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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1600 on: June 09, 2022, 07:47:34 PM »
Quote from: AllAroundTheWorld
It is not intended to be.

So you admit that you are responding to evidence with non-evidence. Nothing more needs to be said here.

Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1601 on: June 09, 2022, 08:02:15 PM »
A valid response to evidence is to consider how credible it is. If you have no explanation for how a vaccine could cause someone to become magnetic then you are admitting the evidence is not credible.
Doesn’t your Wiki say something about if you don’t understand something from first principles then you shouldn’t believe it?
Tom: "Claiming incredulity is a pretty bad argument. Calling it "insane" or "ridiculous" is not a good argument at all."

TFES Wiki Occam's Razor page, by Tom: "What's the simplest explanation; that NASA has successfully designed and invented never before seen rocket technologies from scratch which can accelerate 100 tons of matter to an escape velocity of 7 miles per second"

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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1602 on: June 09, 2022, 08:26:44 PM »
Quote from: Gary Green
lol skepticism is the default position fam.

Incorrect. Siding with the existing evidence is the default position.

People are not skeptical of protractors by default. There is evidence that protractors work to some 99.x% accuracy of the tool.

Quote from: AllAroundTheWorld
A valid response to evidence is to consider how credible it is.

In a court of law to discredit someone's evidence you need to produce contradicting evidence showing the evidence produced to be false. A prosecutor claiming that it could be false because "me is skeptical" won't cut it and the person walks free. If they used that argument they would also be reprimanded.

Skepticism is simply invalid in many situations. It's only really a valid response if there is no evidence at all.

Quote from: AllAroundTheWorld
Doesn’t your Wiki say something about if you don’t understand something from first principles then you shouldn’t believe it?

That sentence is clearly about approaching how phenomena work. The content given in this magnet subject was not about how it works, however. The evidence is that it occurs. You are conflicting an empirical phenomena with the necessity of a theory. It works if the mechanism is unknown or known.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2022, 04:40:05 PM by Tom Bishop »

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Offline stack

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Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1603 on: June 09, 2022, 08:45:05 PM »
You probably should have performed a systematic test on all vaccine brands, and multiple batches to account for them changing the formula when this was discovered. You should have also preferably tested this when it was first injected and not a year after the fact.

Hold on a second here. You're telling me that to truly test this I would need to:

- systematically test on all vaccine brands
- multiple batches to account for them changing the formula when this was discovered (particularly hilarious, btw)
- tested this when it was first injected and not a year after the fact (how do you know when I tested?)

So I need to do all of these things to verify my findings, but all of your references don't? How does that work? Why do I have to follow the above, but your people don't?

Where's your experimentation that follows:

- systematically test on all vaccine brands
- multiple batches to account for them changing the formula when this was discovered
- tested this when it was first injected and not a year after the fact

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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1604 on: June 09, 2022, 09:06:25 PM »
Quote from: stack
So I need to do all of these things to verify my findings, but all of your references don't? How does that work? Why do I have to follow the above, but your people don't?

Simply because they are making a positive claim and providing positive evidence that this happened to them. They did make an effort to provide evidence.

You are making a negative claim, that this phenomena did not work on them and that their claims are false, so your burden is much higher to prove that they didn't get injected with a vaccine with magnetic properties. It is possible to prove a negative, but it is much harder to do. It is far easier to prove a positive.

You seem to want to do nothing at all. But there are plenty of things you can do in your effort:

- You could find their chatroom where they admit to an internet hoax to gull the public with magic tricks and false claims

- You can analyze their videos and look for the double-sided sticky tape on the objects

- You can show that one of these people were brought into a laboratory for testing

- You can interview their friends and family and find that the claims were false

- You can investigate and see if multiple people on different unrelated platforms seem to be making this claim

All of this is possible, but you want to do nothing at all.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2022, 09:10:50 PM by Tom Bishop »

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Offline Dr Van Nostrand

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Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1605 on: June 09, 2022, 09:09:22 PM »
Holy crap!

Tom's right!

I'm sticking keys and coins all over myself.

The vaccine worked! I am magnetic!

My time has come! I will destroy my enemies with my magnetic power!

Oh shit they're falling off...
Damn...

Oh wait... if you lick them they really stick. Saliva obviously increases the magnetic power.

I'll make a YouTube video of it. Then these non-magnetic losers will fear me!
My hate for you and everything you stand for is so much deeper than the depths of Shambala that you could probably take the entire Lungmen population down there and back up around twenty million times before you would have sunk to the end of my hate.



Round Earther patiently looking for a better deal...

Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1606 on: June 09, 2022, 09:14:44 PM »
I’ll just leave this here

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/57207134
Tom: "Claiming incredulity is a pretty bad argument. Calling it "insane" or "ridiculous" is not a good argument at all."

TFES Wiki Occam's Razor page, by Tom: "What's the simplest explanation; that NASA has successfully designed and invented never before seen rocket technologies from scratch which can accelerate 100 tons of matter to an escape velocity of 7 miles per second"

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Offline stack

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Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1607 on: June 09, 2022, 09:45:20 PM »
Quote from: stack
So I need to do all of these things to verify my findings, but all of your references don't? How does that work? Why do I have to follow the above, but your people don't?

Simply because they are making a positive claim and providing positive evidence that this happened to them. They did make an effort to provide evidence.

You are making a negative claim, that this phenomena did not work on them and that their claims are false, so your burden is much higher to prove that they didn't get injected with a vaccine with magnetic properties. It is possible to prove a negative, but it is much harder to do. It is far easier to prove a positive.

You missed a whole step. Vax's are not magnetic. Because, it's insane to think otherwise. There's nothing in EA's, test data, anywhere prior to rollout that anything became magnetic.

Then you trot out some knuckleheads who make the claim that vaxs are magnetic. So, that being the claim, then we would need some experimental proof following your criteria:

- systematically test on all vaccine brands
- multiple batches to account for them changing the formula when this was discovered
- tested this when it was first injected and not a year after the fact

Same goes for your soccer players dying en masse on pitches all over the world. You need to provide for each:

- Was an individual vaxed?
- When were they vaxed?
- Which vax did they get?
- Did they have any prior issues with heart disease? Genetic predisposition or otherwise

I mean, even at the outset, how can you make a claim that vax's are killing football players without even knowing if they were vaxed or not? You're making zero logical sense.


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Offline BillO

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Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1608 on: June 09, 2022, 11:00:43 PM »
None of it does anything to disprove the claims given.
You are right, of course.  But the things everyone has presented do go to show how ridiculous the claims are.

I can claim anything.  I can claim I have a 11" dick, and that's why I'm known as the moose.  Nothing you can post here can disprove that claim.  So, I don't think anyone is trying to disprove you claims, just show how ridiculous they are.

I did see the stuff the put into my shoulder.  It was a light amber clear fluid.  Can you think of  a light amber clear fluid that is magnetic?
Quote from: Ironic Pete
I DO NOT NEED DATA, I'M PRETTY SURE I'M RIGHT!!!!

You think something is true, and that's good enough for you.

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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1609 on: June 10, 2022, 02:13:36 AM »
Claiming incredulity is a pretty bad argument. Calling it "insane" or "ridiculous" is not a good argument at all. You have no evidence that this is not occurring in people and your goal is to reject evidence that it is occurring in people. Not a good look.

There is clearly something magnetic-related happening to this person who took the vaccine:

Full Video: https://savetiknowm.org/u/som_alto/6987777724454587649



Translated caption: "Reaction after vaccination # magnet # injection"
« Last Edit: June 10, 2022, 02:27:19 AM by Tom Bishop »

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Offline stack

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Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1610 on: June 10, 2022, 02:34:10 AM »
So you're now saying that the non-MRNA Sputnik vaccine is magnetic? Well I'm glad we don't have that one in the US. Thanks for the PSA.

And since we're operating according to your new rules of evidence, I found a full disk image of a globe earth from the Russian geostationary satellite, Electro-L:



I guess that resolves the debate, right?

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Offline markjo

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Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1611 on: June 10, 2022, 02:37:47 AM »
There is clearly something magnetic-related happening to this person who took the vaccine:

Full Video: https://savetiknowm.org/u/som_alto/6987777724454587649



Translated caption: "Reaction after vaccination # magnet # injection"
Could it possibly be that a small bit of the the tip of the needle broke off, or some small metal sliver of something or other?
Abandon hope all ye who press enter here.

Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.

Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge. -- Charles Darwin

If you can't demonstrate it, then you shouldn't believe it.

#firePete

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Offline BillO

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Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1612 on: June 10, 2022, 02:40:13 AM »
Incredulity does not enter into it when it unanimous Tom.  It becomes a matter of presenting something credible.  I'm not saying people did not stick magnets to their shoulders, nor will I say your latest video does not show something that looks like a magnetic material is below the skin.  However, two comments.

1) This latest video is not proof there is a small piece of iron (or other magnetic material) below the skin.  It could be, but maybe not (remember why you guy's reject videos and pictures).  It's certainly not proof this person was even vaccinated let alone had become magnetic as a result.

2) You have not given anything other than un-reliable (according to TFES) videos and pictures as evidence.  Can you come up with anything more solid?  Like a component of any COVID-19 vaccine that has, or could have, magnetic properties?
« Last Edit: June 10, 2022, 02:57:57 AM by BillO »
Quote from: Ironic Pete
I DO NOT NEED DATA, I'M PRETTY SURE I'M RIGHT!!!!

You think something is true, and that's good enough for you.

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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1613 on: June 10, 2022, 03:00:40 AM »
It's not only in Russia; the people in this "Covid Vaccine Magnet Challenge" video from California have their arms pretty vertical.

« Last Edit: June 10, 2022, 03:02:59 AM by Tom Bishop »

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Offline stack

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Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1614 on: June 10, 2022, 05:12:29 AM »
It's not only in Russia; the people in this "Covid Vaccine Magnet Challenge" video from California have their arms pretty vertical.

So 5 out of every 9 people become magnetic?

Why did they only put the magnets on the injection site? Is the claim now that only the injection site is 'sticky'?

And to bill's point, what ingredients in each of the various vaccines are magnetic?

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Offline Lord Dave

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Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1615 on: June 10, 2022, 05:51:05 AM »
It's not only in Russia; the people in this "Covid Vaccine Magnet Challenge" video from California have their arms pretty vertical.

So 5 out of every 9 people become magnetic?

Why did they only put the magnets on the injection site? Is the claim now that only the injection site is 'sticky'?

And to bill's point, what ingredients in each of the various vaccines are magnetic?

Also why the surface?  The needle is pretty deep in the muscle layer.  So what gets deposited on the surface?
If you are going to DebOOonK an expert then you have to at least provide a source with credentials of equal or greater relevance. Even then, it merely shows that some experts disagree with each other.

Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1616 on: June 10, 2022, 08:47:23 AM »
Claiming incredulity is a pretty bad argument.
Thanks for my new sig :). Presumably you'll be removing the Occam's Razor Wiki page now, which is a box set of argument from incredulity.

How credulous one finds something is subjective, but I'd suggest that there are more objective measures, like how many people find something plausible or whether any obvious mechanism can be understood between claimed cause and effect. If pretty much everyone who knows what they're talking about is calling bullshit on something then that is not irrelevant. And if there's no obvious casual link between the claimed effect and cause then that is not irrelevant either. And that's the difference between the Occam's Razor Wiki nonsense (rockets go really fast, that can't be right!) and this.

If I said that after a vaccine my arm hurt a bit then I'd suggest that most people would find that credible - there's a clear cause and effect there, I just had a needle stuck in my arm. Ouchie. If I said that after a vaccine I had the ability to fly then most people would not find that credible - famously, humans can't fly and there's no obvious reason a vaccine would give one that ability.
This magnetic stuff is somewhere in between those but I'd suggest towards the latter. There's no obvious reason that having a vaccine would cause one to become magnetic. Off the top of my head - maybe there's some magnetic substance in the vaccine which would cause the claimed effect. But

1) There isn't
2) Any metallic elements there are would be trace at best.

But OK, I've been vaccinated so I had a go and holy shit, I'm Magneto!:


(yes yes, I have a hairy arm. apologies for being so manly)

There are only a few minor issues with this.
1) I haven't had a vaccine for over a year, unless the claim is that this magnetism is permanent.
2) Those coins aren't magnetic.
3) That isn't the arm I had the vaccine in.

Apart from that, that's all very compelling evidence. The BBC link I posted above explains what's going on - tl;dr friction and other slight stickiness on the skin
As always, the credibility you give to "evidence" depends entirely on whether that evidence confirms what you want to believe.
And, as always, you probably don't believe any of this and are either trolling or wasting everyone's time or both.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2022, 01:22:53 PM by AllAroundTheWorld »
Tom: "Claiming incredulity is a pretty bad argument. Calling it "insane" or "ridiculous" is not a good argument at all."

TFES Wiki Occam's Razor page, by Tom: "What's the simplest explanation; that NASA has successfully designed and invented never before seen rocket technologies from scratch which can accelerate 100 tons of matter to an escape velocity of 7 miles per second"

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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1617 on: June 10, 2022, 03:25:28 PM »
Where is your evidence? Claiming a possibility is not evidence.

A group in Europe conducted a study of this on Luxembourgers last year:

https://www.globalresearch.ca/study-electromagnetism-vaccinated-persons-luxembourg/5749516

Quote
Only 30 vaccinated and 30 unvaccinated people were finally interviewed while the target was to interview 100 for the first group and 100 for the second. The condition of gender distribution was met. In each group, 15 women and 15 men were interviewed.

In the non-vaccinated group, out of the 30 individuals interviewed, the number of people showing attraction to the magnet was 0 (zero).

Therefore the experiment ended there for this group.

In the vaccinated group, on the other hand, 29 of the 30 individuals interviewed showed attraction to the magnet. That is, the magnet adhered to their skin without difficulty.

Of these same 29 individuals, 22 have the magnet adhering to only one shoulder and only to the injection area. These 22 individuals are those who received only one injection. The other 7 people in this same group have the magnet adhering on both shoulders.

In this group, known as the group of vaccinated people living or working in Luxembourg, it appears that:
- 17 received at least one injection from Pfizer
- 7 received at least one injection from Astra Zeneca
- 3 received at least one injection from the Moderna laboratory
- 3 received the single injection from Johnson & Johnson
- 6 received both Pfizer injections
- 1 received the 2 injections from Astra Zeneca
- 1 received the 2 injections from Moderna
« Last Edit: June 10, 2022, 03:33:10 PM by Tom Bishop »

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Online Rama Set

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Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1618 on: June 10, 2022, 03:37:03 PM »
Where is your evidence? Claiming a possibility is not evidence.

A group in Europe conducted a study of this on Luxembourgers last year:

https://www.globalresearch.ca/study-electromagnetism-vaccinated-persons-luxembourg/5749516

Quote
Only 30 vaccinated and 30 unvaccinated people were finally interviewed while the target was to interview 100 for the first group and 100 for the second. The condition of gender distribution was met. In each group, 15 women and 15 men were interviewed.

In the non-vaccinated group, out of the 30 individuals interviewed, the number of people showing attraction to the magnet was 0 (zero).

Therefore the experiment ended there for this group.

In the vaccinated group, on the other hand, 29 of the 30 individuals interviewed showed attraction to the magnet. That is, the magnet adhered to their skin without difficulty.

Of these same 29 individuals, 22 have the magnet adhering to only one shoulder and only to the injection area. These 22 individuals are those who received only one injection. The other 7 people in this same group have the magnet adhering on both shoulders.

In this group, known as the group of vaccinated people living or working in Luxembourg, it appears that:
- 17 received at least one injection from Pfizer
- 7 received at least one injection from Astra Zeneca
- 3 received at least one injection from the Moderna laboratory
- 3 received the single injection from Johnson & Johnson
- 6 received both Pfizer injections
- 1 received the 2 injections from Astra Zeneca
- 1 received the 2 injections from Moderna

There are sources of error that aren’t addressed in this. There is nothing quantifiable about the magnetic field they supposedly measured. How this can be taken seriously is beyond me.

It’s a group that also pushes homeopathy, 5G conspiracies and has a doctor that tried to link autism to vaccination.

It’s a pile of shit steamier than Tom’s arguements in the recent days.
Th*rk is the worst person on this website.

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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: Coronavirus Vaccine and You
« Reply #1619 on: June 10, 2022, 03:38:02 PM »
There are sources of error that aren’t addressed in this. There is nothing quantifiable about the magnetic field they supposedly measured. How this can be taken seriously is beyond me.

It’s a group that also pushes homeopathy, 5G conspiracies and has a doctor that tried to link autism to vaccination.

It’s a pile of shit steamier than Tom’s arguements in the recent days.

I asked you guys for evidence and you, again, merely claimed that the evidence you saw was false, without evidence for that either. I also highly doubt that a group called European Forum for Vaccine Vigilance is studying 5G or homeopathy.

Where is your evidence? It certainly seems like anyone could have conducted these types of trials and tests when people started taking the vaccines last year. Where is the actual evidence you are standing on in support of your position that no one has become magnetized by the Covid vaccines?
« Last Edit: June 10, 2022, 03:43:55 PM by Tom Bishop »