[Excelsior John]

I should be curious to know who did the study that purports to prove that the religious outlive the non-religious. Has it been peer-reviewed? How was it validated? I'm a religious man, but just taking some blind statistic that someone pulled out of their heiny is playing awfully loose w/ facts. What about atheists w/ a strong network of friends & supporters analogous to a faith community, v. a Jew living in the Deep South 100 miles from another Jew? & every half-educated dimwit knows we didn't evolve from monkeys. We are a Primate, like them. Well, maybe EJ DID evolve from them, but the rest of us didn't, & Darwin never said we did.

Are you honesley saying you beleived we evolved from flippin monkees?!! That is papostros??!

[Yaakov ben Avraham]

Fappenhosen, I read the article. It seems to boil down to 'having a good support network' on a national scale. Whether religious or not, if you've got that (& otherwise have good vital indicators), you're likely to live longer. So my advice to atheists is: go join the Unitarians. They don't require belief in God, but you do get the social network. Seriously, kidding aside, although its true about the Unitarians, if you're a lonely atheist, go find some like-minded folk & hang out for about an hour on Sundays & Wednesdays & read 'The God Delusion' together. When you're not doing that, volunteer some time making the world a better place, working w/ the handicapped or something. Chances are, you'll socialise as much w/ friends, enjoy life, & contribute to making the world a better place just as well as any theist who goes to worship & Scripture study & volunteers his time making the world a better place. Well, there you have it. Or, if you'd rather be a religious Jew, Private Message me & we can talk about that

[fappenhosen]

Fappenhosen, I read the article. It seems to boil down to 'having a good support network' on a national scale.

Yes, so unless the whole country is atheist then joining a local book group just won't work.

However, they also point out that there may be a cause and effect confusion. It could be that ill health causes religion. Rather than religion causing good health.

So my advice to atheists is: go join the Unitarians. They don't require belief in God

Some argue that neither does Judaism.

[Yaakov ben Avraham]

Fappenhosen, it is a VERY small minority, but you're right. No, EJ, Darwin never taught that, although yes, I expect that given your general lack of intelligence, your ancestors of EITHER colour probably did swing from their tails. PLEASE note the lack of racism here. I have had many Black colleagues whom I have respected. EJ's problem isn't his race, its his IQ.

[Saddam Hussein]

Fappenhosen, it is a VERY small minority, but you're right. No, EJ, Darwin never taught that, although yes, I expect that given your general lack of intelligence, your ancestors of EITHER colour probably did swing from their tails. PLEASE note the lack of racism here. I have had many Black colleagues whom I have respected. EJ's problem isn't his race, its his IQ.

And just like that, the thread became about Yaakov and EJ jerking each other off.  Yet again.

[Hoppy]

Fappenhosen, it is a VERY small minority, but you're right. No, EJ, Darwin never taught that, although yes, I expect that given your general lack of intelligence, your ancestors of EITHER colour probably did swing from their tails. PLEASE note the lack of racism here. I have had many Black colleagues whom I have respected. EJ's problem isn't his race, its his IQ.

And just like that, the thread became about Yaakov and EJ jerking each other off.  Yet again.

Of course you had to chime in.

[Yaakov ben Avraham]

To hell w/ 1/32, I just wish I could get a tray that properly fit the microwave, & a different flavour of Maruchan Instant Lunch Noodles.

[Hoppy]

To hell w/ 1/32, I just wish I could get a tray that properly fit the microwave, & a different flavour of Maruchan Instant Lunch Noodles.

And you're calling 32 stupid.

[Yaakov ben Avraham]

Obviously, a trip to Wal-mart is in order. FAPPENHOSEN, Rabbi Mordecai Kaplan wrote a book, 'Judaism as a Civilization' in which he advocated the idea that Judaism was the civilisation of the Jewish ethnic group. God, by his definition, was that sum force that brought out the best in people, & was not personal. He never really committed on that. Some of his work expresses a distinctly non-personal, almost non-theistic (but not atheistic as such) worldview. Some of it, however, retreats from that a bit & allows for traditional theism. The Reconstructionist movement he founded is only 2% of all Jews, but has influenced the rest of us immensely. He believed the 613 Commandments of the Law were NOT divinely ordained (that non-personal God), but were valuable folkways of the Jewish ethnic group & should be followed for that reason. I, like most traditional Jews, love & hate him. Judaism is a civilisation. The Commandments are folkways. But God IS personal, & the Commandments are divinely ordained. So, he got it

[Yaakov ben Avraham]

partly right. His ideas have been most influential in Reconstructionism, which he founded, & Reform. But none of us have been untouched. I've read 'Judaism as a Civilization', & am reading it again now. You might find it interesting. I don't know where you live, but maybe one can be found in a library.

[fappenhosen]

That would be like reading Twilight fan fiction before reading Twilight. I wouldn't really understand the characters and plot and I might end up throwing it at the wall. Then someone would tell me that 50 Shades Of Grey is the only real Twilight fan fiction worth reading.

Wikipedia is enough for me. But thanks for the suggestion.

[Fortuna]

Yea, that's why the life expectancy was so high in the dark ages.

[DDDDAts all folks]

I believe in everything, that way I can't be wrong.

[fappenhosen]

I believe in everything, that way I can't be wrong.

Do you believe you are both wrong and not wrong?

[Saddam Hussein]

Hey guys, just thought I'd mention that I don't like Dawkins.

[Fortuna]

Hey guys, just thought I'd mention that I don't like Dawkins.

He's just the opposite end of the spectrum.

[Rushy]

I believe in everything, that way I can't be wrong.

Most religions have a mutual exclusivity rule in their book to avoid this sort of thing. Most major monotheistic religions each purport that only their god is the one true god. Judaism, for example, states you can have no idols before God. This is why in Christianity they regard Jesus as God, because if Jesus was only a man they would not be allowed to worship him.

[fappenhosen]

It is impossible for us to know conclusively whether God exists and what he is like unless he takes the initiative and reveals himself.

We must scan the horizon of history to see if there is any clue to God's revelation. There is one clear clue. In an obscure village in Palestine, 2,000 years ago, a Child was born in a stable. Today the entire world is still celebrating the birth of Brian

[DDDDAts all folks]

It is impossible for us to know conclusively whether God exists and what he is like unless he takes the initiative and reveals himself.

We must scan the horizon of history to see if there is any clue to God's revelation. There is one clear clue. In an obscure village in Palestine, 2,000 years ago, a Child was born in a stable. Today the entire world is still celebrating the birth of Brian

lol, I love Monty Python

[Yaakov ben Avraham]

To go where angels fear to tread, I shall that Judaism is the religion of the Jew. We know what God has revealed to us, & what he expects of us. What he may or may not have revealed to Gentiles, & what he expects or does not expect from them, we neither know, nor care, provided they abide by the 7 Laws of Noah (these can be found online). So we are not an exclusive faith the way Christianity & Islam are.