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Other Discussion Boards => Philosophy, Religion & Society => Topic started by: Yaakov ben Avraham on January 08, 2014, 03:59:22 AM

Title: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Yaakov ben Avraham on January 08, 2014, 03:59:22 AM
On another topic, is anyone here any kind of Latter-day Saint (Utah variety or otherwise)? Has anyone read The Book of Mormon? What do you think of it? I've read it. I'm doing some work on it. Any thoughts? Anyone who doesn't know about it, let me know, & I can give a brief synopsis.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Socker on January 08, 2014, 04:03:54 AM
The only thing I know about Mormonism is from South Park, so I doubt I can give a good opinion.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Yaakov ben Avraham on January 08, 2014, 04:24:56 AM
Fair enough. The Book of Mormon is a document 1st published in 1830. According to Joseph Smith, Jr, he was led to metal plates that had the appearance of gold by an angel named Moroni. Allowed to take them in September of 1827, he was able w/ the help of magical devices called the Urim & Thummim to translate the text. The text itself is a document divided into 15 'books', each by a different author, much like the Bible. Like that book, The Book of Mormon tells the story of the rise & fall of civilisations, these ones in the Americas. Both originated in the Middle East, the 1st about 2100 BC, the 2nd in 600 BC. I won't tell you more, as that would spoil it, except to say that yes, according to this, the Americas DID get a visit from Jesus! Go figure! I don't subscribe to any of this personally, but I do find it fascinating. Thoughts?
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Saddam Hussein on January 08, 2014, 04:58:36 AM
I'm a Jew.

Wow, thanks for the reminder.  I had almost forgotten.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Shane on January 08, 2014, 05:06:34 AM
Yaakov'd. The only thing I know about Mormons is they're annoying and come to my door once in a while, and something about magic underpants.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Yaakov ben Avraham on January 08, 2014, 05:15:36 AM
Saddam, fair enough. I had that coming! Statement edited to remove the stupid reference to the obvious.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: beardo on January 08, 2014, 08:20:44 AM
Yaakov'd. The only thing I know about Mormons is they're annoying and come to my door once in a while, and something about magic underpants.
You should talk to them about a magic fist that punches unwelcome visitors who visit too often.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Alchemist21 on January 08, 2014, 02:49:36 PM
Yaakov'd. The only thing I know about Mormons is they're annoying and come to my door once in a while, and something about magic underpants.

Are you sure that's not the Jehovah's Witnesses?
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Yaakov ben Avraham on January 08, 2014, 02:55:54 PM
No, he's right. Mormons do believe in wearing special garments under their clothing. They derive these beliefs from a blend of Jewish & Masonic concepts.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Rama Set on January 08, 2014, 03:18:11 PM
Jospeh Smith was also a convicted conman who for some reason translated the texts in to middle english.  I wonder why... Think he might have gotten along with L. Ron Hubbard.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Yaakov ben Avraham on January 08, 2014, 04:45:04 PM
Well, whatever one thinks of Joseph or the Church he founded, the fact is, that while he was brought to law on MANY occasions, he was only found guilty of a very minor offence, namely, being disorderly & being an imposter. There is no record even of a punishment. An argument can always be made that Joseph was simply acting the fool, as many young folk do. I'm playing Devil's Advocate here. Re: the Middle English, that is true. The argument could be made that this was done because people were accustomed to this in their Bibles & churches. Again, Devil's Advocate. There was only one English Bible used in 1830, the Authorised Version (King James Version). Most Americans were using a 1769 imprint of the KJV, which is what was sold in this country @ the time. Joseph's own Bible was that imprint. It could be argued that writing in then standard English would have been out of order, just as no one translated the Bible into contemporary English until the 20th Century.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Thork on January 09, 2014, 11:07:57 PM
Mormons always seem super happy to me. If believing in a book a man wrote with his face in a hat makes people happy, its one of the better religions.

Also, can Mormons have sex with their siblings or is that a myth?
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Yaakov ben Avraham on January 09, 2014, 11:16:56 PM
That's a myth. Incest is as forbidden to the LDS as it is to most. I've never even heard that one before, & I've been around Mormons for years. They used to practice polygyny, & some fundamentalist sects still do, but the mainline Church hasn't since 1890.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Thork on January 09, 2014, 11:33:07 PM
That's a myth. Incest is as forbidden to the LDS as it is to most.
The link below is long, but if you have the time, you'll see Mormonism is absolutely laced with incest.

http://human-nature.com/science-as-culture/walker.html

Of course its an internet source and if you look for evidence of anything on the internet, you'll find it.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Yaakov ben Avraham on January 09, 2014, 11:51:11 PM
Since I'm on my dumbphone, I can't read the link, but, early in Mormon history, some very strange things did go on. Mormonism was in many ways what fundamentalist Mormons are today: clannish, secretive, outright dangerous. One could say cult-like. If incest occurred (which would not surprise me), it was likely in that early period of the history of the Church that no one in the Mormon Church knows about, because all they get in church is the sanitised version. Those few who DO know shut up or get stomped on by the Brethren. The power of the Mormon Church in the Intermountain West is NOT something to underestimate. One who does may find that it is the last professional act they take before being squashed like a bug.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Tintagel on January 10, 2014, 03:43:32 PM
Since I'm on my dumbphone, I can't read the link, but, early in Mormon history, some very strange things did go on. Mormonism was in many ways what fundamentalist Mormons are today: clannish, secretive, outright dangerous. One could say cult-like. If incest occurred (which would not surprise me), it was likely in that early period of the history of the Church that no one in the Mormon Church knows about, because all they get in church is the sanitised version. Those few who DO know shut up or get stomped on by the Brethren. The power of the Mormon Church in the Intermountain West is NOT something to underestimate. One who does may find that it is the last professional act they take before being squashed like a bug.
This doesn't sound like an organization I want any part of.  :/
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Yaakov ben Avraham on January 12, 2014, 08:45:38 PM
& yes, unless you are prepared to (a) sweep a lot under the rug about early Mormon history, or (b) acknowledge that stuff happened but keep your yap shut in public, the LDS Church is NOT an organisation you want to be part of. @ the least, you will be subject to the so-called 'Court of Love' (a Church court where punishments up to excommunication are doled out; & no, I am NOT making up the Orwellian name, they literlly do call such a procedure a 'Court of Love'). @ worst, if you live in Mormon Country, your professional existance could be destroyed. The Morg ('Resistance is futile') is relentless. The stories I could share...
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Excelsior John on February 25, 2014, 03:12:41 AM
On another topic, is anyone here any kind of Latter-day Saint (Utah variety or otherwise)? Has anyone read The Book of Mormon? What do you think of it? I've read it. I'm doing some work on it. Any thoughts? Anyone who doesn't know about it, let me know, & I can give a brief synopsis.
Morminism is nothing but a flippin evil santanic cult. They are NOT Christans!! They dont beleive that Jesus is God thus they are absibituteley NOT Christans
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Rama Set on February 25, 2014, 06:35:39 AM
Morminism is nothing but a flippin evil santanic cult. They are NOT Christans!! They dont beleive that Jesus is God thus they are absibituteley NOT Christans

From: http://mormon.org/faq/belief-in-jesus-christ

Quote
Jesus Christ is the literal Son of God. His birth, life, death, and resurrection fulfilled the many prophecies contained in the scriptures concerning the coming of a Savior. He was the Creator, He is our Savior, and He will be our Judge (see Isaiah 9:6, 53:3-7; Psalms 22:16-18).

Under the direction of our Heavenly Father, Jesus Christ created the earth (John 1:10; Hebrews 1:2).


So they dont believe in the trinity, big deal.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: beardo on February 25, 2014, 07:07:34 AM
Rama, pls.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Blanko on February 25, 2014, 08:17:19 AM
Sounds like a more literal God than in other sects to me.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Rama Set on February 25, 2014, 01:51:54 PM
Rama, pls.

Reported for racism.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Excelsior John on February 25, 2014, 11:23:25 PM
Morminism is nothing but a flippin evil santanic cult. They are NOT Christans!! They dont beleive that Jesus is God thus they are absibituteley NOT Christans

From: http://mormon.org/faq/belief-in-jesus-christ

Quote
Jesus Christ is the literal Son of God. His birth, life, death, and resurrection fulfilled the many prophecies contained in the scriptures concerning the coming of a Savior. He was the Creator, He is our Savior, and He will be our Judge (see Isaiah 9:6, 53:3-7; Psalms 22:16-18).

Under the direction of our Heavenly Father, Jesus Christ created the earth (John 1:10; Hebrews 1:2).


So they dont believe in the trinity, big deal.
Rigecting the Trinitey is rigecting God!!! And deniel of Jesus as God is the deniel of Jesus altogether!!!!!
Rama, pls.
What?
Sounds like a more literal God than in other sects to me.
Da flip now?!!
Rama, pls.

Reported for racism.
Why??! Im not saying he isent an rascist (wich he is) but pda flip whyz???!!!!!
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Lemon on February 26, 2014, 03:16:10 PM
I am not a mormon
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: beardo on February 26, 2014, 03:22:48 PM
I LOVE AFRICAN-AMERICENS
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Rama Set on February 26, 2014, 03:48:21 PM
I love African-Americen lovers!
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Excelsior John on February 27, 2014, 12:20:36 AM
I am not a mormon
Well then you are an blaspimer an idolter and an IDIOT!!!
I LOVE AFRICAN-AMERICENS
As do i as an African American!!! :) :)
I love African-Americen lovers!
Why thank you ! I love you to! :)
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: jroa on February 27, 2014, 06:57:54 PM
I am not a racist.  I hate everyone equally. 
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Socker on February 28, 2014, 07:11:16 PM
I am not a racist.  I hate everyone equally. 
That joke is older than the Internet.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Saddam Hussein on February 28, 2014, 07:16:24 PM
I am not a racist.  I hate everyone equally. 
That joke is older than the Internet.

Yeah, that was a markjo-grade joke.  For shame, jroa.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Rama Set on February 28, 2014, 08:47:30 PM
Jroa is not only old, but quite drunk and looking for a reason to shoot someone.  Keep going Saddam.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: jroa on March 01, 2014, 06:33:59 AM
Give me a reason.  Please. 
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Yaakov ben Avraham on March 01, 2014, 08:57:07 PM
So am I to understand that the concept of Trinity, which word appears nowhere in the Christian Bible, is what Jesus himself believed? Then I take it he was praying to himself when he prayed? & God sent God to impregnate a virgin to give birth to God... Even though the Hebrew Scriptures are quite clear: 'Hear, O Israel! The Lord our God, the Lord is one.' And Jesus, having been a Jew, would have been appalled to find people worshipping him today. The ultimate in idolatry is what it is.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: beardo on March 01, 2014, 09:03:10 PM
Jewsus.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Rama Set on March 01, 2014, 09:55:47 PM
So am I to understand that the concept of Trinity, which word appears nowhere in the Christian Bible, is what Jesus himself believed? Then I take it he was praying to himself when he prayed? & God sent God to impregnate a virgin to give birth to God... Even though the Hebrew Scriptures are quite clear: 'Hear, O Israel! The Lord our God, the Lord is one.' And Jesus, having been a Jew, would have been appalled to find people worshipping him today. The ultimate in idolatry is what it is.

Might I recommend educating yourself?
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: fappenhosen on March 13, 2014, 04:15:52 PM
The Book of Mormon? What do you think of it?

It's bullshit. Like all religions.

/thrad

Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: beardo on March 13, 2014, 08:32:49 PM
Yaakov, I once saw a documentary about early discoveries of the Americas, and one part was about a Cherokee chief who believes that the Cherokee are descendants of Hebrews who sailed east on Roman ships via the Red Sea. What do you think of this?
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Ghost of V on March 13, 2014, 08:51:16 PM
My sister is a "Mormon", and when I say that I mean that she says she is but doesn't really practice anything in the Mormon religion. However, she has brought Mormon missionaries over to my apartment to "convert" me. Of course it didn't work, but they're a really nice group of people. Most Mormons are. I don't know whether to be frightened or contented, so I try to stay away from them all for the most part.

One of the Elders was telling me about these heavenly Golden Plates that Joseph Smith Jr. used to write/translate The Book of Mormon. I asked them where the Plates went once Smith was done using them, and apparently he gave them back to the Angels he got them from.

Most questions I asked them ended in some ridiculous supernatural answer, so I'm inclined to believe that the religion was a sham (ala Scientology) that got out of hand. Of course, that can be said about almost all religions.

Their tiered heaven system or whatever is pretty unique, however.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: fappenhosen on March 14, 2014, 01:30:46 AM
Of course, that can be said about almost all religions.

Jesus: Hey listen, what if we were all just nice to each other?
The People: Not interested fuck ball. Keep your hippy shit away from our children.
Jesus: OMG I just turned this water into wine and walked across a lake and everything!
The People: Wow he was sent from God!
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Снупс on March 14, 2014, 11:45:28 AM
Their tiered heaven system or whatever is pretty unique, however.

That sounds interesting, I'm not sure I've heard of this before now somehow. What's that like?
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Ghost of V on March 14, 2014, 06:11:26 PM
Their tiered heaven system or whatever is pretty unique, however.

That sounds interesting, I'm not sure I've heard of this before now somehow. What's that like?

There are a few different tiers in their Afterlife. I'm not very well versed in it, but it goes something like this:
If you didn't believe in your life, you're sent to some "school" where they teach you, then possibly send you back to earth for a redo to get into the real "believers heaven" when your life ends.

Well, a better way to explain it would just be to send you here (http://eom.byu.edu/index.php/Degrees_of_Glory).

*edit* just found this interesting diagram on Wikipedia, lol.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/eb/The_Plan_of_Salvation.jpg/800px-The_Plan_of_Salvation.jpg)
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: fappenhosen on March 15, 2014, 01:34:32 AM
Wait. If you go back to earth then its not a final judgement. Right?
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Ghost of V on March 15, 2014, 01:37:30 AM
Wait. If you go back to earth then its not a final judgement. Right?

I don't believe so.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: fappenhosen on March 15, 2014, 01:57:32 AM
Kind of sucks that you don't get to go into the VIP heaven if you haven't heard of Jesus. Sounds like a shitty sweet 16 party.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Rushy on March 15, 2014, 01:58:53 AM
Final Judgement sounds like a boss fight.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: fappenhosen on March 15, 2014, 02:01:19 AM
I hope its a good boss. Not like the boss at the end of Borderlands.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Ghost of V on March 15, 2014, 04:36:49 AM
You'll get into Heaven eventually. You just have to be reeducated and try again, I guess...

Of course, would probably be better if you talked to a real Mormon.

Final Boss would be YHWH from thr Shin Megami Tensei series.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: beardo on March 15, 2014, 08:13:03 AM
Where is Yaakov anyway?
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: jroa on March 15, 2014, 08:39:12 AM
He is counting his gold. 
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: beardo on March 15, 2014, 08:54:53 AM
Damn.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: jroa on March 15, 2014, 09:57:53 AM
One. 
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Yaakov ben Avraham on March 16, 2014, 02:08:10 AM
Well, after counting my gold, I have $4.25 to my name until I get paid my weekly stipend by my financial advisor on Monday. Beardo, in the mid to late XIX Century, such beliefs were quite common. However, so far as I know, there is no ethnic or linguistic relationship between the Cherokee people or language & the Hebrew/Jewish people or Hebrew language, despite claims to the contrary. Greetings, all. Sorry to disappear like that. Back now.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Rushy on March 16, 2014, 03:50:06 AM
counting my gold

You're such a Jew.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Saddam Hussein on March 16, 2014, 04:16:51 AM
Oh no, he's back.
Title: Re: Mormonism & The Book of Mormon
Post by: Yaakov ben Avraham on March 16, 2014, 05:11:55 AM
Irush, it was JROA that made reference to me counting my gold. If you have issues w/ that, I suggest you take them up w/ him. :) Sadaam, quit acting all butt-hurt. You'd think I'd beaten & tortured you or something.