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Offline crutonius

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Re: Trump
« Reply #8220 on: January 08, 2021, 09:23:25 PM »
Trump confirms he won't attend the inauguration because he's a toddler or something

Or as Newsthump reports it...

https://newsthump.com/2021/01/08/trump-confirms-he-wont-attend-biden-inauguration-as-he-will-already-be-in-jail/

Thanks for confirming that you get your information from radical leftists.



This is of course preposterous.

Everyone knows that Trump would resign and have Pence Pardon him.  And that's the reason he wouldn't have to attend the inauguration.  Because Pence would technically be the outgoing president.

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Offline honk

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Re: Trump
« Reply #8221 on: January 08, 2021, 09:30:51 PM »
Whoa whoa whoa, how can Trump not attend his own re-inauguration? He's going to be the next president as well as the current one, so he has to be there, right? Tom?
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Offline Dr David Thork

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Re: Trump
« Reply #8222 on: January 08, 2021, 09:31:07 PM »
Both of you are imagining problems with zero evidence for them.


No one in the US is discriminated against from voting ... other than the lazy. That's they same the world over. In my country, young people moaned and moaned about Brexit and how it ruins their futures etc. But when it came down to it, they didn't vote because they were too lazy to bother their arses to go to the polling station on polling day.

If you are too lazy to get some photo ID organised, then tough shit. And if you are black and lazy ... zero sympathy. Other black people manage to vote. There is no discrimination. Its on you if you can't vote. Not someone else suppressing you.
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Offline AATW

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Re: Trump
« Reply #8223 on: January 08, 2021, 09:34:53 PM »
Both of you are imagining problems with zero evidence for them.
No, you are. What evidence is there that not having to produce photo ID leads to rampant fraud?
What problem are you solving?

I happen to have a passport and a driver's licence but what if I didn't have those things? What other photo ID could I produce in order to vote? We don't have any national ID cards so am I supposed to spend £60 on a passport just so I can exercise my democratic right? Unless you're suggesting people are issued an ID so they can vote for free, an idea which has some merit but what problem does it solve? There's a potential issue, I agree, but is there actually an issue here?
Tom: "Claiming incredulity is a pretty bad argument. Calling it "insane" or "ridiculous" is not a good argument at all."

TFES Wiki Occam's Razor page, by Tom: "What's the simplest explanation; that NASA has successfully designed and invented never before seen rocket technologies from scratch which can accelerate 100 tons of matter to an escape velocity of 7 miles per second"

Rama Set

Re: Trump
« Reply #8224 on: January 08, 2021, 09:43:28 PM »
Both of you are imagining problems with zero evidence for them.


No one in the US is discriminated against from voting ... other than the lazy. That's they same the world over. In my country, young people moaned and moaned about Brexit and how it ruins their futures etc. But when it came down to it, they didn't vote because they were too lazy to bother their arses to go to the polling station on polling day.

If you are too lazy to get some photo ID organised, then tough shit. And if you are black and lazy ... zero sympathy. Other black people manage to vote. There is no discrimination. Its on you if you can't vote. Not someone else suppressing you.

So when Jeb Bush, in the 2000 election, instructed people with similar names to black felons to be taken off the voter roles despite being warned it would absolutely lead to false positives, that was the fault of black people? Or is it that you just don’t know what you’re talking about.

And when the Texas DOJ gave Florida a list of current FL residents who had committed a crime in TX so they could also be barred from voting, despite it not being legal to do so, disproportionately affecting black and Democratic voters, that was because they were black and lazy?

Is Gerrymandering the fault of black people?

Is more severe sentencing for similar crimes the fault of black people?

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Offline Dr David Thork

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Re: Trump
« Reply #8225 on: January 08, 2021, 09:44:04 PM »
Both of you are imagining problems with zero evidence for them.
No, you are. What evidence is there that not having to produce photo ID leads to rampant fraud?
What problem are you solving?

I happen to have a passport and a driver's licence but what if I didn't have those things? What other photo ID could I produce in order to vote? We don't have any national ID cards so am I supposed to spend £60 on a passport just so I can exercise my democratic right? Unless you're suggesting people are issued an ID so they can vote for free, an idea which has some merit but what problem does it solve? There's a potential issue, I agree, but is there actually an issue here?

I cannot even get into a club in my town without photo ID. It is hard to get served in many bars without photo ID or for shops. If you need photo ID to buy a beer or cigarettes, why is it such a big ask to show some photo ID so we can be sure that you are who you say you are when you turn up to vote?

You are willing to require photo ID at a supermarket to be sure someone is of legal age to buy beer. Why wouldn't you want photo ID to ensure someone is eligible to vote? It's a vote. Its important.

Only someone who wishes to encourage fraud amongst certain demographics would advocate more lax security protocols.

And in the UK, I have a few issues myself. I fucking hate that we use pencils. Give me a permanent marker. I don't want someone rubbing out my vote and changing it. I also think we should have photo ID. Also the Scots get way too many seats for their population size. We should all strive for the best system possible. Not one where we look to lower the standards because you are worried lazy black people won't bother their arses to vote Democrat as they are all programmed to do.
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Offline Iceman

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Re: Trump
« Reply #8226 on: January 08, 2021, 10:01:10 PM »
Both of you are imagining problems with zero evidence for them.
No, you are. What evidence is there that not having to produce photo ID leads to rampant fraud?
What problem are you solving?

I happen to have a passport and a driver's licence but what if I didn't have those things? What other photo ID could I produce in order to vote? We don't have any national ID cards so am I supposed to spend £60 on a passport just so I can exercise my democratic right? Unless you're suggesting people are issued an ID so they can vote for free, an idea which has some merit but what problem does it solve? There's a potential issue, I agree, but is there actually an issue here?

I cannot even get into a club in my town without photo ID. It is hard to get served in many bars without photo ID or for shops. If you need photo ID to buy a beer or cigarettes, why is it such a big ask to show some photo ID so we can be sure that you are who you say you are when you turn up to vote?

You are willing to require photo ID at a supermarket to be sure someone is of legal age to buy beer. Why wouldn't you want photo ID to ensure someone is eligible to vote? It's a vote. Its important.

Only someone who wishes to encourage fraud amongst certain demographics would advocate more lax security protocols.

And in the UK, I have a few issues myself. I fucking hate that we use pencils. Give me a permanent marker. I don't want someone rubbing out my vote and changing it. I also think we should have photo ID. Also the Scots get way too many seats for their population size. We should all strive for the best system possible. Not one where we look to lower the standards because you are worried lazy black people won't bother their arses to vote Democrat as they are all programmed to do.


they often have ID. Lawmakers have just added additional requirements that many can't meet given their housing situations. ID isn't the problem. they can get ID. its the voting eligibility requirements that need to be changed to that their ID can be used....as identification so they can vote. anyone who can prove their identity as a lawful citizen who is of age should be allowed to vote. Full Stop.

Rama Set

Re: Trump
« Reply #8227 on: January 08, 2021, 10:12:48 PM »

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Offline Dr David Thork

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Re: Trump
« Reply #8228 on: January 08, 2021, 10:18:09 PM »
they often have ID. Lawmakers have just added additional requirements that many can't meet given their housing situations. ID isn't the problem. they can get ID. its the voting eligibility requirements that need to be changed to that their ID can be used....as identification so they can vote. anyone who can prove their identity as a lawful citizen who is of age should be allowed to vote. Full Stop.

Yes, you also need to provide an address. How unreasonable in a place where you are voting in STATE elections to make sure you actually reside in the state you are voting in. Else why not pop to the state next door where the vote might be much closer and spend your vote there?

Again, this is not discrimination. These are rules that apply to everyone.
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Rama Set

Re: Trump
« Reply #8229 on: January 08, 2021, 10:24:58 PM »
they often have ID. Lawmakers have just added additional requirements that many can't meet given their housing situations. ID isn't the problem. they can get ID. its the voting eligibility requirements that need to be changed to that their ID can be used....as identification so they can vote. anyone who can prove their identity as a lawful citizen who is of age should be allowed to vote. Full Stop.

Yes, you also need to provide an address. How unreasonable in a place where you are voting in STATE elections to make sure you actually reside in the state you are voting in. Else why not pop to the state next door where the vote might be much closer and spend your vote there?

Again, this is not discrimination. These are rules that apply to everyone.

Discrimination is not just that a rule applies to one group. Otherwise a rule that requires you to have $1B to vote wouldn’t be discriminatory. You should have a think before hitting “post”.

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Offline stack

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Re: Trump
« Reply #8230 on: January 08, 2021, 10:27:41 PM »
they often have ID. Lawmakers have just added additional requirements that many can't meet given their housing situations. ID isn't the problem. they can get ID. its the voting eligibility requirements that need to be changed to that their ID can be used....as identification so they can vote. anyone who can prove their identity as a lawful citizen who is of age should be allowed to vote. Full Stop.

Yes, you also need to provide an address. How unreasonable in a place where you are voting in STATE elections to make sure you actually reside in the state you are voting in. Else why not pop to the state next door where the vote might be much closer and spend your vote there?

Again, this is not discrimination. These are rules that apply to everyone.

I think you should focus on the pencil problem you have there. At least we have sharpies. 33 States here require some form of voter ID with varying degrees of compliance. So it seems we are way ahead of you and you still don't seem to have a rampant voter fraud problem. Get your house in order and catch up before you tell us how to "fix" our system.

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Offline Iceman

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Re: Trump
« Reply #8231 on: January 08, 2021, 10:31:26 PM »
they often have ID. Lawmakers have just added additional requirements that many can't meet given their housing situations. ID isn't the problem. they can get ID. its the voting eligibility requirements that need to be changed to that their ID can be used....as identification so they can vote. anyone who can prove their identity as a lawful citizen who is of age should be allowed to vote. Full Stop.

Yes, you also need to provide an address. How unreasonable in a place where you are voting in STATE elections to make sure you actually reside in the state you are voting in. Else why not pop to the state next door where the vote might be much closer and spend your vote there?

Again, this is not discrimination. These are rules that apply to everyone.

11% of eligible voting age Americans don't have photo ID - 8% of Whites and 25% of African-Americans, according to ACLU. 8% of Trump's potential voting base could miss out on voting if they don't fix voter registration laws!

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Offline Dr Van Nostrand

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Re: Trump
« Reply #8232 on: January 08, 2021, 10:37:58 PM »
Voter ID is one of those issues where both sides are wrong.

The right is wrong in that there is never been any significant evidence of voter fraud having any impact on an election.

The left is wrong because I don't want some Rando to be able to walk up my voting place and vote for me. Just because unidentified voters have never been a problem doesn't mean they won't be a problem. Seat belts in a car are useless until you actually get in a wreck.

They're both wrong in that voter precincts are now moving to electronic poll books. Soon your photo will be part of your voter records. When you walk up to vote, they will have your picture along with your registration. No ID needed.
Round Earther patiently looking for a better deal...

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If the world is round, it means that you’re just an idiot who believes stupid crap on the internet.

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Offline Fortuna

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Re: Trump
« Reply #8233 on: January 08, 2021, 10:38:31 PM »
We don't have any national ID cards so am I supposed to spend £60 on a passport just so I can exercise my democratic right?

Yes. Just like how you're compelled to file taxes to exercise your democratic rights.

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Offline AATW

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Re: Trump
« Reply #8234 on: January 08, 2021, 10:41:25 PM »
It is hard to get served in many bars without photo ID or for shops. If you need photo ID to buy a beer or cigarettes

It’s not “hard” to get served. Maybe you have youthful good looks but I never get ID’d anywhere. I’m mid-40s and...yeah, there’s no doubt I’m “of age”. But sure, my niece is over 30 sometimes gets ID’s so yes, it happens. Why? Because there’s a problem - young people regularly try to buy alcohol and cigarettes and try to get into clubs when they shouldn’t. You can argue how big a problem that actually is, but there are potential consequences for shops and bars not abiding by these laws which is why they err on the side of caution.

Quote
why is it such a big ask to show some photo ID so we can be sure that you are who you say you are when you turn up to vote?

It’s not so unreasonable, IF you’re going to give someone an ID. I don’t think you should assume people have one, or make someone pay for one, in order for them to be able to vote. It’s not your right to be served in a bar when you get to 18, it is your right to be able to vote.

Quote
Why wouldn't you want photo ID to ensure someone is eligible to vote? It's a vote. Its important.

Is it important? It’s only important if you have any evidence that there are lots of people taking advantage of the fact you don’t need photo ID to commit voter fraud. You have yet to provide any.
Tom: "Claiming incredulity is a pretty bad argument. Calling it "insane" or "ridiculous" is not a good argument at all."

TFES Wiki Occam's Razor page, by Tom: "What's the simplest explanation; that NASA has successfully designed and invented never before seen rocket technologies from scratch which can accelerate 100 tons of matter to an escape velocity of 7 miles per second"

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Offline Dr David Thork

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Re: Trump
« Reply #8235 on: January 08, 2021, 10:55:20 PM »
they often have ID. Lawmakers have just added additional requirements that many can't meet given their housing situations. ID isn't the problem. they can get ID. its the voting eligibility requirements that need to be changed to that their ID can be used....as identification so they can vote. anyone who can prove their identity as a lawful citizen who is of age should be allowed to vote. Full Stop.

Yes, you also need to provide an address. How unreasonable in a place where you are voting in STATE elections to make sure you actually reside in the state you are voting in. Else why not pop to the state next door where the vote might be much closer and spend your vote there?

Again, this is not discrimination. These are rules that apply to everyone.

Discrimination is not just that a rule applies to one group. Otherwise a rule that requires you to have $1B to vote wouldn’t be discriminatory. You should have a think before hitting “post”.

Literally anyone can get ID and register where they reside. Even the homeless can vote.
https://www.findlaw.com/voting/my-voting-guide/the-homeless-vote--can-you-legally-cast-a-ballot-.html

Not everyone has $1billion.

You don't know what discrimination is, which is probably why you keep complaining you see it everywhere, even when it is not present.



It is hard to get served in many bars without photo ID or for shops. If you need photo ID to buy a beer or cigarettes

It’s not “hard” to get served. Maybe you have youthful good looks but I never get ID’d anywhere. I’m mid-40s and...yeah, there’s no doubt I’m “of age”. But sure, my niece is over 30 sometimes gets ID’s so yes, it happens. Why? Because there’s a problem - young people regularly try to buy alcohol and cigarettes and try to get into clubs when they shouldn’t. You can argue how big a problem that actually is, but there are potential consequences for shops and bars not abiding by these laws which is why they err on the side of caution.
??? It is impossible in my town and many others, to enter bars and clubs without photo ID. And it has nothing to do with how grizzled your features are. They want to make sure you aren't on their pubwatch list, and if there is a major crime such as a stabbing, they want to know exactly who you were and that you weren't rocking up with fake ID.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PubWatch
Do not tell me you can just waltz into high street bars in your town without photo ID. I'm not talking about your village pub. I mean like a proper town bar or club.


Quote
why is it such a big ask to show some photo ID so we can be sure that you are who you say you are when you turn up to vote?

It’s not so unreasonable, IF you’re going to give someone an ID. I don’t think you should assume people have one, or make someone pay for one, in order for them to be able to vote. It’s not your right to be served in a bar when you get to 18, it is your right to be able to vote.
It is your right to be served. Just as you can't tell a gay person you aren't making a cake for them, you can't refuse someone a beer if they are sober and of age.


Quote
Why wouldn't you want photo ID to ensure someone is eligible to vote? It's a vote. Its important.

Is it important? It’s only important if you have any evidence that there are lots of people taking advantage of the fact you don’t need photo ID to commit voter fraud. You have yet to provide any.
The seat belt analogy earlier was sufficient. It's a security measure put in place to prevent fraud. It's the same as making me take my fucking shoes off to get on an aeroplane. There is no evidence of lots of people getting on aircraft with shoe bombs. One person tried it once 20 years ago and failed anyway. We still have to take our bloody shoes off. So get your photo ID out black folk. Its not discrimination. Everyone has to do it.
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Re: Trump
« Reply #8236 on: January 08, 2021, 11:03:28 PM »
communism is when you don't need a photo-id to vote
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Offline honk

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Re: Trump
« Reply #8237 on: January 08, 2021, 11:14:42 PM »
I think there should be a separate thread if people want to talk about Voter ID laws. In other news:

https://www.vox.com/platform/amp/2021/1/8/22220840/sasse-trump-capitol-storming-impeachment
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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: Trump
« Reply #8238 on: January 08, 2021, 11:26:46 PM »
I think there should be a separate thread if people want to talk about Voter ID laws. In other news:

https://www.vox.com/platform/amp/2021/1/8/22220840/sasse-trump-capitol-storming-impeachment

Interesting. A gossip rag.

"One Republican senator who says he’s been in touch with senior White House aides about the matter claims the president was “delighted.”

...

Though an adviser who spoke to New York magazine’s Olivia Nuzzi said that Trump disliked the optics of the mob, viewing them as 'low class.'"

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Offline Pete Svarrior

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Re: Trump
« Reply #8239 on: January 08, 2021, 11:30:13 PM »
Trump just got permabanned from Twitter.

May he shitpost in peace
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