The Flat Earth Society
Other Discussion Boards => Technology & Information => Topic started by: xasop on February 12, 2015, 05:59:41 PM
-
I just bought an Apple laptop. Specifically, an iBook G4 (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Apple-Laptop-iBook-G4-1-33Ghz-12-inch-40gb-1GB-DVD-Combo-WiFi-OS-X-10-5-8-leo-/161595631915).
I am looking forward to getting my hands on this and replacing OS X with OpenBSD.
-
mega
-
I just bought an Apple laptop. Specifically, an iBook G4 (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Apple-Laptop-iBook-G4-1-33Ghz-12-inch-40gb-1GB-DVD-Combo-WiFi-OS-X-10-5-8-leo-/161595631915).
I am looking forward to getting my hands on this and replacing OS X with OpenBSD.
Why would you do that?
-
Welcome, brother. We've been waiting for you.
-
I just bought an Apple laptop. Specifically, an iBook G4 (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Apple-Laptop-iBook-G4-1-33Ghz-12-inch-40gb-1GB-DVD-Combo-WiFi-OS-X-10-5-8-leo-/161595631915).
I am looking forward to getting my hands on this and replacing OS X with OpenBSD.
Why would you do that?
He is going to turn it in to a walking mockery of what apple stands for. Literally walking...
-
I just bought an Apple laptop. Specifically, an iBook G4 (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Apple-Laptop-iBook-G4-1-33Ghz-12-inch-40gb-1GB-DVD-Combo-WiFi-OS-X-10-5-8-leo-/161595631915).
I am looking forward to getting my hands on this and replacing OS X with OpenBSD.
Why would you do that?
He is going to turn it in to a walking mockery of what apple stands for. Literally walking...
Money, over priced hardware, locked capabilities?
-
Hardly over priced Lord Dave. It is ancient. 2005!
Even in its day it was a steaming pile and Apple eventually gave in and put Intel processors in their computers so they could compete again.
I'm starting to think Parsifal is a junk hoarder. He buys cheap rubbish and fills his house with it. What happened to the Chinese laptop? How many laptops do you need? You aren't a poor man. Just get one really good one.
If you want a toy get a raspberry pi or and Intel NUC or something. A nine year old laptop ... for $200AUD with the postage. You have hoarding problems.
-
He is performing an experiment. Sounds like a good plan to me.
-
Is the experiment to see if he can corner the market in computers no one else wants to buy?
-
The collecting of outdated technological artifacts, like Thinkpads and old IBM mechanical keyboards, is an esoteric practice, Thork. You aren't autistic enough to understand.
-
Or maybe he is too autistic to understand.
-
This forum demonstrates the six degrees of autism theory perfectly.
-
Why would you buy an apple laptop just to replace OSX with OpenBSD? You paid more for OSX than you did the laptop's actual hardware.
-
Why would you buy an apple laptop just to replace OSX with OpenBSD? You paid more for OSX than you did the laptop's actual hardware.
Have you no adventurous spirit?
-
You paid more for OSX than you did the laptop's actual hardware.
???
-
You paid more for OSX than you did the laptop's actual hardware.
???
If you subtract the hardware cost out of Apple products (yes, even second hand, because the laptop's price depreciates based on the original price) then you end up paying at least 60% of the cost attributed to OSX. Other laptops attribute on average about 30% to the OS.
It's not huge savings at the price level he was buying at, but savings is savings.
-
You paid more for OSX than you did the laptop's actual hardware.
???
If you subtract the hardware cost out of Apple products (yes, even second hand, because the laptop's price depreciates based on the original price) then you end up paying at least 60% of the cost attributed to OSX. Other laptops attribute on average about 30% to the OS.
It's not huge savings at the price level he was buying at, but savings is savings.
What makes you think that the price of the OSX upgrade (it shipped with 10.4 but was upgraded to 10.5) was factored into the Parsifal's $110 bid price? BTW, as I recall, OSX 10.5 was about a $100 upgrade at the time.
-
Other laptops attribute on average about 30% to the OS.
Windows is about £90. A laptop costs between £400 and £2000. How is the OS 30%? Ever?
-
Other laptops attribute on average about 30% to the OS.
Windows is about £90. A laptop costs between £400 and £2000. How is the OS 30%? Ever?
Only chumps pay 90 brit dollars for Windows.
-
Only chumps pay for Windows.
-
Why would you do that?
Why wouldn't you do that?
Welcome, brother. We've been waiting for you.
I am deeply looking forward to replacing Apple's crapware with an OS worth the bytes it takes up. Am I still your brother?
Hardly over priced Lord Dave. It is ancient. 2005!
How does being ancient preclude it from being overpriced?
Even in its day it was a steaming pile and Apple eventually gave in and put Intel processors in their computers so they could compete again.
It's a good thing I don't plan to actually use the bloatware OS that comes pre-installed on it, so it might actually perform decently with a well-written OS.
I'm starting to think Parsifal is a junk hoarder. He buys cheap rubbish and fills his house with it.
As always, I care about your opinion very much. As a matter of fact, it's the main reason I made this thread.
What happened to the Chinese laptop?
Nothing. It still runs just fine, and I've been using it to learn MIPS assembly programming.
How many laptops do you need?
None at all.
You aren't a poor man. Just get one really good one.
Are you drunk again? If I were a poor man, I probably wouldn't go buying lots of different computers. The fact that I have money means I can afford to. Since I also want to, that works out rather nicely.
If you want a toy get a raspberry pi or and Intel NUC or something.
I already have three Raspberry Pis I do nothing with. Now that I'm making the switch to OpenBSD, which doesn't support closed hardware platforms like the rPi, I probably won't use them for anything. I'm probably going to sell them soon.
As for an Intel NUC... Thork, why do you still assume everyone else has the same needs and desires as you? You haven't even bothered to ask why I wanted an iBook before barging in with your amazing opinions.
A nine year old laptop ... for $200AUD with the postage. You have hoarding problems.
Is it hoarding if I actually use the hardware?
Is the experiment to see if he can corner the market in computers no one else wants to buy?
No, but now that you mention it, that sounds like a great idea. What better way to save money than to buy hardware for which there is literally zero demand?
Why would you buy an apple laptop just to replace OSX with OpenBSD? You paid more for OSX than you did the laptop's actual hardware.
Because I wanted to try out OpenBSD's macppc port (http://www.openbsd.org/macppc.html). Funnily enough, that requires purchasing a PowerPC Mac, which is kind of hard to find without OS X pre-installed. I decided to go for the last (and therefore best-specced) 12-inch iBook model; I briefly considered the last PowerBook, which has slightly better specs, until I realised that the 12-inch model has NVIDIA graphics. And fuck getting a laptop bigger than 12 inches.
As for why I want to use the hardware platform; I'm interested in trying new and different hardware platforms in general, but this one in particular caught my attention for a couple of reasons. One, Apple's PowerPC systems are some of the few non-x86 commercially viable laptops produced in the past decade, and the laptop form factor is convenient because I can move it around and not have to worry about a tangled mess of VGA, serial or network cables.
The second reason is that PowerPC is a big-endian architecture. Every other computer I've ever owned has been little-endian (either x86-like, or else a little-endian MIPS or ARM variant). If I'm going to want to get more involved in OpenBSD hacking, it will be convenient to be able to test my changes on a big-endian platform, as endianness bugs are fairly common and easy to miss.
SPARC is another big-endian architecture, so I will probably also buy a SPARCbook at some point if I can find one (they were never particularly popular, and haven't been produced in some time, so that might prove difficult).
Only chumps pay for Windows.
Only chumps use Windows.
-
Ha ha ha.
-
You haven't even bothered to ask why I wanted an iBook before barging in with your amazing opinions.
There can be no reason other than you love filling your home full of antiquated crap.
-
I'm starting to think Parsifal is a junk hoarder. He buys cheap rubbish and fills his house with it.
As always, I care about your opinion very much. As a matter of fact, it's the main reason I made this thread.
Actually, this raises a good question. I do not mean this as criticism, or anything in any way malicious, but: why did you make this thread? If it's not for an exchange of opinions, then what's the goal?
-
Actually, this raises a good question. I do not mean this as criticism, or anything in any way malicious, but: why did you make this thread? If it's not for an exchange of opinions, then what's the goal?
Is this really, truly the first time you've ever wondered why he makes these threads? Up until this point, him treating the forum as a twitter didn't make you wonder why?
-
Perhaps not, but I've never really been curious enough to ask. Now I am.
-
I'm starting to think Parsifal is a junk hoarder. He buys cheap rubbish and fills his house with it.
As always, I care about your opinion very much. As a matter of fact, it's the main reason I made this thread.
Actually, this raises a good question. I do not mean this as criticism, or anything in any way malicious, but: why did you make this thread? If it's not for an exchange of opinions, then what's the goal?
Thorkpinions aren't real opinions.
-
There can be no reason other than you love filling your home full of antiquated crap.
How about the reasons I gave in my last post?
Actually, this raises a good question. I do not mean this as criticism, or anything in any way malicious, but: why did you make this thread? If it's not for an exchange of opinions, then what's the goal?
An exchange of opinions about the topic at hand, certainly, but not a one-way torrent of opinions on the OP's psychological state.
-
Aww yiss, shit is happening:
(http://img.sjm.so/ibook_shipping)
-
inb4 it gets stuck for 3 weeks in customs because the NSA installs its firmware chip on it.
-
:^)
-
I'm starting to think Parsifal is a junk hoarder. He buys cheap rubbish and fills his house with it.
As always, I care about your opinion very much. As a matter of fact, it's the main reason I made this thread.
Actually, this raises a good question. I do not mean this as criticism, or anything in any way malicious, but: why did you make this thread? If it's not for an exchange of opinions, then what's the goal?
Perhaps if he renamed this board to "Parsifal's Tech Blog", then his goal might be more apparent.
-
inb4 it gets stuck for 3 weeks in customs because the NSA installs its firmware chip on it.
It's an apple product. Why would they need to add another spy chip?
-
It's an apple product. Why would they need to add another spy chip?
The one in it right now is probably outdated.
-
My new iBook is on a wild ride around the USA. Since the last image I posted, it's departed New York for Ohio, and has now stopped for a while in Kentucky:
(http://img.sjm.so/ibook_shipping2)
Where will it go next? Tune in next week to find out!
-
Maybe some badguys will get a hold of it and use it to check their email.
-
My iBook is still chilling in Erlanger. I hope it's picking up lots of fried chicken to bring home for me.
-
Parsifal loves the tendies
-
My iBook is still chilling in Erlanger.
It probably makes a great football for the warehouse staff.
-
I have now ordered a storage upgrade (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00AQT2LRK) for my new iBook. This is going to be so awesome.
Oh, and the iBook itself is still in Kentucky. Can't you yanks get your act together and deliver a fucking package?
-
Erlanger is really ghetto. Actually most of Kentucky is. When I was there, it was like they were trying so hard to join the first world, but didn't quite get there.
-
They're too busy getting drunk on shitty corn spirits.
-
It's about time:
(http://img.sjm.so/ibook_shipping3)
These timestamps are all kinds of wonky. According to eBay's tracker, it arrived in Ohio before leaving New York, and has now been shipped out from Kentucky at a time which is (even by Sydney time) in the future.
-
Apparently being shipped to "International Destination" involves more bouncing around America first:
(http://img.sjm.so/ibook_shipping4)
-
You're never getting the laptop...
-
I think it's Groundhog Day:
(http://img.sjm.so/ibook_shipping5)
-
8 days and it still isn't even in your country yet. It seems your laptop is actually taking its own vacation and made its way to Graceland where it is now having an extended stop to enjoy the music and memorabilia. It'll probably arrive with a large set of pork chop sideburns and boot up with messages like "uh-huh" and log off saying "thank you, thank you very much". Then again that laptop was probably around when Elvis was still alive and likely has a few archived images of him on its hard drive. When your laptop arrives ... you should name him Elvis.
-
That was quality Thork babbling I just read.
-
Elvis doesn't comply with Parsifal's computer naming convention.
-
I'm pretty sure there was an Ewok called Elvis. The little brown furry one.
-
That was quality Thork babbling I just read.
-
It'll probably arrive with a large set of pork chop sideburns and boot up with messages like "uh-huh" and log off saying "thank you, thank you very much".
My OS doesn't make sounds unless I tell it to.
Then again that laptop was probably around when Elvis was still alive and likely has a few archived images of him on its hard drive. When your laptop arrives ... you should name him Elvis.
Elvis doesn't comply with Parsifal's computer naming convention.
I'm pretty sure there was an Ewok called Elvis. The little brown furry one.
I've actually switched my naming convention to Star Trek characters, since I prefer it to Star Wars. My ThinkPad is spock, for instance, because it runs OpenBSD where everything is logical.
I'm not sure what I'll call the iBook. Perhaps gath.
-
I'm not sure what I'll call the iBook. Perhaps gash.
ftfy
-
You should name it Right Hand of Darkness. That's what I named my netbook. My Wi-Fi name is Left Hand of Darkness. They work together.
-
You should name it Right Hand of Darkness. That's what I named my netbook. My Wi-Fi name is Left Hand of Darkness. They work together.
I'll bet your right hand of darkness is very busy.
-
You should name it Right Hand of Darkness. That's what I named my netbook. My Wi-Fi name is Left Hand of Darkness. They work together.
gath is such a fitting name, though. He's the ruler of a planet called Sikaris, encountered by Voyager, which allures them by its abounding luxuries and eagerness to please, with no signs of poverty or crime. As the episode progresses, it's revealed that everyone on Sikaris is really only interested in their own pleasure, and Gath really just wants the crew of Voyager to stay around forever and indulge in their utopia instead of returning to Earth.
Perfect for an Apple laptop.
-
You should name it Right Hand of Darkness. That's what I named my netbook. My Wi-Fi name is Left Hand of Darkness. They work together.
gath is such a fitting name, though. He's the ruler of a planet called Sikaris, encountered by Voyager, which allures them by its abounding luxuries and eagerness to please, with no signs of poverty or crime. As the episode progresses, it's revealed that everyone on Sikaris is really only interested in their own pleasure, and Gath really just wants the crew of Voyager to stay around forever and indulge in their utopia instead of returning to Earth.
Perfect for an Apple laptop.
You're right. That's better for an Apple product. I thought I had seen all of Voyager, but I am drawing a blank on this one.
I'll bet your right hand of darkness is very busy.
>:(
-
You're right. That's better for an Apple product. I thought I had seen all of Voyager, but I am drawing a blank on this one.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prime_Factors_%28Star_Trek:_Voyager%29
-
At least it's moving in the right direction, though it still seems to be in the future.
(http://img.sjm.so/ibook_shipping6)
-
Meanwhile, the SSD for it is moving in the wrong direction:
(http://img.sjm.so/ibook_ssd_shipping)
-
What the hell is going on here? Did you pay for retard shipping? Have you contacted the shipping provider about this? Or is it still within the shipping timeframe provided by the seller?
-
What the hell is going on here? Did you pay for retard shipping? Have you contacted the shipping provider about this? Or is it still within the shipping timeframe provided by the seller?
It's still well within the timeframe provided. I paid for the cheapest shipping on offer because I honestly don't care that much if I have to wait a bit longer.
-
Maybe your antiquated laptop met a cute fax machine in Memphis and they are now honeymooning in Hawaii? It is certainly in no rush to have you scramble its brains and send it full retart with openBSD.
-
You should name it Right Hand of Darkness. That's what I named my netbook. My Wi-Fi name is Left Hand of Darkness. They work together.
Except when the netbook is out of range and then the Left Hand doesn't know what the Right Hand is doing.
*ducks*
-
You should name it Right Hand of Darkness. That's what I named my netbook. My Wi-Fi name is Left Hand of Darkness. They work together.
Except when the netbook is out of range and then the Left Hand doesn't know what the Right Hand is doing.
*ducks*
That was kind of funny. Its a shame you can't be funny more than twice a year.
-
(http://img.sjm.so/ibook_shipping7)
Fucking finally. It still appears to be in the future, but at least it's in the future in the same city as me.
-
And my SSD is now also in Sydney:
(http://img.sjm.so/ibook_ssd_shipping2)
With any luck, both items will be delivered tomorrow and I can commence OpenBSD installation.
(http://img.sjm.so/happening)
-
Welp, the SSD got delivered today, but the laptop didn't. Since it's been sitting an hour's walk from me all day accumulating dust, hopefully they'll see fit to ship it the last few kilometres tomorrow.
-
It finally arrived! Now I get to go through the adventure of getting it open so I can replace the hard drive with an SSD, and then I can install OpenBSD. This is going to be so great.
-
You can replace the hard drive with an SSD in an old laptop?
-
You can replace the hard drive with an SSD in an old laptop?
Yes, provided you have a PATA SSD (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00AQT2LRK).
-
Have you finished your Frankenstein laptop yet? You've changed its hard drive and now only to scramble its brains for openBSD. Then ... its alive! Muhahahahaha! Poor Elvis.
-
Well, I fucked up and ripped the power button connector socket right off the motherboard. Now I need to attempt to solder it back on so I can power the system on.
On the bright side, I have successfully replaced the hard drive with an SSD, so when I do manage to power it on, I'll be ready to install OpenBSD.
-
How is that even possible. Were you using a sledgehammer to disassemble it?
-
How is that even possible. Were you using a sledgehammer to disassemble it?
No, it's a notoriously weak component. There are threads all over the Internet about it.
-
Well, I fucked up and ripped the power button connector socket right off the motherboard. Now I need to attempt to solder it back on so I can power the system on.
You could resort to the highly technical option of connecting the pins with a screwdriver to switch it on :^)
-
You could resort to the highly technical option of connecting the pins with a screwdriver to switch it on :^)
I have considered that, but the connectors are inconveniently placed. I would literally need to remove the keyboard and disconnect the touchpad every time I wanted to power the thing up.
-
You could resort to the highly technical option of connecting the pins with a screwdriver to switch it on :^)
I have considered that, but the connectors are inconveniently placed. I would literally need to remove the keyboard and disconnect the touchpad every time I wanted to power the thing up.
Do you really need to power it up more than once?
-
Do you really need to power it up more than once?
Yes, in cases where the battery runs out or I make experimental changes to my operating system which require a hard reboot.
-
How is the battery life on this old laptop? Does it have a new battery? If not, I'm guessing you have about 20 mins unplugged.
-
How is the battery life on this old laptop? Does it have a new battery? If not, I'm guessing you have about 20 mins unplugged.
I'll let you know when I'm done piecing it back together.
-
I have put it together and am now (finally) installing OpenBSD.
-
You could resort to the highly technical option of connecting the pins with a screwdriver to switch it on :^)
I have considered that, but the connectors are inconveniently placed. I would literally need to remove the keyboard and disconnect the touchpad every time I wanted to power the thing up.
Do you really need to power it up more than once?
Really?
-
I just compiled my first kernel on the new iBook. It took 16 minutes and 6.33 seconds, which is several times longer than it takes on my ThinkPad, but not as much longer as I would have expected. This PowerPC hardware seems surprisingly solid, given its age.
-
And the battery life is?
-
And the battery life is?
I wouldn't know, I've been running it on AC thus far.
-
Building the OpenBSD userland takes about 202 minutes. That means I can get a full OS built (excluding X.org) in under four hours.
Time to compile X.org and see how long that takes. I'd guess maybe two hours or so.
-
Building the OpenBSD userland takes about 202 minutes. That means I can get a full OS built (excluding X.org) in under four hours.
Time to compile X.org and see how long that takes. I'd guess maybe two hours or so.
Sounds like there is a huge amount of bloatware in there.
-
Building the OpenBSD userland takes about 202 minutes. That means I can get a full OS built (excluding X.org) in under four hours.
Time to compile X.org and see how long that takes. I'd guess maybe two hours or so.
Sounds like there is a huge amount of bloatware in there.
Out of curiosity, what is your point of reference here? Given how loudly you like to proclaim your ineptitude with operating systems on a regular basis, I wouldn't have picked you as having any experience building them from source.
-
Takes 20 mins to install windows. If its going to take 202 mins to put your crapware on there, there must be an awful lot of unnecessary bloat with it. :)
-
Takes 20 mins to install windows.
On an iBook?
-
Takes 20 mins to install windows.
On an iBook?
On anything with a half decent intel processor and an SSD.
-
Takes 20 mins to install windows. If its going to take 202 mins to put your crapware on there, there must be an awful lot of unnecessary bloat with it. :)
You do know what it means to compile software, right?
-
Takes 20 mins to install windows. If its going to take 202 mins to put your crapware on there, there must be an awful lot of unnecessary bloat with it. :)
You do know what it means to compile software, right?
If course he does. He is a software developer!
-
Takes 20 mins to install windows. If its going to take 202 mins to put your crapware on there, there must be an awful lot of unnecessary bloat with it. :)
You do know what it means to compile software, right?
Beat me to it... I was going to ask why he was confusing compiling vs. installing (copying)... I can't imagine how long windows would take to compile.
-
Compiling Windows on some laptop would probably take weeks.
-
You hear that, Th*rk?
-
... did Thork seriously just confuse compilation with installation? w0w
Also, compiling X.org takes just under three hours, which means a full recompilation of my OS including X takes less than seven hours. Not bad for a decade-old PowerPC laptop.
-
... did Thork seriously just confuse compilation with installation? w0w
Also, compiling X.org takes just under three hours, which means a full recompilation of my OS including X takes less than seven hours. Not bad for a decade-old PowerPC laptop.
I had heard that although the old mac laptops specs were not as powerful on paper as old intel based laptops, they performed comparably. would you agree or disagree with this?
-
I had heard that although the old mac laptops specs were not as powerful on paper as old intel based laptops, they performed comparably. would you agree or disagree with this?
I haven't been using it for long enough to comment, but it definitely performs better than I would have expected it to.
Also, I just found an endianness bug in my window manager. Owning a big-endian system is already paying dividends.