[Iceman]

Ok I'm just confused as to when all these court case dismissals turn into good news for Trump...

Let's say, for argument's sake, that aside from the ones mentioned above, all the other cases that were dismissed weren't for lack of merit, but lack of standing. You've cited several. These are from a spectrum of courts all the way up the american judicial system. What court DOES have the standing to hear these cases?

Originally you said that the dismissals were good because they created a path to SCOTUS...but as weve seen, that hasnt worked out - not yet at least.

So we appear to be left with these alleged mountains of evidence of voter fraud, but no court has  been willing -or able- to hear any of it. You'd think there would be a mechanism - somewhere within the system - for these piles and piles of critical evidence of crumbling of American democracy to he heard in court.

I know nothing about law but it just seems like that's been the elephant in the room when it comes to the cases that have been brought forward and dismissed. It cant still be a good thing that two and a half months after the election, 3 days before inauguration of ol' Joey Nopulse, that none of this evidence has made it to a court room??

[Tom Bishop]

What post? You guys are supposed to be arguing against fraud because the cases were dismissed.

You present some cases about election procedure, not about the direct fraud claims. Looks like you have come up with a lack of evidence to support your statements and can't use that line anymore.

Here's another one more than zero:

"The 6-to-0 decision from Nevada’s high court came after a lower court gave a full-scale ruling against the Trump campaign’s efforts in the state last week. Judge James T. Russell of the Nevada District Court ruled Friday that there was no evidence supporting the claims of fraud and wrongdoing made by the campaign in a state President-elect Joe Biden won by more than 33,000 votes.

In a 40-page order from the Nevada Supreme Court late Tuesday, the justices “affirmed” the decision from Russell and said the court would take no action. The court found the Trump campaign failed to identify “any unsupported factual findings” in Russell’s decision, with the state’s high court concluding it had also “identified none.”

“To prevail on this appeal, appellants must demonstrate error of law, findings of fact not supported by substantial evidence or an abuse of discretion in the admission or rejection of evidence by the district court,” the order read. “We are not convinced they have done so.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/12/09/nevada-supreme-court-trump-election-results/

That one is about fraud. GOP complains that they didn't even get a chance to hear witnesses, argue the case with the Supreme Court or write their brief.

https://nevadagop.org/nevada-gops-statement-on-the-nevada-supreme-courts-ruling/

[Tom Bishop]

What post?

Your post.  The one I quoted above. That you deleted.

You may be mistaken. Here is the post where you quoted me:

You said:

We've been talking about this "cases were dismissed" claim for weeks now, and you guys still haven't haven't provided the evidence that they were dismissed on merit, so your evidence is zero.

Which has now been done.  Thanks for playing.

I noticed you deleted your comment, by the way.  Not surprised since you are dishonestly trying to build an unassailable position. Pretty pathetic.

The post you quoted containing the text "We've been talking about this 'cases were dismissed' claim for weeks now" is still there: https://forum.tfes.org/index.php?topic=5536.msg230056#msg230056

Ok I'm just confused as to when all these court case dismissals turn into good news for Trump...

Let's say, for argument's sake, that aside from the ones mentioned above, all the other cases that were dismissed weren't for lack of merit, but lack of standing. You've cited several. These are from a spectrum of courts all the way up the american judicial system. What court DOES have the standing to hear these cases?

Originally you said that the dismissals were good because they created a path to SCOTUS...but as weve seen, that hasnt worked out - not yet at least.

So we appear to be left with these alleged mountains of evidence of voter fraud, but no court has  been willing -or able- to hear any of it. You'd think there would be a mechanism - somewhere within the system - for these piles and piles of critical evidence of crumbling of American democracy to he heard in court.

I know nothing about law but it just seems like that's been the elephant in the room when it comes to the cases that have been brought forward and dismissed. It cant still be a good thing that two and a half months after the election, 3 days before inauguration of ol' Joey Nopulse, that none of this evidence has made it to a court room??

There wouldn't be a mechanism if courts are finding ways to dismiss the cases because they don't want to be involved or overturn an election.

https://www.wkyc.com/article/news/local/ohio/ohio-republican-congressional-delegation-electoral-college-certification-vote/95-9a53e80e-32d1-4121-a8b2-60df2a47a4fa

“Rep. Bob Gibbs: On Monday, Gibbs announced he will join those objecting to certification.

The right to vote and be heard, to have a voice in our government is one of the most important pillars of our democracy. I believe fraudulent actions and illegal voting in one state dilutes the power and voice of voters in all states. I do not believe the allegations of fraud and improprieties have gotten their day in court, as many cases were dismissed on procedural grounds, often times citing lack of standing."

Political Journalist Mike Walsh:

https://www.theepochtimes.com/after-trumps-last-stand-left-seeks-revenge_3649577.html

"Wuz we robbed? It’s very likely, given the suspicious circumstance of Biden’s materializing popular votes in precisely the swing states that were needed for victory. And while the multiple lawsuits contesting those votes have been consistently thrown out in various courts (including, disgracefully, the Texas suit presented to the U.S. Supreme Court), they were dismissed on procedural grounds, and the evidence remains to this day unheard."

Rose Sentinel:

https://romesentinel.com/stories/trump-following-all-legal-means-to-challenge-suspect-state-election-results,108212

"Trump and his allies have filed roughly 50 lawsuits challenging election results, and nearly all have been dismissed or dropped but on procedural grounds that did not test the evidence. AP claims Trump has lost twice at the U.S. Supreme Court but that was also procedural and did not consider evidence."

Some cases did make their way through and turn into ordered audits of the machines.

From the Antrim County Forensics Report:

https://www.scribd.com/document/488105156/Antrim-County-Forensics-Report-on-Dominion-Voting-System#from_embed

"We conclude that the Dominion Voting System is intentionally and purposefully designed with inherent errors to create systemic fraud and influence election results. The system intentionally generates an enormously high number of ballot errors. The electronic ballots are then transferred for adjudication. The intentional errors lead to bulk adjudication of ballots with no oversight, no transparency, and no audit trail. This leads to voter or election fraud. Based on our study, we conclude that The Dominion Voting System should not be used in Michigan. We further conclude that the results of Antrim County should not have been certified."

[Iceman]

But does that response not just seem like a whole bunch of right-leaning folks that are upset that they arent winning - the election and this myriad of legal prayers afterwards. They are using their rights and taking action through the proper channels, and the impartial judges are shutting them down - for numerous reasons. Then the Ohio rep and the NV GOP making statements about how they find it unfair. But that's a bunch of people just whining that the experts - state and US supreme court judges - dont agree with them.

Is there a way for the cases to get through and allow the public to see all this incredible evidence of fraud?

[Tom Bishop]

But does that response not just seem like a whole bunch of right-leaning folks that are upset that they arent winning - the election and this myriad of legal prayers afterwards. They are using their rights and taking action through the proper channels, and the impartial judges are shutting them down - for numerous reasons. Then the Ohio rep and the NV GOP making statements about how they find it unfair. But that's a bunch of people just whining that the experts - state and US supreme court judges - dont agree with them.

Is there a way for the cases to get through and allow the public to see all this incredible evidence of fraud?

Some of them did get through, and turned into audits and continuing trials.

The forensic audit also showed that the votes were flipped:

https://www.theepochtimes.com/mkt_app/redacted-information-in-dominion-audit-report-shows-races-were-flipped-analyst_3625228.html





The audit also found that the logs were missing:

"Likewise, all server security logs prior to 11:03 pm on November 4, 2020 are
missing. This means that all security logs for the day after the election, on
election day, and prior to election day are gone. Security logs are very important
to an audit trail, forensics, and for detecting advanced persistent threats and
outside attacks, especially on systems with outdated system files. These logs
would contain domain controls, authentication failures, error codes, times users
logged on and off, network connections to file servers between file accesses,
internet connections, times, and data transfers. Other server logs before
November 4, 2020 are present; therefore, there is no reasonable explanation for
the security logs to be missing."

[Iceman]

Is that the same Ramsland who got county names wrong in his filings and incorrectly claimed voter turnout exceeded 100% in several Michigan counties?

I dont know much about what you've linked, but at face value, if true that's obviously problematic. If other cases had any similarly strong sounding evidence...you would think there would be courts that might find a way to hear it?

[Tom Bishop]

I haven't seen that.

Courts are still hearing evidence for voter fraud. Not only is there forensic evidence of machine issues, there is also video evidence depicting confessions of voter fraud from Italy.

Testimony on Video: https://www.filmon.com/vod/view/breaking-news-testimony-of-senior-italian-judge-alfio-d-urso-italian-tax-court-and-supreme-court-public-defender-us



Same guy as in his picture on his uni page: https://www.diges.unicz.it/web/docenti/durso-alfio/

Written Testimony:



Article:

The Italian Job: Explosive New Testimony on Dominion Election Fraud

"A former IT contractor for the Italian military testified in federal court in Rome that while he was working for Leonardo, SpA in Pescara, Italy he helped rig the U.S. election against Trump by using the companies satellites; $1 billion in U.S. contracts now suspect"

[stack]

Is that the same Ramsland who got county names wrong in his filings and incorrectly claimed voter turnout exceeded 100% in several Michigan counties?

I dont know much about what you've linked, but at face value, if true that's obviously problematic. If other cases had any similarly strong sounding evidence...you would think there would be courts that might find a way to hear it?

Yes. One and the same.

[Tom Bishop]

Is that the same Ramsland who got county names wrong in his filings and incorrectly claimed voter turnout exceeded 100% in several Michigan counties?

I dont know much about what you've linked, but at face value, if true that's obviously problematic. If other cases had any similarly strong sounding evidence...you would think there would be courts that might find a way to hear it?

Yes. One and the same.

If you think that Ramsland is lying to the court, then why isn't anyone bothering to prosecute him for lying and submitting a false statements? That is very serious. They haven't prosecuted anyone for their false fraud statements that you allege are occurring. Liberals are baselessly calling audits and people liars. Probably because you guys don't even care about voter fraud.

[Iceman]

I haven't seen that.

Courts are still hearing evidence for voter fraud. Not only is there forensic evidence of machine issues, there is also video evidence depicting confessions of voter fraud from Italy.

Testimony on Video: https://www.filmon.com/vod/view/breaking-news-testimony-of-senior-italian-judge-alfio-d-urso-italian-tax-court-and-supreme-court-public-defender-us



Same guy as in his picture on his uni page: https://www.diges.unicz.it/web/docenti/durso-alfio/

Written Testimony:



Article:

The Italian Job: Explosive New Testimony on Dominion Election Fraud

"A former IT contractor for the Italian military testified in federal court in Rome that while he was working for Leonardo, SpA in Pescara, Italy he helped rig the U.S. election against Trump by using the companies satellites; $1 billion in U.S. contracts now suspect"

So what court should we expect will be hearing this evidence? What are the developments? I remember hearing about that bombshell when it was dropped on the 6th, but haven't heard anything since...is it progressing? (These are snarky comments, I just dont know the answers)

[stack]

I haven't seen that.

Courts are still hearing evidence for voter fraud. Not only is there forensic evidence of machine issues, there is also video evidence depicting confessions of voter fraud from Italy.

You really will latch on to just about anything without looking into it. There's too many falsehoods to list, just scan the article. The italygate claim is garbage:

Fact check: Evidence disproves claims of Italian conspiracy to meddle in U.S. election (known as #ItalyGate)

VERDICT
False. There is no legitimate evidence that an employee of the Italian defense company Leonardo SpA interfered in the 2020 U.S. presidential election.
https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-fact-check-debunking-italy-gate/fact-check-evidence-disproves-claims-of-italian-conspiracy-to-meddle-in-us-election-idUSKBN29K2N8

[Tom Bishop]

I haven't seen that.

Courts are still hearing evidence for voter fraud. Not only is there forensic evidence of machine issues, there is also video evidence depicting confessions of voter fraud from Italy.

You really will latch on to just about anything without looking into it. There's too many falsehoods to list, just scan the article. The italygate claim is garbage:

Fact check: Evidence disproves claims of Italian conspiracy to meddle in U.S. election (known as #ItalyGate)

VERDICT
False. There is no legitimate evidence that an employee of the Italian defense company Leonardo SpA interfered in the 2020 U.S. presidential election.
https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-fact-check-debunking-italy-gate/fact-check-evidence-disproves-claims-of-italian-conspiracy-to-meddle-in-us-election-idUSKBN29K2N8

Did you bother reading your article?

"Reuters was not able to independently confirm the document’s authenticity."

"An individual named “Alfio D’Urso” is listed on Italy's national bar database (here). Reuters was unable to reach D'Urso to establish further details."

"On Nov. 12, Chris Krebs, who worked on protecting the 2020 election from hackers as the head of the Department of Homeland Security’s Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency (CISA), called the 2020 vote 'the most secure in American history'"

"VERDICT: False. There is no legitimate evidence that an employee of the Italian defense company Leonardo SpA interfered in the 2020 U.S. presidential election."

Wow, I guess it's debunked. 

[stack]

I haven't seen that.

Courts are still hearing evidence for voter fraud. Not only is there forensic evidence of machine issues, there is also video evidence depicting confessions of voter fraud from Italy.

You really will latch on to just about anything without looking into it. There's too many falsehoods to list, just scan the article. The italygate claim is garbage:

Fact check: Evidence disproves claims of Italian conspiracy to meddle in U.S. election (known as #ItalyGate)

VERDICT
False. There is no legitimate evidence that an employee of the Italian defense company Leonardo SpA interfered in the 2020 U.S. presidential election.
https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-fact-check-debunking-italy-gate/fact-check-evidence-disproves-claims-of-italian-conspiracy-to-meddle-in-us-election-idUSKBN29K2N8

Did you bother reading your article?

"Reuters was not able to independently confirm the document’s authenticity."

"An individual named “Alfio D’Urso” is listed on Italy's national bar database (here). Reuters was unable to reach D'Urso to establish further details."

"On Nov. 12, Chris Krebs, who worked on protecting the 2020 election from hackers as the head of the Department of Homeland Security’s Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency (CISA), called the 2020 vote 'the most secure in American history'"

"VERDICT

False. There is no legitimate evidence that an employee of the Italian defense company Leonardo SpA interfered in the 2020 U.S. presidential election."

Wow, I guess it's debunked. 

Like that's the extent of the article. In any case, yep, it's debunked. Glad you agree.

[stack]

I haven't seen that.

As in Ramsland's idiocy? Yes, you have seen that. Quite some time ago. You must simply not remember or are lying:

Wrong.

https://twitter.com/IvanPentchoukov/status/1338505355463188482

Looks like you’ve backed another winner

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2020/dec/04/russell-james-ramsland-jr/affidavit-michigan-lawsuit-seeking-overturn-electi/

Is that the same Ramsland who got county names wrong in his filings and incorrectly claimed voter turnout exceeded 100% in several Michigan counties?

I dont know much about what you've linked, but at face value, if true that's obviously problematic. If other cases had any similarly strong sounding evidence...you would think there would be courts that might find a way to hear it?

Yes. One and the same.

If you think that Ramsland is lying to the court, then why isn't anyone bothering to prosecute him for lying and submitting a false statements? That is very serious. They haven't prosecuted anyone for their false fraud statements that you allege are occurring. Liberals are baselessly calling audits and people liars. Probably because you guys don't even care about voter fraud.

And you answered your own question way back when, which you have also seemed to have forgotten. By saying that he relied on others, he’s not saying that it’s his direct claim. Therefore, he can’t get slapped with perjury:

Are the people who say that the forensic report is wrong forensic auditors?

The person who says the forensic report is right has a history of cherry picking who they believe and how much regard they have for people’s qualifications depending on whether what’s being said agrees with their world view or not.

So that's a "no, they are not forensic auditors" then.

Neither is Ramsland.

Does he say that he performed the audit himself, or does he say in the intro "For this report, I have relied on these experts and resources"?

Funny how you have no recollection of Ramsland...

[garygreen]

If you think that Ramsland is lying to the court, then why isn't anyone bothering to prosecute him for lying and submitting a false statements? That is very serious. They haven't prosecuted anyone for their false fraud statements that you allege are occurring. Liberals are baselessly calling audits and people liars. Probably because you guys don't even care about voter fraud.

if you think the dnc rigged the election, then why isn't anyone bothering to prosecute the guilty parties for election fraud? that is very serious. trump's justice department hasn't prosecuted anyone for the election fraud that you allege occurred. conservatives are baselessly calling courts and election officials liars. probably because you guys don't even care about democracy.

in all seriousness, though, if this is such a slam dunk, then i don't get why trump is only pushing these cases in civil term. as you say, there is clearly a veritable mountain of evidence that the dnc rigged the election, and that's a crime. trump has the full federal alphabet soup at his disposal. they can't find a single witness? lol i mean it should require one, right?

[Tom Bishop]

I haven't seen that.

Courts are still hearing evidence for voter fraud. Not only is there forensic evidence of machine issues, there is also video evidence depicting confessions of voter fraud from Italy.

You really will latch on to just about anything without looking into it. There's too many falsehoods to list, just scan the article. The italygate claim is garbage:

Fact check: Evidence disproves claims of Italian conspiracy to meddle in U.S. election (known as #ItalyGate)

VERDICT
False. There is no legitimate evidence that an employee of the Italian defense company Leonardo SpA interfered in the 2020 U.S. presidential election.
https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-fact-check-debunking-italy-gate/fact-check-evidence-disproves-claims-of-italian-conspiracy-to-meddle-in-us-election-idUSKBN29K2N8

Did you bother reading your article?

"Reuters was not able to independently confirm the document’s authenticity."

"An individual named “Alfio D’Urso” is listed on Italy's national bar database (here). Reuters was unable to reach D'Urso to establish further details."

"On Nov. 12, Chris Krebs, who worked on protecting the 2020 election from hackers as the head of the Department of Homeland Security’s Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency (CISA), called the 2020 vote 'the most secure in American history'"

"VERDICT

False. There is no legitimate evidence that an employee of the Italian defense company Leonardo SpA interfered in the 2020 U.S. presidential election."

Wow, I guess it's debunked. 

Like that's the extent of the article. In any case, yep, it's debunked. Glad you agree.

Saying that you looked a little and couldn't find anything is about the worst way to debunk something.

You linked us to a leftist propaganda website.

Reuters also says Dominion is not connected to Venezuela or Smartmatic:

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-dominion/fact-check-dominion-is-not-linked-to-antifa-or-venezuela-did-not-switch-u-s-2020-election-votes-in-virginia-and-was-not-subject-to-a-u-s-army-raid-in-germany-idUSKBN2861TB



From an NIST.gov report:

https://www.nist.gov/system/files/documents/itl/vote/2010-07-06VoterActionLetter2TGDC.pdf





From the Reuters link:

"DOMINION AND SMARTMATIC

The video claims that Dominion uses Smartmatic Software and that Dominion is a front company for Smartmatic.

Samira Saba, communications director for Smartmatic, told Reuters via email for a previous fact check (here) : “Smartmatic has never owned any shares or had any financial stake in Dominion Voting Systems. Smartmatic has never provided Dominion Voting Systems with any software, hardware or other technology."

On the Dominion voting website, it states that Dominion has never been and is not currently owned by Smartmatic: “Dominion is an entirely separate company and a fierce competitor to Smartmatic. Dominion and Smartmatic do not collaborate in any way and have no affiliate relationships or financial ties. Dominion does not use Smartmatic software.” (www.dominionvoting.com/)"

Contradicted by this PDF on Colorado's website:

https://web.archive.org/web/20181220221329if_/https://www.sos.state.co.us/pubs/elections/VotingSystems/files/2015/projectPlans/Dominion.pdf



Smartmatic bought Sequoia, which bought Dominion. I guess there is no Dominion-Smartmatic connection according to your propaganda website.

The person began working for Smartmatic in Venezuela. It says Smartmatic and not Dominion, so I guess there is no Dominion-Venezuela connection.

[Iceman]

The text you highlighted seems to say that both Smartmatic and dominion each  acquired Sequoia.

Just as I'm not a lawyer, I'm equally not a businessman...but that dont seem right

[Tom Bishop]

The text you highlighted seems to say that both Smartmatic and dominion each  acquired Sequoia.

Just as I'm not a lawyer, I'm equally not a businessman...but that dont seem right

That's still a connection. And it says in the NIST document that Smartmatic retained ownership of the software used in Sequoia.

https://www.nist.gov/system/files/documents/itl/vote/2010-07-06VoterActionLetter2TGDC.pdf

if you think the dnc rigged the election, then why isn't anyone bothering to prosecute the guilty parties for election fraud?

Who says they aren't being arrested?

Jan 13 - BREAKING: Raquel Rodriguez ARRESTED by Texas AG on FOUR felony charges relating to voter fraud!



Claims that she's bringing in thousands of votes to the polls:



Someone offers to sell him votes:



Admits what she's doing is illegal:



Verification of her arrest:

https://spectrumlocalnews.com/tx/san-antonio/news/2021/01/14/san-antonio-woman-arrested--accused-of-election-fraud--ag-paxton-says-

[Tom Bishop]

Another arrest recently, a Democrat Politian: https://www.theblaze.com/news/ready-democratic-city-councilman-arrested-charged-with-eight-counts-of-election-fraud?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

[Lord Dave]

Fun fact:
No voting machine in existence can accept an encrypted military sattelite system's signal.  Because this isn't a movie and thats not how wifi or cell networks work.

So not sure how he hacked anything with a military satelite.