totallackey

Re: Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
« Reply #60 on: January 16, 2018, 07:50:17 PM »
Repeating the OP:
"Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
would be the lack of a CGI rendering of the complete model, along with a detailed release of all inputs used for creating the model.

Those inputs used for creating the model would need to minimally include Kepler's Laws of planetary motion and Newton's Laws of motion and universal gravitation and account for the Laws of Thermodynamics.

Does anyone have such a model, open for inspection?"

If you do not have a model for submission, then please refrain from posting.
Thanks for repeating the OP and assisting!

I appreciate it!

totallackey

Re: Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
« Reply #61 on: January 16, 2018, 07:51:59 PM »
Yep.

Except for Kepler's laws of planetary motion. Approximations or not, scientists claim these work.

I revised the OP.

Out of curiosity, are you aware the Kepler's laws were used to predict the existence and location of Neptune and the prediction of the location was accurate to within one degree in the sky?
That's the story.
Repeating the OP:
"Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
would be the lack of a CGI rendering of the complete model, along with a detailed release of all inputs used for creating the model.

Those inputs used for creating the model would need to minimally include Kepler's Laws of planetary motion and Newton's Laws of motion and universal gravitation and account for the Laws of Thermodynamics.

Does anyone have such a model, open for inspection?"

If you do not have a model for submission, then please refrain from posting.

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Offline nickrulercreator

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Re: Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
« Reply #62 on: January 16, 2018, 08:41:37 PM »
Have you all ever heard of Celestia? https://celestia.space/ It has a LOT of what total is looking for.
This end should point toward the ground if you want to go to space. If it starts pointing toward space you are having a bad problem and you will not go to space today.

Rama Set

Re: Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
« Reply #63 on: January 16, 2018, 11:43:33 PM »
Yep.

Except for Kepler's laws of planetary motion. Approximations or not, scientists claim these work.

I revised the OP.

Out of curiosity, are you aware the Kepler's laws were used to predict the existence and location of Neptune and the prediction of the location was accurate to within one degree in the sky?
That's the story.

That’s the history. So it looks like you have to show that story false if you want to dismantle Kepler’s Laws.

Quote
Repeating the OP:
"Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
would be the lack of a CGI rendering of the complete model, along with a detailed release of all inputs used for creating the model.

Those inputs used for creating the model would need to minimally include Kepler's Laws of planetary motion and Newton's Laws of motion and universal gravitation and account for the Laws of Thermodynamics.

Does anyone have such a model, open for inspection?"

If you do not have a model for submission, then please refrain from posting.

No need to spam it like some weird robot parrot. I already provided you one.

totallackey

Re: Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
« Reply #64 on: January 17, 2018, 12:02:12 AM »
Yep.

Except for Kepler's laws of planetary motion. Approximations or not, scientists claim these work.

I revised the OP.

Out of curiosity, are you aware the Kepler's laws were used to predict the existence and location of Neptune and the prediction of the location was accurate to within one degree in the sky?
That's the story.

That’s the history. So it looks like you have to show that story false if you want to dismantle Kepler’s Laws.
Struck from the record due to: OFF TOPIC! BS!
Quote
Repeating the OP:
"Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
would be the lack of a CGI rendering of the complete model, along with a detailed release of all inputs used for creating the model.

Those inputs used for creating the model would need to minimally include Kepler's Laws of planetary motion and Newton's Laws of motion and universal gravitation and account for the Laws of Thermodynamics.

Does anyone have such a model, open for inspection?"

If you do not have a model for submission, then please refrain from posting.

No need to spam it like some weird robot parrot. I already provided you one.
Yet to be verified.

Unless you are a moderator, I don't want to hear it.

Repeating the OP:
"Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
would be the lack of a CGI rendering of the complete model, along with a detailed release of all inputs used for creating the model.

Those inputs used for creating the model would need to minimally include Kepler's Laws of planetary motion and Newton's Laws of motion and universal gravitation and account for the Laws of Thermodynamics.

Does anyone have such a model, open for inspection?"

If you do not have a model for submission, then please refrain from posting.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2018, 12:20:29 PM by totallackey »

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Offline rabinoz

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Re: Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
« Reply #65 on: January 17, 2018, 12:50:10 AM »
Repeating the OP:
"Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
would be the lack of a CGI rendering of the complete model, along with a detailed release of all inputs used for creating the model."
No it would not be "Damning evidence against the heliocentric model"!

Quote from: totallackey
"Those inputs used for creating the model would need to minimally include Kepler's Laws of planetary motion"
As I have repeatedly stated, an accurate model would not obey "Kepler's Laws of planetary motion" because they are only approximations.
And as I have stated before,  the orbits of Neptune and Pluto clearly do not obey "Kepler's Laws of planetary motion".

So, your OP is still obviously flawed!  Try again!

Quote from: totallackey
"and Newton's Laws of motion and universal gravitation and account for the Laws of Thermodynamics.
Does anyone have such a model, open for inspection?"
If you do not have a model for submission, then please refrain from posting.
Sorry, I do not take orders from a lackey! It's a lackey's place in life to take orders from his lord and master, not that I'm claim that exalted position.
Quote
Definition of lackey
1.   a : footman 2, servant
      b : someone who does menial tasks or runs errands for another

2 :  a servile follower : toady

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Offline nickrulercreator

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Re: Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
« Reply #66 on: January 17, 2018, 01:43:26 AM »
alright looks like i was ignored. I'll try again. Totallackey, there's a simulator called Celestia that might have what you're looking for: https://celestia.space
This end should point toward the ground if you want to go to space. If it starts pointing toward space you are having a bad problem and you will not go to space today.

Re: Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
« Reply #67 on: January 17, 2018, 02:47:45 AM »
I just registered and am not sure if this is the correct place to post something.
My name is Gregory Wiseman and I was one of the crew on the 2014 NASA expedition to the ISS.  My daughter told me about this society earlier today and I am honeslty intrigued.   I am not sure if the members here are truly in the pursuit of knowledge or just having fun but if it is the former then I am happy to share my personal experiences. 
Having spent a little over three months in earths orbit I can tell you all that we live on a stunningly beautiful planet and the earth I can assure you is perfectly round.  So perfectly round that if you shrunk it to the size of a billiard ball, it would be infinitely smoother in your hand than an actual cue ball.  I've been fortunate to view the earth with my own eyes from the heavens of the ISS and our planet is no different than any other, it is round just like a globe.
I'd be happy to answer an questions if they are sincere and hope you all will continue a lifetime of learning.

JohnAdams1145

Re: Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
« Reply #68 on: January 17, 2018, 04:23:16 AM »
Oooh someone who actually went to the ISS -- I guess if you were a Flat Earther we'd call you insane.

A few questions:

Part 1 -- easy explanations, please
1. What do you think about the Flat Earth hypothesis that the Sun is 32 miles wide and 3000 miles above the Earth? What evidence do you think is most convincing to Flat Earthers? I've tried the nuclear fusion argument but that got derailed very quickly (some flatties proposed that the Sun burns hydrogen with oxygen and others said it was ... electric smh).
2. Can you explain in a simple way why the existence of the International Space Station proves the roundness of the Earth without resorting to photographic evidence? (The orbit)
3. Can you describe an easy-to-conduct experiment that would prove the existence of gravity as opposed to universal acceleration (and the 10000 other different forces that FE people invent to account for observed differences by latitude, orbits of celestial bodies, the Cavendish experiment, Foucault pendulums, etc)?
4. Can you explain concisely to a bunch of flatties why aircraft don't have to account for the curvature of the Earth?

Part 2 -- opinion-based
5. Why do you think people like those in the Flat Earth Society distrust  scientists and science so much? Is it their fault, or is science just that hard to grasp?
6. Why do you think is the best way to remedy such ignorance?
7. Do you think the Flat Earth movement is just a more extreme manifestation of science denial that takes place in society today (anti-vaxxers, evolution, homeopathy, climate change, etc)?
8. Does it make you disappointed/angry when people who don't know anything about basic physics/math/chemistry (Tom Bishop, a "Zetetic Council Member," has asserted that pi = 4, 2+2 \neq 4, garlic cures cancer, that Foucault pendulums are affected by the distant stars, and that centripetal acceleration at the equator isn't normal to the Earth's surface) call the work that NASA does fake?
9. What's the best way to convey the magnitude, complexities, and specialization of current scientific work, so that these people realize that the trivial disproofs they come up with have already been thought of and debunked decades ago?
10. What's the best career path from undergraduate student to flying in space?


Also, I'll sum up a lot of FE theory for you, so we don't get the inevitable person spouting garbage about how you didn't address their arguments:
1. The Earth is a flat non-spinning disk with the azimuthal equidistant projection of the globe representing reality (although they can't agree on a map, this is the model they refer to).
2. Gravity doesn't exist; the Earth is accelerating in a direction normal to its surface known as "up" at 9.8 m/s^2.
3. The observed variations in gravitational acceleration come from a proposed form of "gravitation" (which is different from gravity; just think of the flatties' definition of "gravitation" as "invisible ").
4. All forms of the Coriolis effect are caused by some other form of "gravitation" produced by the stars, and they won't debate this with you.
5. The Sun, Moon, and any manmade satellites (if they acknowledge them, since there's a rift about this) orbit in circles above the Earth.
6. We are "shielded" from the invisible acceleration by the Earth's mass. By Einstein's equivalence principle, this and #2 mean that we can think of ourselves as the only things in Earth's neighborhood affected by an invisible  "downward" force.
7. There is no curvature of the horizon (even if there is)
8. All of the occlusions of the buildings and ships and other such things are due to "perspective" and/or "distortion" (although it has been demonstrated that the lead flatties know nothing about optics)
9. The horizon always stays at eye level (blatantly false)
10. We see further as we get higher up because of "perspective," "distortion," or "particulates" (more in lower parts) in the atmosphere.
11. Day and night are because the Sun has a magical lampshade that casts a "spotlight" on Earth.
12. NASA photos are fake.
13. Amateur rocketry uses "fisheye" lenses that make the Earth appear to be curved.
14. They don't understand spherical geometry, so the distance/angles argument is still a work in progress.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2018, 09:56:29 AM by JohnAdams1145 »

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Offline supaluminus

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Re: Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
« Reply #69 on: January 17, 2018, 07:00:26 AM »
I just registered and am not sure if this is the correct place to post something.
My name is Gregory Wiseman and I was one of the crew on the 2014 NASA expedition to the ISS.  My daughter told me about this society earlier today and I am honeslty intrigued.   I am not sure if the members here are truly in the pursuit of knowledge or just having fun but if it is the former then I am happy to share my personal experiences. 
Having spent a little over three months in earths orbit I can tell you all that we live on a stunningly beautiful planet and the earth I can assure you is perfectly round.  So perfectly round that if you shrunk it to the size of a billiard ball, it would be infinitely smoother in your hand than an actual cue ball.  I've been fortunate to view the earth with my own eyes from the heavens of the ISS and our planet is no different than any other, it is round just like a globe.
I'd be happy to answer an questions if they are sincere and hope you all will continue a lifetime of learning.

Is there any way at all you can verify who you are? This kind of primary sourcing sounds too good to be true, if you’ll pardon my meaning.
When an honest man discovers that he is mistaken, either he will cease being mistaken...

... or he will cease being honest.

 - a loyal slave to reason and doubt

totallackey

Re: Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
« Reply #70 on: January 17, 2018, 11:00:56 AM »
Repeating the OP:
"Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
would be the lack of a CGI rendering of the complete model, along with a detailed release of all inputs used for creating the model.

Those inputs used for creating the model would need to minimally include Kepler's Laws of planetary motion and Newton's Laws of motion and universal gravitation and account for the Laws of Thermodynamics.

Does anyone have such a model, open for inspection?"

If you do not have a model for submission, then please refrain from posting.

totallackey

Re: Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
« Reply #71 on: January 17, 2018, 11:03:36 AM »
Off topic post
Your post has been reported to the moderator as it is entirely off topic. Any response to your post has also been reported to moderation.

Please start your own thread as I am sure you will generate more than enough interest.

Have a nice day.

Repeating the OP:
"Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
would be the lack of a CGI rendering of the complete model, along with a detailed release of all inputs used for creating the model.

Those inputs used for creating the model would need to minimally include Kepler's Laws of planetary motion and Newton's Laws of motion and universal gravitation and account for the Laws of Thermodynamics.

Does anyone have such a model, open for inspection?"

If you do not have a model for submission, then please refrain from posting.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2018, 11:06:18 AM by totallackey »

Rama Set

Re: Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
« Reply #72 on: January 17, 2018, 12:52:23 PM »
Off topic post
Your post has been reported to the moderator as it is entirely off topic. Any response to your post has also been reported to moderation.

Please start your own thread as I am sure you will generate more than enough interest.

Have a nice day.

Repeating the OP:
"Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
would be the lack of a CGI rendering of the complete model, along with a detailed release of all inputs used for creating the model.

Those inputs used for creating the model would need to minimally include Kepler's Laws of planetary motion and Newton's Laws of motion and universal gravitation and account for the Laws of Thermodynamics.

Does anyone have such a model, open for inspection?"

If you do not have a model for submission, then please refrain from posting.

First-hand observation of a heliocentric solar system is better than a computer simulation. Also, if he is in space then that is proof that Newtonian mechanics correctly model the solar system since they are used for calculations to get in to orbit.

Whether or not the poster is “fake news” or not is the pertinent question.

totallackey

Re: Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
« Reply #73 on: January 17, 2018, 12:57:24 PM »
First-hand observation of a heliocentric solar system is better than a computer simulation. Also, if he is in space then that is proof that Newtonian mechanics correctly model the solar system since they are used for calculations to get in to orbit.

Whether or not the poster is “fake news” or not is the pertinent question.
Your post has been reported to moderation for being off topic.

Repeating the OP:
"Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
would be the lack of a CGI rendering of the complete model, along with a detailed release of all inputs used for creating the model.

Those inputs used for creating the model would need to minimally include Kepler's Laws of planetary motion and Newton's Laws of motion and universal gravitation and account for the Laws of Thermodynamics.

Does anyone have such a model, open for inspection?"

If you do not have a model for submission, then please refrain from posting.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2018, 01:10:41 PM by totallackey »

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Offline rabinoz

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Re: Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
« Reply #74 on: January 17, 2018, 01:04:01 PM »
<< deceitfully edited quotation deleted >>
So you finally admit I was right and cannot refute this:
Repeating the OP:
"Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
would be the lack of a CGI rendering of the complete model, along with a detailed release of all inputs used for creating the model."
No, it would not be "Damning evidence against the heliocentric model"!

Quote from: totallackey
"Those inputs used for creating the model would need to minimally include Kepler's Laws of planetary motion"
As I have repeatedly stated, an accurate model would not obey "Kepler's Laws of planetary motion" because they are only approximations.
And as I have stated before,  the orbits of Neptune and Pluto clearly do not obey "Kepler's Laws of planetary motion".

So, your OP is still obviously flawed!  Try again!

totallackey

Re: Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
« Reply #75 on: January 17, 2018, 01:16:02 PM »
Personal editorial about the way the OP is phrased snipped.
You can start your own editorial elsewhere if you like.

The OP is asking for a CGI rendering of the Solar System:

Repeating the OP:
"Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
would be the lack of a CGI rendering of the complete model, along with a detailed release of all inputs used for creating the model.

Those inputs used for creating the model would need to minimally include Kepler's Laws of planetary motion and Newton's Laws of motion and universal gravitation and account for the Laws of Thermodynamics.

Does anyone have such a model, open for inspection?"

If you do not have a model for submission, then please refrain from posting.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2018, 01:44:42 PM by totallackey »

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Offline juner

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Re: Damning evidence against the heliocentric model...
« Reply #76 on: January 17, 2018, 03:26:48 PM »
Your post has been reported to moderation for being off topic.

Stop doing that. If you want to report a post because you believe it breaks the rules, then just report it. It isn't necessary to announce it as it can only serve to further derail a thread.


EDIT - I am locking this thread since you children can't seem to behave.

totallackey, have a few days vacation to cool off. If you come back, stop intentionally antagonizing people and posting in bad faith. The quote function is intended just for that, not for you to editorialize someone's words. Using it to shorten someone's point is fine, but what you are doing is not acceptable in the upper fora.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2018, 03:36:49 PM by junker »