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Offline TomInAustin

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What are satellites?
« on: September 16, 2018, 10:08:30 PM »
I am not asking where radio signals come from but what are the visible objects that move across the sky at amazing speeds?  Ones you can track via many apps.
Do you have a citation for this sweeping generalisation?

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Offline TomInAustin

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Re: What are satellites?
« Reply #1 on: September 17, 2018, 02:25:46 PM »
Nobody?
Do you have a citation for this sweeping generalisation?

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Offline junker

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Re: What are satellites?
« Reply #2 on: September 17, 2018, 03:00:21 PM »
Nobody?

There is no reason to bump a thread less than 24 hours after you make it. If people want to reply, they will. You have been here long enough to know better. Warned.

Re: What are satellites?
« Reply #3 on: September 17, 2018, 08:01:57 PM »
I don't believe there are "satellites" flying through space around a ball earth. I do believe that aircraft can go really, really high up. lol

Re: What are satellites?
« Reply #4 on: September 17, 2018, 08:20:06 PM »
I don't believe there are "satellites" flying through space around a ball earth. I do believe that aircraft can go really, really high up. lol
And stay in the same place transmitting tv signals?

Re: What are satellites?
« Reply #5 on: September 17, 2018, 09:24:57 PM »
I don't believe there are "satellites" flying through space around a ball earth. I do believe that aircraft can go really, really high up. lol
And stay in the same place transmitting tv signals?

Stationary stuff just needs a tower. It doesn't need to be way high up in "space." Besides, you can't see those kinds of satellites. You can see the "Space Station" or other moving craft when it flies over though.

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Offline MCToon

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Re: What are satellites?
« Reply #6 on: September 17, 2018, 10:32:40 PM »
I don't believe there are "satellites" flying through space around a ball earth. I do believe that aircraft can go really, really high up. lol
And stay in the same place transmitting tv signals?

Stationary stuff just needs a tower. It doesn't need to be way high up in "space." Besides, you can't see those kinds of satellites. You can see the "Space Station" or other moving craft when it flies over though.


When I aim a DishTV dish, it's not pointing to a tower, at the angle it's pointing, a tower would be low enough to be visible.  The angle is pretty sensitive, if you are a little off, there's no signal.

When aiming a dish you use your lat/long coordinates and plug it into a calculator like this one:
http://www.dishpointer.com/

Plug in Santa Monica: 34, -118.4 and South Carolina: 34, -77.91.  I chose these because they are both at 34 degrees north for easier comparison.  Look at the convergence of the two lines, they converge in the ocean west of Ecuador.  Both dishes need to be pointed upwards at 40.8 degrees.  I cannot resolve how a non-satellite could be at that location.

I love this site, it's a fantastic collection of evidence of a spherical earth:
Flight times
Full moon
Horizon eye level drops
Sinking ship effect

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Offline TomInAustin

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Re: What are satellites?
« Reply #7 on: September 18, 2018, 04:09:07 PM »
I don't believe there are "satellites" flying through space around a ball earth. I do believe that aircraft can go really, really high up. lol
And stay in the same place transmitting tv signals?

I was asking about the ones you can easily spot and watch as they move across the sky.
Do you have a citation for this sweeping generalisation?

Re: What are satellites?
« Reply #8 on: September 18, 2018, 09:51:49 PM »
I don't believe there are "satellites" flying through space around a ball earth. I do believe that aircraft can go really, really high up. lol
And stay in the same place transmitting tv signals?

I was asking about the ones you can easily spot and watch as they move across the sky.
Well documented, as used for GPS.

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Offline TomInAustin

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Re: What are satellites?
« Reply #9 on: September 18, 2018, 10:34:38 PM »
I don't believe there are "satellites" flying through space around a ball earth. I do believe that aircraft can go really, really high up. lol
And stay in the same place transmitting tv signals?

I was asking about the ones you can easily spot and watch as they move across the sky.
Well documented, as used for GPS.

Indeed.  What i am really looking for is an FE explanation.
Do you have a citation for this sweeping generalisation?

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Offline stack

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Re: What are satellites?
« Reply #10 on: September 18, 2018, 11:13:16 PM »
Indeed.  What i am really looking for is an FE explanation.

Most often cited FE explanation I've seen is "balloons".

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Offline MCToon

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Re: What are satellites?
« Reply #11 on: September 19, 2018, 09:45:16 PM »
Indeed.  What i am really looking for is an FE explanation.

Most often cited FE explanation I've seen is "balloons".

I've seen claims of balloons as well.  There are significant problems with this idea though.  Balloons are blown around by the wind, balloons with directional control is possible, many football games have blimps floating over them.  Perhaps a more advanced version of what blimps use.  At high altitudes these winds are very strong.  I can't imagine a balloon with strong enough stabilization.

Of course, these balloons don't answer the OP's question.  It's about the things we can see with our eyes, cameras, or telescopes.  These things are certainly visible.

There are many web sites that provide location data for satellites so we can verify if predictions match reality.  You can find one on the site that will be near you soon, then track it.  This site gives locations:https://www.n2yo.com/

This site even lists future reentries of debris and "spacejunk".  http://www.satview.org/  Could be interesting to look for a reentry that will happen at night nearby and film it.

Here's a compilation of some reentries:


Jeranism even posted a nice video using his own camera of the ISS transiting the moon.

I love this site, it's a fantastic collection of evidence of a spherical earth:
Flight times
Full moon
Horizon eye level drops
Sinking ship effect

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Offline stack

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Re: What are satellites?
« Reply #12 on: September 19, 2018, 11:18:39 PM »
Indeed.  What i am really looking for is an FE explanation.

Most often cited FE explanation I've seen is "balloons".

I've seen claims of balloons as well.  There are significant problems with this idea though.  Balloons are blown around by the wind, balloons with directional control is possible, many football games have blimps floating over them.  Perhaps a more advanced version of what blimps use.  At high altitudes these winds are very strong.  I can't imagine a balloon with strong enough stabilization.

Of course, these balloons don't answer the OP's question.  It's about the things we can see with our eyes, cameras, or telescopes.  These things are certainly visible.

You find a lot of what conspiracy theorists believe as to why satellites shouldn't exist. But literally, the only thing I can find to answer what those things in the sky are that one can see is the balloon theory. Of course, that leads to how exactly they stay in place if need be. Some claim the atmosphere is very calm at 100km or so. Then there's the need to keep them aloft. Seemingly, we'd have balloons dropping out of the sky all the time. 

Of course, the other explanation is that what we see are satellites. Go figure. I wrote in some other thread that I'm confused as to why FET wouldn't just embrace the existence of satellites. Just weave them into similar explanations about how other heavenly objects rotate above a plane. No takers as of yet.

TL;DR - According to what I've been able to find, FET claims we are observing balloons, not satellites. 

Offline iamcpc

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Re: What are satellites?
« Reply #13 on: September 20, 2018, 07:04:56 PM »
I am not asking where radio signals come from but what are the visible objects that move across the sky at amazing speeds?  Ones you can track via many apps.

I took a good picture of the ISS on one of the days when you could see it. It matches other pictures I've seen of it from people with better camera/telescope than me. The explanation of what this was ranged from:

-A meteor orbiting the earth
-A balloon
-A high flying airplane
-A fake picture/photoshop
-A glitch in the camera
-I don't know but it's definitely not a satellite

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Offline MCToon

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Re: What are satellites?
« Reply #14 on: September 20, 2018, 07:08:51 PM »
Indeed.  What i am really looking for is an FE explanation.

Most often cited FE explanation I've seen is "balloons".

I've seen claims of balloons as well.  There are significant problems with this idea though.  Balloons are blown around by the wind, balloons with directional control is possible, many football games have blimps floating over them.  Perhaps a more advanced version of what blimps use.  At high altitudes these winds are very strong.  I can't imagine a balloon with strong enough stabilization.

Of course, these balloons don't answer the OP's question.  It's about the things we can see with our eyes, cameras, or telescopes.  These things are certainly visible.

You find a lot of what conspiracy theorists believe as to why satellites shouldn't exist. But literally, the only thing I can find to answer what those things in the sky are that one can see is the balloon theory. Of course, that leads to how exactly they stay in place if need be. Some claim the atmosphere is very calm at 100km or so. Then there's the need to keep them aloft. Seemingly, we'd have balloons dropping out of the sky all the time. 

Of course, the other explanation is that what we see are satellites. Go figure. I wrote in some other thread that I'm confused as to why FET wouldn't just embrace the existence of satellites. Just weave them into similar explanations about how other heavenly objects rotate above a plane. No takers as of yet.

TL;DR - According to what I've been able to find, FET claims we are observing balloons, not satellites.

We do know for certain that air pressure decreases with altitude.  This can practically be seen visiting Denver or Mt. Everest.  There is no argument I've seen about this pressure gradient.  At 100km, the pressure is terrifically small.  The calculated pressure is 0.03torr or 0.0000394737atm, values have reportedly been measured lower at 0.0019 torr or 0.0000025 at 90km.
Source: http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/Kinetic/barfor.html#c5

Either way, at 100km, there isn't much air to maneuver with a propeller or jet.  For this a balloon would require pressurized gas or small rockets.  Both require consumable materials, limiting the lifespan.  There needs to be a crew of people launching, monitoring, decommissioning, relaunching each balloon.  There are quite a large number of these that would have to be maintained around a flat world.  There are many TV based satellites at the very least.

The other problem is the location.  If you triangulate the location of the DishTV satellite I posted about previously, you will find the altitude is not 100km, but, over 35,000km.  As there are no known publicly claimed balloon altitudes over 60km, this would require massive breakthroughs in technology just to get to 100km.

Sources:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flight_altitude_record#Unmanned_gas_balloon
http://www.isas.jaxa.jp/e/special/2003/yamagami/03.shtml

Given the satellite height problem we now require many balloons all over the world to intercept the triangulation lines.  Not just over major cities, but anywhere someone might point a DishTV dish.  I've done this in rural Minnesota successfully at our family cabin.  My dad used to drive a motorhome with an auto-calibrating dish on top, he used it everywhere.  The number of these balloons required to cover the US is massive.

I can't see a way to resolve this.  Balloons to service just DishTV is not tenable.

It's unfortunate there are no FE proponents to take part in any satellite discussion.  It's a difficult conundrum, with no FE resolution I've ever seen.  Hand waving about balloons and solar powered aircraft just make the FE position look foolish.
I love this site, it's a fantastic collection of evidence of a spherical earth:
Flight times
Full moon
Horizon eye level drops
Sinking ship effect