  And trust me, those people really want to be able to just shoot their boss and anyone else they feel is "lazy" or "incompetent".
Instead they're stuck at a dead end job they hate, working for a boss they hate, and can't make up their own fucking mind about anything except how much they wish they could make decisions.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on April 17, 2022, 11:14:13 PM
Oh yay, more lies from Putin's propaganda news website.  I just don't understand why people worship men like him.  What is the attraction?
It's called a cult of personality.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cult_of_personality
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: JSS on April 18, 2022, 11:37:04 AM
Oh yay, more lies from Putin's propaganda news website.  I just don't understand why people worship men like him.  What is the attraction?
It's called a cult of personality.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cult_of_personality

I understand the concept, I just can't see what the draw to men like Putin and Trump is. They don't look strong to me, they just look like assholes. Their power is entirely based on throwing other people under the bus and sacrificing them for their own personal gain. Why would anyone want to attach themselves to someone like that who is clearly just going to use you and throw you away the moment you're no longer useful to them?

Putin looks weak to me.  It's like conservatives think that eagerness to pull the trigger of a gun is strength, when it's just fear.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: xasop on April 18, 2022, 12:32:51 PM
I understand the concept, I just can't see what the draw to men like Putin and Trump is. They don't look strong to me, they just look like assholes. Their power is entirely based on throwing other people under the bus and sacrificing them for their own personal gain. Why would anyone want to attach themselves to someone like that who is clearly just going to use you and throw you away the moment you're no longer useful to them?
You just described every successful dictator in history.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on April 20, 2022, 03:46:10 PM
(https://assets.zerohedge.com/s3fs-public/styles/inline_image_mobile/public/inline-images/sarmat_0.jpg?itok=zw8-kbKR)

What is "kinetic impact energy"?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Dr Van Nostrand on April 20, 2022, 03:59:48 PM
(https://assets.zerohedge.com/s3fs-public/styles/inline_image_mobile/public/inline-images/sarmat_0.jpg?itok=zw8-kbKR)

What is "kinetic impact energy"?

Do you really not know or is this just another troll for Satan or Jesus or whatever?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on April 20, 2022, 07:49:27 PM
No please explain Dr., looks as big as Fatman.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on April 20, 2022, 10:38:42 PM
I don't know why you're posting a picture of a missile, but it's one of these:

By the end of the year (2021), the Russian military will conduct two test launches of its RS-28 Sarmat (NATO reporting name: SS-X-29), according to a source in the Russian defense industry. The liquid-fueled, MIRV-equipped (multiple independently targetable reentry vehicle) super-heavy intercontinental missile has been in development at the Makeye Rocket Design Bureau since 2009.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on April 21, 2022, 01:34:24 PM
It's the Satan-II missile and it's one of the only things keeping Putin alive. The biggest fear is now that Putin has been embarrassed by failing to take cities only 50 miles from his own border, he'll start using nukes. Like many authoritarians, he is a whiny manchild who hates looking like an idiot on the world stage. His entire identity is built around his own ego and failure does him more damage than you could hope to achieve by any other means. Imagine spending decades spinning this fantasy tale of being a strategic mastermind KGB agent and you blow it all away in only 2 months by telegraphing your incompetence to every corner of the world.

Our biggest concern should be the reports that his internal propaganda is still very strong and Russians genuinely believe he's destroying a Nazi regime in Ukraine. Doubly concerning that his propaganda has managed to turn Americans against their own government in favor of a country they've never stepped foot in.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on May 03, 2022, 01:57:45 PM
https://www.cnn.com/2022/05/03/europe/russia-ukraine-declaration-of-war-intl-hnk-ml/index.html

Putin may officially declare war on Ukraine soon, finally admitting to the war they've been waging for about two months now...
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Fortuna on May 03, 2022, 06:12:58 PM
So instead of flooding somewhat trained soldiers into a meat grinder, they’re going to flood totally untrained soldiers into it.

There’s also this https://twitter.com/ohra_aho/status/1521464911515332608?s=21&t=nB2ivG5OVoOr3d2cKzvB9A

Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on May 03, 2022, 09:16:31 PM
Apparently Putin is supposed to temporarily hand over power while having surgery.  If true, that would be the ideal time to do it.  "Complications" during surgery happen all the time, right?  :-X
https://www.indiatoday.in/world/story/putin-undergo-cancer-surgery-hand-over-power-report-1944927-2022-05-03
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Fortuna on May 03, 2022, 10:34:19 PM
It looks like that dude is just a Putin clone. A possible upside is that he surely doesn't have manlet syndrome.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rama Set on May 04, 2022, 02:25:57 AM
Apparently Putin is supposed to temporarily hand over power while having surgery.  If true, that would be the ideal time to do it.  "Complications" during surgery happen all the time, right?  :-X
https://www.indiatoday.in/world/story/putin-undergo-cancer-surgery-hand-over-power-report-1944927-2022-05-03

Maybe he will accidentally fall out a window, during surgery.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on May 04, 2022, 07:16:45 AM
You're missing the bigger word there: Cancer.
Its possible he's in a later stage of cancer and thats what prompted the war.  The "I need to rebuild the USSR before I die, which i can now see."

He's gonna die sooner than he thought and he wants a legacy.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Dr Van Nostrand on May 04, 2022, 11:35:32 AM
You're missing the bigger word there: Cancer.
Its possible he's in a later stage of cancer and thats what prompted the war.  The "I need to rebuild the USSR before I die, which i can now see."

He's gonna die sooner than he thought and he wants a legacy.

And since Putin knows he's going to die anyway, he doesn't care if he destroys the whole world chasing his legacy.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on May 07, 2022, 07:38:13 PM
Dear Mr. Poopie Pants and cellar pusher man, Russian economy is vibrant while mine is collapsing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kwc-XBjl1tc&t=242s
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Pete Svarrior on May 07, 2022, 07:54:06 PM
Russian economy is vibrant while mine is collapsing.
lmao when was the last time you've looked at the Russian economy? It wasn't vibrant before it imploded, and imploding didn't help.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on May 07, 2022, 08:17:21 PM
https://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=RUB&to=USD&view=2Y

ruble chart to dollar. They are killing it. Bank interest rates are down 17 to 14% with maybe GDP coming in 10% light, yet to be seen as Gov Fuel sales are up 80% 1st Q.

Now here in the state we are suckin so bad, inflation pushing 20% Brandon printing Trillions a day it seems and giving it away to a dead Ukraine for what? yeah the 10% big guy. Food fuel thru the roof.

https://www.rt.com/business/555097-russia-sanctions-recession-economist/

Oh and guess what, our gold was lent out, we own none. $ is worthless. Ruble backed by Gods Money

Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Pete Svarrior on May 07, 2022, 08:18:52 PM
ruble chart to dollar
Have you considered looking into *why* that is? Their imports no longer exist, so the currency is strong. Hypothetically, at least - there isn't really much trade going on. That is no indicator of how well their economy is doing, nor is it going to last particularly long until they change course.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on May 07, 2022, 08:46:32 PM
Ive kept abreast of world economics for decades. Here's a chart of the dollar https://www.tradingview.com/symbols/TVC-DXY/

The ruble would be and is smoking the dollar as you see its extensive rise the last year +. Russia weened itself off the dollar for most but swift action. It mostly deals in Euro Yuan and Ruble.

The Fed is trapped and can't raise rates much more and regardless we can't afford the debt anyway. The world has caught on and is again purchasing a lot of gold to use as central reserves. The US dollar imo has seen the strength and may continue to see more as the world begins to try to settle their contractual dollar debts asap. This outs a strain on the buck and increases its value until suck time nations move into new financial platforms of trade. The buck is a weapon now, no one really wants it. We'll see a Yuan/gold backed like Ruble with maybe a Euro. The US will try some crypto funny coin to be able to print again like crazy. Don't expect it to be accepted.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on May 07, 2022, 09:27:01 PM
Ive kept abreast of world economics for decades.
Then you're aware that the US GDP is about 15 times bigger than Russia's, right?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on May 07, 2022, 11:02:08 PM
Ive kept abreast of world economics for decades.
Then you're aware that the US GDP is about 15 times bigger than Russia's, right?
You do realize the US GDP is a bunch of nonsense, right? Consisting of 300 million spenders who make squat and have an average income of 5 times that of a Russian, yet Russia is the leading WORLD exporter Nat Gas and Wheat let alone

"The nation is a leading producer of coal, diamonds, aluminum, asbestos, gemstones, diamonds, lime, lead, gypsum, iron ore, bauxite, gallium, boron, mica, natural gas, potash, platinum, oil, rare earth metals, pig iron, peat, nitrogen, cadmium, arsenic, magnesium, molybdenum, phosphate, sulfur, titanium sponge, silicon, uranium, tellurium, vanadium, tungsten, cobalt, graphite, silver, vermiculite, selenium, rhenium, copper, and gold."

https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/what-are-the-major-natural-resources-of-russia.html

I would say they kick our ass pound for pound but most americans a soo fricken obese, they win any pound for pound !
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on May 11, 2022, 01:23:15 PM
"The nation is a leading producer of coal, diamonds, aluminum, asbestos, gemstones, diamonds, lime, lead, gypsum, iron ore, bauxite, gallium, boron, mica, natural gas, potash, platinum, oil, rare earth metals, pig iron, peat, nitrogen, cadmium, arsenic, magnesium, molybdenum, phosphate, sulfur, titanium sponge, silicon, uranium, tellurium, vanadium, tungsten, cobalt, graphite, silver, vermiculite, selenium, rhenium, copper, and gold."

Africa produces all of these raw resources as well. Are you going to start yammering on about the epic power of the African economy? Russia is a poor nation with no industrial power, it's why they export all of their raw resources instead of using them, because they quite simply can't use them. It's a shithole. I don't understand why you've decided to bask in the glorious shining shit that it is. I suggest you move there and spend a few days finding out just how much a shithole it is then come back and appreciate what you've been given in America (and sure as hell do not deserve!).

You should be so lucky we're not in Russia, as I'd be a commissar and I'd be executing people like you for posting anti-government propaganda.

In other news:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/natural-gas-prices-rise-in-europe-after-ukraine-cuts-flows-11652255011

Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on May 14, 2022, 10:01:19 PM
If Ukrainian intelligence is to be believed, there is supposedly a military coup underway to remove Putin.
https://www.newsweek.com/coup-putin-russia-ukraine-general-cancer-kyrylo-budanov-1706685
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on May 15, 2022, 01:44:55 AM
Planar Moderator aka Rushy

On a mostly satanic site, great resume. I seriously doubt you'd be elected to much anywhere.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on May 15, 2022, 05:56:34 AM
Planar Moderator aka Rushy

On a mostly satanic site, great resume. I seriously doubt you'd be elected to much anywhere.

Does anyone actually get freely elected in Russia?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on May 16, 2022, 02:37:31 AM
Planar Moderator aka Rushy

On a mostly satanic site, great resume. I seriously doubt you'd be elected to much anywhere.

If I were a satanist I'd be busy posting missiles literally named "SATAN", glorifying the slaughter of human beings, laughing about Europe running out of energy and dying in the cold. Wait, that's you! You do that!

Enjoy hell, demonic scum. The Lord will burn you away from my great nation like the cancer you are.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Crudblud on May 16, 2022, 05:48:40 AM
How has this thread stayed in the Lounge of all places for so long?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on May 17, 2022, 02:27:38 AM
https://www.zerohedge.com/military/least-300-azov-fighters-surrender-russians-azovstal-plant-ending-lengthy-siege

Russia now controls all mariupol.  Peace was spread to the survivors.

Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on June 01, 2022, 03:25:58 PM
https://www.defenseone.com/policy/2022/05/us-sending-ukraine-advanced-rockets-kyiv-promises-not-fire-russia/367588/

Can't see how giving Ukraine rocket artillery with ~50 miles of range can go wrong.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: crutonius on June 01, 2022, 04:12:20 PM
It really wouldn't be in their best interest to attack Russia itself as from the occasional ammo or fuel depot.  I'm pretty sure Ukraine knows that.

Also the triple 7's we've been giving them have enough range to attack cities in Russia from Kharkiv so it doesn't add much risk to Russian territory.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on June 02, 2022, 01:47:19 PM
It really wouldn't be in their best interest to attack Russia itself as from the occasional ammo or fuel depot.  I'm pretty sure Ukraine knows that.

Also the triple 7's we've been giving them have enough range to attack cities in Russia from Kharkiv so it doesn't add much risk to Russian territory.

Expecting a country being torn apart to act rationally is a mistake. Further, adding fuel to an already raging fire simply because it hasn't gotten out of hand yet is not a fantastic idea.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Pete Svarrior on June 02, 2022, 01:49:01 PM
The alternative seems to be appeasing Russia while it's led by an insane man - I would not expect for him to act rationally either. You could argue that non-involvement is an option, but that's largely the same as letting Russia grow bolder.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on June 02, 2022, 01:58:42 PM
The alternative seems to be appeasing Russia while it's led by an insane man - I would not expect for him to act rationally either. You could argue that non-involvement is an option, but that's largely the same as letting Russia grow bolder.

We have plenty of other weapons to lob into Ukraine that don't involve long range strike capability that Ukraine frankly doesn't need nor do they have the intelligence capacity to use on their own. What we're doing is giving a country weapons and intelligence to the point that we're already far too involved. There's a difference between increasing resistance to the Russian invasion versus fighting an ever more direct war with Russia itself.

We're walking a fine line where one side is a literal apocalypse and the other is letting one corrupt shithole heavily damage another. It's not fair to the Ukrainian people, but it's also not fair to the rest of the planet to antagonize an increasingly unstable nuclear nation. Appeasement isn't a naughty word we should never engage in. This isn't WWII where it's just some Nazis, planes and tanks, it's a possible nuclear exchange scenario where we back Russia into a corner so far that their government destabilizes. Putin may not be the most stable man around, but all it takes is one enraged general who thinks Putin is a coward who won't "fight for the Russian people" or whatever to pop shit off in such a way that we can't put the genie back in the bottle.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: crutonius on June 02, 2022, 02:12:43 PM
I think its a mistake to assume that there's some kind of rulebook that Putin is referring to if he's deciding if he's okay with a particular weapon or not.  He's not a statesman.  He's a thug.  The only thing these people understand is power.  Frankly I think it's a mistake not to give Ukraine even more advanced weapons asap.

Also kicking an invading army out of the country is hardly backing them into a corner. 

Russia is nowhere near collapse.  A nation like Russia can take an enormous amount of punishment before it collapses.  In ww2 things were so bad they had to run public service announcements telling starving peasants not to cannibalize their children.  They still held up.

We've tried appeasing Putin many times.  Chechnya, Georgia, Ukraine, Ukraine again, Ukraine for a third time.  I suppose if we appease him this one last time he might stop.  It has to work eventually right?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on June 02, 2022, 02:24:09 PM
I think its a mistake to assume that there's some kind of rulebook that Putin is referring to if he's deciding if he's okay with a particular weapon or not.  He's not a statesman.  He's a thug.  The only thing these people understand is power.  Frankly I think it's a mistake not to give Ukraine even more advanced weapons asap.

Huh? No one mentioned a rulebook. What thread are you reading?

Also kicking an invading army out of the country is hardly backing them into a corner. 

I'm referring to their economic sanctions, not anything to do with Ukraine itself.

Russia is nowhere near collapse.  A nation like Russia can take an enormous amount of punishment before it collapses.  In ww2 things were so bad they had to run public service announcements telling starving peasants not to cannibalize their children.  They still held up.

Defaulting on their international debt proves otherwise. The last time the Russians had economic problems, the USSR dissolved and we ended up with some very nasty nuclear weapons talks to avoid unstable governments having access to nuclear weapons and ensure the continuation of the central Russian government. I'd rather avoid that again (and you should too!).

We've tried appeasing Putin many times.  Chechnya, Georgia, Ukraine, Ukraine again, Ukraine for a third time.  I suppose if we appease him this one last time he might stop.  It has to work eventually right?

In each of those times we successfully avoided nuclear war. Avoiding nuclear war has been the entire goal of all geopolitics since the US dropped two bombs on Japan.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: crutonius on June 02, 2022, 02:38:29 PM
I was referring to some theoretical line we could cross, arms-wise, where Russia would be justified to strike a NATO aligned country to stop the shipments.  He'll strike if he thinks he can get away with it, not because we sent Ukraine something too dangerous to Russia.

North Korea still exists with as much sanctions as Russia has.  They're too broke to invade anyone.  That's sort of the goal.

Ironically a lot of those nukes were in Ukraine.  They gave them up for Russia's guarantee to not invade them.  Again I seriously doubt that the sanctions we've put on them are likely to cause Russia to collapse.

Maybe I'm wrong but I just don't think that giving up chunks of territory to anyone threatening nuclear war is a great foreign policy.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Pete Svarrior on June 02, 2022, 02:47:01 PM
In each of those times we successfully avoided nuclear war.
I dunno, Putin is still saying he'll totally start a nuclear war. Postponing it while giving him time to grow stronger (regardless of whether he squandered it) doesn't seem to have worked out so far.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on June 02, 2022, 03:23:02 PM
In each of those times we successfully avoided nuclear war.
I dunno, Putin is still saying he'll totally start a nuclear war. Postponing it while giving him time to grow stronger (regardless of whether he squandered it) doesn't seem to have worked out so far.

There is no surviving a nuclear war, how strong (or weak) he grows is irrelevant when just 10% of Russia's nuclear arsenal could render the planet uninhabitable. Letting him take chunks out of his neighbors is a very easy price to pay for not dying in WWIII. He knows this, which is why it's his strategy to just do a bit at a time. If he were truly an unstable madman, he'd be invading all of his neighbors simultaneously while egging NATO. The fact that he has never done that is a great indicator that he hasn't completely lost his sanity just yet.

Maybe I'm wrong but I just don't think that giving up chunks of territory to anyone threatening nuclear war is a great foreign policy.

Why? At what point do you say "I'm willing to gamble the entire planet's habitability on this piece of land"? A lot of these arguments sound more like a desire to not "let Putin win" or some other egotistical gibberish versus the actual stakes at hand here. I would let Putin take all of non-nuclear Europe before I gamble a single American getting wiped by a Russian nuke. If Russia nukes us, we have to nuke them back, then the entire planet loses. Yes, the whole planet. A worldwide extinction event that humanity may not survive (and if it does, we lose several thousand years of civilizational progress over the course of a few days).

It doesn't make sense to risk nuclear war over some muddy terrain in Eastern Europe. Quite literally anything we do to Russia ratchets up the chance they end the world. It would be the irrational choice, yes, but massive wars have started over irrational choices that were easily avoided.



Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on June 02, 2022, 03:30:24 PM
By that logic, wouldn't it also work if the US said "We'll nuke you unless you stop"?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: crutonius on June 02, 2022, 04:24:22 PM
In each of those times we successfully avoided nuclear war.
I dunno, Putin is still saying he'll totally start a nuclear war. Postponing it while giving him time to grow stronger (regardless of whether he squandered it) doesn't seem to have worked out so far.

There is no surviving a nuclear war, how strong (or weak) he grows is irrelevant when just 10% of Russia's nuclear arsenal could render the planet uninhabitable. Letting him take chunks out of his neighbors is a very easy price to pay for not dying in WWIII. He knows this, which is why it's his strategy to just do a bit at a time. If he were truly an unstable madman, he'd be invading all of his neighbors simultaneously while egging NATO. The fact that he has never done that is a great indicator that he hasn't completely lost his sanity just yet.

Maybe I'm wrong but I just don't think that giving up chunks of territory to anyone threatening nuclear war is a great foreign policy.

Why? At what point do you say "I'm willing to gamble the entire planet's habitability on this piece of land"? A lot of these arguments sound more like a desire to not "let Putin win" or some other egotistical gibberish versus the actual stakes at hand here. I would let Putin take all of non-nuclear Europe before I gamble a single American getting wiped by a Russian nuke. If Russia nukes us, we have to nuke them back, then the entire planet loses. Yes, the whole planet. A worldwide extinction event that humanity may not survive (and if it does, we lose several thousand years of civilizational progress over the course of a few days).

It doesn't make sense to risk nuclear war over some muddy terrain in Eastern Europe. Quite literally anything we do to Russia ratchets up the chance they end the world. It would be the irrational choice, yes, but massive wars have started over irrational choices that were easily avoided.

So your plan would be let anyone with a nuke take over as much territory as they want and hope that territory doesn't include where you happen to live?

Also, non nuclear?  Wouldn't the same logic hold up if Putin attacks a nuclear power?  By this logic shouldn't the US surrender if Russia threatens to nuke us?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Pete Svarrior on June 02, 2022, 05:05:31 PM
The fact that he has never done that is a great indicator that he hasn't completely lost his sanity just yet.
That's one possible explanation. I'm not convinced it's correct. Keep in mind that it wouldn't be Putin, personally, launching the nukes, and his generals have previously put the brakes on significantly smaller infractions than annihilating the world. Their loyalty is to their own comfort, not to Putin, and not to Russia.

Chances are that the moment he declares a nuclear strike, he gets shot in the head by a high-ranking official. He's done his fair share of shooting people in the head, so he likely realises that.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on June 02, 2022, 05:21:55 PM
By that logic, wouldn't it also work if the US said "We'll nuke you unless you stop"?

The US has a lot more to lose than Russia. It's like threatening the local homeless man you'll knock down his tent versus him threatening to topple your skyscrapers. The risk vs. reward is completely different. Russia is more willing to risk getting nuked to gain some territory than we are to protect it (which is why we aren't knocking down Putin's door with SEAL team six).

So your plan would be let anyone with a nuke take over as much territory as they want and hope that territory doesn't include where you happen to live?

Yes, because anything else involves inviting nuclear warfare. It's also why the US' supposed devotion to protecting Taiwan is meaningless and when China finally decides to take Taiwan by force, they'll eventually get it.


Also, non nuclear?  Wouldn't the same logic hold up if Putin attacks a nuclear power?  By this logic shouldn't the US surrender if Russia threatens to nuke us?

No, the same logic does not apply to a nuclear power. A nuclear power cannot invade another nuclear power. Again, this has been the basis for all geopolitics since the late 40's.

The fact that he has never done that is a great indicator that he hasn't completely lost his sanity just yet.
That's one possible explanation. I'm not convinced it's correct. Keep in mind that it wouldn't be Putin, personally, launching the nukes, and his generals have previously put the brakes on significantly smaller infractions than annihilating the world. Their loyalty is to their own comfort, not to Putin, and not to Russia.

Chances are that the moment he declares a nuclear strike, he gets shot in the head by a high-ranking official. He's done his fair share of shooting people in the head, so he likely realises that.

If we start reaching for assumptions that involve Putin behaving irrationally (though he has not seemed to have done so yet) then also reaching for the assumption that his colleagues are just as irrational as he is would be easy. We also don't know where the generals surrounding Putin have their loyalties. "To their own comfort" is merely an opinion and one that is not evident.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: crutonius on June 02, 2022, 05:25:28 PM

Also, non nuclear?  Wouldn't the same logic hold up if Putin attacks a nuclear power?  By this logic shouldn't the US surrender if Russia threatens to nuke us?

No, the same logic does not apply to a nuclear power. A nuclear power cannot invade another nuclear power. Again, this has been the basis for all geopolitics since the late 40's.


Aha.  So we give Ukraine, Taiwan and anyone we want to not get invaded their own set of nukes.

Problem solved.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Pete Svarrior on June 02, 2022, 05:27:03 PM
If we start reaching for assumptions that involve Putin behaving irrationally (though he has not seemed to have done so yet)
Most of his recent actions are largely described as irrational by people who know better than you or me. It could be that they're wrong and you're right, but it won't be as easy as dismissing this analysis as "reaching for assumptions".

then also reaching for the assumption that his colleagues are just as irrational as he is would be easy.
It would, were it not for their track record.

We also don't know where the generals surrounding Putin have their loyalties. "To their own comfort" is merely an opinion and one that is not evident.
Your opinion is also far from evident. Are we just gonna sit here and say "well gmm that's just your opinion" to each other, or do you want to try and have a discussion?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: AllAroundTheWorld on June 02, 2022, 05:54:54 PM
In each of those times we successfully avoided nuclear war.
I dunno, Putin is still saying he'll totally start a nuclear war. Postponing it while giving him time to grow stronger (regardless of whether he squandered it) doesn't seem to have worked out so far.
My nephew is convinced we are all about to die in a thermonuclear war (he’s an adult by the way, and he is prone to doom-mongering). I don’t think so because even if Putin is mad enough to push the button, which I doubt, in real life he doesn’t actually have a button. There are some checks and balances even in Russia and when push comes to shove I don’t think they’d actually launch. Prove me wrong, boys, prove me wrong!
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Fortuna on June 02, 2022, 06:21:27 PM
In each of those times we successfully avoided nuclear war.
I dunno, Putin is still saying he'll totally start a nuclear war. Postponing it while giving him time to grow stronger (regardless of whether he squandered it) doesn't seem to have worked out so far.
My nephew is convinced we are all about to die in a thermonuclear war (he’s an adult by the way, and he is prone to doom-mongering). I don’t think so because even if Putin is mad enough to push the button, which I doubt, in real life he doesn’t actually have a button. There are some checks and balances even in Russia and when push comes to shove I don’t think they’d actually launch. Prove me wrong, boys, prove me wrong!

Russia’s rhetoric is pretty effective. They are playing up their crazy villain persona that we see them as.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Pete Svarrior on June 02, 2022, 06:31:51 PM
There are some checks and balances even in Russia and when push comes to shove I don’t think they’d actually launch. Prove me wrong, boys, prove me wrong!
Egads, it sounds like we broadly agree. I'm not sure if I'd call it "checks and balances" (sounds way too codified), but I have some faith in the self-preservation instinct of the men in kushy dictatorship jobs.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on June 02, 2022, 07:44:02 PM
We could just cede Ukraine. Russia basically already has Belarus. The question becomes, what do we do if Russia gets super pissed with Finland and Sweden if they join NATO and decide to invade there? We'd be in the same MAD scenario only that NATO is forced to act militarily. The MAD call would be raised and someone has to lay down their cards and/or fold...Or launch nukes.

As others have pointed out, what happens elsewhere. Do we just let China take Taiwan because of nukes? NK take SK because they have nukes? Should the US (NATO) just back off from every scenario where a nuke power invades another nation? Just go full-on isolationist because of the perpetual threat of Nukes? Idk. But it seems like this isn't our first rodeo and the world hasn't become radioactively winterized because of past conflicts. Maybe this one is different. Hard to say.

And logically, (though logic may not apply), would Russia really nuke the planet? It seems counter-intuitive considering no one would get anything they want. It would all be gone. Think of how sad the oligarchs would be if their yachts were vaporized.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: crutonius on June 02, 2022, 08:02:32 PM
From what I understand, Russia's nuclear arsenals is controlled by the Strategic Rocket Forces which has a good degree of independent from their executive branch.

It may be the case that Putin can't just circumvent this separation of powers without the attempt being very visible.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: crutonius on June 02, 2022, 08:08:32 PM
There's also another problem with the strategy of letting psychos with nukes just have whatever they want; there's more than one psycho with a lot of nukes. 

Suppose we isolate.  Every bad actor with a nuclear arsenal starts grabbing land like a fire sale.  What happens if they start challenging each other?  I guess at least we can claim that the end of the world wasn't our fault.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on September 06, 2022, 06:51:30 PM
This video should really be on this thread as the groupies running this site wanted to blame Russia as the bad guy bully when it was obvious they were instigated ...wanna fight, f..k yeah

NOW freeze and die bitchez

https://rumble.com/v1ism72-they-finally-admitted-it.html
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on September 06, 2022, 07:39:35 PM
Russia doesn't invade

russia invaded with peace keepers in 2022

Really makes you think, doesn't it?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: crutonius on September 06, 2022, 08:29:36 PM
This video should really be on this thread as the groupies running this site wanted to blame Russia as the bad guy bully when it was obvious they were instigated ...wanna fight, f..k yeah

NOW freeze and die bitchez

https://rumble.com/v1ism72-they-finally-admitted-it.html

I was under the impression that Joe Biden, with his powerful intellect and sharp wit, tricked Putin into special military operationing Ukraine.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on September 06, 2022, 08:34:15 PM
Russia doesn't invade

russia invaded with peace keepers in 2022

Really makes you think, doesn't it?

Not really, it's like you telling me "that's sick". Can have positive or negative connotations.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on September 06, 2022, 09:23:53 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzgPJeYZaOU
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on September 06, 2022, 10:41:50 PM
J-man, have you ever considered the possibility that former Warsaw pact and Soviet states want to join NATO because they don't want to ever be under Russian control again?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: crutonius on September 06, 2022, 11:45:21 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzgPJeYZaOU

Sweet Jesus.  She's going all the way back to to the 1600s to justify their war.  Why don't they go all the way back to the times of Genghis Khan and use that as a justification to invade Mongolia?

Also, this whole NATO justification, this is just nonsense.  Finland and Sweden are about to join.  That's way more of an infringement on Russia.  You would think Russia would be making more noise about that but nope.  Not a peep.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on September 22, 2022, 04:33:12 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/R8lDLiy.jpg)
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on September 22, 2022, 06:06:33 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/R8lDLiy.jpg)

I'm fairly certain the story is fake.

Why?

Here's one claiming its real.

https://thenewsdept.com/trending/77774.html?amp=1

Just to give you an idea of size...
My house in Norway is 126 sq. m of usable area.  Bigger once you add up all the storage space.


Also: why would you have them publically shown where they live?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on September 22, 2022, 09:06:57 PM
My favorite part from the article:

"This was reported on one of the Telegram channels."
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: crutonius on September 22, 2022, 09:19:17 PM
Even if they did buy an 8 million dollar house I don't see what that has to do with anything unless it's somehow skimmed from the international aid that Ukraine is receiving.

The pic is also misleading.  I don't think Zelenskyy has even left the country since the invasion.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on September 22, 2022, 09:27:11 PM
Even if they did buy an 8 million dollar house I don't see what that has to do with anything unless it's somehow skimmed from the international aid that Ukraine is receiving.

The pic is also misleading.  I don't think Zelenskyy has even left the country since the invasion.

Also, didn't his parents move to Israel like... decades ago?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Fortuna on September 25, 2022, 09:40:25 PM
In each of those times we successfully avoided nuclear war.
I dunno, Putin is still saying he'll totally start a nuclear war. Postponing it while giving him time to grow stronger (regardless of whether he squandered it) doesn't seem to have worked out so far.

That’s part of the Russian hybrid warfare doctrine. They want to be seen as the unhinged crazy people who could fire off a nuke just for looking at them funny. They’ve built an entire narrative around it that a lot of people have bought. They want to get as much value out of their arsenal as humanly possible without actually using it.

According to the latest publicly available intelligence reports, it’s been business as usual for the world’s strategic forces.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rama Set on September 25, 2022, 11:58:53 PM
In each of those times we successfully avoided nuclear war.
I dunno, Putin is still saying he'll totally start a nuclear war. Postponing it while giving him time to grow stronger (regardless of whether he squandered it) doesn't seem to have worked out so far.

That’s part of the Russian hybrid warfare doctrine. They want to be seen as the unhinged crazy people who could fire off a nuke just for looking at them funny. They’ve built an entire narrative around it that a lot of people have bought. They want to get as much value out of their arsenal as humanly possible without actually using it.

According to the latest publicly available intelligence reports, it’s been business as usual for the world’s strategic forces.

Except that the White House has literally reached out to the Kremlin to warn them not to use nukes which is very far from business as usual.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on September 26, 2022, 01:41:25 AM
Vote is almost legit....Guess who wins?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: crutonius on September 26, 2022, 02:28:42 AM
Vote is almost legit....Guess who wins?

https://youtu.be/n6_4dNPNOec

Hmm... Voting with a gun to one's head. I suspect that may affect the legitimacy of those vote somewhat.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on September 26, 2022, 03:11:07 AM
Hmm...  Maybe Poland should hold a totally legitimate referendum to annex the rest of Ukraine, that way any further attacks by Russia on Polish territory would trigger a response by the rest of NATO.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on September 26, 2022, 05:25:16 PM
Merely peacekeepers
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Dr Van Nostrand on September 26, 2022, 07:53:02 PM
Merely peacekeepers

Masses of people risking their life to flee Russia's brutal and bloodthirsty autocracy.
Masses of people desperately risking their lives to get into the United states for liberty and opportunity.

Idiotic American conservatives running in the opposite direction. Sad...
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on September 26, 2022, 09:13:07 PM
Merely peacekeepers
Yes, scorched earth is quite peaceful.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: J-Man on September 26, 2022, 11:25:48 PM
I wonder how the EU and Germany is handling this inflation, no gas, no wheat, no yobs, no food.

They could have weathered all this strife if they just wouldn't have listened. Bad Gold, Don't buy to protect your fam.

Snowden and Seagal become Russian citizens...
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: crutonius on September 26, 2022, 11:30:46 PM
Great.  Now they can be drafted.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on September 27, 2022, 04:22:18 AM
I wonder how the EU and Germany is handling this inflation, no gas, no wheat, no yobs, no food.

They could have weathered all this strife if they just wouldn't have listened. Bad Gold, Don't buy to protect your fam.

Snowden and Seagal become Russian citizens...
Importing.
Using electric heat.

Its a mess and it sucks. 
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Dr Van Nostrand on September 27, 2022, 12:15:42 PM
I wonder how the EU and Germany is handling this inflation, no gas, no wheat, no yobs, no food.

Yes, Putin and the glorious Soviet Union will save all of Europe from inflation and Nazi aggression.

Snowden and Seagal become Russian citizens...

Yes, you should join them in their wonderful new life of prosperity and freedom. There are all kinds of career opportunities in the Russian military.



America needs to move as many of these traitorous freaks to Russia as we can. Rather than allowing the Republicans to make us part of the new Soviet Republic, we need to ship them to Russia. Rand Paul, Melissa Boebert, M.J. Greene, Matt Gaetz, Josh (the running man) Hawley, Ron Johnson, Donald Trump and the whole Hee Haw gang needs to go. Roger Stone, Steve Bannon, Bill Barr need to go to prison for thirty years and then get shipped to Russia.

After Ronald Reagan's pressure helped bring down the Soviet Union, these turncoats are helping Putin rebuild it. These communist collaborators are supporting Russia for one reason, they know Russia will support them in the next election.

This is how Venezuela became a Russian nation state. Putin flooded their media with propaganda that got those idiots to elect a bunch of corrupt pro-Russia politicians who then changed the laws so they can't be un-elected. We're watching it happen here.


Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on September 27, 2022, 08:35:11 PM
I wonder how the EU and Germany is handling this inflation, no gas, no wheat, no yobs, no food.

They could have weathered all this strife if they just wouldn't have listened. Bad Gold, Don't buy to protect your fam.
What will gold buy you if there is nothing for sale?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on September 28, 2022, 05:27:16 PM
https://www.npr.org/2022/09/27/1125322026/russia-ukraine-referendums

Quote
The referendums are widely viewed as an initial Kremlin move toward formal Russian annexation of the territories, even as the exact timetable remains unclear.

Results reported Tuesday by Russian state media allegedly showed over 98% voting in favor of the measure in the self-proclaimed Donetsk and Luhansk People's Republics; while 93% voted for it in the Zaporizhzhia region and 87% in the Kherson region.

This very legitimate vote shows that the regions Russia wanted to help keep the peace in now suddenly want to be part of Russia.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rama Set on September 28, 2022, 06:21:03 PM
And by such overwhelming and compelling margins. I don’t see how anyone can support Ukraine anymore.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: crutonius on September 28, 2022, 06:31:54 PM
Well that's that I guess.  I suppose the Ukrainian military will just be packing it up and leaving now.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on September 28, 2022, 07:26:53 PM
Seems legit, not like the Russian reported numbers would give anyone pause...

Results reported Tuesday by Russian state media allegedly showed over 98% voting in favor of the measure in the self-proclaimed Donetsk and Luhansk People's Republics; while 93% voted for it in the Zaporizhzhia region and 87% in the Kherson region.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Dr Van Nostrand on September 28, 2022, 08:22:02 PM
In Russia, the elections are managed by the federal government. Everyone cast their ballot then a black truck from the federal government takes the ballots away and announces the next day that El Presidente Gigante won in the landslide once again. There are no state or local election officials and no accountability.

This is what Trump attempted to do in his first year in office. Most Republicans thought it was a pretty cool idea.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/trumps-voting-commission-asked-states-to-hand-over-election-data-theyre-pushing-back/2017/06/30/cd8f812a-5dce-11e7-9b7d-14576dc0f39d_story.html
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Pete Svarrior on September 28, 2022, 09:02:10 PM
I wonder how the EU and Germany is handling this inflation, no gas, no wheat, no yobs, no food.
Pretty well. How's shilling for Satan going for you?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tron on September 30, 2022, 03:20:38 AM
Why does anyone doubt that the some regions in eastern Ukraine would want to seperate themselves from the current Ukrainian government?  In 2014, the same government overthrew there Russian Guy who has since been in exile in Russia. ?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on September 30, 2022, 04:26:57 AM
I haven't a clue what's true or not, but Russia reporting 98% voting in favor seems just a tad suspicious. I mean when in the world has anything like this legitimately resulted in 2% shy of 100%? I guess it could happen, but really, 98%?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tom Bishop on September 30, 2022, 04:49:48 AM
I haven't a clue what's true or not, but Russia reporting 98% voting in favor seems just a tad suspicious. I mean when in the world has anything like this legitimately resulted in 2% shy of 100%? I guess it could happen, but really, 98%?

Incorrect. It's 98% of those who voted, voted in favor of joining Russia.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tron on September 30, 2022, 05:00:05 AM
Yes, perhaps not everybody voted but I I think there was an effort to include residents of the area, including those who fled to Russia.  It does seem like a high number.  Zelenskyy said he's concerned about people within these regions who may not be so quick to pick sides.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: crutonius on September 30, 2022, 06:29:01 AM
Well I'm not going to lie.  I'm pretty disappointed that they voted to join Russia.  But a votes a vote.  I notice that the Ukrainian army appears to be driving Russian out of their own sovereign territory as of a day ago!

Perhaps Russia should take the matter to the UN.  They've always been extremely effective at resolving international disputes.  I have no doubt that a strong letter written by them to Ukraine should cause them to retreat.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rama Set on September 30, 2022, 10:27:42 AM
I haven't a clue what's true or not, but Russia reporting 98% voting in favor seems just a tad suspicious. I mean when in the world has anything like this legitimately resulted in 2% shy of 100%? I guess it could happen, but really, 98%?

Incorrect. It's 98% of those who voted, voted in favor of joining Russia.

That’s what he said. 98% voting in favour.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on September 30, 2022, 10:59:24 AM
I haven't a clue what's true or not, but Russia reporting 98% voting in favor seems just a tad suspicious. I mean when in the world has anything like this legitimately resulted in 2% shy of 100%? I guess it could happen, but really, 98%?

Incorrect. It's 98% of those who voted, voted in favor of joining Russia.

Ummm, yeah, typically voters who voted are those who voted.

Did you want to make some sort of cogent point? If so, you may want to try again.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on September 30, 2022, 11:33:29 AM
I haven't a clue what's true or not, but Russia reporting 98% voting in favor seems just a tad suspicious. I mean when in the world has anything like this legitimately resulted in 2% shy of 100%? I guess it could happen, but really, 98%?

Incorrect. It's 98% of those who voted, voted in favor of joining Russia.

Ummm, yeah, typically voters who voted are those who voted.

Did you want to make some sort of cogent point? If so, you may want to try again.

His point is that anyone who didn't want to be part of Russia wasn't allowd to vote.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on September 30, 2022, 01:49:10 PM
https://www.bbc.com/news/live/world-63077272

Ah, you see, now that the regions are literally Russia, Ukraine is actually invading Russia! Putin is a true mastermind of strategic thought.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tom Bishop on September 30, 2022, 01:51:19 PM
I haven't a clue what's true or not, but Russia reporting 98% voting in favor seems just a tad suspicious. I mean when in the world has anything like this legitimately resulted in 2% shy of 100%? I guess it could happen, but really, 98%?

Incorrect. It's 98% of those who voted, voted in favor of joining Russia.

Ummm, yeah, typically voters who voted are those who voted.

Did you want to make some sort of cogent point? If so, you may want to try again.

The point is that you phrased it as "Russia reporting 98% voting". This is incorrect phrasing and implied that 98% of the people voted in favor of Russia. It's really 98% of people who voted who voted in favor of Russia.

This connects to your remarks of absurdity. The people who loved Ukraine could simply have not voted or have already migrated out of the country or to the anti-Russia side of the country.

It is also possible that people simply side with Russia there and hate Zielinski based on social pressures there, much like how upwards of 98% of people hate pedophiles based on social norms and pressures.

Whatever the explanation, the point is that you were wrong about the phrasing of your remarks.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on September 30, 2022, 02:01:35 PM
I haven't a clue what's true or not, but Russia reporting 98% voting in favor seems just a tad suspicious. I mean when in the world has anything like this legitimately resulted in 2% shy of 100%? I guess it could happen, but really, 98%?

Incorrect. It's 98% of those who voted, voted in favor of joining Russia.

Ummm, yeah, typically voters who voted are those who voted.

Did you want to make some sort of cogent point? If so, you may want to try again.

The point is that you phrased it as "98% voting". This is incorrect phrasing and implied that 98% of the people voted in favor of Russia. It's really 98% of people who voted who voted in favor of Russia.

This connects to your remarks of absurdity. The people who loved Ukraine could simply have not voted  or have already migrated out of the country or to the anti-Russia side of the country.

It is also possible that people simply side with Russia there and hate Zielinski based on social pressures there, much like upwards of 98% of people hate pedophiles based on social norms and pressures.

Whatever the explanation, the point is that you were wrong about the phrasing of your remarks.

You missed the
"Or they were afraid to not vote yes for fear of retaliation from the armed guards watching them vote "
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rama Set on September 30, 2022, 02:54:14 PM
I haven't a clue what's true or not, but Russia reporting 98% voting in favor seems just a tad suspicious. I mean when in the world has anything like this legitimately resulted in 2% shy of 100%? I guess it could happen, but really, 98%?

Incorrect. It's 98% of those who voted, voted in favor of joining Russia.

Ummm, yeah, typically voters who voted are those who voted.

Did you want to make some sort of cogent point? If so, you may want to try again.

The point is that you phrased it as "Russia reporting 98% voting". This is incorrect phrasing and implied that 98% of the people voted in favor of Russia. It's really 98% of people who voted who voted in favor of Russia.

Everyone got his meaning. You are being uselessly pedantic

[quite]This connects to your remarks of absurdity. The people who loved Ukraine could simply have not voted or have already migrated out of the country or to the anti-Russia side of the country.

It is also possible that people simply side with Russia there and hate Zielinski based on social pressures there, much like how upwards of 98% of people hate pedophiles based on social norms and pressures.[/quote]

98% is an absurd election result you absolute troll. Comparing this to people’s views on pedophiles proves it.

Quote
Whatever the explanation, the point is that you were wrong about the phrasing of your remarks.

Everyone got the meaning, including you. Perhaps you should get back under the bridge?

Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rama Set on September 30, 2022, 02:55:31 PM
Why does anyone doubt that the some regions in eastern Ukraine would want to seperate themselves from the current Ukrainian government?  In 2014, the same government overthrew there Russian Guy who has since been in exile in Russia. ?

People are doubting the results of the referendum, not the possibility that separatists exist.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on September 30, 2022, 03:44:05 PM
I haven't a clue what's true or not, but Russia reporting 98% voting in favor seems just a tad suspicious. I mean when in the world has anything like this legitimately resulted in 2% shy of 100%? I guess it could happen, but really, 98%?

Incorrect. It's 98% of those who voted, voted in favor of joining Russia.

Ummm, yeah, typically voters who voted are those who voted.

Did you want to make some sort of cogent point? If so, you may want to try again.

The point is that you phrased it as "Russia reporting 98% voting". This is incorrect phrasing and implied that 98% of the people voted in favor of Russia. It's really 98% of people who voted who voted in favor of Russia.

This connects to your remarks of absurdity. The people who loved Ukraine could simply have not voted or have already migrated out of the country or to the anti-Russia side of the country.

It is also possible that people simply side with Russia there and hate Zielinski based on social pressures there, much like how upwards of 98% of people hate pedophiles based on social norms and pressures.

Whatever the explanation, the point is that you were wrong about the phrasing of your remarks.

I wrote, "...Russia reporting 98% voting in favor..."

Typically, "voting in favor" of something requires one to actually vote. It's amazing that you don't understand this.

Pedophilia versus seceding from your country? Really? That's your logic?
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Tom Bishop on September 30, 2022, 05:48:39 PM
Quote
I wrote, "...Russia reporting 98% voting in favor..."

Typically, "voting in favor" of something requires one to actually vote. It's amazing that you don't understand this.

Actually that sentence implies that 98% of the region voted in favor of Russia. This is incorrect, and it is shameful that you initially phrased it that way and did not point out that it is 98% of people who voted.

It is also easy to see that 98% of received votes voting for something is not particularly rare, as opposed to your appeal to absurdity.

https://www.google.com/search?q=%2298+percent+voted%22

On Morocco constitution - "Morocco says 98 percent voted 'yes' for new constitution - Al Arabiya"

On an Iraqui referendum - "While 97 percent of voters reportedly favored the constitution in Shiite Basra and 98 percent voted yes in the Kurdish province of Sulaimaniyah, 97 percent of the approximately 100,000 Sunni voters in the city of Fallujah were opposed."

On a flight union vote - "less than 50 percent of the Delta flight attendants participated, so the union was not certified even though over 98 percent voted for AFA"

On a Venezuela referendum - "Total number of voters in Sunday's referendum, based on 95 percent of voting centers reporting. Of these, more than 98 percent voted in favor of"

On the Black woman vote - "Ninety-four percent of Black women voted for Hillary Clinton in the 2016 presidential election and 98 percent voted for Doug Jones in the"

etc., etc., etc.,

So it seems that your appeal to absurdity is actually based on your personal ignorance of voting and politics. 98% does regularly occur.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: stack on September 30, 2022, 06:42:32 PM
It doesn’t imply that at all. You’re being more absurd than normal. Do you really expect people to say, “98% of people who voted voted in favor of…”??? How does someone vote in favor of something without voting???

How is "Morocco says 98 percent voted 'yes' for new constitution” different than "Russia reporting 98% voting in favor for…”? “Voting” implies "voted”. You know, like casting a vote in favor of something...

Are you actually that desperate for me to have said, "Russia says 98 percent of people who voted voted in favor for…” That you got tripped up on “reporting” versus “says” and “voted” instead of “voting”?  Truly absurd based on your personal ignorance of language and meaning.

NPR: Russian state media allegedly showed over 98% voting in favor of
Me: Russia reporting 98% voting in favor

Again, how does someone vote in favor of something without voting??? You’re being ridiculous.

And like I said, “I guess it can happen”, but personally, I find it a smidge suspect considering that Russia is not seen as the most reliable narrator. Why you’re all cozy with Putin is a mystery to me.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: crutonius on September 30, 2022, 06:47:35 PM
I don't think Ukraine has got the memo on the annexation yet.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/ukrainian-forces-encircling-russian-units-around-lyman-stronghold-spokesperson-2022-09-30/

It's an interesting move by Putin.  I don't  know if it's getting the intended results.  Now by Russian law he's in a situation where Russia is being invaded and Putin, the strong man, the mastermind always playing 4d chess, can't defend his own territory.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Rushy on September 30, 2022, 08:10:25 PM
The intention is to do more-or-less exactly what they did to annex Crimea. The difference being the reaction of the West is quite a bit different than it was before. There's no telling if NATO and the EU will pressure for peace this time around versus continuing to support the Ukrainian military. It feels like the Nord Stream sabotage indicates that NATO is willing to go All The Way this time rather than pressure Ukraine into staying quiet.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: crutonius on September 30, 2022, 09:28:34 PM
Russia isn't looking for a peace deal. They're looking for a cease fire so they can rearm and try again.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: markjo on September 30, 2022, 10:41:14 PM
It doesn’t imply that at all. You’re being more absurd than normal. Do you really expect people to say, “98% of people who voted voted in favor of…”??? How does someone vote in favor of something without voting???

Hey, give Tom a break.  For all we know, a total of 100 people voted and 98 of them voted to join Russia. 

Russia isn't looking for a peace deal. They're looking for a cease fire so they can rearm and try again.
They'll get that opportunity once winter sets in.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: crutonius on September 30, 2022, 11:53:04 PM
I'm very curious about the winter situation. I guess a lot depends on how prepared their armies are for it.

Russia is used to dealing with the cold. I would think their equipment is made for it. Then again Russias army is in complete shambles so it might be an opportunity for Ukraine.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Lord Dave on October 01, 2022, 04:54:36 AM
I'm very curious about the winter situation. I guess a lot depends on how prepared their armies are for it.

Russia is used to dealing with the cold. I would think their equipment is made for it. Then again Russias army is in complete shambles so it might be an opportunity for Ukraine.

It'll be tragic irony:
Russia will lose due to the winter cold, like so many others who attacked Russia.
Title: Re: Russia doesn't invade, they recognize Donbass Republics: send in peacekeepers !
Post by: Dr Van Nostrand on October 01, 2022, 12:19:53 PM
American conservatives don't believe the election results from their own country but they believe this bullshit from Putin. They're idiots.

There was no election, thousands of people are dead, hundreds of thousands fled the country. When have 92% of any group voted in one direction. It's all a sham. A handful of Russian soldiers in Donetsk filled out a few paper ballots supporting Putin and dumbasses like Tucker Carlson believe it.

Of course, all the thousands of people fighting and dying in Ukraine to protect the country from an invasion from a bloodthirsty dictator are all just crisis actors. It's all a liberal hoax.

Just another reason that I will never vote for another Republican for the rest of my life.