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Technology & Information / Re: James Webb telescope launches!
« on: July 15, 2022, 05:45:01 AM »
Comparison of the same image from Hubble to JWST
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Technology & Information / Re: James Webb telescope launches!
« on: July 15, 2022, 05:00:52 AM »
Some more!
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Technology & Information / Re: James Webb telescope launches!
« on: July 11, 2022, 11:25:15 PM »
The first full-color image is finally here!! The photo represents an area in the sky the size of a grain of sand held out at arms length by someone on the ground and contains countless thousands of galaxies!!!
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Flat Earth Theory / Re: Moon landing hoax question
« on: May 27, 2022, 07:15:56 PM »
The true and factual history of moon missions is much more complex than is presented above.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_missions_to_the_Moon
Look at the chart of all moon missions, starting with Pioneer 0. It wasn't just a simple matter of who did what first. Both the US and the USSR experienced countless mission failures for every narrow success. There were different mission objectives, from orbiters to flybys, impactors and finally landers. The space race wasn't just one achievement, NASA didn't decide one day to put a man on the moon - it was the culmination of decades of rapid but incremental advancements in rocket science.
If space is a hoax, then does that mean every space professional is also in on the hoax? According to this source [1] "the global space sector employed around 1 million persons around the world in 2017. To give orders of magnitude, around 350 000 full-time employees are active in the United States, 200 000 in the Russian Federation and around 60 000 in Europe."
That is quite a lot of people who are in on the conspiracy. It is quite incredible that 1 million people are able to keep the existence of a super secret criminal organization completely and utterly hidden. Imagine the life of fantastic wealth and luxury that they could afford by collectively embezzling tens of billions of dollars a year. Don't conspiracy theorists every feel jealous that they are being left out?
[1] https://www.oecd-ilibrary.org/sites/c5996201-en/1/2/3/index.html?itemId=/content/publication/c5996201-en&mimeType=text/html&_csp_=ffe5a6bbc1382ae4f0ead9dd2da73ff4&itemIGO=oecd&itemContentType=book
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_missions_to_the_Moon
Look at the chart of all moon missions, starting with Pioneer 0. It wasn't just a simple matter of who did what first. Both the US and the USSR experienced countless mission failures for every narrow success. There were different mission objectives, from orbiters to flybys, impactors and finally landers. The space race wasn't just one achievement, NASA didn't decide one day to put a man on the moon - it was the culmination of decades of rapid but incremental advancements in rocket science.
If space is a hoax, then does that mean every space professional is also in on the hoax? According to this source [1] "the global space sector employed around 1 million persons around the world in 2017. To give orders of magnitude, around 350 000 full-time employees are active in the United States, 200 000 in the Russian Federation and around 60 000 in Europe."
That is quite a lot of people who are in on the conspiracy. It is quite incredible that 1 million people are able to keep the existence of a super secret criminal organization completely and utterly hidden. Imagine the life of fantastic wealth and luxury that they could afford by collectively embezzling tens of billions of dollars a year. Don't conspiracy theorists every feel jealous that they are being left out?
[1] https://www.oecd-ilibrary.org/sites/c5996201-en/1/2/3/index.html?itemId=/content/publication/c5996201-en&mimeType=text/html&_csp_=ffe5a6bbc1382ae4f0ead9dd2da73ff4&itemIGO=oecd&itemContentType=book
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Flat Earth Theory / Re: Question on the motives of The Space Travel Conspiracy
« on: April 30, 2022, 07:18:30 PM »What is the motive of Spacex?
What is the motive of the Japanese Space Agency, and India Space Agency?
When the Chinese decided to have a space program, did NASA go over there, explain the situation, and get them to go along with the hoax? For what motive? Or did they have a missile go splat against the dome, contact NASA and ask them what to say? I find the image of a meeting such as this where one side is revealing the earth is flat and securing the cooperation of someone grown up in RE world, even more fascinating when they come out of the meeting faking RE without missing a beat.
If one speculates about such a motive? Details and corroboration, or just speculation?
It must be really disappointing for the astronauts, aerospace engineers, and scientists who spend 10+ years training to work in this field only to be presented with a Powerpoint document at the very end telling you that your entire worldview is a lie, and the Earth is actually how it is described 2000 years ago by Levantine monks. Even more incredible that none of these people leak this information.
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Flat Earth Investigations / Re: Sydney to Santiago Flight path
« on: April 13, 2022, 02:13:56 AM »
Can I raise another interesting flight path? I want to raise two routes to the same destination: to Amundsen-Scott South Pole Base.
It is about an 8-hour flight from Christchurch, New Zealand to the South Pole. http://www.submm.caltech.edu/~cdd/yu_4th_grade/yu_4th_grade.html
Similarly, it is about an 8.5-hour flight from Punta Arenas, Chile to the South Pole. https://www.polar-quest.com/trips/antarctica/fly-to-the-south-pole-20212022
Represented on the Flat Earth is obviously impossible, as the South Pole is infinitely smeared across the circumference of the Earth.
On a globe it is simple enough.
It is about an 8-hour flight from Christchurch, New Zealand to the South Pole. http://www.submm.caltech.edu/~cdd/yu_4th_grade/yu_4th_grade.html
Similarly, it is about an 8.5-hour flight from Punta Arenas, Chile to the South Pole. https://www.polar-quest.com/trips/antarctica/fly-to-the-south-pole-20212022
Represented on the Flat Earth is obviously impossible, as the South Pole is infinitely smeared across the circumference of the Earth.
On a globe it is simple enough.
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Science & Alternative Science / Re: UFO's on a Flat Earth.
« on: April 08, 2022, 05:13:58 AM »
I don't think there is such thing as 'space' in flat earth, there are no 'other planets', there is not even a solar system as science understands it.
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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: FL GOP are homophobic crybabies
« on: April 08, 2022, 03:27:46 AM »
Teaching queer perspectives on all facets of life is very important, sexuality and gender is only a small part of it.
And, if we're going to be pedantic about this, being LGBT is only a 'queering' of gender and sexuality because heterosexuality and 'family values' are oppressively enforced, globally. Stop thinking only within western contexts.
For example queerness in America and queerness and India are two completely different conversations involving a queering of two completely different sets of social and cultural relationship/marital norms. There is not one 'gay' monolith, but conservatives have created a bogeyman out of thin air.
Queerness, and oppression, are two sides of the same coin. They do not exist without the other, for if there were no oppressive societal externalities there would be no queering.
You could very much argue that flat earth, and alternative sciences like it, are 'queer' science, and conspiracy theories 'queer' politics, because they subvert the status-quo of what is widely socially accepted, and you will find that there is soft social pressures everywhere that see this enforced. I mean, try getting a job as a scientist, policymaker, or teacher, if you're 'out' as a flat earther? Doors will be shut on your face, that is what it means to be queer.
Thinking that queerness starts and stops inside the bedroom is small-minded.
And, if we're going to be pedantic about this, being LGBT is only a 'queering' of gender and sexuality because heterosexuality and 'family values' are oppressively enforced, globally. Stop thinking only within western contexts.
For example queerness in America and queerness and India are two completely different conversations involving a queering of two completely different sets of social and cultural relationship/marital norms. There is not one 'gay' monolith, but conservatives have created a bogeyman out of thin air.
Queerness, and oppression, are two sides of the same coin. They do not exist without the other, for if there were no oppressive societal externalities there would be no queering.
You could very much argue that flat earth, and alternative sciences like it, are 'queer' science, and conspiracy theories 'queer' politics, because they subvert the status-quo of what is widely socially accepted, and you will find that there is soft social pressures everywhere that see this enforced. I mean, try getting a job as a scientist, policymaker, or teacher, if you're 'out' as a flat earther? Doors will be shut on your face, that is what it means to be queer.
Thinking that queerness starts and stops inside the bedroom is small-minded.
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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: LGBT School Teachers
« on: April 05, 2022, 03:30:23 PM »Being gay is sexual. Being straight is...not sexual.
What does it even mean to be heterosexual then, to you?
Talking to kids about gay/trans people doesn't make them gay, by that logic teaching kids about Dinosaurs causes them to mutate into reptilian monsters.
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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: LGBT School Teachers
« on: April 05, 2022, 12:28:24 AM »
If we are going to start discriminating against people for having a biological advantage, then let's start with stripping Michael Phelps of all of his gold medals.
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Flat Earth Theory / Re: ECHOSTAR (Private Satellite) Earth footage?
« on: April 04, 2022, 11:49:32 PM »
If pictures, videos, launch documentation, press releases, names of project contributors, project timelines, budgets, etc etc are not high enough quality evidence to be accepted, what is?
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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Trump
« on: April 04, 2022, 11:46:14 PM »Trumpism is a threat to the free world itself.
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Flat Earth Theory / Re: ECHOSTAR (Private Satellite) Earth footage?
« on: March 23, 2022, 03:47:55 AM »Quote from: secretagent10Tom, my original post was a little bit more than saying “here’s some footage, accept it”. It was a bit of a meta argument.
I’m completely admitting that you can just say it’s fake and I can’t do much about it. I’m asserting that the REASONING used by FE’ers in the comments are based on false interpretations/misunderstandings.
If these are the things that made them FE’ers, they got to their position for the wrong reasons. All that FET really has is desperate skepticism that you “technically” can’t disprove as long as you push the bar for evidence back enough.
NASA faking the data is sort of the underlying premise of this concept and website.
Most of the discussions resolve around the next step of whether FE/RE is possible. NASA's possible fakery is already part of the premise of the discussion and is typically conceded as possible even by RE'ers here to allow for further discussion.
The reality of the Round Earth should be irrefutable through mountains of functional evidence and not just at the whims of whether space agencies are possibly faking data or not. If you leave things as "possible" and argue through incredulity, then it remains "possible" that you are wrong.
As an empirical matter you should be also concerned that you believe in something which you have not seen verification for and that your belief is based on trust in authority. That sounds more like a faith issue to me.
If not NASA, do you trust the Japan Meteorological Agency, and JAXA? Because they launched and operate Himawari 8, a weather satellite which you can tune into to see a new full-disc photo of the Earth every 10 minutes.
https://himawari8.nict.go.jp/
You can prove the photo is real because it's corroborated by ground-based weather radar.
https://www.accuweather.com/en/au/darwin/13718/weather-radar/13718
If this were all a fakery, it would have to be an international conspiracy (no NASA in sight) between Japan, Australia, and everyone in between. It would need to be maintained forever, with no margin for error, updated every 10 minutes, accurately reflecting real cloud formation patterns, and smoke from forest fires. With all that would be required to fake this, it would be so much easier to just... put a geostationary earth-cam up in space to take real pictures.
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Flat Earth Theory / Re: The Bipolar Model- An Investigation.
« on: March 20, 2022, 03:41:05 PM »
Presumably beyond the light of the Sun the water would naturally freeze.
Do you have any evidence for this new ice wall? At least the old Antarctic ice wall had photos of the Ross Ice Shelf as an attempt at proof.
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Flat Earth Theory / Re: The Bipolar Model- An Investigation.
« on: March 20, 2022, 03:00:30 AM »
So the Bipolar model at least acknowledges the existence of the Antarctic continent, I hope that puts to rest some of the sad arguments such as Amundsen-Scott base being fake.
But if Antarctica is a continent and not the ice wall, does the Bipolar model flat earth still have an ice wall perimeter?
But if Antarctica is a continent and not the ice wall, does the Bipolar model flat earth still have an ice wall perimeter?
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Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Putin pulling the strings of Republicans
« on: March 17, 2022, 11:05:29 PM »
The House votes 424-8 to suspend normal trade relations with Russia, those 8 are a real who's who of crazies:
Andy Biggs of Arizona
Dan Bishop of North Carolina
Lauren Boebert of Colorado
Matt Gaetz of Florida
Marjorie Taylor Greene of Georgia
Glenn Grothman of Wisconsin
Thomas Massie of Kentucky
Chip Roy of Texas
At least they made it clear which side of the democracy/dictatorship debate they stand on.
Andy Biggs of Arizona
Dan Bishop of North Carolina
Lauren Boebert of Colorado
Matt Gaetz of Florida
Marjorie Taylor Greene of Georgia
Glenn Grothman of Wisconsin
Thomas Massie of Kentucky
Chip Roy of Texas
At least they made it clear which side of the democracy/dictatorship debate they stand on.
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Technology & Information / Re: James Webb telescope launches!
« on: March 17, 2022, 08:38:35 PM »
First image back from the alignment test, taken in near-infrared on a star 100 times fainter than the human eye can see. The galaxies in the background!
https://www.nasa.gov/press-release/nasa-s-webb-reaches-alignment-milestone-optics-working-successfully
https://www.nasa.gov/press-release/nasa-s-webb-reaches-alignment-milestone-optics-working-successfully
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Flat Earth Theory / Re: Found a fully working flat earth model?
« on: February 07, 2022, 02:54:23 AM »
If OP is claiming that via arbitrary transformation the globe can be a disc and vice versa, what’s to say then the Earth isn’t a rhombus, donut, non-euclidean, or shaped exactly like Howard Stern?
If we ignore reality we can arbitrarily transform one coordinate system into another, welcome to the history of map making, this was never even a point of debate in the first place and I fail to see how it has any relevance to Flat Earth theory at all.
If we ignore reality we can arbitrarily transform one coordinate system into another, welcome to the history of map making, this was never even a point of debate in the first place and I fail to see how it has any relevance to Flat Earth theory at all.
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Flat Earth Theory / Re: Moonbounce propagation time and the distance of the Moon from Earth
« on: February 02, 2022, 05:31:20 PM »That is incorrect, one person absolutely can moonbounce to themselves. Here's an article from the Radio Society of Great Britain: https://rsgb.org/main/technical/space-satellites/moonbounce/
"One of the unique characteristics of EME is that it is possible to hear and observe your own transmissions echoed back approximately 2.5 seconds later as the transmitted signal propagates from the earth to the moon, is reflected, and propagates back to the earth."
There is no reason one person could not transmit and receive back to themselves. Anywhere the moon is visible, you can receive a moonbounce, it's no different if you're 50 feet from the source or 50 miles.
You posted an article of someone who thinks it's possible, and who makes no attempt at demonstration. A very low level of evidence. That you can find anonymous authors who make such ignorant claims means nothing.
I'll find all the sources you want. How about this, then: https://www.qrz.com/db/AD6GD WA6PY as he was known in the radio community, has a well-documented account with many photos, and magazine appearances, one calling him the Master of Moonbounce.
But answer me this - if a transmitter and receiver can pull off an EME, why can't that be one person? I fail to see the logic there. Any place with a sight-line to the Moon, can receive an EME transmission, it's not like you have to know where your receiver is. Radio is a wave, not a laser pointer that must be precisely beamed back and forth.
The reason nobody does this is because communicating with people over long distances is the point of an EME, not to measure the distance of the move, although it can be used in that way.
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Flat Earth Theory / Re: Experiment to Distinguish FE from RE
« on: February 02, 2022, 05:19:02 PM »In physics, there's a very big difference between the way things look, and they way they calculate.
Math doesn't care how i draw things, it only cares about the numbers, and even numbers are surprisingly flexible because you can change the formulas.
A very simple example: imagine i make the entire universe twice as big, you and your ruler included. Would you notice?
The math/physics can be tweaked so it also doesn't notice.
Have a look at https://troolon.com It shows physics working on a variety of differently shaped earths.
- coordinate transformations can turn any shape into any other shape
- coordinate transformations don't break physics
-> physics can be made to work on any shape universe (have a look at http://troolon.com for pictures)
-> There is no test to differentiate between the shapes. In reality we can only observe/measure the physical properties, not the shape.
So have a look around you and try these two views: i'm standing on a globe and lightrays are straight,
or you could say: i'm standing on a flat plane, and light curves to exactly counteract the missing curve.
Your eyes wouldn't be able to tell the difference and there's no physical test to distinguish between the two views, it's just a matter of perception.
It's like the old question: Am i moving, or is the entire universe moving around me? It's just a matter of how you look at the world.
Also this result shouldn't be very surprising. The universe could already be a sphere, a simulation, have no shape (QM), be a restored backup from 5 minutes ago ... We will simply never know the shape of the planet. It can be flat, it can be a globe or even a velociraptor.
But physics doesn't just exist in the woo woo air, it is proven through observation. Take for example, general relativity. Yes, it's just math that Einstein put down on paper, and exists purely in the mathematical world. But it can be proved, such as in the Eddington experiment, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eddington_experiment where Einstein correctly predicted the deflection of the position of a star as it is curved by the Sun's gravity on its path to us. Newtonian physics when applied to this problem, got it wrong.
There are galaxies in the night sky that look as though they've been twisted into a ring, evidence of gravity's influence on light. Physics makes predictions, predictions that come true under the most rigorous epistemological scrutiny.
By your own account, you say that your model is unobservable and unpredictable, so what makes it a theory and not just a fantasy?