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Offline Lord Dave

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Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1400 on: December 01, 2023, 09:29:50 PM »
Well a deposition regarding potentially illegal activity should probably be done in private. If anything illegal was done then the names Hunter Biden has to mention should probably go to law enforcement or the Congressional Sergeant at Arms rather than speak the names in public and tip off a potential criminal who thought that they were safe or that they wouldn't be pointed out, and cause people to destroy records and documents in a mad panic.

Among its powers, the House performs law enforcement functions and has powers to arrest people who defy their orders. If you are called by the House to testify in a private deposition, you should probably do what they say.

Again, sounds like an excuse.  Especially for a fishing deposition since no illegal activity has yet been found or charges brought.  Republicans have nothing to charge him on and this is purely a ploy to drum up either something they can use in sound bites for the election or a despirate hope that they can get him to admit to something illegal.
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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1401 on: December 03, 2023, 10:37:35 PM »
They do claim to have evidence for the Biden's pay-for-play schemes - https://oversight.house.gov/landing/biden-family-investigation/

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Offline Lord Dave

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Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1402 on: December 04, 2023, 07:27:56 AM »
They do claim to have evidence for the Biden's pay-for-play schemes - https://oversight.house.gov/landing/biden-family-investigation/
They've had the same claim for what.... 4 years? 
Trump has claimed election fraud for 8.
And democrats claimed Trump had russian influence for 2.

None of them produced any usable evidence so you'll excuse me if I don't trust a press release.
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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1403 on: December 04, 2023, 10:39:30 PM »
They do claim to have evidence for the Biden's pay-for-play schemes - https://oversight.house.gov/landing/biden-family-investigation/
They've had the same claim for what.... 4 years? 
Trump has claimed election fraud for 8.
And democrats claimed Trump had russian influence for 2.

None of them produced any usable evidence so you'll excuse me if I don't trust a press release.

It's not the same four year old claims. They have been posting new evidence and new claims to the link I gave all year. They most recently added something today December 4th -

https://oversight.house.gov/release/comer-releases-direct-monthly-payments-to-joe-biden-from-hunter-bidens-business-entity%ef%bf%bc/

"WASHINGTON—Today, House Committee on Oversight and Accountability Chairman James Comer (R-Ky.) released subpoenaed bank records revealing Hunter Biden’s business entity, Owasco PC, made direct monthly payments to Joe Biden. Hunter Biden is currently under an investigation by the Department of Justice for using the Owasco PC corporate account for tax evasion and other serious crimes.

Following subpoenas to obtain Biden family associates’ bank records, Chairman Comer issued subpoenas for Hunter and James Biden’s personal and business bank records. The House Oversight Committee has identified over 20 shell companies and uncovered how the Bidens and their associates raked in over $24 million dollars between 2015 and 2019 by selling Joe Biden as “the brand.” Financial records obtained show Hunter Biden’s business account, Owasco PC, received payments from Chinese-state linked companies and other foreign nationals and companies."
« Last Edit: December 04, 2023, 10:41:45 PM by Tom Bishop »

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Offline Lord Dave

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Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1404 on: December 04, 2023, 11:22:43 PM »
They do claim to have evidence for the Biden's pay-for-play schemes - https://oversight.house.gov/landing/biden-family-investigation/
They've had the same claim for what.... 4 years? 
Trump has claimed election fraud for 8.
And democrats claimed Trump had russian influence for 2.

None of them produced any usable evidence so you'll excuse me if I don't trust a press release.

It's not the same four year old claims. They have been posting new evidence and new claims to the link I gave all year. They most recently added something today December 4th -

https://oversight.house.gov/release/comer-releases-direct-monthly-payments-to-joe-biden-from-hunter-bidens-business-entity%ef%bf%bc/

"WASHINGTON—Today, House Committee on Oversight and Accountability Chairman James Comer (R-Ky.) released subpoenaed bank records revealing Hunter Biden’s business entity, Owasco PC, made direct monthly payments to Joe Biden. "
What years?  That would seem to be important.  And how much?  Because if its like $1,000 a month for the political campaign, it would make sense.  Hell, every politician gets money from businesses, sad as it is.

Quote
Hunter Biden is currently under an investigation by the Department of Justice for using the Owasco PC corporate account for tax evasion and other serious crimes.
I look forward to seeing how that goes or if charges are ever brought.

Quote
Following subpoenas to obtain Biden family associates’ bank records, Chairman Comer issued subpoenas for Hunter and James Biden’s personal and business bank records. The House Oversight Committee has identified over 20 shell companies and uncovered how the Bidens and their associates raked in over $24 million dollars between 2015 and 2019 by selling Joe Biden as “the brand.” Financial records obtained show Hunter Biden’s business account, Owasco PC, received payments from Chinese-state linked companies and other foreign nationals and companies."
And?  Selling famous people as a brand is a time honored tradition.  Tho wasn't Trump president during half of that time, not Biden?  Sounds like we need a better breakdown of the time period.  If biden was sold as "the brand" when he wasn't VP, wouldn't help your case.  Hell, him being VP and being sold as a brand isn't really all that unusual. 
I mean, Trump himself made $24 in 2018 alone.  You know, when he was president.

And Chinese-state linked companies needs clarification because that means nothing.  Tik-Tok is a chinese state linked company and if you get ad money from tik-tok... you get money from a chinese-state linked company! He could also own stocks in these companies, which would earn him income from the stocks and the company itself.  They should have released more information like which companies, how much, and what the payments were for.

So far, they might have Hunter Biden on selling his father's position for his own gain.  But they haven't linked anything illegal to Joe Biden.
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Offline Dr Van Nostrand

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Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1405 on: December 05, 2023, 01:43:22 AM »
It took them years to find a micropenis of evidence involving less dollars than Russia donated to the NRA under the Trump administration. Too bad they don't bring that same level of scrutiny to their own idiots like Trump and Santos. If they ask the Bidens about any of this, all they would have to do is quote the Trump Family Defense, "I don't remember."

The Democrats were quick to chase Menendez out of the Senate. But the Republicans were covering for a guy who lied about his mom being in 9/11 and his grandparents being in the Holocaust. The hypocrisy is particularly stark when you think about they would say if Biden gave the unhinged, gaffe-filled, speeches that Trump has given lately.





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Offline honk

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Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1406 on: December 05, 2023, 05:58:54 AM »
Is trying to profit off the presidency and informally sell access to power illegal or not? You can't say that it's not a big deal when Trump and his family do it and then flip out when a couple of Biden's relatives (not even Biden himself, just his relatives) try to do something similar.

And democrats claimed Trump had russian influence for 2.

Don't let conservatives rewrite history on this. There is ample evidence that Russia wanted Trump elected and interfered with the 2016 election to achieve that goal. Now, is there any proof that Trump only won because of that interference? No. Does this mean that the 2016 election was somehow invalid or illegitimate? No. And is acknowledging this interference in any way "equivalent" to Trump's efforts to overturn the 2020 election? No, absolutely not. But it happened, no matter how much conservatives wish that it didn't.
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Offline Lord Dave

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Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1407 on: December 05, 2023, 08:32:40 AM »
Is trying to profit off the presidency and informally sell access to power illegal or not? You can't say that it's not a big deal when Trump and his family do it and then flip out when a couple of Biden's relatives (not even Biden himself, just his relatives) try to do something similar.

And democrats claimed Trump had russian influence for 2.

Don't let conservatives rewrite history on this. There is ample evidence that Russia wanted Trump elected and interfered with the 2016 election to achieve that goal. Now, is there any proof that Trump only won because of that interference? No. Does this mean that the 2016 election was somehow invalid or illegitimate? No. And is acknowledging this interference in any way "equivalent" to Trump's efforts to overturn the 2020 election? No, absolutely not. But it happened, no matter how much conservatives wish that it didn't.

You misunderstand.  I meant that Trump was being directly influenced/bribed/blackmailed by Russia, not that Russia wanted him in power.  Thats a given.
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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1408 on: December 05, 2023, 04:41:51 PM »
We appear to be at the point where you guys are claiming that multiple Biden family members were being bribed by foreign country entities to trick Joe Biden into influencing policy decisions, but Joe Biden didn't know about it. ::)

Quote from: Lord Dave
So far, they might have Hunter Biden on selling his father's position for his own gain.  But they haven't linked anything illegal to Joe Biden.

Ok. So you admit that Hunter Biden was selling access to his father's power (through tricking his father into influencing or doing things). How can you maintain that congress doesn't need to investigate that?

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Offline Lord Dave

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Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1409 on: December 05, 2023, 08:20:13 PM »
We appear to be at the point where you guys are claiming that multiple Biden family members were being bribed by foreign country entities to trick Joe Biden into influencing policy decisions, but Joe Biden didn't know about it. ::)

No one is suggesting this.
Also, please point to policies that the VP of America enacted on behalf of foriegn governments through Hunter. >_>

Quote
Quote from: Lord Dave
So far, they might have Hunter Biden on selling his father's position for his own gain.  But they haven't linked anything illegal to Joe Biden.

Ok. So you admit that Hunter Biden was selling access to his father's power (through tricking his father into influencing or doing things). How can you maintain that congress doesn't need to investigate that?

???
If I tell you that Bill Gates is my best friend and I can totally put in a good word for you, does that mean Bill Gates is doing what I say?

Please stop putting words in my mouth.  One can sell a relationship for gain without actually doing anything.  Hunter doesn't need to even communicate to his father to use his father's position to his advantage.  Networking is literally the most effective way to get a job and what better way than to namedrop your famous dad? 


If you are going to DebOOonK an expert then you have to at least provide a source with credentials of equal or greater relevance. Even then, it merely shows that some experts disagree with each other.

Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1410 on: December 06, 2023, 03:08:37 AM »
...One can sell a relationship for gain without actually doing anything.  Hunter doesn't need to even communicate to his father to use his father's position to his advantage.  Networking is literally the most effective way to get a job and what better way than to namedrop your famous dad?
Absolutely, and even beyond getting the job, having a namedropable person on your board can be an advantage even if they never do anything.  In some deal one CEO says to another "well you know we have the Presidents son on our board...".  All the more so in areas where influence is at times pedaled this way, but it need not always be so.  Just the appearance of the possibility can easily be enough.  If it went further in this case I have no idea, but it need not have done so and I am not aware of any evidence that it did.
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Offline Dr Van Nostrand

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Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1411 on: December 06, 2023, 04:16:16 AM »
Or maybe Hunter Biden was just so fucked up on drugs and alcohol that his daddy had to co-sign for his truck. It happens in the trailer parks of South Texas everyday.

But you know those Chinese bastards were in on it somehow.
https://www.cnn.com/2023/12/04/politics/oversight-committee-hunter-biden-car-payments/index.html

Decades of Trump's documented business ties to Russia, working to  compromise the election, full-on insurrection and now they expect me to take them seriously with this $1300 bullshit. That's the dinner bill at the club for Giuliani and his buddies, Lev and Igor (their actual fucking names).

Meanwhile to bring this thread back to its actual subject, Biden, let us reflect on what the nature of Fox News reporting would look like if they were talking about two Biden family friends that went to prison that were seriously named LEV AND IGOR!

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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1412 on: December 06, 2023, 05:51:05 PM »
Even under the scenario that Hunter Biden was collecting money under the guise of providing access to political power, but was really scamming the people paying him, how can you maintain that this shouldn't be investigated by Congress? Why are you guys crying that this should not be investigated?

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Offline Roundy

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Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1413 on: December 06, 2023, 06:07:57 PM »
Even under the scenario that Hunter Biden was collecting money under the guise of providing access to political power, but was really scamming the people paying him, how can you maintain that this shouldn't be investigated by Congress? Why are you guys crying that this should not be investigated?

Yo, this is a thread about Joe Biden. If there's evidence that Hunter Biden did something corrupt of course it should be investigated. But without evidence that Joe was involved it's just another scandal involving a President's relative and is definitely not a basis for impeachment. That whole angle is just a clown show, meant to even the playing field a bit (Look, their guy got impeached too!!) and thus far has been demonstrated to be nothing but a desperate fever dream concocted by some truly corrupt politicians.
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Offline Lord Dave

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Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1414 on: December 06, 2023, 07:49:32 PM »
Even under the scenario that Hunter Biden was collecting money under the guise of providing access to political power, but was really scamming the people paying him, how can you maintain that this shouldn't be investigated by Congress? Why are you guys crying that this should not be investigated?
Probably because they aren't investigating anyone else.  I'm rather certain the number of people, including the Trumps, who personally benefitted from a relative in high office is pretty damn high.  Do you agree every single political family should be investigated to check for such wrongdoings?  Maybe make it illegal (because its not).
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Offline markjo

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Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1415 on: December 06, 2023, 10:20:21 PM »
Even under the scenario that Hunter Biden was collecting money under the guise of providing access to political power, but was really scamming the people paying him, how can you maintain that this shouldn't be investigated by Congress? Why are you guys crying that this should not be investigated?
Hey, it's not as if Joe Biden appointed Hunter as a presidential advisor while Hunter was making truckloads of money from outside business interests.
https://www.citizensforethics.org/reports-investigations/crew-investigations/jared-and-ivanka-made-up-to-640-million-in-the-white-house/
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Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1416 on: December 07, 2023, 02:17:45 AM »
Even under the scenario that Hunter Biden was collecting money under the guise of providing access to political power, but was really scamming the people paying him, how can you maintain that this shouldn't be investigated by Congress? Why are you guys crying that this should not be investigated?
First I did NOT say it was a scam, there are multiple reasons to put a high profile person on your board, one is just how it appears.   We should investigate things of which we have reason to believe (i.e. evidence) that there was illegal activity.  I am not aware of such in the Hunter Biden case.

What there IS apparently evidence for is that Hunter Biden did not pay his federal taxes for a number of years and dealing with that (in addition to paying the back taxes and interest which he did already) was all part of the plea deal that fell apart a while back.  So now he is being charged with federal tax violations.  I think that was all pretty much expected.  How much of that plea deal failure is politically motivated (to have the case going on during the campaign season)  and how it will all eventually turn out, I have no idea.
« Last Edit: December 08, 2023, 04:34:23 AM by ichoosereality »
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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1417 on: December 09, 2023, 05:51:23 AM »
Even under the scenario that Hunter Biden was collecting money under the guise of providing access to political power, but was really scamming the people paying him, how can you maintain that this shouldn't be investigated by Congress? Why are you guys crying that this should not be investigated?

Yo, this is a thread about Joe Biden. If there's evidence that Hunter Biden did something corrupt of course it should be investigated. But without evidence that Joe was involved it's just another scandal involving a President's relative and is definitely not a basis for impeachment. That whole angle is just a clown show, meant to even the playing field a bit (Look, their guy got impeached too!!) and thus far has been demonstrated to be nothing but a desperate fever dream concocted by some truly corrupt politicians.

Hunter Biden was collecting money on the suggestion of providing access to Joe Biden's political power. How is that not about Joe Biden, or warranting of an investigation?

The purpose of an investigation is to investigate things and collect evidence. Your statement of "without evidence that Joe was involved" suggests that you want Congress to investigate this and collect evidence. Oddly, you are simultaneously expressing a desire for an investigation while telling us that they should not investigate this.

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Offline Roundy

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Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1418 on: December 09, 2023, 04:46:17 PM »
Even under the scenario that Hunter Biden was collecting money under the guise of providing access to political power, but was really scamming the people paying him, how can you maintain that this shouldn't be investigated by Congress? Why are you guys crying that this should not be investigated?

Yo, this is a thread about Joe Biden. If there's evidence that Hunter Biden did something corrupt of course it should be investigated. But without evidence that Joe was involved it's just another scandal involving a President's relative and is definitely not a basis for impeachment. That whole angle is just a clown show, meant to even the playing field a bit (Look, their guy got impeached too!!) and thus far has been demonstrated to be nothing but a desperate fever dream concocted by some truly corrupt politicians.

Hunter Biden was collecting money on the suggestion of providing access to Joe Biden's political power. How is that not about Joe Biden, or warranting of an investigation?

The purpose of an investigation is to investigate things and collect evidence. Your statement of "without evidence that Joe was involved" suggests that you want Congress to investigate this and collect evidence. Oddly, you are simultaneously expressing a desire for an investigation while telling us that they should not investigate this.

Except I never argued it didn't warrant an investigation. The Republicans have been investigating this for years now and have turned up 0 evidence of corruption on Joe Biden's part. Try harder, Tom.  ::)

Clown show. You're a part of it.  ;D
« Last Edit: December 09, 2023, 04:49:08 PM by Roundy »
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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: President Joe Biden
« Reply #1419 on: December 09, 2023, 07:29:43 PM »
The questions you replied to are "how can you maintain that this shouldn't be investigated by Congress? Why are you guys crying that this should not be investigated?" Presumably anyone replying to me with an argument must think that this should not be investigated. It's good that you can be honest with yourself and have clarified that you think that this should be investigated.

In regards to evidence produced, there has been plenty.

Hunter Biden is giving a portion of his money to the "Big Guy". Aren't you curious who this person is? Joe Biden's brother referred to Joe Biden as the "Big Guy". Hunter Biden's business partner also says that Joe Biden was the "Big Guy". Why is Joe Biden receiving a portion of the money Hunter is getting for this influence peddling scheme?

We have a Birisma executive admitting to the FBI that they paid Hunter and Joe Biden millions in bribes.

Hunter Biden's business partner admitted that he used Hunter Biden to "get help from D.C." in firing the infamous Ukranian prosecutor that honk really loves -

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/devon-archer-hunter-biden-burisma-execs-ukrainian-prosecutor-fired

Quote
Archer said Zlochevsky and Pozharski "placed constant pressure on Hunter Biden to get help from D.C." in getting Ukrainian prosecutor Viktor Shokin ousted. Shokin was investigating Burisma for corruption.

According to the source, Archer testified that in December 2015, Hunter Biden, Zlochevsky and Pozharski "called D.C." to discuss the matter. Archer testified that Biden, Zlochevsky and Pozharski stepped away to make the call.

It is unclear if Hunter and the Burisma executives spoke directly to Joe Biden on the matter.

At the time, though, Joe Biden was in charge of U.S.-Ukraine policy for the Obama administration.

As stated above, Joe Biden was in charge of the US-Ukrainian policy at the time. Joe Biden incidentally also admits that he was instrumental in firing the prosecutor.

So please clarify that nothing has been produced.

Even more wild, it seems to go further than Hunter Biden. Multiple Biden family members were apparently receiving foreign money.

https://nypost.com/2023/05/10/nine-biden-family-members-who-allegedly-got-foreign-money-identified-by-house-gop/

Quote
Nine Biden family members who allegedly got foreign money identified by House GOP

...

Joe Biden’s son [Hunter], Joe Biden’s brother [James], Joe Biden’s brother’s wife [Sara], Hunter Biden’s girlfriend or Beau Biden’s widow [Hallie], however, you want to write that, Hunter Biden’s ex-wife [Kathleen Buhle], Hunter Biden’s current wife [Melissa Cohen], and three children of the president’s son and the president’s brother,” Comer said.

The chairman seemed to indicate that only one of Biden’s grandchildren and two of his brother’s children got the foreign funds.

“We’re talking about grandchil — a grandchild,” Comer said at the press conference. “That’s odd, most people that work hard every day’s grandchild doesn’t get a wire from a foreign national.

https://www.swiowanewssource.com/audubon/article_cab0ad73-0d63-5ff5-bcd8-611ebd4372c9.html

Quote
WASHINGTON—House Committee on Oversight and Accountability Chairman James Comer (R-Ky.) today released a bank records memorandum detailing new information obtained in the committee’s investigation into the Biden family’s influence peddling and business schemes. The Oversight Committee has obtained thousands of pages of financial records revealing the Biden family and associates’ complicated network of companies set up during Joe Biden’s vice presidency and the millions the Bidens received from foreign sources. The financial records also reveal how the Bidens used complicated transactions to hide payments from foreign nationals, including CCP-linked associates, and provide clear indications of influence peddling schemes during then-Vice President Biden’s tenure.

“The Bidens intentionally sought to hide, confuse, and conceal their influence peddling schemes, but bank records don’t lie. The Bidens made millions from foreign nationals providing what seems to be no services other than access and influence. From the thousands of records we’ve obtained so far, we know the Biden family set up over a dozen companies when Joe Biden was vice president. The Bidens engaged in many intentionally complicated financial transactions to hide these payments and avoid scrutiny. In at least one instance, the Bidens’ CCP-linked associates took steps to conceal the source of the payment to the Bidens.

“The Bidens’ foreign entanglements are breathtaking and raise serious questions about why foreign actors targeted the Biden family, what they expected in return, and whether our national security is threatened. We will continue to pursue additional bank records to follow the money trail and inform legislative solutions to prevent this type of corruption. Americans deserve answers, transparency, and accountability,” said Chairman Comer.
« Last Edit: December 09, 2023, 08:03:13 PM by Tom Bishop »