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Messages - Tom Bishop

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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: The NBA should be shut down
« on: May 03, 2014, 04:02:51 PM »
From the Daily Mail article above:

She wouldn't allow Sterling to take meetings with certain people, Stiviano told Walters, which angered his business peers.

She said that executives and board members of the Clippers who were jealous of the free reign she had when it came to the team would call Sterling and tell him that Stiviano had brought people 'who look a certain way' to Clippers games when he wasn't there.

But not just black people, Stiviano claimed, but people 'that didn't give me a good look,' like 'gangsters,' 'thugs,' 'bad women.'

It makes sense to me. His business partners perceived her as being his mistress/girlfriend when he brought her to games. The comments he received are as expected. If your girlfriend starts taking other guys to parties when you are absent, to have a good time, outside observers might have some not so nice comments to say, too.

Sterling was being attacked by racist and classist remarks, and his options were either to fight the world and the opinions of his business partners, or simply have his girlfriend/mistress to cease her actions and end all controversy.

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: The NBA should be shut down
« on: May 03, 2014, 03:39:13 PM »
Does anyone else find it amusingly hypocritical that a guy who made such racist remarks has a mixed race girlfriend?

It doesn't seem very hypocritical if you listen to the actual tapes to get his unfiltered views and opinion on the subject.

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: The NBA should be shut down
« on: May 03, 2014, 03:27:37 PM »
No they do not select a race because they are fast and tall.  They select fast and tall people, many of them are black.  If there was a dearth of fast and tall chinese women, guess what the league would be constituted with?

But the fact is that there are not a lot of tall Chinese women. The NBA is discriminating against them by not recruiting them to play on their teams because of their physical characteristics. This is diametrically opposed to their recent lengthy statements that the NBA is an inclusive association and does not tolerate discrimination in any manner.

Quote from: Gary
Businesses exist to make profit.  If you're the NBA, employing Chinese women to play basketball is bad for business.

That doesn't make discrimination right.

Quote from: Rama
Meh, Donald Sterling is a dick.  Social stigmatization is what he deserves.  Not to mention he is a marketing nightmare.

Donald Sterling was unfairly stigmatized. If you listen to the entire tape he explains his reasoning for not wanting her associate with black people in public, with her slutty poses around them, because he was receiving numerous calls and hate mail from racists who were upset about it.

If you were traveling abroad are sending your daughter to an all-Indian school, as the only Caucasian girl there, you might get a lot of comments and abuse. Is it racist to get fed up with it and take her out of that Indian school?

Donald Sterling explains in the tape that he is just an old man, and does not want to fight the world. He wants to do the simplest thing and have her avoid controversy. I encourage you to find and listen to the full tape. He denies numerous times that his decision has anything to do with hate of black people, but it is simply what must be done because of the society of which we live.

Philosophy, Religion & Society / The NBA should be shut down
« on: May 03, 2014, 05:14:15 AM »
Who is the NBA to condemn Donald Sterling for his opinions on people with certain physical characteristics, when the association is itself guilty of discriminating against people for their physical characteristics?

Why isn't the NBA recruiting 5 foot tall Chinese men to play on their teams? Where are all of the Korean women? They are selecting a certain race and gender because they are fast and tall.

The entire thing should be shuttered. The recent actions and announcements from the board that the NBA is an inclusive organization and vehemently against discrimination is a load of BS.

Flat Earth Projects / Re: Tom Bishop out sick
« on: May 02, 2014, 04:04:51 AM »
I'm back.

Flat Earth Projects / Tom Bishop out sick
« on: March 25, 2014, 05:01:15 AM »
Some may have noticed my recent absence. I'm not going to be posting too much for the next month.

Flat Earth Projects / Re: News Release
« on: February 28, 2014, 04:54:09 AM »
I apologize for being away. I've been having some health issues this month and haven't been able to concentrate on much. The press release looks good. I think it needs something though. An open challenge to prove us wrong, perhaps. Something provocative, rather than informational.

Flat Earth Projects / Re: Constructing a constitution
« on: February 06, 2014, 05:05:29 PM »
I noticed a flaw in my suggestion. Under what I suggested above the council could not readily tell which names are suspicious or not. Obviously "AxeMan" with a one week old account and few serious posts in the upper forums could be disqualified as an obvious sham, but what about a more serious contributor who has been around for a while and has seen to get himself elected with phony voting accounts.

I'm a bit worried that this would carry an impression of us being the other FES. It feels extremely similar to, for example, the Oxford Brookes University. Y'know, that second university in Oxford that everyone is talking about... not. They're not even a bad university, but the name acts as a detractor and provides opportunity for mockery.

But as it stands right now we are already the "other" Oxford. Rather than being an unrelated Oxford startup school I would prefer to be the Oxford Graduate School, the place of higher studies for Oxford University.
Honestly, I'd like to see that too, but I doubt that will ever happen.  Unless and until FE'ers can start supporting their FE "models" with math that matches real world observations, then your "Graduate School" will be no better than FES grade school.

Why do you keep saying this? If you've been paying attention for the last seven years, the community often does to provide some sort of math for its models. I've seen math used to compute Special Relativity for acceleration problems, I've seen math used to compute how hot the a small and near sun would be to warm the earth, and I've seen math in Earth Not a Globe to compute convexity. Math has been provided for calculating the thickness of the earth under a "gravity" model, as well as math to predict the recurrence of a lunar eclipse.

Efforts need to be made to search through the old threads and categorize this in the Wiki, but it cannot be said that no math is ever performed.

Flat Earth Projects / Re: Constructing a constitution
« on: February 06, 2014, 10:11:57 AM »
I admit that I don't have any good answers for the constitution.

I think a main sticking point for me was figuring out a way the selection of new candidates can be fair to the public, for the council, and for the integrity of the forum.

I came up with an idea that we could institute a form of checks and balances on this matter. We allow the public forum to vote and elect people they want to see to run along side the council members. The council can reserve veto power over suspicious names on the public selection. Finally, admins can act as watch dogs and reserve veto power over the council if they see impropriety in disqualifying applicants.

In this way things can be fair to all, and no party has too much power over the election process.

Flat Earth Theory / Re: Ask a Flat Earth Theorist Anything
« on: February 06, 2014, 09:48:29 AM »
Who is your favorite figure in Flat Earth history and why?

I'll let it go if there is a lack of support on the matter.

Flat Earth Projects / Re: News Release
« on: February 06, 2014, 09:25:21 AM »
To clarify on this thread; was I voted to write the press release, or simply approach the press? It had sounded as if a press release was in progress and I was simply tasked with mass emailing press agencies.

In any event, as there seems to be a delay with a press release formation, I will take the liberty to help with this task. First, what we need is a summary of what the article will be about.


1. Give a background of the society from its origins to get the reporters up to speed
2. Explain why we splintered off - dissension in the ranks!
3. Explain why this is a better flat earth society, that we contain leading Flat earth theorists
4. Explain that we have several projects in the works, an annotated Earth Not a Globe, an Encyclopedia Wiki, a video, new Zetetic ideas that revolutionize science, etc.
5. Welcome visitors to join us. Maybe a challenge to show us that we are wrong.

Secondly, the points need to be fleshed out, and those bullet points turned into paragraphs.

Flat Earth Projects / First PR Project for the Society
« on: February 06, 2014, 08:32:08 AM »
From the other forums, a number of ideas were brought up.

1. Create a video animation
2. Write an annotated edition of Earth Not a Globe
3. Improve the Wiki
4. Organize a Group Reddit AMA
5. Reach out to the press
6. Perform an experiment

Were there any other good ideas?

I see different kinds of pros and cons to each. While I would like to do them all, perhaps we as a group should decide what is MOST important, and should be focused on FIRST. Otherwise, if we try to do everything, delay and failure is imminent. When we decide on a direction to go threads should be created in the higher forums to gauge ideas from the community and help get things going.

The press thing, well, I sort of feel we need more substance to give the press than some information that a new forum was created because of technical issues and and lack of leadership. Maybe if we had a video, new wiki diagrams, annotated ENAG, or something, we could have something to show them. Also, if a name change is imminent, alerting the news right now would not be a good idea.

However, if it is felt that alerting the press should be our first and foremost goal, these feelings can be put aside.

I'm a bit worried that this would carry an impression of us being the other FES. It feels extremely similar to, for example, the Oxford Brookes University. Y'know, that second university in Oxford that everyone is talking about... not. They're not even a bad university, but the name acts as a detractor and provides opportunity for mockery.

But as it stands right now we are already the "other" Oxford. Rather than being an unrelated Oxford startup school I would prefer to be the Oxford Graduate School, the place of higher studies for Oxford University.

We may not have the keys to Oxford University, but we can have the keys to its Graduate School. The path we are on right now is to start an unrelated "Oxford University" and attempt some sort of competition for the name.

I believe we should compete, but it should not around which site is the "real" or "true" Flat Earth Society. That distracts from the movement. A different name separates us from the distraction.

My idea is to create something which compliments the .org site so that we may prosper. For example, I would like to start writing a first chapter to a new annotated edition of Earth Not a Globe. When the chapter is done we can host it on the site and make a post on the .org site to tell them about these things the academy has done, not act as a representative from a competitor and try to sway them to join our competing Flat Earth Society because we are better and Daniel is so bad, etc.

When reaching out to the press, I suspect that there would be more interest in hearing that the Flat Earth Society has created the Flat Earth Academy, the first academic organization to further FET and academic brain trust of Zetetic Science, rather than a story of how some people revolted and created a different Flat Earth Society because of some technical issues.

As I see it, the Flat Earth Academy of Sciences would still be part of the Flat Earth Society. It's a sister organization. We will present ourselves to the world as being part of the Flat Earth Society. This is simply our research branch.

The .org site is for the noobs, the academy is where people eventually migrate for higher level discussions and to organize projects.

I do not see any reason to compete with the other site, attempt dissension, or confusion. We are all part of the Flat Earth Society, whether we accept the .org leadership or not. I've been with the FES before Daniel even registered the .org site. I have no problem calling whatever name we choose for this site as being an organ of the Flat Earth Society.

Flat Earth Projects / Re: Name Change
« on: February 05, 2014, 04:44:04 PM »
Other ideas from the thread ranged from "The Independent Flat Earth Society", "The International Flat Earth Society," "The Flat Earth Academy", and "The Flat Earth Academy of Zetetic Sciences". There is also a suggestion for a "Universal Zetetic Society". I apologize if I missed anything.

While I like the idea of the Universal Zetetic Society, I tend to agree with one of the posters in the thread, who mentioned that the public would not instantly relate to the name. For that to work focus of the forum would need to switch from FET to general skepticism and empiricism. It implies that the forum is about a certain method of scientific inquiry, rather than anything to do with FET specifically. Not that it wouldn't work, however. I believe this was the focus of Rowbotham's original Universal Zetetic Society -- a place for free thinkers and original thought free of the chains of scientific dogma.

Science & Alternative Science / Bill Nye debates Ken Ham on Creationism
« on: February 05, 2014, 04:08:52 PM »
Article -
Video -

Did anyone catch this? Bill Nye debated the founder of the Creation Museum on Creationism.

Flat Earth Projects / Name Change
« on: February 01, 2014, 05:30:18 PM »
On the other board we were talking about a name change. What do we think about that?

Here was my contribution to the discussion:

Idea: The Flat Earth Academy of Sciences

A Think Tank dedicated to the advancement of earth science and the Zetetic Philosophy. As a sister organization to the Flat Earth Society the academy collects, organizes, and publishes scientific material pertaining to the movement.

Whereas the Flat Earth Society is a basic forum where newcomers go for basic discussion, the Flat Earth Academy of Sciences is where they go when they graduate. It is a place for higher level debate, and provides a venue for its members to publish research, organize projects, and speak with other Flat Earthers.

Gary, if you want more discussion about Flat Earth Theory, then I would suggest starting some threads. From the threads I've seen in the upper foura so far, people seem willing to engage in discussion. It is not that there are lack of people willing to talk to you.

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