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Other Discussion Boards => Technology & Information => Topic started by: Fortuna on June 26, 2019, 07:01:00 AM

Title: New laptop
Post by: Fortuna on June 26, 2019, 07:01:00 AM
Welcome to yet another new tech purchase advice thread.

I'm getting a new laptop. I'm looking at the most recent MacBook Air and the Thinkpad X1 Carbon (base model). I'm really interested in the opinions of people who already have variants of the Thinkpad since I've never owned a modern one before. How would it compare to the MacBook air? I've never actually seen an X1 in person since they seem to be missing from every tech showroom I've been to. I'm also curious about the build quality of recent, Lenovo made Thinkpads. I have an old IBM Thinkpad in the garage that is heavy enough and sturdy enough to murder someone with, but I've heard the build quality has somewhat declined since Lenovo took over.

With Apple's recent price gouging shenanigans, I'm leaning towards the X1. It has ports for days, a sexy af carbon fiber frame, and that jet black matte finish that will make any nerd lift his skirt in a hot second. I'll also be doing plenty of virtualization, so the quad core i5 would be spicy as fuck compared to the dual core i5 on the Air. Although, the idea of having a Windows based laptop kind of makes me cringe. I'm worried about battery optimization and heat dissipation mostly. What do you computer dudes think?

One final note: I probably wouldn't install a different OS on the Thinkpad.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Lord Dave on June 26, 2019, 09:44:50 AM
I work with lenovos now.

The carbon x1 is useful if you're not doing anything power hungry or strenuous.  It has 2 usb-C ports, 2 usb-A ports, 1 hdmi, no ethernet port (except with special adapter), no removable battery (and the internal isn't great).

Its also pretty fragile and is weak compared to the T480 in terms of processing power.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: xasop on June 26, 2019, 11:39:17 AM
I use an X1 Carbon (4th gen, I think) as my daily driver. It's a fantastic laptop. I don't know where Dave is getting his info from, the battery life is excellent (accounting for the fact that I run OpenBSD, which doesn't have the best power management; Linux got way more juice out of it back when I ran that) and it handles tasks like compiling software just fine. Maybe newer generations are different.

I wouldn't touch any Mac with a ten-foot pole.

Another option you might consider is the X1 Extreme, which is a bit bulkier but comes with a GTX 1050 Ti Max-Q so it can do gaming on the go as well. I'm hoping to get the 2nd gen (which should be out in a few months) as my next daily driver.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Lord Dave on June 26, 2019, 12:06:57 PM
We have gen 6.  Never touched gen 4.  So my results may vary.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Lord Dave on June 26, 2019, 01:33:51 PM
Just spoke to my coworker.  Seems I was wrong, they're good.  Especially the i7.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Fortuna on June 26, 2019, 04:04:48 PM
I use an X1 Carbon (4th gen, I think) as my daily driver. It's a fantastic laptop. I don't know where Dave is getting his info from, the battery life is excellent (accounting for the fact that I run OpenBSD, which doesn't have the best power management; Linux got way more juice out of it back when I ran that) and it handles tasks like compiling software just fine. Maybe newer generations are different.

I wouldn't touch any Mac with a ten-foot pole.

Another option you might consider is the X1 Extreme, which is a bit bulkier but comes with a GTX 1050 Ti Max-Q so it can do gaming on the go as well. I'm hoping to get the 2nd gen (which should be out in a few months) as my next daily driver.

Yeah, the X1 Extreme looks really good too. I was actually set on getting gen 2 as soon as it came out, but after looking more into Lenovo’s stated and actual battery life for gen 1 it made me reconsider. Since it sounds like you’ve had a good experience with the Carbon, I’ll most likely go with that.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: junker on June 26, 2019, 05:07:58 PM
I had the 1st gen X1 several years ago, and currently use a 2018 MacBook Pro for work and a 2013 MacBook Air at home. Unless you have some need/want to be in the Apple ecosystem, get the X1 Extreme. The only Macs I use are ones I didn't have to pay for. While I prefer them in general for my own use case, I would go Lenovo if I had to spend my own dollarydoos.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Fortuna on July 01, 2019, 04:46:36 AM
I came to my senses after playing around with the new Macbooks at Best Buy. I'll be going with one of those instead of the Thinkpad. Cost is not a huge factor, and I don't mind paying a premium to be able to use macOS instead of Windows.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Clyde Frog on July 01, 2019, 11:51:08 PM
I realize you've made your decision, but I'm here to offer up another vote for the Lenovo systems. The X1 Carbon G6 is a great machine. If you need a little more oomph, for gaming the X1 Extreme has a GTX graphics card in it, while the P1 has a more CAD-focused Quadro card. They are all very capable systems though.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Fortuna on September 03, 2020, 12:53:19 AM
I never got the MacBook. But I did finally order an X13 Yoga. I got the model with a 128GB SSD that I’ll be upgrading after, since it looks like Lenovo copied Apple and charges ridiculous sums for more storage. That confuses me since you can’t upgrade MacBook storage after you order it, but you can with the Thinkpad. I also got the 400 nit “low power” display. Since it’s a custom configuration, it’s taking longer than normal to ship. Also, the estimated ship date has changed every single day since I ordered it a few days ago. Not sure what that’s all about.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: xasop on September 03, 2020, 01:25:37 AM
I never got the MacBook. But I did finally order an X13 Yoga. I got the model with a 128GB SSD that I’ll be upgrading after, since it looks like Lenovo copied Apple and charges ridiculous sums for more storage. That confuses me since you can’t upgrade MacBook storage after you order it, but you can with the Thinkpad. I also got the 400 nit “low power” display. Since it’s a custom configuration, it’s taking longer than normal to ship. Also, the estimated ship date has changed every single day since I ordered it a few days ago. Not sure what that’s all about.

I ordered a T14, also with the 400-nit display, and also with 128 GB storage (Lenovo has always tried to scam you on upgrades at order time). I got the AMD variant with a Ryzen 4750U, objectively the correct CPU.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Fortuna on September 03, 2020, 02:31:05 AM
I never got the MacBook. But I did finally order an X13 Yoga. I got the model with a 128GB SSD that I’ll be upgrading after, since it looks like Lenovo copied Apple and charges ridiculous sums for more storage. That confuses me since you can’t upgrade MacBook storage after you order it, but you can with the Thinkpad. I also got the 400 nit “low power” display. Since it’s a custom configuration, it’s taking longer than normal to ship. Also, the estimated ship date has changed every single day since I ordered it a few days ago. Not sure what that’s all about.

I ordered a T14, also with the 400-nit display, and also with 128 GB storage (Lenovo has always tried to scam you on upgrades at order time). I got the AMD variant with a Ryzen 4750U, objectively the correct CPU.

Didn't see the AMD option available on their website yet for the X13.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Lord Dave on September 03, 2020, 03:36:20 AM
Lenovo tends to use actual NVME drives these days so if your ok opening up the bottom screws, ya can usually replace it yourself.

At least on the models I work with.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: xasop on September 03, 2020, 04:28:16 AM
Lenovo tends to use actual NVME drives these days so if your ok opening up the bottom screws, ya can usually replace it yourself.

Yeah, that's my intention. Actually, the T14 has dual M.2 slots (one 80-mm and one 42-mm), so I plan to get one of these (https://tweakers.net/pricewatch/1233361/intel-660p-2tb.html) for OpenBSD and one of these (https://tweakers.net/pricewatch/1211927/wd-sn520-m2-42mm-512gb.html) for Windows so I can use garbage software needed for uni when I'm travelling.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Fortuna on September 03, 2020, 05:49:01 AM
Lenovo tends to use actual NVME drives these days so if your ok opening up the bottom screws, ya can usually replace it yourself.
one 80-inch and one 42-inch

(https://i.redd.it/v06ve00dpdz11.jpg)
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Lord Dave on September 03, 2020, 06:00:56 AM
Lenovo tends to use actual NVME drives these days so if your ok opening up the bottom screws, ya can usually replace it yourself.

Yeah, that's my intention. Actually, the T14 has dual M.2 slots (one 80-inch and one 42-inch), so I plan to get one of these (https://tweakers.net/pricewatch/1233361/intel-660p-2tb.html) for OpenBSD and one of these (https://tweakers.net/pricewatch/1211927/wd-sn520-m2-42mm-512gb.html) for Windows so I can use garbage software needed for uni when I'm travelling.

Do they have the damn bay requiring an extra "holder" like the t470-490 and the p50-52?
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: xasop on September 03, 2020, 02:04:44 PM
one 80-inch and one 42-inch

(https://i.redd.it/v06ve00dpdz11.jpg)

I'm just used to writing "inch" after numbers when it comes to computers because computer manufacturers like to use stupid units for some reason.

Do they have the damn bay requiring an extra "holder" like the t470-490 and the p50-52?

I have no idea, I haven't received the laptop yet. I'm just going by what I've read online.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Lord Dave on September 03, 2020, 03:55:02 PM
one 80-inch and one 42-inch

(https://i.redd.it/v06ve00dpdz11.jpg)

I'm just used to writing "inch" after numbers when it comes to computers because computer manufacturers like to use stupid units for some reason.

Do they have the damn bay requiring an extra "holder" like the t470-490 and the p50-52?

I have no idea, I haven't received the laptop yet. I'm just going by what I've read online.

It does not.

But no Thermal pad either.  So don't get anything heat sensitive.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Rama Set on September 03, 2020, 04:31:57 PM
stupid units for some reason.

'murica
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Toddler Thork on September 03, 2020, 05:02:09 PM
I have no idea, I haven't received the laptop yet.
Chy-na
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: xasop on September 03, 2020, 08:13:00 PM
I have no idea, I haven't received the laptop yet.
Chy-na

I ordered it 3 days ago and they estimated 5-6 weeks before I submitted the order. I'd say I'm well within the realm of expectations here.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Fortuna on September 03, 2020, 08:16:36 PM
I have no idea, I haven't received the laptop yet.
Chy-na

I ordered it 3 days ago and they estimated 5-6 weeks before I submitted the order. I'd say I'm well within the realm of expectations here.

Whoa, I ordered mine on the same day. We’re thinkpad twinsies.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: xasop on September 03, 2020, 08:37:52 PM
Whoa, I ordered mine on the same day. We’re thinkpad twinsies.

Yeah except you ordered the worse ThinkPad.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Lord Dave on September 03, 2020, 09:16:34 PM
Whoa, I ordered mine on the same day. We’re thinkpad twinsies.

Yeah except you ordered the worse ThinkPad.
Clearly y'all haven't had the fun of a P52 and its "defective" Thunderbolt port.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Fortuna on September 03, 2020, 09:38:18 PM
Whoa, I ordered mine on the same day. We’re thinkpad twinsies.

Yeah except you ordered the worse ThinkPad.
Clearly y'all haven't had the fun of a P52 and its "defective" Thunderbolt port.

My first laptop was a hand-me-down IBM Thinkpad something or other. It must have weighed 10 pounds or more.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Fortuna on September 11, 2020, 04:28:58 AM
It's in transit. Currently waiting to leave the UPS distribution center in Alaska. Hopefully a polar bear doesn't eat it.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Fortuna on September 16, 2020, 04:01:12 AM
Just got it. The trackpad sucks complete ass compared to my 7 year old Macbook. Battery life is ok. Build quality of the laptop overall is amazing. I might return it and get another Air like I should have done to begin with. If it wasn't for the jank trackpad I'd 100% keep it.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: junker on September 16, 2020, 03:20:09 PM
Just got it. The trackpad sucks complete ass compared to my 7 year old Macbook. Battery life is ok. Build quality of the laptop overall is amazing. I might return it and get another Air like I should have done to begin with. If it wasn't for the jank trackpad I'd 100% keep it.

I returned my Dell XPS 9500 and got a 2020 MacBook Air. You won't regret doing the same. If trackpad quality is a big deal, nothing is even in the same realm of existence as the MacBook. The new keyboards are pretty good too, although the butterfly keyboard on my work MBP was starting to grow on me.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: xasop on September 16, 2020, 03:56:20 PM
If trackpad quality is a big deal, nothing is even in the same realm of existence as the MacBook.

I keep seeing people say this, and having used both ThinkPads and MacBooks, I just don't see it. MacBook trackpads are absolutely awful to use. Maybe it's just about what you're used to.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Fortuna on September 16, 2020, 08:23:08 PM
Just got it. The trackpad sucks complete ass compared to my 7 year old Macbook. Battery life is ok. Build quality of the laptop overall is amazing. I might return it and get another Air like I should have done to begin with. If it wasn't for the jank trackpad I'd 100% keep it.

I returned my Dell XPS 9500 and got a 2020 MacBook Air. You won't regret doing the same. If trackpad quality is a big deal, nothing is even in the same realm of existence as the MacBook. The new keyboards are pretty good too, although the butterfly keyboard on my work MBP was starting to grow on me.

Yeah, agreed. Generally the Thinkpad one is decent compared to some other brands, but it just fails any time you need it to be precise. If they just copied Apple’s trackpad tech it would be a pretty dank laptop.

Hmm, this may be a difficult decision. The flippy screen is awesome for watching videos and doesn’t wobble at all. The keyboard is hella good. The chassis feels very sturdy, all carbon fiber maybe? It’s hard to tell. But it feels like a very lightweight, super durable plastic. As durable as aluminum, if not more so. I’d be really sad to lose all these ports too. And the jet black finish looks really nice.

Oh, it says it's made out of magnesium on the bottom.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Fortuna on January 10, 2021, 06:58:46 PM
So yeah, I returned the hunk of shit and bought an M1 Macbook Air.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: xasop on January 10, 2021, 07:22:18 PM
So yeah, I returned the hunk of shit and bought an M1 Macbook Air.

How can you return something before buying it?
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Fortuna on January 10, 2021, 07:28:40 PM
So yeah, I returned the hunk of shit and bought an M1 Macbook Air.

How can you return something before buying it?

The hunk of shit being the Thinkpad. It was still better than any other Windows laptop, but the Macbook Air is just too advanced. It doesn't even have a fan, the battery charge lasts forever, and according to benchmarks the M1 CPU is as good or faster than the i7-8700k I have in my main PC. This is the first laptop I've ever used that seems to defy the laws of thermodynamics.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Lord Dave on February 09, 2021, 05:11:10 PM
So yeah, I returned the hunk of shit and bought an M1 Macbook Air.

How can you return something before buying it?

The hunk of shit being the Thinkpad. It was still better than any other Windows laptop, but the Macbook Air is just too advanced. It doesn't even have a fan, the battery charge lasts forever, and according to benchmarks the M1 CPU is as good or faster than the i7-8700k I have in my main PC. This is the first laptop I've ever used that seems to defy the laws of thermodynamics.

It says its good because it can't run anything stressful anyway. 
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Toddler Thork on February 09, 2021, 06:14:48 PM
This is the first laptop I've ever used that seems to defy the laws of thermodynamics.
I'm waiting for them to redesign the iMac with the M1x chip. Then I am going to stab Bill Gates in the back after 25 years of marriage, and enjoy a sloppy blowjob behind a dumpster from Tim Cook. And if that conjures up a dirty image in your mind, its not as dirty as I will feel reading "So, you just bought your first Mac. Locate the power button and press to turn on ... "
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Lord Dave on February 09, 2021, 10:42:31 PM
This is the first laptop I've ever used that seems to defy the laws of thermodynamics.
I'm waiting for them to redesign the iMac with the M1x chip. Then I am going to stab Bill Gates in the back after 25 years of marriage, and enjoy a sloppy blowjob behind a dumpster from Tim Cook. And if that conjures up a dirty image in your mind, its not as dirty as I will feel reading "So, you just bought your first Mac. Locate the power button and press to turn on ... "

Didn't you used to write iphone apps?
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Toddler Thork on February 09, 2021, 11:52:51 PM
This is the first laptop I've ever used that seems to defy the laws of thermodynamics.
I'm waiting for them to redesign the iMac with the M1x chip. Then I am going to stab Bill Gates in the back after 25 years of marriage, and enjoy a sloppy blowjob behind a dumpster from Tim Cook. And if that conjures up a dirty image in your mind, its not as dirty as I will feel reading "So, you just bought your first Mac. Locate the power button and press to turn on ... "

Didn't you used to write iphone apps?
So what?

I knew enough to get into a mac and fire up xcode but ... and your face is likely to melt when I tell you this ... you can develop for iOS on a PC. Yeah. You can use products like Xamarin or Phonegap or React Native or.... well there are lots and they have the advantage that you can deploy to Android at the same time and not write the app twice. MacOS is an absolute mystery to me. I never really wrapped my head around Mac deciding to take a program, scatter its files to the four corners of your hard drive and never ask your opinion on where those things should live. It meant I could never find anything. I hated the rocket pad thing. The search was awful. The back up thing ... time machine .... it seemed to just duplicate, triplicate, quadruplicate my hard drive and use up all the space ... I felt if anything went wrong, I'd never be able to fix it. And the instant I needed to use the command line instead of the mouse ... ok, not happy.

If/when I get a Mac, I'll have to make my peace with all those things and learn them. I was able to largely ignore them as a developer and just got comfortable inside xcode for the very few times I wrote just straight up native objective c.

But I don't see a future for Windows/Intel.

Intel have promised 14+++++ forever.
Microsoft have promised Windows 10 forever.

^That is giving up. That is not innovation. That is uninspiring and getting left behind by Apple. And that won't be making me part with my money next time I buy a computer. I literally own a 14nm Windows 10 computer that I have had for a few years now. I'm ready for a change ... there isn't much of an upgrade out there without busting my bank account.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Fortuna on February 10, 2021, 05:17:45 AM
This is the first laptop I've ever used that seems to defy the laws of thermodynamics.
I'm waiting for them to redesign the iMac with the M1x chip. Then I am going to stab Bill Gates in the back after 25 years of marriage, and enjoy a sloppy blowjob behind a dumpster from Tim Cook. And if that conjures up a dirty image in your mind, its not as dirty as I will feel reading "So, you just bought your first Mac. Locate the power button and press to turn on ... "

The MacBook Air automatically turns on when you open the lid, so you don’t have to worry about any archaic power button nonsense.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Lord Dave on February 10, 2021, 11:09:23 AM
This is the first laptop I've ever used that seems to defy the laws of thermodynamics.
I'm waiting for them to redesign the iMac with the M1x chip. Then I am going to stab Bill Gates in the back after 25 years of marriage, and enjoy a sloppy blowjob behind a dumpster from Tim Cook. And if that conjures up a dirty image in your mind, its not as dirty as I will feel reading "So, you just bought your first Mac. Locate the power button and press to turn on ... "

Didn't you used to write iphone apps?
So what?

I knew enough to get into a mac and fire up xcode but ... and your face is likely to melt when I tell you this ... you can develop for iOS on a PC. Yeah. You can use products like Xamarin or Phonegap or React Native or.... well there are lots and they have the advantage that you can deploy to Android at the same time and not write the app twice. MacOS is an absolute mystery to me. I never really wrapped my head around Mac deciding to take a program, scatter its files to the four corners of your hard drive and never ask your opinion on where those things should live. It meant I could never find anything. I hated the rocket pad thing. The search was awful. The back up thing ... time machine .... it seemed to just duplicate, triplicate, quadruplicate my hard drive and use up all the space ... I felt if anything went wrong, I'd never be able to fix it. And the instant I needed to use the command line instead of the mouse ... ok, not happy.

If/when I get a Mac, I'll have to make my peace with all those things and learn them. I was able to largely ignore them as a developer and just got comfortable inside xcode for the very few times I wrote just straight up native objective c.

But I don't see a future for Windows/Intel.

Intel have promised 14+++++ forever.
Microsoft have promised Windows 10 forever.

^That is giving up. That is not innovation. That is uninspiring and getting left behind by Apple. And that won't be making me part with my money next time I buy a computer. I literally own a 14nm Windows 10 computer that I have had for a few years now. I'm ready for a change ... there isn't much of an upgrade out there without busting my bank account.

Yep.  Mind blown.  The very idea of being able to code iOS apps on a non-mac... Just... Unbelievable.

AMD has a good upgrade.  Didn't break my bank too hard but I had to upgrade everything minus the graphics card and power.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Toddler Thork on February 10, 2021, 02:07:19 PM
AMD has a good upgrade.  Didn't break my bank too hard but I had to upgrade everything minus the graphics card and power.

Does it? I mean, I have a Ryzen already.

I remember buying my first SSD. It was only 64Gb because that was all I could afford at the time. They were seriously expensive. I loaded my favourite operating system on to it (Parsifal - look away now) Windows, and booted the PC for the first time. It was like magic. Like the work of the devil. I couldn't believe how fast it instantly made my computer. That's the kind of upgrade i want. I want magic. And when I see ...

This is the first laptop I've ever used that seems to defy the laws of thermodynamics.
... magic. I want it. I want an M1 chip in my computer. That is the future. Not x86.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Clyde Frog on February 10, 2021, 02:32:20 PM
AMD has a good upgrade.  Didn't break my bank too hard but I had to upgrade everything minus the graphics card and power.
Does it? I mean, I have a Ryzen already.
The Ryzen 5000 series is a different animal than, say, the 3000 series. Much of a bigger leap than 3000 to 4000. Zen3 architecture is a huge improvement. AMD is out-innovating Intel quite a bit as of late.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Toddler Thork on February 10, 2021, 02:45:41 PM
AMD is out-innovating Intel quite a bit as of late.
They are still being handed their arses by Apple.

The future isn't power hungry x86 chips that compute generic workloads. Its going to be ARM with SOC tech, tuned to match the silicon to the software. I'm not running complex fluid dynamics computations. I watch youtube videos, make a the odd website, browse the internet and make a spreadsheet here and there. I want fast response times, low noise, low heat.

I'm happy to wait. As every day goes by, more and more apps are added to be m1 compatible and to make the experience better. I never like being an early adopter and beta testing someone else's software without being paid for it. But soon.

Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: xasop on February 10, 2021, 02:55:08 PM
The future isn't power hungry x86 chips that compute generic workloads. Its going to be ARM with SOC tech, tuned to match the silicon to the software. I'm not running complex fluid dynamics computations. I watch youtube videos, make a the odd website, browse the internet and make a spreadsheet here and there. I want fast response times, low noise, low heat.

That's interesting. When I wanted that 7 years ago, this is what you said:

You bought a computer that is optimised for the internet and now you intend to unoptimise it for the internet?

You picked a computer with an Arm cortex A15 chip on it. And then put Debian on it. Do Debian have an app store? This is a tablet chip. Not x86. What could you possibly be intending to do on this computer? The only thing it is good for is browsing the internet ... and you just made it slower at doing that.

You're an idiot.

Why the change of heart? Are you sure you're not just regurgitating corporate marketing hype again?
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Clyde Frog on February 10, 2021, 02:58:56 PM
AMD is out-innovating Intel quite a bit as of late.
They are still being handed their arses by Apple.
For light use applications, they have a leg up. For workloads that require more horsepower, not so much.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Toddler Thork on February 10, 2021, 03:04:54 PM
The future isn't power hungry x86 chips that compute generic workloads. Its going to be ARM with SOC tech, tuned to match the silicon to the software. I'm not running complex fluid dynamics computations. I watch youtube videos, make a the odd website, browse the internet and make a spreadsheet here and there. I want fast response times, low noise, low heat.

That's interesting. When I wanted that 7 years ago, this is what you said:

You bought a computer that is optimised for the internet and now you intend to unoptimise it for the internet?

You picked a computer with an Arm cortex A15 chip on it. And then put Debian on it. Do Debian have an app store? This is a tablet chip. Not x86. What could you possibly be intending to do on this computer? The only thing it is good for is browsing the internet ... and you just made it slower at doing that.

You're an idiot.

Why the change of heart? Are you sure you're not just regurgitating corporate marketing hype again?

1) I have no idea who Ævan is.
2) You took an ARM chip that was optimised for a job and gave it a completely different job making it useless. I intend to use the chip as Apple designed it to be used. And 7 years later, it does a lot more than that awful crap you bought all those years ago. That Ævan guy was right. You are an idiot.

AMD is out-innovating Intel quite a bit as of late.
They are still being handed their arses by Apple.
For light use applications, they have a leg up. For workloads that require more horsepower, not so much.
I just said, most of what I do is light applications. I'm not a weather man or the NSA. I'd like those applications to boot instantly and run like a greased weasel.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: xasop on February 10, 2021, 03:12:46 PM
You took an ARM chip that was optimised for a job and gave it a completely different job making it useless. I intend to use the chip as Apple designed it to be used. And 7 years later, it does a lot more than that awful crap you bought all those years ago. That Ævan guy was right. You are an idiot.

So you are just regurgitating corporate hype. Here's a hot tip: ARM laptops are, in general, no more specialised for doing one task than x86 laptops are, you've just bought into some marketing drone telling you they are. They're just another kind of machine.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Toddler Thork on February 10, 2021, 03:54:34 PM
ARM laptops are, in general, no more specialised for doing one task than x86 laptops are
Apple laptops are. It's a lot more than just a ringbus with some cache bolted to it. They have an SOC. Here ... check out this marketing diagram

(https://zdnet1.cbsistatic.com/hub/i/r/2020/11/10/68b349a2-b9b3-4d97-8326-6c7a8de0ea80/resize/1200xauto/ffebded4655e62d335ff93af4af9a9bc/014.jpg)

And its all on 5nm making anything Intel have seem very old.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: xasop on February 10, 2021, 03:56:57 PM
They have an SOC.

Oh, well that changes everything. ::)
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Toddler Thork on February 10, 2021, 04:01:54 PM
I don't know what your problem is? Apple make their laptops in china. You have a penchant for Chinese laptops.

Here is some more marketing to get you excited.
https://www.theverge.com/2020/11/19/21574057/apple-m1-chips-laptop-performance-intel-qualcomm-competition
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: junker on February 10, 2021, 04:16:32 PM
I've been cycling through quite a few laptops lately, most recently a Yoga 6. I am considering just returning that and getting the base model M1 Air since I don't do any heavy tasks on mobile and I have a decent desktop for anything the Air can't handle. I should make a thread about it...
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Lord Dave on February 10, 2021, 05:20:02 PM
AMD has a good upgrade.  Didn't break my bank too hard but I had to upgrade everything minus the graphics card and power.

Does it? I mean, I have a Ryzen already.

I remember buying my first SSD. It was only 64Gb because that was all I could afford at the time. They were seriously expensive. I loaded my favourite operating system on to it (Parsifal - look away now) Windows, and booted the PC for the first time. It was like magic. Like the work of the devil. I couldn't believe how fast it instantly made my computer. That's the kind of upgrade i want. I want magic. And when I see ...

This is the first laptop I've ever used that seems to defy the laws of thermodynamics.
... magic. I want it. I want an M1 chip in my computer. That is the future. Not x86.

I mean, I don't think you'll get that kind of magic yet.  Maybe Raytracing cards are that.

But honestly, it sounds like you want a mobile phone with a desktop mode.  Dock it, have a full desktop on your mobile.  Or an ipad with a stand and keyboard.

Which is totally fine and that 5nm is damn impressive since 7nm wasn't that long ago.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: junker on February 10, 2021, 05:59:15 PM
I've been cycling through quite a few laptops lately, most recently a Yoga 6. I am considering just returning that and getting the base model M1 Air since I don't do any heavy tasks on mobile and I have a decent desktop for anything the Air can't handle. I should make a thread about it...

Well I ordered it. Going to go pick it up today. Thork's hype convinced me.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Toddler Thork on February 10, 2021, 06:24:04 PM
Well I ordered it. Going to go pick it up today. Thork's hype convinced me.
I'd like you to bad mouth it and save me £1500 or more.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Fortuna on February 10, 2021, 06:29:26 PM
I've been cycling through quite a few laptops lately, most recently a Yoga 6. I am considering just returning that and getting the base model M1 Air since I don't do any heavy tasks on mobile and I have a decent desktop for anything the Air can't handle. I should make a thread about it...

There’s nothing the Air can’t handle. I edit 4K video and RAW image files on it every week. My only regret is I didn’t wait for the upcoming Pro, since it’s supposed to bring back MagSafe charging.

Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: xasop on February 10, 2021, 06:34:11 PM
https://twitter.com/bluerise/status/1354216838406823936

Looks like the M1 may actually be useful soon.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: junker on February 11, 2021, 01:55:54 AM
I've been cycling through quite a few laptops lately, most recently a Yoga 6. I am considering just returning that and getting the base model M1 Air since I don't do any heavy tasks on mobile and I have a decent desktop for anything the Air can't handle. I should make a thread about it...

There’s nothing the Air can’t handle. I edit 4K video and RAW image files on it every week. My only regret is I didn’t wait for the upcoming Pro, since it’s supposed to bring back MagSafe charging.

Yeah this thing has been amazing to use so far. I was tempted to wait for the 14" Pro to launch as well, but I don't do anything on my laptop that would justify spending that much money. Not sure if they replace the 13" altogether and keep the 14" at the $1299 base price, or just start the 14" at a few hundred dollars more. I do miss MagSafe though, it was a bonehead move to ever get rid of it. Although it is nice to be able to use the same charger on my phone and laptop with usb-c.

Anyway, everyone should get an M1 Mac.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Fortuna on February 11, 2021, 03:10:28 AM
I've been cycling through quite a few laptops lately, most recently a Yoga 6. I am considering just returning that and getting the base model M1 Air since I don't do any heavy tasks on mobile and I have a decent desktop for anything the Air can't handle. I should make a thread about it...

There’s nothing the Air can’t handle. I edit 4K video and RAW image files on it every week. My only regret is I didn’t wait for the upcoming Pro, since it’s supposed to bring back MagSafe charging.

Yeah this thing has been amazing to use so far. I was tempted to wait for the 14" Pro to launch as well, but I don't do anything on my laptop that would justify spending that much money. Not sure if they replace the 13" altogether and keep the 14" at the $1299 base price, or just start the 14" at a few hundred dollars more. I do miss MagSafe though, it was a bonehead move to ever get rid of it. Although it is nice to be able to use the same charger on my phone and laptop with usb-c.

Anyway, everyone should get an M1 Mac.

(https://i.redd.it/5ywrahmbozf31.png)

The other thing is it runs a virtualized version of lightroom as well as my desktop PC running it on metal. That sounds like a wild exaggeration, but it isn't. Since I got the 256GB version of the laptop it means I can't store many photo files locally (they're 20-30MB each), so I have them populate from the cloud every time I run the program. This takes a few seconds on the Macbook. It took 5 minutes or more on the ThonkPad. And the ThonkPad's fan kept ramping up to 9000 RPM, and the system would hang every few seconds. No thanks, bro.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: xasop on February 21, 2021, 02:11:25 AM
https://twitter.com/bluerise/status/1354216838406823936

Looks like the M1 may actually be useful soon.

And it boots:

https://marc.info/?l=openbsd-arm&m=161386122115249&w=2
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Fortuna on February 23, 2021, 12:29:03 AM
I exchanged the Air.

And bought the 512GB version instead. Apparently this version also has a higher binned processor that doesn't heat throttle as quickly.
Title: Re: New laptop
Post by: Fortuna on April 21, 2021, 04:06:54 AM
I downloaded a program called Wipr that blocks ads in Safari. I wish Apple wasn't so poopy and let you use regular addons like ublock, but this will have to do. The current version of Chrome uses too much battery power and isn't as responsive as Safari.