441

Flat Earth Community / Re: Can Globe believers prove Earth has curvature by their own Curvature Charts?

« on: November 08, 2018, 12:57:40 AM »

Yes, when I go to sea all our charts are based upon the earth being a globe.  We can travel halfway around the earth with no street signs or direction posts anywhere and arrive at our destination each and every time.  When I'm on land then I use flat earth charts.  I don't get lost there either, but I can usually follow road and street signs.

442

Flat Earth Theory / Re: The Horizon is Always at Eye Level

« on: November 07, 2018, 05:08:02 AM »

I saw a small misquote:  "water always flows downhill".  The correct quote should be:  "water flows toward the center of gravity". 

443

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Math Evidence (calcs and data) corroborating turning torso and radius 6371km

« on: November 07, 2018, 03:11:08 AM »

The answers to a lot of questions about the global earth can be found in the the publication called "The American Practical Navigator".  It's available on line for free.  Most of the theory of the global earth can be found there, but you will have to be prepared to spend some time reading and understanding the theory and information contained in this publication.  This publication can be found on any American Flagged ship as it is required to be on board at all times.  You really can't argue too much with the contents as a ship conducts an 'experiment' each time it leaves the dock and sails from point A to point B.  The part that says 'Practical' means exactly what it says. You take the theory and information found in this publication and it just plain works.  Is everything down to a gnat's ass?  No.  King Neptune is a harsh task master and will kill you if you don't pay attention and know what to do when things get ugly.  The American Practical Navigator is required reading for any watch officer because the safety of the ship and crew depends on the theory and practice of the information in this publication.  Why would it be interesting to people on this site?  Because the theory of the global earth is explained fairly well and there is no BS.  Is the theory and information verifiable in theory and practice?  Yes, ships come and go daily and navigate using the theories and practice contained in this publication.  It wasn't unusual for me to have the pages open and on my desk often while at sea.  How can you really dispute anything that works in theory and practice?

444

Flat Earth Projects / Re: Wiki - Moon

« on: November 06, 2018, 04:32:00 PM »

I see you had no problem finding an amateur radio operator that said he couldn't communicate via the moon because he deemed it to be impossible.  Maybe you actually accepted the veracity of that YouTube video.  My core question remains; what kind of experiments would you find acceptable for measuring the distance to the moon?  Any measurements made would obviously depend on a fixed location on the earth and the current position of the moon in it's orbit.  The zenith points of the moon based upon the global earth paradigm are well known and used by nautical navigators all the time.  I am assuming that you deem all those figures as fake.  Is there any tables of the moon's position that you would certify as valid?  Unless there is a agreed upon moon's zenith position at a known time any distance measurement made could automatically be disputed.  All I'm trying to do is define all the possible variables in advance to mitigate misunderstandings.  If this data doesn't exist and you can't agree upon anything please let me know and I will understand.           

445

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Meteorites and the dome

« on: November 05, 2018, 08:02:53 PM »

When I was a lot younger I actually saw a meteorite, or maybe a piece of the dome, fly across the sky and hit the earth very close to where I was standing.  The meteorite hit the ground close enough to me that I actually saw it hit and bounce back up into the air a short distance.  We all ran over and saw what looked like a large, red hot, rock about 12 inches in diameter.  If it was a part of the dome it didn't look very transparent to me at the time.  But again, that was a long time ago and my memory could have become 'clouded' as well.

446

Flat Earth Projects / Re: Wiki - Moon

« on: November 05, 2018, 07:56:09 PM »

The flat earth wiki states that the moon is about 3000 miles above the surface of the earth.  The diagram on the wiki seems to indicate that the center of the moon's orbit is the North Pole.  I can't find any 'official' radius of orbit.  A rough estimate could be made from the diagram, but there doesn't seem to be any kind of scale on the 'map'.  My rough estimate would be about half the radius of the flat earth.  The 'official' figure (from the flat earth web site) I get for the radius is 12,250 miles.  No figure on the speed of light could be found.  All my research is based solely on what I could find on the flat earth wiki.  I am assuming that the flat earth consensus supports what data I could glean from the wiki and the website in general.  That's my starting point.   Would the Zetetic methods support any kind of electronic measurements other than using pictures that can be altered to bias the results?  What kind of authentication methods could be employed so everyone could agree on the results of these measurements? 

447

Flat Earth Projects / Re: Wiki - Moon

« on: November 05, 2018, 06:39:38 PM »

Is there any agreement that the distance from the earth to moon can be measured electronically with a reasonable amount of accuracy?  Do the FET proponents believe that this technology is fake, or can the distance to the moon really, really be measured in a couple of different ways?  Leave aside the issue of whether the moon is spherical.  Let the issue of distance alone be the question Du Jour. Of course the next question would be what would be an acceptable authority for that measurement?  What kind of equipment would be acceptable?  Is the standard speed of light an agreed upon figure?  Of course maybe all these questions can't really be answered in a reasonable way because everyone can have a different response so any proposed answer will be highly disputed and deemed to be fake or fabricated.  Maybe it's all about the controversy rather than the 'facts'.   

448

Flat Earth Community / Re: Now days, it is VERY rational to believe Earth is not a Ball

« on: November 05, 2018, 04:05:40 PM »

Using pictures to show a globe earth are very difficult because the effects are on the edge of perception.  You have to do accurate calculations and apply them correctly and even then the desired effects will usually be less than the other variables that you can't control.  Do a simple thought experiment.  Take an average sized swimming pool.  As accurately as you can measure it's depth.  Now pour in a glass of water.  You know absolutely for sure that the depth of that pool has just increased, but do you expect to be able to measure it?  It is rational for a landlubber to believe that the earth is flat.  Experiencing the effects of the globe are usually just indirectly felt and even the direct effects can usually be difficult to rationalize and could be interpreted to mean you are really on a flat earth because that is your core belief.  If you take a course in celestial navigation and then actually use that knowledge to correctly get from point A to point B at sea your belief system can slowly be altered.  Today the art of celestial navigation is in decline because GPS navigation is so good, accurate, and easy to use.  The sun, moon, planets, and stars along with an accurate clock can be used to accurately determine your position on the earth, as long as your base assumption is that the earth is a globe.  These assertions can still be demonstrated today.  The bottom line is that for a landlubber to believe in a flat earth is totally rational.  For a seaman, the global earth is essential. 

449

Flat Earth Investigations / Re: Re: Help Me debunk this stupid video

« on: November 04, 2018, 04:55:54 AM »

No reason the debunk any of these videos.  After all, on this very site, in the FAQ section,  there is a statement that pictures and videos can't really be trusted.  That goes both ways.  Any video for or against the FET or RET models could be a fraud.  Could there be some kind of validation standard for all videos that is acceptable to both sides?  Maybe some videos are made in studios and are intentionally made to look like they are faked as a diversionary tactic for some unknown reason while the real ones are unreleased.  After all NASA has a huge budget and they know that they may have enemies.   

450

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Amateur radio shows the earth is round

« on: October 30, 2018, 05:15:34 PM »

In the Merchant Marines we had a moto   "Acta Non Verba".   Catch you later. 

451

Flat Earth Theory / Re: What is actually the definition of this "zetetic method" Flat-Earthers use?

« on: October 29, 2018, 04:56:30 PM »

The problem is you can learn more & more about less & less until you understand everything about nothing, or you can learn less & less about more & more until you understand  nothing about everything.  The caveman could understand just about everything that was needed to know about the club that was used to obtain supper for him & his family.  These days people understand a lower & lower percentage of the technology of the everyday things in your life. There's nothing wrong having a healthy degree of skepticism, but mostly you just have to go with the opinions of the specialists who do a particular thing day in and day out.  To me it's almost like slavery, because I've always tried to 'know everything'.  These days I just know that I can't.  If you really want to dig into it, there are some reasonably priced MEMS accelerometers out there that you can buy that will allow you to measure the rotation of the earth.  Sure, the actual reading will be hidden in some noise, but after some filtering will be reasonably accurate.  Can you trust it?  You won't be able to see the actual insides of the chip.  You won't be able to understand a lot of the technology in it's construction.  You might not understand a lot of the math behind the filtering algorithm.  But does all this mean that the results are wrong?  There's nothing at all wrong with using some simple 'duct tape' and 'bees wax' tests where you can see and understand most everything.  I've certainly used that approach myself countless times for certain things, but you also have to believe in the serious limitations they impose as well.

452

Flat Earth Investigations / Re: Distance to the Moon?

« on: October 28, 2018, 07:32:59 PM »

At the speed of light and with a distance to the moon of about 238855 miles you would expect a radio signal to return in about 2.5 seconds.  You don't really need a pulse, just a regular radio and an antenna with plenty of gain.  It doesn't have to be mounted on a big tower, you just have to point it at the moon.  If the moon is only 3000 miles away then the delay will only be about 30 milliseconds.  You would be able to hear with your own ears the difference in those two times and you would know for sure.

453

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Amateur radio shows the earth is round

« on: October 28, 2018, 07:20:49 PM »

It sounds like you have the longitudinal wave technology down pat.  Again, make use of that technology.  Design some microwave equipment, but don't try to sell it in the US.  As you said, only the military is allowed to use it.  Instead go to China, or better yet meet a Chinese agent in Thailand.  Don't let them steal your technology but get them to manufacture the equipment in Vietnam.  Then those items can be sold in places like Sim Lim Tower in Singapore.  I can then get a new longitudinal wave radio made by Baofeng in a shop there.  A few years ago I bought some radio equipment there that I still have. I just don't think I can reveal what it was.  Don't get left out in the cold.  Think like an international entrepreneur and put your ideas in motion.  Don't let the US government tell you what you can and can't do.  The power is in your hands and the time is wasting away.

454

Flat Earth Investigations / Re: Distance to the Moon?

« on: October 28, 2018, 03:45:29 PM »

Using any reflectors on the moon would presume that there was actually a mission to the moon that has been deemed 'fake' by many on this site.  You don't actually have to use those reflectors at all.  Radio waves can be bounced off the moon.  Amateur radio operators have been using the moon as a reflector for a long time.  It's a straight forward process to send a pulse to the moon, then measure the time it takes to come back.  Since the speed of radio waves is well known, you can calculate the distance. Radars can also measure the range to the moon as well.   

455

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Amateur radio shows the earth is round

« on: October 28, 2018, 03:37:00 PM »

Well, it seems that lot's of folks have knowledge of things that could help mankind advance if only the government would let them.  Funny, I worked on navy ships for several years, and even held a secret clearance, but never ran across any of the kind of equipment you say exists.  Maybe I should just state that 'I can neither confirm nor deny that longitudinal wave equipment exists'.  I don't want to spill the beans.  Since the DOE is the only ones that can make use of longitudinal wave equipment, maybe the FET folks should start a political movement to get that changed.  You can count me out of that effort, however, I don't want to see a bunch of black SUV's with 10 antennas on the roof spooking around my neighborhood.

456

Science & Alternative Science / Re: The beliefs on this board...

« on: October 28, 2018, 03:07:03 PM »

See Tom Campbell's videos on the double slit experiment.  That's how I got started with his stuff in the first place.  His arguments are compelling.  It certainly appears that mankind can't have simultaneous knowledge about certain things because the software of the virtual world we exist in wasn't written that way.  I don't know whether to be afraid or comforted.  It seems that we all have free will, but everything is probabilistic and it's impossible to know 100% about anything.  I find the possibility of a virtual reality very interesting.  I've never been much of a video game player because it was addicting to me.  I started playing video games once and didn't do some important things that had to be done on time.  After learning my lesson I put the games away and never went back.  My only thoughts now are time spans.  Allegedly, mankind has existed for millions of years and has had a natural progression toward better and better things over that time.  If we are in a virtual reality the time perception of whose video game we are in must be a lot shorter, or they just can exist for an infinite amount to time.  One of the first video games out there was Kingdom.  I played that on one of the first commercial personal computers out there.  You set up all the variable about your 'Kingdom'.  Planted so many acres of corn, dug so many wells, spent some of your gold for weapons, and took some of your concubines out of the field and gave them certain other duties.  After you had all your variables set up the game would generate a random number and that would effect the outcome of your kingdom.  I remember something like 'the Huns would attack, a herd of locusts would eat half your field crop, wells would go dry, concubines would run off, ect.  You then had to analyze the new situation and reallocate all your resources.  Isn't that about what's happening on a continuous basis in the real world? 

457

Science & Alternative Science / Re: Do you trust your senses?

« on: October 28, 2018, 02:22:50 PM »

Yes, you have hit the nail on the head, so to speak.  If you ever played football and took a big hit you tend to 'see stars' and your hear 'ringing' in your ears.  That is exactly the 'woozie' feeling that I get much of the time.  The sounds in my ears clearly aren't real and my balance even on a flat earth is compromised.  I can't trust that I am level and have some difficulty standing up straight in a completely dark room.  Fortunately,  in my last years before retirement, I was at sea.  In 15 meter seas, no one on the ship could stand up straight.  See Psalm 107:23-30. 

458

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Amateur radio shows the earth is round

« on: October 28, 2018, 02:11:38 PM »

The possible problem with the UNKNOWN ether wind was solved by Michelson & Morley long ago, or so I thought.  Why would you ever mention anything about longitudinal e/m waves to anyone?  If the phenomenon exists then I'm sure that you can develop some radio equipment that uses it.  Long, long ago I borrowed money from my parents and started an electronics business.  Business was good and I paid my parents back and continued to operate that business for 23 years until I sold out to a much larger corporation.  I had the courage of my convictions and used my knowledge of radios to my advantage in business.  You can do the same with your knowledge of longitudinal e/m waves.  Clearly the majority don't believe that they exist.  That's a HUGE advantage in business.  You could develop equipment and get some patents.  Now is the time to have the courage of YOUR convictions.  Get out there and take advantage of what you know.  Don't let the ignorance of others hold you back.

459

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Amateur radio shows the earth is round

« on: October 28, 2018, 01:16:53 PM »

After reading the last post and all the technical literature, the FET folks should be well educated in the theory of microwave on the flat earth.  After working with that kind of equipment for 50 years I still believe that microwaves are limited by the curvature of the earth.  So do designers and manufacturers of equipment.   If the earth were flat then a microwave communications company could be started, equipment bought, bids won, and links set up and would be at a HUGE advantage over the existing old companies that insist that the earth is a sphere.   By all means, take that superior knowledge about the real form of the earth, and go out and make your fortune using that knowledge.  That is the dream of many.  Please, make it a reality. 

460

Flat Earth Community / Re: RE believers - why are you here?

« on: October 28, 2018, 05:33:29 AM »

In the case of microwave links, that are said to be limited by the curvature of the earth, you can have many radio amateurs (like I am) that will just try a link for the fun of it.  There isn't any money involved.  Many work for large companies in their technical department.  Many are owners of small businesses (like I used to be) and would gladly try something if they thought some money could be made.  There were a lot of people who thought that the V-8 engine wasn't a very practical idea until they were 'schooled' by Henry Ford.  Look at the controversy between AC and DC electricity.  DC was the accepted model and had Edison behind it.  Tesla thought that AC had outstanding advantages.  Guess who won over the long haul?  I can personally attest that even a small businessman can get the attention of a large corporation if he has a viable idea and can produce a working prototype.  Again, if the flat earth theory is viable, you don't really need a whole bunch of proof or scientific evidence.  What you need is a working prototype.  Turn it over to a large corporation and let them test it.  Of course you will have to protect yourself from them if they decide to steal your idea, but then, who can steal the idea that the earth is actually flat?