[honk]

Tom is clearly trolling, and it would be counter-productive to spend too much time dissecting his post. There is, however, one thing that I think does deserve a response, because it's become a popular talking point on the right lately, especially with the recent push to tear down the statues of Confederate leaders in Southern states:

This cult has always been on the wrong side of history. It was the party of slavery, the party of Jim Crow laws, and the party which opposed Civil Rights.

The notion that Democrats should feel guilty or responsible for the Democrats of a hundred years ago is ridiculous. Those people are all dead and gone a very long time, and their political beliefs have died with them. What's important is what the parties stand for today, and whom they have representing them now.

[Tumeni]

Trump's rallies have, in the past, included the assembled masses chanting the Great Leader's favoured catchphrases; "Lock Her Up" and others.

Isn't that more indicative of a cult? Mindless drones, chanting the words of the leader?

[timterroo]

I haven't heard the negative people here say one objectively positive thing about Trump; only pure forced negativity.

I've tried to find something objectively positive to say about him, unfortunately, the words positive and negative themselves are quite subjective words in the meaning of good or bad.

I oppose most of the policies Trump has signed, and I can't get behind his hateful rhetoric - objectively, the dissonance that he forces on American's is psychologically harmful.

The best thing I can say about him is that he isn't an ordinary politician, which I used to think was a good thing - thanks to Trump, I'm no longer certain of this.

[AATW]

There is nothing wrong with Trump

Right. Apart from...

He’s clearly racist. Just look at the language he uses and the policies he’s in favour of.

Clearly a misogynist - again, look at the language he uses and the attitudes he displays towards woman.

He’s a sexual predator who boasted about barging into dressing rooms of Miss Teen USA, has made troubling remarks about how attractive his own daughter is and boasted about sexually assaulting women.

He’s a compulsive liar, when fact checked his statements have a far higher percentage of falsehood than previous presidents.

He has some of the hallmarks of a dictator - he repeatedly attempts to delegitimise the press when they challenge him. They’re the people who are supposed to hold him to account but dictators refuse to be held to account. So he claims they are “fake news” (despite his own astonishing record of lying). And that’s what dictators do - ignore the press, you get your news from me. Proper dictators do it properly, banning any dissenting news sources, he hasn’t quite gone that far but I sense he would if he could.
He’s also routinely sacked people who haven’t been yes men to him.

He refuses to be scrutinised - witness the way he’s acted in recent press conferences, calling any question which isn’t “wouldn’t you agee, Mr President, that you’re doing a terrific job” a “nasty question”. And in one instance he just walked off when asked a question he didn’t like.

He has all the characteristics of a serious narcissistic personality disorder. Seriously.
Look them up and tell me Trump doesn’t display them.

So yeah, apart from all that, nothing wrong with him.

And you have to be trolling when you say Trump is thoughtful. Give me one example of him being thoughtful. I don’t see evidence of much thought or introspection going in to anything he does.

[timterroo]

He has all the characteristics of a serious narcissistic personality disorder. Seriously.
Look them up and tell me Trump doesn’t display them.

He truly does. There is now a documentary surrounding Trump's past that lead up to his running for President. It's called "Trump: An American Dream". Some of Trump's closest allies have stated him to by very sociopathic in his personality. Stating that they aren't sure what his values are, or whether he even has any. Trump doesn't seem to distinguish between right and wrong, only what's good for himself.

Trump, at one point, had a personal assistant who's sole responsibility was to collect news articles about Trump, so that Trump could read them.

Trump's favorite subject is 'Trump'. He doesn't care what's right or wrong, only that he is in the spotlight and that people are talking about him. These are the reasons it is so easy for Trump to say whatever he wants, he's getting attention from it, and he injects it like a heroin addict.

[AATW]

You just have to look at the way he talks. He constantly boasts about how good he is at everything - claims never backed up with evidence - and how much he knows about everything. He regularly uses phrases in the form “I know more about <x> than anyone”. And interestingly he routinely claims that everyone else agrees with him about that. He says things like “they were amazed, they said how do you know so much about this?”. Did they though, Donald? Did they say that?
When he claimed to have achieved more than any other president the UN literally laughed at him. No one on the world stage takes him seriously, obviously they have to appear to but that reaction was telling.

His response to the pandemic has been a combination of
1) Saying there is no problem and they’ve got it all under control
2) (when it was clear there was a bloody great problem) SayIng over and over what a fantastic job he’s doing as the bodies pile up.

He’s not well. Seriously.

[Lord Dave]

You just have to look at the way he talks. He constantly boasts about how good he is at everything - claims never backed up with evidence - and how much he knows about everything. He regularly uses phrases in the form “I know more about <x> than anyone”. And interestingly he routinely claims that everyone else agrees with him about that. He says things like “they were amazed, they said how do you know so much about this?”. Did they though, Donald? Did they say that?
When he claimed to have achieved more than any other president the UN literally laughed at him. No one on the world stage takes him seriously, obviously they have to appear to but that reaction was telling.

His response to the pandemic has been a combination of
1) Saying there is no problem and they’ve got it all under control
2) (when it was clear there was a bloody great problem) SayIng over and over what a fantastic job he’s doing as the bodies pile up.

He’s not well. Seriously.

Part of me suspects that he only has people around him to actually say these things.  So his entire world view is filtered through "Donald Trump is amazing".  Which would explain a few things.  If you hire a bunch of people who do everything in their power to kiss your ass, you're gonna be upset when the rest of the world doesn't.

[AATW]

Part of me suspects that he only has people around him to actually say these things.  So his entire world view is filtered through "Donald Trump is amazing".  Which would explain a few things.  If you hire a bunch of people who do everything in their power to kiss your ass, you're gonna be upset when the rest of the world doesn't.

I think there's some of that, but I also think when he says things like this he's just delusional.
I mean listen to this:



It's just delusion. No other word for it. And his lying is interesting. All politicians lie of course but he is a compulsive liar.
He lies like a child lies - lies about silly things which are just demonstrably not true.



There are many things I don't understand about Trump's administration, one of the things I don't understand most is how Trump can lie like this and there is no consequence. His supporters either don't care or they don't acknowledge he does it. I find it bizarre.

[honk]

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/14/us/politics/trump-ramp-water-glass-health.html

I'm glad this is getting more attention. Trump is not in good health, and we won't know the extent of his condition unless he gets an actual independent medical examination, not a checkup from someone who'll say what Trump tells him to for fear of being fired. I'm not just saying this because of how regularly Trump both directly and through his campaign mocks his opponents for verbal stumbles and perceived physical weakness. It's a serious issue. The president is visibly deteriorating, and if he's no longer mentally or physically capable of doing his job, then there's a line of succession that needs to be followed. Trump's inner circle don't get to "take over" by propping him up and telling him what to say.

[timterroo]

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/14/us/politics/trump-ramp-water-glass-health.html

I'm glad this is getting more attention. Trump is not in good health, and we won't know the extent of his condition unless he gets an actual independent medical examination, not a checkup from someone who'll say what Trump tells him to for fear of being fired. I'm not just saying this because of how regularly Trump both directly and through his campaign mocks his opponents for verbal stumbles and perceived physical weakness. It's a serious issue. The president is visibly deteriorating, and if he's no longer mentally or physically capable of doing his job, then there's a line of succession that needs to be followed. Trump's inner circle don't get to "take over" by propping him up and telling him what to say.

When watching Trump pick up the glass and bottles of water as he does, he does appear to be favoring his right hand - as though he doesn't have the strength or dexterity in his right hand. Perhaps it is weak from a blood flow issue or stroke? Purely hypothetical.

[Pete Svarrior]

I'm glad this is getting more attention.

I'm surprised that you'd mistake such obvious spin for "more attention". Trump has been pretty obviously and visibly afraid of stairs when he started campaigning in the first place. Have you already forgotten him holding handsies with Theresa May a few years back?

This is not a new concern, nor is it a sign of deterioration. It's probably just a slight phobia.

[AATW]

Tbh, as much as I can't stand Trump, I agree with Pete.
Going to file this under "nothing to see here". I'm calling bullshit on him being in prime, tip top condition, but physically he seems well enough to do his duties. Not in any other way, unfortunately. There are plenty of legitimate things to criticise him for, we don't nee to make up stuff.

[Roundy]

Tbh, as much as I can't stand Trump, I agree with Pete.
Going to file this under "nothing to see here". I'm calling bullshit on him being in prime, tip top condition, but physically he seems well enough to do his duties. Not in any other way, unfortunately. There are plenty of legitimate things to criticise him for, we don't nee to make up stuff.

I mean, honk said he wasn't making the argument that this is news because of how he's used his opponents' perceived frailties against them, but I am. He used a handful of unflattering clips in a commercial to help him win against Hillary. If she was at death's door then, she'd be dead by now. He constantly accuses Biden of mental frailty because of his occasional flubs.

Like honk pointed out, we really know nothing about his medical history. He dictated a letter to his personal physician claiming he would be the healthiest person ever elected president if he won. Then the Trump people seized his medical records after the same physician disclosed that he takes medication to help grow his hair. He openly hides his own medical condition from the public.

So yeah, when something like this happens (and I think it's important to point out that the glass of water is part of it too, but hey, maybe he has a phobia of water), we should scrutinize it. Trump would be doing so mercilessly if the shoe was on the other foot. But given the complete mystery around his actual medical condition, and the fact that this sort of thing is part of Trump's own repertoire, he has personally invited us all to call his health into question leading into the election. Fair is fair.

[totallackey]

ONE MILLION REQUESTS FOR TICKETS!!!

RALLY IN TULSA!!!

[AATW]

ONE MILLION REQUESTS FOR TICKETS!!!

RALLY IN TULSA!!!

You missed off the "TRUMP CLAIMS" bit at the start, which means it's almost certainly not true.
This from the man who made claims about the number of people at his inauguration which were demonstrably false.
Why don't you care that you have a compulsive liar running your country? I mean, we have one running mine too but I do at least care about that and didn't vote for him.

[totallackey]

ONE MILLION REQUESTS FOR TICKETS!!!

RALLY IN TULSA!!!

You missed off the "TRUMP CLAIMS" bit at the start, which means it's almost certainly not true.
This from the man who made claims about the number of people at his inauguration which were demonstrably false.
Why don't you care that you have a compulsive liar running your country? I mean, we have one running mine too but I do at least care about that and didn't vote for him.

Because the claim is true.

If any part of the claim wasn't true, the media would have had their "fact check," shit out already.

I care more about known liars running the media than I do about who is supposedly running the country.

You are foolish to believe the President or the PM is anything more than a puppet.

[AATW]

Because the claim is true.

If any part of the claim wasn't true, the media would have had their "fact check," shit out already.

Well, the sources I've found carefully say "Trump Claims", which in itself is telling but hey, maybe this time he is telling the truth.

I care more about known liars running the media than I do about who is supposedly running the country.

You should care about both but it's worrying, IMO, to have a leader of a country who can't be trusted.

You are foolish to believe the President or the PM is anything more than a puppet.

And yet you seem to quite specifically support Trump for some reason.
And I hear this argument a lot, but I don't buy it
Trump's presidency has been very...Trumpy - getting money to pay for The Wall, withdrawing support for the WHO and withdrawing from the Paris Climate Agreement. He has signed a bunch of Executive Orders to push through his agenda. That's all pure Trump.

[totallackey]

Because the claim is true.

If any part of the claim wasn't true, the media would have had their "fact check," shit out already.

Well, the sources I've found carefully say "Trump Claims", which in itself is telling but hey, maybe this time he is telling the truth.

"The Trump Campaign" =/= Donald Trump

I care more about known liars running the media than I do about who is supposedly running the country.

You should care about both but it's worrying, IMO, to have a leader of a country who can't be trusted.

I stated, "I care more about..." meaning I care about both.

I don't trust anyone, let alone a figurehead.

You are foolish to believe the President or the PM is anything more than a puppet.

And yet you seem to quite specifically support Trump for some reason.
And I hear this argument a lot, but I don't buy it
Trump's presidency has been very...Trumpy - getting money to pay for The Wall, withdrawing support for the WHO and withdrawing from the Paris Climate Agreement. He has signed a bunch of Executive Orders to push through his agenda. That's all pure Trump.

I support a lot of the policies that have come out since Trump has been in front of the cameras in his current position.

That climate change bullshit...is bullshit.

The efforts against human trafficking are excellent.

Much needed.

The WHO needs to be cut loose, as does the UN BS.

But no one will ever truly follow through with it on an individual level, because they are figureheads.

[Tumeni]

All other events at the venue projected for the rally have been cancelled, but for some reason, the booking for the rally has been accepted.

Attendees are expecting to sign a waiver absolving the organisers (Trump for President LLC) from liability should they become ill from COVID-19

So ...

Could the venue be held liable in future lawsuits, should large numbers become ill after the event?

If they realise this is a possibility, can they decline the booking? Are they obliged to open their venue if someone sufficiently famous wants to use it?

Are they acting wisely in the above regard?

[honk]

I'm glad this is getting more attention.

I'm surprised that you'd mistake such obvious spin for "more attention". Trump has been pretty obviously and visibly afraid of stairs when he started campaigning in the first place. Have you already forgotten him holding handsies with Theresa May a few years back?

This is not a new concern, nor is it a sign of deterioration. It's probably just a slight phobia.

Trump has visibly struggled with stairs a few times over the course of his presidency, but on many more occasions he's casually gone up and down stairs with no trouble at all, and the media haven't really bothered reporting on those moments because "Trump climbs stairs with no problem, nothing unexpected happens," isn't exactly a newsworthy story. Trump doesn't have a phobia of stairs in the sense that it's a purely psychological, irrational fear like how some people are afraid of clowns; he's afraid of more difficult stairs that he knows or thinks he won't be able to traverse smoothly and confidently. It might not be a sign of degradation, I'll admit. He might have been physically capable of moving faster, but was worried about stumbling and decided to be safe and take things extra slow. The same goes for the drink of water. Maybe he just has some arthritis that makes it painful for him to raise his arm too high. There are perfectly reasonable explanations for why a man his age has been acting the way he has, but Trump won't admit to any of them, because he refuses to admit to any flaws at all. So do his doctors. The only thing we really know is that the story he's given us of near-perfection isn't true.