[retlaw]

So do you think your location has settled?  A friend of mine had to get a flexible gas line on his house because the soil was moving.  Do you think the mountain rose, as this does happen and maybe considering the angles it could move enough?  Do you think the earth has wobbled enough?  Do you think the earth's orbit has changed enough?  Any ideas?

Looks like it settled. It happened all in one year three summers ago when I noticed it.
How can't you notice it?

The mountains haven't moved. There are some here that move a lot but not these ones.
Even if it had moved it would of had to have been a catastrophic move to change whats happened.

I first thought the only thing it could be was pole shift. But then thinking about it if we believe modern science and global earth then gravity could also play into effect if another large body of mass was entering earths gravitational forces. This could cause a temporary or permanent change in obits do to the extra force at play.
But no one can see a large enough body of mass close enough to qualify so what are the options?

[Westprog]

Isn't it interesting, though, here on the forum where there's the opportunity to defend the theory, to explain how the Sun stays the same size in the sky as it's moving further away, that it disappears even when there's supposedly a clear line of sight to it - there's nobody in the entire flat Earth community willing to explain their point of view.

Except for the books we have written over the last 150 years and the Wiki which talks about that, right?

Yes, that's what I expected.

Not even the pretence at an argument - merely an assertion that this is all explained Somewhere Else.

I know that there are all kinds of obfuscated ridiculous books and videos out there. However, if there were a shred of truth to them, then it should be possible for someone to come here and explain, simply, in words, how the Sun can be moving away and stay the same apparent size.

Things moving away and becoming apparently smaller form part of our basic experience of life. In order to prove that this doesn't apply, it would be a good start to give one, single example of something moving away and staying the same apparent size.

The importance of this particular argument is that the fundamental argument used by flat Earth supporters is that their model reflects what they see in everyday life. I've demonstrated, using only the most basic universal experience available to every human being, that the opposite is true. The flat Earth model relies on people refusing to accept the evidence of their own eyes, instead choosing to believe in something out of faith.

I'll also comment that I did not expect anyone to come on this thread and try to seriously explain how objects can move away and remain the same apparent size. The absurdity of the argument would be such that simply by trying to make it, they would undermine themselves. So we get the Fermat argument - "I have a really good proof but there's no room for it here."

[Westprog]

Isn't it interesting, though, here on the forum where there's the opportunity to defend the theory, to explain how the Sun stays the same size in the sky as it's moving further away, that it disappears even when there's supposedly a clear line of sight to it - there's nobody in the entire flat Earth community willing to explain their point of view.

Except for the books we have written over the last 150 years and the Wiki which talks about that, right?

Tom, I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt here. I just don't know what experiment I can conduct to prove to myself what the wiki and you say is true.

And the experiment would have to demonstrate just one thing - something moving away which remained the same apparent size.

A single example of this would do a great deal to support the argument that it's possible.

[Westprog]

I'll mention just one other thing, which should be obvious, but ignoring the obvious is all too prevalent here.

The change in apparent size is a product of the relative distance. If something is a yard away, and it moves further away by another yard, its apparent size will significantly reduce. (It will occupy a quarter of its previous area).

If something is a hundred yards away, and it moves a yard further away, it will not appear to significantly decrease in size.

This is again something that every sighted human being fully understands. Indeed, it's an essential part of understanding the world. A three year old knows that when his mother moves away, she is not actually shrinking.

[Westprog]

I'll make another point relating to the way the flat Earth believers characterise those who claim the Earth is round. They're credulous, right? They believe what they're told. The flat Earthers think for themselves, they aren't duped by NASA and NATO and the Illuminati. They've seen through the deception with the power of their own incisive minds.

So on this thread I've deliberately left out all of the accumulated wisdom of ten thousand years, and kept it to actual personal experience which is open to everyone. And what happens? The response is "The sacred texts explain all this, were you but wise enough to understand." Responses which deal in actual personal experience open to everyone? None.

[Westprog]

And one other point.

There are of course optical phenomena which bring things apparently closer. This includes, among mirages, etc, telescopes and binoculars.

However, even when you're looking at something through a telescope, as it moves away, it appears smaller. This applies to, say, aircraft. Look at an aircraft passing overhead with the naked eye, and it will become smaller as it moves away. Look at it through a telescope, and it will appear larger than with the naked eye - but it will also become apparently smaller as it moves away.

[Scroogie]

So do you think your location has settled?  A friend of mine had to get a flexible gas line on his house because the soil was moving.  Do you think the mountain rose, as this does happen and maybe considering the angles it could move enough?  Do you think the earth has wobbled enough?  Do you think the earth's orbit has changed enough?  Any ideas?

Looks like it settled. It happened all in one year three summers ago when I noticed it.
How can't you notice it?

The mountains haven't moved. There are some here that move a lot but not these ones.
Even if it had moved it would of had to have been a catastrophic move to change whats happened.

I first thought the only thing it could be was pole shift. But then thinking about it if we believe modern science and global earth then gravity could also play into effect if another large body of mass was entering earths gravitational forces. This could cause a temporary or permanent change in obits do to the extra force at play.
But no one can see a large enough body of mass close enough to qualify so what are the options?

Wandered through the forum here for a couple of hours and this if the first really interesting post I've encountered.

My initial thought was that you may have experienced a manifestation of the nutation of the earth's axis. There are several terms to the nutation, most quite insignificant, the largest, which has a period of 18.6 years, could possibly be what has caused the phenomenon you experienced. I'm no astrophysicist so I'll have to go and read up on nutation and its magnitude, but, for now, this is my best guess.

I live in mountainous country, too, but am nowhere as lucky as you to have such a cool phenomenon as a double sunset in my own backyard. But you've given me food for thought. Mebbe if I were to scour the countryside I could find such a place, and mebbe even get a video of a double sunset.

[The next day] - I do have a question. For how many years before the change was noticed had you been observing the double sunset? And, during that time had you noticed any changes, such as the sun setting slightly further up the mountain, the second sunrise to sunset period varying in length, etc.?