[juner]

Prove that it's not real...

Nice, asking to prove a negative.

Also, Admins who keep deleting comments, Why do you keep doing that?

No one is deleting comments. Sometimes off-topic comments will be split from a thread and moved to another forum/topic. I don't see any recent comments in this thread being split or moved.

[xenotolerance]

Prove that it's not real...

Nice, asking to prove a negative.

Put another way, he's saying prove that the footage and eyewitness accounts are fake. It's not unfalsifiable

[ryjay707]

Prove that it's not real...

Nice, asking to prove a negative.

Yet, any proof that people do post of them being there, or them watching the feed while being there is immediately shunned and labeled as fake. It's just an infinite circle of "Prove it" -posts proof- "I wasn't there so it's not true."

Also, Admins who keep deleting comments, Why do you keep doing that?

No one is deleting comments. Sometimes off-topic comments will be split from a thread and moved to another forum/topic. I don't see any recent comments in this thread being split or moved.

There was a string of comments between Pete and I that were about his non-opinion and us being "Zealous people" for being able to make a snappy decision about what really happened while we were watching it happen first hand. it was right at the end of page 2, now there's a page 3, and those comments between Pete and I are gone.

[NorseMythology]

Prove that it's not real...

Nice, asking to prove a negative.

Also, Admins who keep deleting comments, Why do you keep doing that?

No one is deleting comments. Sometimes off-topic comments will be split from a thread and moved to another forum/topic. I don't see any recent comments in this thread being split or moved.

Yesterday this thread was 2 pages long when I responded, today I looked through the thread 5 times looking for my post and it wasn't there. About an hour ago I noticed the first response on page 2 was from Pete today, now I look and it is different and my post magically reappeared.

I have no idea what is going on, just letting you know what I am experiencing (I am on my mobile, but I havent seen this on other forums on my mobile).

Regards

[juner]

There was a string of comments between Pete and I that were about his non-opinion and us being "Zealous people" for being able to make a snappy decision about what really happened while we were watching it happen first hand. it was right at the end of page 2, now there's a page 3, and those comments between Pete and I are gone.

Users can edit/remove their own posts. It wasn't moderation/admin. I see your "zealous" posts/quotes in this thread.

[Rushy]

Prove that it's not real...

Nice, asking to prove a negative.

Put another way, he's saying prove that the footage and eyewitness accounts are fake. It's not unfalsifiable

The only thing I asked you to prove is that there is in fact a roadster in orbit. Instead of saying "I can't" you'd rather post incorrectly about fallacies. I think it's interesting that rather than admitting you can't prove your own claim, you'd prefer that I prove the car is not there. Like the other poster, let me point you to Russell's Teapot: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russell%27s_teapot

[ryjay707]

Prove that it's not real...

Nice, asking to prove a negative.

Put another way, he's saying prove that the footage and eyewitness accounts are fake. It's not unfalsifiable

The only thing I asked you to prove is that there is in fact a roadster in orbit. Instead of saying "I can't" you'd rather post incorrectly about fallacies.

Many people watched it get put there Rushy, that's the proof. Although to you, that's not enough proof that people watched and recorded it get put there. Because as we said, so even though people have shown proof, your mindset is that of "If I didn't see it, It's not true". So, how even when we can show you proof (like the entire launch of the rocket, to where the car is in space) when all you'll do is say it's fake because you weren't there and we don't have any images proving that it's there right now?

There was a string of comments between Pete and I that were about his non-opinion and us being "Zealous people" for being able to make a snappy decision about what really happened while we were watching it happen first hand. it was right at the end of page 2, now there's a page 3, and those comments between Pete and I are gone.

Users can edit/remove their own posts. It wasn't moderation/admin. I see your "zealous" posts/quotes in this thread.

I do not yet have an opinion strong enough to bring to the table. That's why I haven't brought one. Unlike some of the more zealous individuals here, I don't make snap decisions about things like this.

ones like this, Junker, Pete and I had a few posts after this one on page 2 that  You see my Zealous Posts/Quotes that were the recent ones of me asking him for a response after the original ones are gone. There were multiple ones after the last post of mine on page 2. I don't know if Pete deleted his posts, but I sure didn't and they're no longer there.

It was something close to Pete quoted one of the few things at the end of page 2 that I posted. Then said something about how i misunderstood it.

I posted a thing quoting it saying it wasn't quite misunderstood as it was mis-wrote, and allaround and I were still waiting to hear what reasoning he had to not believe that we saw what we saw.

Pete posted he had no opinions on it because he isn't a Zealous person enough to make snappy decisions that weren't well thought through.

I posted that I don't understand how being there and confirming with my own eyes using multiple devices to watch the machine be thrown further and further into space is snappy and not well thought through.

he posted something about he didn't have an opinion and we just think he did.

I asked him what his opinion was then. ------ a few hours later I"m back and this entire discussion in this thread is gone.

[xenotolerance]

Like I said, the rocket launch is not a teapot, because it is falsifiable. I am encouraging you to share your reasoning and falsification, so to speak.

A careful reader may have noticed my evaluation is already in the thread, maybe look again

[NorseMythology]

Prove that it's not real...

Nice, asking to prove a negative.

Put another way, he's saying prove that the footage and eyewitness accounts are fake. It's not unfalsifiable

The only thing I asked you to prove is that there is in fact a roadster in orbit. Instead of saying "I can't" you'd rather post incorrectly about fallacies.

Many people watched it get put there Rushy, that's the proof. Although to you, that's not enough proof that people watched and recorded it get put there. Because as we said, Even though people have shown proof, Your mindset is that of "If I didn't see it, It's not true"

There was a string of comments between Pete and I that were about his non-opinion and us being "Zealous people" for being able to make a snappy decision about what really happened while we were watching it happen first hand. it was right at the end of page 2, now there's a page 3, and those comments between Pete and I are gone.

Users can edit/remove their own posts. It wasn't moderation/admin. I see your "zealous" posts/quotes in this thread.

I do not yet have an opinion strong enough to bring to the table. That's why I haven't brought one. Unlike some of the more zealous individuals here, I don't make snap decisions about things like this.

ones like this, Junker, Pete and I had 2-3 posts after this one on page 2 that  You see my Zealous Posts/Quotes that were the recent ones of me asking him for a response after the original ones are gone. There were multiple ones after the last post of mine on page 2. I don't know if Pete deleted his posts, but I sure didn't and they're no longer there.

Same here. I thought I was going nuts for a minute.

[xenotolerance]

Also, Rushy has a post at the top of page 3 quoting me referencing war of the worlds, but my post along those lines is now missing. Like, clicking the quote link just reloads the page

I can reach the post through my profile, following its permalink takes me to the top of page 3, post not seen

[ryjay707]

Also, Rushy has a post at the top of page 3 quoting me referencing war of the worlds, but my post along those lines is now missing. Like, clicking the quote link just reloads the page

I know I'm not deleting my comments, so Junky either there's a problem on the servers end with the comments being deleted for no reason. Or there's an admin/mod doing it.

[juner]

Also, Rushy has a post at the top of page 3 quoting me referencing war of the worlds, but my post along those lines is now missing. Like, clicking the quote link just reloads the page

I don't see any trace of that one. There was a database issue this morning, I assume it could be related to that. Won't know for sure until Parsifal makes a post about it and we know the impact, but I can confirm it wasn't a mod/admin split/move/delete because those are all logged.

[ryjay707]

Back on topic though Rushy, ---- If we have proof and you just dismiss it as fake no matter what because you weren't there or didn't see it. How can we who were there and did see it prove to you that it happened?  No matter what you're going to say it's not true because you didn't see it so, how can we prove it to you?

[Pete Svarrior]

And Pete, I'm still waiting to hear why you say you have no opinion, yet dismiss the people who claim they were actually there and tell them that their decision is Zealous and a snappy decision.

I do not dismiss them. I've done anything but that. I said (to paraphrase) "You saw what you saw, and that's fine by me. We might disagree, but there's nothing wrong with disagreeing." You are extremely intent on claiming that I said things I didn't say, and you simply refuse to accept any attempts at clarification. If you're not interested in what I'm actually saying, why ask? Why not just debate your strawman in the comfort and privacy of your own bedroom?

[Curious Squirrel]

Also, Rushy has a post at the top of page 3 quoting me referencing war of the worlds, but my post along those lines is now missing. Like, clicking the quote link just reloads the page

I don't see any trace of that one. There was a database issue this morning, I assume it could be related to that. Won't know for sure until Parsifal makes a post about it and we know the impact, but I can confirm it wasn't a mod/admin split/move/delete because those are all logged.

Curiously, most of these 'vanished' posts can be seen in the topic summary when making a post. Maybe that'll be helpful to sorting things out.

Prove that it's not real...

Nice, asking to prove a negative.

Put another way, he's saying prove that the footage and eyewitness accounts are fake. It's not unfalsifiable

The only thing I asked you to prove is that there is in fact a roadster in orbit. Instead of saying "I can't" you'd rather post incorrectly about fallacies. I think it's interesting that rather than admitting you can't prove your own claim, you'd prefer that I prove the car is not there. Like the other poster, let me point you to Russell's Teapot: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russell%27s_teapot

Sure, there's a live feed from the roadster about right now(? Might no longer be up, but here is some archived footage, clipped right before a beautiful view of the Earth is shown) as well as video from many angles of the object that brought it up there taking off, and pieces of it returning. Your turn. Care to show the 'obvious fakery' in this video? Or do I need to find some more of the videos of the launch?

[ryjay707]

And Pete, I'm still waiting to hear why you say you have no opinion, yet dismiss the people who claim they were actually there and tell them that their decision is Zealous and a snappy decision.

I do not dismiss them. I've done anything but that. I said (to paraphrase) "You saw what you saw, and that's fine by me. We might disagree, but there's nothing wrong with disagreeing." You are extremely intent on claiming that I said things I didn't say, and you simply refuse to accept any attempts at clarification. If you're not interested in what I'm actually saying, why ask? Why not just debate your strawman in the comfort and privacy of your own bedroom?

You are dismissing it though. "If your incomplete account is all you need, I choose to disagree with your methodology."  And you somehow disagree with what we saw. Yet you haven't explained why our accounts of what happened were incomplete, you haven't explained why you disagree with our methodology, and you haven't explained on how you disagree with a conclusion that some people who witnessed first hand have come up with claiming it's incomplete. When you yourself did not see it. You apparently haven't even made an opinion on what you saw during a live feed (or replay of a live feed ---- even though you said in that one post that you can't believe everything you see on tv---or internet --- which is an opinion).

But long story short, you're trying to say that it's just our opinion is that they launched the rocket with a car in it into outer space. Meanwhile, it's not an opinion, it's a fact that was observed by many people. --- Everything you have been saying to us, has been you dismissing what we say because it's not factual enough for you since you weren't there.

[Pete Svarrior]

You are dismissing it though.

Okay, well, if you're not willing to accept that I probably know my own intentions better than you do, I sincerely doubt that this conversation is going to take us anywhere at all.

[ryjay707]

You are dismissing it though.

Okay, well, if you're not willing to accept that I probably know my own intentions better than you do, I sincerely doubt that this conversation is going to take us anywhere at all.

And there you go ignoring the other bits, If you know your own intentions then explain how what we saw was an incomplete account in your eyes. Explain how you disagree with what we saw.

[NorseMythology]

And Pete, I'm still waiting to hear why you say you have no opinion, yet dismiss the people who claim they were actually there and tell them that their decision is Zealous and a snappy decision.

I do not dismiss them. I've done anything but that. I said (to paraphrase) "You saw what you saw, and that's fine by me. We might disagree, but there's nothing wrong with disagreeing." You are extremely intent on claiming that I said things I didn't say, and you simply refuse to accept any attempts at clarification. If you're not interested in what I'm actually saying, why ask? Why not just debate your strawman in the comfort and privacy of your own bedroom?

"To be clear, the intention of that post was not to assert that it's false (though you can guess my thoughts on the matter)."

It seems as though you are insinuating that you think it is false but refuse to actually say it because you cannot justify it. Lets face it, you know it was real but your preconceived belief procludes you from admitting it. The only thing you can do is compartmentalize it so you don't have to address it.

As much as your programming wants you to dismiss it, I believe deep down you know it to be true.

Am I wrong?

I have had my entire paradigm wrecked many times, I know it isn't pleasant, it can take a long time to try to piece things back together in another way that makes sense, but we have to be honest with ourself.

I actually find it way more exciting just taking in information and letting the pieces fall where they may.

[Mediator]

I guess my question would be (by the way hi, first time poster!):

Why would Elon Musk spend all this time, effort and money on the line to do something fake? He has a business to run, profits to make, Space X cost a large fortune to fund, build and finally generate results. He also has plans to take it further and make it s profitable enterprise. I can’t see why he would possibly agree to do this, and then fake it. I mean, what would be the point? He’s a business man, a smart one. There’s just no reason why he would agree to build a rocket and pretend it works, fake the images, and pretend to release a car into space. What would he possibly gain from doing that?

I can see exactly what he’d lose, along with the money and effort of setting the whole thing up, if he was ever proven to be a fraud he would destroy his name, business and everything else. You wouldn’t risk that for... well that’s my block. He doesn’t need money, he’s a private business so he doesn’t need the government or NASA. He did this himself.

Help me out here.

Either: It was real, and it was a huge event showing a private organisation launching a rocket (and car) into space. Promoting his achievements, business and name.

Or: It was fake. Pointless. Could destroy everything for him should he ever be discovered.

That’s my question.