[markjo]

I've already shown via diagram that it's impossible for the moon to be in the sky with the sun, since the angles would need to be in excess of 0.5 degrees. A video showing the sun and moon in the sky simultaneously is dirt in your face.

Would you care to provide such a video?  I don't recall seeing the sun in the OP video.

[Tom Bishop]

I've already shown via diagram that it's impossible for the moon to be in the sky with the sun, since the angles would need to be in excess of 0.5 degrees. A video showing the sun and moon in the sky simultaneously is dirt in your face.

Would you care to provide such a video?  I don't recall seeing the sun in the OP video.

I'm referring to the video you posted.

[Gulliver]

I've already shown via diagram that it's impossible for the moon to be in the sky with the sun, since the angles would need to be in excess of 0.5 degrees. A video showing the sun and moon in the sky simultaneously is dirt in your face.

Wrong. Your diagram does NOT show an accurate positions for the Earth, Sun, and Moon. Your diagram shows the configuration during a TOTAL eclipse. Your video shows a PARTIAL eclipse. You fail miserably.

[markjo]

I'm referring to the video you posted.

Are you sure that you watched the right video?  In the one that I provided, the sun didn't rise above the horizon until fully eclipsed moon was starting to set into the horizon.

Also, your diagram was not drawn properly to scale.

[james_zombob]

that video that tom showed was fake. it has to be fake. all the other photos and videos that the RErs posted were fake, so that one has to be too.

[markjo]

No, it's real.  It just doesn't show what he thinks it shows.

[Rama Set]

that video that tom showed was fake. it has to be fake. all the other photos and videos that the RErs posted were fake, so that one has to be too.

Tom is a FEer.

[DonaldC]

I had been away from TFES for quite a while. I started reading and then made a posts on the old site recently. Then I came to find out about the great Flat Earth Schism. And here I am.    

Yes everything is always faked. Typical TB reply.

[doane2u]

 The problem with it is that it is presented with illustrations that are only presented in one plane... more flat thinking going on. The earth and the moon exist as spheres in 3d space and are on tilted axis and rotations that can not be easily defined in a simple 2d illustration. Also, refraction bends the light rays of the sun and the moon enabling us to see both for several minutes during the Selenelion. But in general, here is a good explanation from a knowledgeable site (click here)The Moon phases are the same all over the world, both in the Northern and Southern Hemispheres. The same percentage of the Moon will be illuminated no matter where on Earth you are. However, whether the Waxing Crescent Moon looks like a banana, a boat, or even an umbrella, depends on the time, the date, your location, and the Moon's position in the sky.

Exactly which part of the Moon is lit up–the top, bottom, or the side–also depends on how high the Moon is in the sky. The Waxing Crescent Moon is generally higher in the sky in the summer than in the winter.

The line–or curve–dividing the illuminated and dark parts of the Moon is called the terminator. The terminator of a Waxing Crescent Moon can be on the right side, the left, the top, or the bottom.

[Novarus]

The image is invalid for the following reasons:

1. The little man is over 1/4th the size of the earth's diameter, standing 2000 miles tall, and is able to see over the curvature of the earth to see the sun and moon simultaneously.

Tom, how is:


any more valid that this? 

One image depicts ma man who is 2000+ miles tall, looking around the curvature of the earth, and the other does not.

The Sun, moon and earth are also not literally at those distances or those sizes. It's a diagram for illustration purposes. Don't be so obtuse - like most flat earth theorists, you completely ignore the concept of scale.

[juner]

Did you really feel the need to necro a 2.5 year old thread?

[IonSpen]

Thanks for bumping this thread, it was very informative!

[totallackey]

The Sun, moon and earth are also not literally at those distances or those sizes. It's a diagram for illustration purposes. Don't be so obtuse - like most flat earth theorists, you completely ignore the concept of scale.

Explain how the "concept of scale," so drastically screws up what should be PARALLEL light rays emitting from the sun?

I do not care how you demonstrate the scale, if there is direct light coming from the Sun, the entire moon would be illuminated in the photo.

[Tom Bishop]

The Sun, moon and earth are also not literally at those distances or those sizes. It's a diagram for illustration purposes. Don't be so obtuse - like most flat earth theorists, you completely ignore the concept of scale.

If you read the rest of this thread you will find that we discussed an illustrated how an accurate scale would affect the scene.

[Blorgon A173]

It's important to note the colour of the sky and the colour changes that occur in the original video. Before sunrise there is an atmospheric phenomenon known as "the belt of venus", look it up on wikipedia. Light from the sun causes a sudden change in colour from a pale indigo to an orangeish hue. 100 percent of visible sunrises have a visible belt of venus. In the video there is no indication of a belt of venus descending or even beginning to appear. This means that even at the end of the video the sun is still several degrees (usually 5-10 or more degrees) below the horizon showing that this eclipse is not a true selenelion. To prove that it is possible to witness this stage of a lunar eclipse at this time of day in the established model, let's determined how long before sunrise it is. The belt of Venus usually becomes visible about 20-30 minutes before sunrise so the end of the video is at least 20-30 minutes prior to sunrise. Additionally judging by the contacts (ie stages) of the eclipse the video started at least an hour or more before sunrise. This puts the moon easily within a window to view it entering the penumbra even without considering refraction.

http://epod.usra.edu/SGBeltof%20Venus_MG_0958_1600.jpg

[FS]

Actually, I think I have a possible explanation from a globe perspective for the sliver of light on the underside of the moon, but I haven't thought it through fully yet.  Nevertheless, I'll post it here, but first, kudos to Blorgon A173 for that information he/she gave on 5/11/17.  Anyway, the moon takes ½ month to make a half-orbit around the earth; whereas the earth takes only 12 hours to make a half-rotation, so, in the video, even though the moon appears to be moving downward, because of the earth's spin, the moon is actually moving upward, but at a slower speed, in the view of someone on the earth, than the earth is spinning, so the moon actually seems to be going down, merely because of the spin of the earth changing the view of the sky faster than the slower motion of the moon going up.  In fact, at the same time of evening on the next day, it should be higher in the sky.  Because the moon is actually going up, the sliver of light on the bottom of it is obscured by the earth from the top going down.  I have tried to make a rudimentary illustration below, but I haven't really bothered with figuring out the scale.

[Macarios]

Atmospheric refraction of the light from a star is zero in the zenith, less than 1′ (one arc-minute) at 45° apparent altitude, and still only 5.3′ at 10° altitude; it quickly increases as altitude decreases, reaching 9.9′ at 5° altitude, 18.4′ at 2° altitude, and 35.4′ at the horizon; all values are for 10 °C and 1013.25 hPa in the visible part of the spectrum.

(from: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmospheric_refraction)

This goes for both, Sun and Moon.

At that photo Moon is behind Earth at the bottom edge of the Earth's shadow area.

https://www.space.com/13856-total-lunar-eclipse-rare-senelion.html

[Tumeni]

Since more than one person wants to resurrect this, regardless of age of thread, can I ask Tom and other FEers;

If you imagine yourself looking down upon the Earth, Sun and Moon from above, and place an imaginary clockface over the Earth,
would you agree firstly that the situation being discussed, IF we take the textbook description of the Earth/Moon system at face value, has the Moon at 12 and the Sun at 6? i.e. each on directly opposite sides when viewed from above.