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Offline Particle Person

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Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #380 on: June 30, 2014, 06:29:39 AM »
On that map, the snowy mountain ranges to the east, west, and south make up the province border and aren't part of the playable area. If your only argument for Oblivion's conversation system is that it's funny and that it's just a game, then I can do nothing more but submit the matter to the arbitration of our wise audience.

You can't accuse something of being "just" three colors when the thing you're defending is almost entirely monochromatic. More than three quarters of Cyrodiil is just green fields and green trees.
Your mom is when your mom and you arent your mom.

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Offline beardo

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Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #381 on: June 30, 2014, 11:02:01 AM »
BUT GREEN IS PRETTIER THAN GREY AND WHITE! BAAAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW!
The Mastery.

Offline Blanko

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Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #382 on: June 30, 2014, 12:54:11 PM »
>objectively worse
>hard facts

Not this shit again

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Offline Rushy

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Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #383 on: June 30, 2014, 02:13:52 PM »
I watched some speedruns of morrowind and I can say it simply isn't a very good game.

Offline Blanko

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Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #384 on: June 30, 2014, 02:55:29 PM »
I watched some speedruns of morrowind and I can say it simply isn't a very good game.

Game is literally five minutes long, gg worse than Gone Home

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Offline Pete Svarrior

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Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #385 on: June 30, 2014, 04:04:24 PM »
Dark Souls II is poorly designed.

Oh, wait, that's not the right thread... or is it?
Read the FAQ before asking your question - chances are we already addressed it.
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If we are not speculating then we must assume

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Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #386 on: June 30, 2014, 04:59:38 PM »
All right, I'm in Tamriel now.  What do?

Ghost of V

Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #387 on: June 30, 2014, 05:14:36 PM »
I'm not. I hate Skyrim, as well as every other ES game that came out after Morrowind. Oblivion is just objectively worse.

Morrowind? Really? You do realize that that is the game where you can hit someone dead-on and still miss due to dice-rolls right? >_>

Back to addressing this post.

The problem here is that you're looking at this objectively; I'm looking at it subjectively. I have more fun playing Oblivion than I do playing Skyrim. That's a personal fact, for me. My personal tastes lead me to post on forums about how Oblivion is better than Skyrim. Although Skyrim does add some "improvements" on the original formula, it also takes some away. For example, the level up system in Skyrim is subjectively worse than Oblivion's level up system. I felt like I was actually creating a specified character with his own skills/weaknesses in Oblivion. Leveling up requires thought and dedication in Oblvion; Skyrim's system is just la-di-da/hoop-da-loop put points into a tree and pick which stat you want to level out of THREE stats. Oblivion's level up system, while more complicated, is more engaging and promotes experimentation and planning. The reason for this is because I think Skyrim was made with a more "noob-friendly" attitude, so that new ES players don't fuck up their character builds within the first few levels. I guess I should be thanking Bethesda, but I'm not a child and I know how to manage stats. Stat management is a large part of RPGS and adds more depth. Unforunately, Skyrim is lacking in the depth department because of these changes.


Comparisons:
Conversation system: I think it's funnier to watch in Oblivion. Especially when you're just cruising into a town and you're forced to turn around and zoom in on some guarding yelling "HALT" at you. Never gets old. Of course, this is completely subjective. I can understand how some people could see Skyrim's handling of dialog as more graceful or realistic (because it is).

Quests: the quests were far better in Oblivion, especially the guild quests. The guild quest progession made sense in Oblivion: you're not trusted by the guilds until you complete several quests, in Skyrim there's some loophole that makes you the most important member of each guild immediately. The civil war quest in Skyrim is a big dull timesink (ransack 20+ keeps) with no useful reward. In Oblivion, I actually cared about the characters in the guilds, especially with the Dark Brotherhood. When I was told I had to kill all the Dark Brotherhood NPCS in Oblivion I was actually a tad bit upset. Skyrim never got any sort of emotional reaction out of me except anger at all the retarded PS3 glitches (which deserves its own section).

Glitches: Skyrim's has an abundance of gamebreaking glitches. The game glitches out all the time. I haven't played it in a while so I don't know if it's been patched for the console versions, so forgive me if it has. I actually could not complete Skyrim because one of the main questlines broke during my playthrough. The quest were you have to give all your equipment to this elf guy and go to a Thalmor party yielded an infinite loadscreen (I tried several things to fix this, but eventually had to create a completely new character). I know that Oblivion has it's share of glitches and bugs too, but I never had a game-breaking glitch.

Towns: I haven't seen anyone claim that Skyrim has better towns than Oblivion. Morthal, Winterhold, and Dawnstar are the biggest offenders here. They are absolutely boring and it seems like the devs put no effort into making them (fuck, you could make a better town with the TES quest maker that is bundled with Skyrim/Oblvion, easily). I understand why they're so shitty story-wise, but it still seems lazy to me. Maybe these towns were dumbed down because of the rushed launch of Skyrim? Who knows. Oblivion's towns are all unique and relatively large. Each town feels like it has its own culture and each town has its own unique architecture.  Even Kvatch is better than Morthal, Winterhold, and Dawnstar and that is saying something.


I'll get to more later.

Offline Blanko

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Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #388 on: June 30, 2014, 05:42:02 PM »
Morrowind? Really? You do realize that that is the game where you can hit someone dead-on and still miss due to dice-rolls right? >_>

Hey nice opinions, dude.

Ghost of V

Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #389 on: June 30, 2014, 07:01:27 PM »
Morrowind? Really? You do realize that that is the game where you can hit someone dead-on and still miss due to dice-rolls right? >_>

Hey nice opinions, dude.

Would be amusing if it was an opinion to begin with.

Saddam Hussein

Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #390 on: June 30, 2014, 07:10:46 PM »
That's enough.  This thread is about TESO.  I am a Nord dragonknight.  Discuss.

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Online Lord Dave

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Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #391 on: June 30, 2014, 07:26:45 PM »
That's enough.  This thread is about TESO.  I am a Nord dragonknight.  Discuss.
Fuck a dark elf.
If you are going to DebOOonK an expert then you have to at least provide a source with credentials of equal or greater relevance. Even then, it merely shows that some experts disagree with each other.

Offline Blanko

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Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #392 on: June 30, 2014, 07:54:20 PM »
Morrowind? Really? You do realize that that is the game where you can hit someone dead-on and still miss due to dice-rolls right? >_>

Hey nice opinions, dude.

Would be amusing if it was an opinion to begin with.

Sure, stat checks are worse than spamming LMB to win in an RPG because hard cold facts yeah :^)

Ghost of V

Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #393 on: June 30, 2014, 09:06:34 PM »
Morrowind? Really? You do realize that that is the game where you can hit someone dead-on and still miss due to dice-rolls right? >_>

Hey nice opinions, dude.

Would be amusing if it was an opinion to begin with.

Sure, stat checks are worse than spamming LMB to win in an RPG because hard cold facts yeah :^)

Quote what you have a problem with next time. Dice rolls are fact in Morrowind.

Offline Blanko

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Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #394 on: June 30, 2014, 09:21:35 PM »
Morrowind? Really? You do realize that that is the game where you can hit someone dead-on and still miss due to dice-rolls right? >_>

Hey nice opinions, dude.

Would be amusing if it was an opinion to begin with.

Sure, stat checks are worse than spamming LMB to win in an RPG because hard cold facts yeah :^)

Quote what you have a problem with next time. Dice rolls are fact in Morrowind.

You're making the implication that dice rolls are a bad thing.

Ghost of V

Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #395 on: June 30, 2014, 09:23:34 PM »
Dice-rolls in a game with combat that appears action-based is counter intuitive.

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Offline Particle Person

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Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #396 on: June 30, 2014, 09:25:04 PM »
I'm not. I hate Skyrim, as well as every other ES game that came out after Morrowind. Oblivion is just objectively worse.

Towns: I haven't seen anyone claim that Skyrim has better towns than Oblivion. Morthal, Winterhold, and Dawnstar are the biggest offenders here. They are absolutely boring and it seems like the devs put no effort into making them (fuck, you could make a better town with the TES quest maker that is bundled with Skyrim/Oblvion, easily). I understand why they're so shitty story-wise, but it still seems lazy to me. Maybe these towns were dumbed down because of the rushed launch of Skyrim? Who knows. Oblivion's towns are all unique and relatively large. Each town feels like it has its own culture and each town has its own unique architecture.  Even Kvatch is better than Morthal, Winterhold, and Dawnstar and that is saying something.


I'll get to more later.

This is the only part I really have a problem with. Of course it's perfectly acceptable to prefer Oblivion. I reluctantly let the game into a special place in my heart a long time ago (I was lying earlier).

Now, on to the hard cold facts. Skyrim has three tiers of settlements: major cities, minor cities, and towns. Oblivion has two: cities and towns. Morthal, Winterhold, and Dawnstar are all minor cities. If you're going to compare settlements, it only makes sense to compare Skyrim's major cities (Solitude, Windhelm, Markarth... you know, the "real" cities) to Oblivion's cities. In that case, I don't know anybody who prefers Oblivion's city design. The cities in Oblivion are basically all just blobs of buildings on a flat plain. In Skyrim, cities are integrated with the environment in more interesting ways. Markarth is carved into a mountainside. Solitude is built on an enormous rock arch by the sea. Riften is a blob of buildings on a flat plain. O wait. Basically, improved technology allowed BGS to realize something closer to what was portrayed in their concept drawings. The concepts for Oblivion cities were great too (Here's what Leyawiin could have looked like), but time constraints and unfamiliarity with the hardware they were developing for would prove to be 2serious.
Your mom is when your mom and you arent your mom.

Offline Blanko

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Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #397 on: June 30, 2014, 09:29:43 PM »
I don't see how it's action-based at all. In fact, for Morrowind they did a good job of realizing that a system entirely based on pressing the attack button until the opponent falls over does not make for very good action, which is why your success in combat is entirely reliant on character building. For Oblivion and Skyrim they didn't realize that, and also didn't make the necessary improvements to the system to make it seem actually "action-based".

Oblivion still has a fair amount of focus on character building, which is part of the reason why it's better than Skyrim, but in Skyrim it does not matter at all. It's all been replaced by shitty takedown animations.

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Offline Particle Person

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Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #398 on: June 30, 2014, 09:34:50 PM »
Oblivion still has a fair amount of focus on character building, which is part of the reason why it's better than Skyrim, but in Skyrim it does not matter at all. It's all been replaced by shitty takedown animations.

Oh no, you too? What exactly has been replaced by "shitty "takedown" animations"? Those animations only trigger when you've already killed something. They're purely cosmetic and don't affect the course of combat at all. I'm starting to understand that neither of you have spent very much time in either game.
Your mom is when your mom and you arent your mom.

Offline Blanko

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Re: The Elder Scrolls Online
« Reply #399 on: June 30, 2014, 09:37:37 PM »
I mean it's their way of making the game appear more combat-oriented, when no actual changes were made to the combat system. Since the RPG structures underneath the combat are worse in Skyrim, the whole thing is worse as a whole.